Mayka, I do not need to know anything about history, whether written in English, Spanish or Chinese to determine whether or not the Basque (or Kurds or Tibetan or American Indian) people have their own country. I need only to look on a map, or consult a list of countries that are recognized by the UN.
Knowledge of history might help me understand WHY or HOW a peoples have built a country - or have been deprived of one - but history is not necessary to know the current state of affairs. ...Bill! From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maria Lopez Sent: Saturday, September 11, 2010 5:22 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Zen] Other traditions Bill; Funny that an American person living in Thailand seems to know better than a Vasque Person, or Spanish about their own land. I strongly advice you to read the History but read it by well educated Spanish historians who happen to be a lot of more neutral while talking about history in different worldwide countries and not by English Spoken historians who are not very good at it. It seems as they find hard to face that in fact while they still were leaving their excrements behind in the castle corners Italy was in the renasciment. I'm saying this because they are not very good telling the history about any country and there are times that they manipulate the history too!. However, do as you wish it doesn't affect me much if you keep with your incorrect history information or not. I can only tell you that your information about the Vasque Country doesn't fit the real book of History of the Vasque Country. Unless you are saying all this because for the seek of the argument. Mayka --- On Sat, 11/9/10, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote: From: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: RE: [Zen] Other traditions To: [email protected] Date: Saturday, 11 September, 2010, 7:31 Mayka, The Basque people occupy lands that overlap Spain and France, just as the Kurdish people occupy lands that overlap Iran and Turkey. Neither the Basque or the Kurdish people have a country of their own. Tibet hasn’t been an independent country since they were conquered by the Mongols in the 1200’s. China incorporated it as early as the 1700’s, and most recently punctuated their annexation in 1910. In 1950 under The Seventeen Point Agreement and recognized by the UN, Tibet officially recognized China’s sovereignty. In 1959 Tibet revolted unsuccessfully against China which resulted in the Dalai Lama fleeing Tibet. The UN still recognized the Seventeen Point Agreement and China’s sovereignty over Tibet. Tibet is not an independent country, it’s part of China. You can dislike this, think in unfair and try to wish it away, but these are the facts. …Bill! From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maria Lopez Sent: Saturday, September 11, 2010 10:20 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Zen] Other traditions Bill: Tibet is a Country. China's invasion into Tibet and making from it a province are just politics. The Vasque Country as the name itself says is a Country. Part of the Vasque Country is in France and part is in Spain. If you would be going to the Vasque Country you will be seeing that is very different from Spain in all the ways. As a contrast , I was borne in the Vasque Country and I believe anyone has ever heard say that I wasn't from Spain. I like Spain due to its rich cultural and paesage variety. And I also like a united Spain with the Vasque Country included rather than separated. Nonetheless the only place in the Iberic peninsula called Country is the Vasque Country and that is because is a Country split up between France and Spain. Mayka --- On Sat, 11/9/10, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote: From: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: RE: [Zen] Other traditions To: [email protected] Date: Saturday, 11 September, 2010, 3:49 Makya, I appreciate your observations. One correction: Tibet is not a country. It’s a province of China. Much like the Basque region of Spain is a province of Spain – even though some of them don’t want to be. …Bill! From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Maria Lopez Sent: Friday, September 10, 2010 10:55 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Zen] Other traditions Yes, that was my impression too about tibetans being superstitious. The TNH sangha in Edinburgh main leader was an ex tibetan nun full of that kind of superstitious tibetan stuff. And her ego would resent if someone would point it out to her. Nonetheless, I quite like the human warm and great sense of humour some original tibetans have. This last July I met a Lama and he would explain the most ordinary daily things in such a simplicity, humour, spontaneous and natural way that he managed to transmit the dharma in a most skillful way. I believe that in spite of cultiural superstition there are some very amazing profoundly awakened wise tibetans as well as in the other way round. In fact they are a whole country and not just an spare sect kind of Thich Nhat Hanh propagation but a whole country. Mayka --- On Fri, 10/9/10, [email protected] <[email protected]> wrote: From: [email protected] <[email protected]> Subject: RE: [Zen] Other traditions To: [email protected] Date: Friday, 10 September, 2010, 14:47 DP, I myself don’t consider Tibetan ‘Buddhism’ actually Buddhist. I should more rightfully be classified as ‘Lamaism’ – with maybe some Buddhist terminology. It’s chock full of superstitions, gods and spirits and a lot of mysticism (and not just ‘chi’), the most well known of which is their belief that the Dalai Lama which is their ‘God-King’, and whom they believe is a reincarnation of the former Dalai Lama clear back to an actual ‘god’ (of Compassion). And don’t get me started on the Dalai Lama…Bill! From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of DP Sent: Friday, September 10, 2010 8:49 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [Zen] Other traditions I have a strange feeling towards other Buddhist traditions. While I find interesting messages in reading about Christianity or even Islam and Judaism (Hinduism I find too alien, although I love some of the imagery and mythology), I have a sort of block against other Buddhist traditions. I can admire somone like the The Dalai Lama, but I find Tibetan Buddhism too esoteric. I have had a few negative experiences on chat boards with other Buddhists in Theravada and Vajranaya traditions, where they even denigrated Zen. Does anyone else find that other Buddhist traditions seem odder to them than traditions outside Buddhism? __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5439 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5439 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5441 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5441 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5441 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5441 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5441 (20100910) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5445 (20100912) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5445 (20100912) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! 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