ED, Gotama went through jhana stages many times, reaching form, formless and thoughtless levels, and finally a breakthrough to Buddhahood. That is wonderful. However, nowadays I don't seem to see anybody attain Buddhahood using the approach (if you do, let me know). As D.T.Suzuki says, every living thing developes. Buddhism has come a long way through Theravada, mahayan all the way to zen. Now zen is different from the original Buddhism, just as you are different now than when you were a naughty boy. Zen has a unique way of practice, which is not at all a copy of the Theravada way. As you say in English, one man's food is another's poison. Makyo is Japanese for 'devilish realm'. It is not 'awakening'. Jhana is a good step to reach some higher levels of practice in some schools, especially Theravada, but IMO it is a devilish level you must not be attached to in zen. A devil is nice if you are entertained to it. But attachment is a completely different matter. As far as Mike is concerned, I don't mean to scare him, but I keep hearing that chi cultivation or chakra manipulation can have serious consequences without the guidance of a qualified teacher. If you don't find a teacher for the time being, the best thing to do is to let the chi flow naturally without forcing it to go anywhere. If you want to continue with traditional zen, let the makyo die down somehow. Alternatively you can go to another route, such as tantra, qigong etc. In that case the chi is completely healthy and useful.
Anthony --- On Sun, 17/4/11, ED <[email protected]> wrote: From: ED <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release To: [email protected] Date: Sunday, 17 April, 2011, 11:56 PM Anthony, In "Zen-Mind Reflections" by Dr. James Austin, the absorbtions (jhana states) are said to comprise a stage one may encounter in one's practice, and which stage lies between the makyo ('awakenings') and kensho-statori (wisdom-insight) stages. As reported in the Theravada literature, the Buddha himself encountered these jhana states prior to his enlightenment, and prior to his demise - and very probably at other times too. The jhana states are not 'illusory' states, as they are the actual personal experiences (sensations, visions, bliss states, compassion states) of the the meditator - and they are all impermanent, as are all phenomena. The experiences in each of the eight jhana states has been been itemized in detail in the Theravada literature. The advice is uniform and unambiguous toward all phenomena encountered in Zen practice, including phenomena in the makyo, jhana and kensho-satori states, and this advice is: Continue practicing. --ED --- In [email protected], Anthony Wu wuasg@ wrote: > Mike, > It is my belief right now that jhana, samadhi, vipassana, chakra > manipulating, psychic power acquisition etc are good practices. But they are > not zen. Zen is pragmatic, but directed to nothing and attached to nothing. > This statement seems to be contraditory, but zen itself is contradictory. > > >Anthony Anthony, I'm not sure if this is a step forward,or a step backward, in my practice (my intuition says 'forward' for me, but not necessarily for other people), but due to recent happenings I can empathise alot more with where JM is coming from. Before last week.JM's language was utterly alien to me and seemed to have no connection with the Zen I was familiiar with. Now I'm not so sure. I think Zen without incorporating the absorbtions (jhanas) and 'heart' can be dry and a little compassionless, but maybe Chan without Zen's hard reality is a little too fuzzy and a bit too 'fairy' worshiping. That might not make sense to most, if not all here, but it does to me. Further, I don't think Zen is completely removed from notions such as chi, chakras etc. After all, in some schools focus is directed to the 'hara' as a place of holding energy. It is this that is cut in seppeku (hara kiri) to release a person's ki (chi). Mike
