Ed, This is an addendum to my post below and better addresses the topic of 'relevance' which you brought up. To do that I will relate one of my favorite stories that better illustrates my point:
A man and woman who lived near the ocean awoke one morning after a terrible storm the night before to find the entire coastline in front of their house littered with thousands and thousands of starfish. The starfish had been washed ashore during the storm and now the tide was retreating and the starfish were left stranded on the beach to die. The woman immediately ran down to the beach and started picking up starfish and throwing them back into the ocean. Her husband, seeing her frantic actions, went down to her, held her in his arms and said, "Dear, there is no use in doing that. The sun is already out. They will all die very soon. It's an act of nature. There are just too many starfish here for your efforts to make any difference." The woman broke free of him, picked up a starfish. threw it into the receding waters, turned to him and said, "I made a difference to that one!". ...Bill! From: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:zen_fo...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of billsm...@hhs1963.org Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 9:21 AM To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Zen] Re: FW: Quote from St. Thomas Aquinas Ed, You wrote: [Ed] However to the more than 99.9999% of humans who do not experience satori, 'Maya' is very, very real. Therefore, I submit to the Zen Forum the proposition that how the very, very few experience reality (or non-reality) is not relevant to the world. I of course don't know the ratio of humans that have or have not experienced satori, but I doubt if it's that small. When I was frequenting the Zen Center of Los Angeles, especially during sesshin (intense teaching retreat) I would estimate that about 25% of the new participants experienced kensho (a mini-satori) on their first or second sesshin. It's not an uncommon occurrence at all. As far as it being 'relevant to the world', I couldn't say. But I can guarantee you it's very relevant to those that experience it. ...Bill! From: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:zen_fo...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ED Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 10:16 PM To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Zen] Re: FW: Quote from St. Thomas Aquinas Definitions of illusion on the Web: an erroneous mental representation something many people believe that is false; "they have the illusion that I am very wealthy" delusion: the act of deluding; deception by creating illusory ideas magic trick: an illusory feat; considered magical by naive observers wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn An illusion is a distortion of the senses, revealing how the brain normally organizes and interprets sensory stimulation. While illusions distort reality, they are generally shared by most people. ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusion Bill, Thanks for clarification of the sense in which persons who are enlightened (are in a state of satori) experience reality (or non-reality) - namely, as 'Maya' (illusory). However to the more than 99.9999% of humans who do not experience satori, 'Maya' is very, very real. Therefore, I submit to the Zen Forum the proposition that how the very, very few experience reality (or non-reality) is not relevant to the world. --ED --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, <billsm...@...> wrote: > > Mayka, > > What I meant to say was that if you are living in a world of illusions (maya) compassion is a badge of honor and something you need to cultivate and practice. > > If you are not living in a world of illusions there is no compassion, no honor, nothing to cultivate and nothing to practice. There is Just THIS! > > ...Bill! __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5592 (20101104) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5592 (20101104) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5592 (20101104) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5592 (20101104) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
