Re: [Zen] Re: Spock?

[Kristy McClain]

Thanks Bill, for your insightful comments.  One of the many things I've always 
admired and respected about you is your ability to address others  "where they 
are".  You  are able to  communicate from a   similar perspective, yet remain 
authentic with your  views. Whether zen practice or life experience, it is one 
of your gifts.  Your words were very instructive to me. 

As to Dallas, my 4yo sports-nut nephew agrees! He was talking non-stop on the 
phone to me with  similar sentiments.  Apparently, Dallas  is on the "D" list, 
even though the cheerleaders maintain a D-cup reputaion.
 
Here's a commercial about Tibet that sparked some  controversy.  My opiniion?  
Its the usual crass American opportunism;)~~ k
 

Did Groupon's Tibet Ad Go Too Far?


In its controversial Super Bowl ad, did Groupon exploit tragedy in Tibet to 
promote its own business?




Judge for Yourself 





 
 --- On Sun, 2/6/11, Bill! <billsm...@hhs1963.org> wrote:


From: Bill! <billsm...@hhs1963.org>
Subject: [Zen] Re: Spock?
To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, February 6, 2011, 6:02 PM


  



Kristy,

Thanks for your post. I've embedded some short replies below:

--- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Kristy McClain <healthyplay1@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Bill,
>  
> I've read your posts for some time, and I think I understand   this, to a 
> degree.  But I  sense that "the zen you practice" is more than just  a 
> sitting practice of zazen.  You often  discuss and share  your 
> understanding of  the sutras and other buddhist ideas-- like the eight-fold 
> path.  While I don't think you encourage ethical mis-conduct, I don't think 
> ethical standards are your focus either, but I may   be mis-reading this 
> about you.  But I sense that you actually are ethical indeed, and wonder if 
> discounting that here is really a ploy to engage conversation.
[Bill!] I think the only difference between us is I don't consider my actions 
or responses as 'ethical' or 'unethical'. I just act and move on. I also don't 
judge other people's actions as 'ethical' or 'unethical'. I just respond the 
them.
 
> You do  discuss buddha nature, however as a result of "just this", or as a 
> by-product, perhaps.  So, I guess I'm thinking that it is your  years of 
> training and experience that has   brought you to the point  wherein you 
> discount much of the trappings that  often co-exist with zen practices, or 
> should i say Zen practices.
For me Just THIS! is Buddha Nature. And yes this my whole life has brought me 
to this point and that certainly includes formal Zen instruction.
 
> I won't ask how I can get to Just this", but I'd like to learn more about 
> how you got there, and maybe a couple things you do each day, other than 
> zazen, that lets you know that you are maintaining your "just this" mind in  
> everyday situations.  (Maybe the tea spill on the PC experience, for 
> example).
[Bill!] Although you didn't ask, one way to 'get to' Just THIS! is zazen. There 
are many others, in fact I beleive any path if followed with complete 
dedication will 'get to' (I'd say 'reveal' since it was always there) Just 
THIS!. I'm not able to maintain Just THIS! is all my everyday situations. To 
expand Just THIS! from zazen to all of my daily life is my practice.

> I see you as very non-judgemental, and whether that  is a result of your 
> practice, or as Indiana Jones would say-- "its not the years, honey--its the 
> mileage".
[Bill!] Well said. I don't know the answer to your question, but I have a hunch 
it is both - or that both are the really just the same thing.
 
> But  when you and others talk about  duality and illusory ideas-- I tend 
> to shrug, because to discuss it here, involves reading posts, assessing  the 
> meaning within, and deciding  whether to respond or not.  You still go to a 
> store to buy goods , so comparing one brand to another is still there.  You 
> likely  experience happiness and  frustration.  You still have to pee or 
> take Flomax. Have mind-blowing  sex.. good sex.. or no sex. 
[Bill!] I try to respond to people from the same perspective they approach me. 
If they are logical I try to use logic. If they are mystical I try to use 
mysticism. If they are dreamers I spin them a tale. Zen Buddhism calls this 
'skillful means'. I am very logically-oreinted myself and have made my living 
from that all my adult life, so logically-based topics are especially 
intereting to me. It's also my weakness. When I am excercising logic I have to 
remain attentive so as to not get lost and sucked-in, and always remember logic 
is illusory - and very seductive for me.
 
> I'm still learning, so your thoughts are appreciated.
[Bill!] I am still learning too, and also appreciate your posts.
 
> May the Force  be with You-- and the Steelers!!~~ k
[Bill!] I have no favorties in this Super Bowl. Both are very good teams. I'm 
just glad the Cowboys have to watch from the sidelines.

...Bill!

> --- On Sun, 2/6/11, Bill! <BillSmart@...> wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Bill! <BillSmart@...>
> Subject: [Zen] Re: Spock?
> To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Sunday, February 6, 2011, 1:24 AM
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> Kristy,
> 
> Most of the time when I use the a phrase like 'the zen I practice' it is 
> really just to signal everyone that I'm not claiming I am the official 
> spokesman for traditional Zen Buddhism. I do claim however to be the official 
> spokesman for 'the zen I practice' and do feel very confident in talking 
> about it.
> 
> Put simply I beleive 'the zen I practice' is Zen Buddhsim without the 
> Buddhism. That's why I always distinguish between 'the zen I practice' (lower 
> case 'z') and the proper name Zen Buddhism (with an upper case 'Z').
> 
> So...if you can think about zen as including practices that are not specific 
> to Buddhism - like zazen; while not including things that are specific to 
> Buddhism - like the Eightfold Path and enlightenment, then that's all it is.
> 
> ...Bill! 
> 
> 
> --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Kristy McClain <healthyplay1@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Bill,
> >  
> > You  often refer to "the zen you practice", as in the following:
> >  
> > > To answer your question, anything that involves observing does not sound 
> > > like zen to me. In the zen I practice there are no dualities such as 
> > > observer/observed (subject/object)...Bill!
> > > 
> > 
> > Would you be willing to share how you do this,  or give an example?
> >  
> > Thanks.. ~K
> >
>