Mike wrote: "I think Zen without incorporating the absorbtions (jhanas) and 'heart' can be dry and a little compassionless, but maybe Chan without Zen's hard reality is a little too fuzzy and a bit too 'fairy' worshiping".
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To me in the real essence of zen any adjectives are out of place. To me zen is the ultimate step one does. Many people embrace zen without been ready for it. As they are not ready they become arrogant individualistic pricks cold as ice. Even when zen is something available to everyone the same, more and more my imimpressionith it is that it's only suitable and of real benefit for a minority of people who have already in them a sense of non separation, unity, universal oneness and therefore a heart. Differently, agree with you that we need from other sources in your case the Jhanas in my case TNH zen buddhism and and the image created in my mind as a model of the heart in Jesuschrist beyond any religious institution. Zen doesn't lack of anything but we do. Mayka --- On Sat, 16/4/11, mike brown <[email protected]> wrote: From: mike brown <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release To: [email protected] Date: Saturday, 16 April, 2011, 5:53 Anthony, I'm not sure if this is a step forward,or a step backward, in my practice (my intuition says 'forward' for me, but not necessarily for other people), but due to recent happenings I can empathise alot more with where JM is coming from. Before last week.JM's language was utterly alien to me and seemed to have no connection with the Zen I was familiiar with. Now I'm not so sure. I think Zen without incorporating the absorbtions (jhanas) and 'heart' can be dry and a little compassionless, but maybe Chan without Zen's hard reality is a little too fuzzy and a bit too 'fairy' worshiping. That might not make sense to most, if not all here, but it does to me. Further, I don't think Zen is completely removed from notions such as chi, chakras etc. After all, in some schools focus is directed to the 'hara' as a place of holding energy. It is this that is cut in seppeku (hara kiri) to release a person's ki (chi). Mike From: Anthony Wu <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 15 April, 2011 22:16:28 Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release JM, Now you have strong allies. Maybe Mike and/or ED can shed light on the 'heart' and the mind. Anthony --- On Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <[email protected]> wrote: From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release To: [email protected] Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 7:53 AM Hi Anthony, I understand that you trying to discuss from a logic or definition of words. I am not saying whether I am correct or wrong. At the beginning of my journey I am like you. I struggle with these terms as well. As I said, it took me six year to conquer my terminology. Actually, all my posts are from my experience. My experience like Daniel's youtube is center in the heart and not in the brain. It is a whole body experience. And this experience coincide more and more with my Teacher's teaching as time passes. Don't mean to confuse you. I also like to say, in my states, there is no mind and no heart, just chi, electricity and lights. The key point IMO, is that state of kensho, satori, or even just Jhana can not sustained without chi, which is labeled as vital energy by Daniel. Of course, my experience could also be labeled as maya by Bill. :-) It is not important what I say or experience. It is only important what you experience. As you well know, Buddha said clearly in Diamond sutra that He said NO dharma. Best, JM Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com http://www.heartchan.org On 4/14/2011 4:10 PM, Anthony Wu wrote: JM, What is 'mind'? What is 'heart'? What is the difference between 'mind' and 'heart'? Anthony --- On Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <[email protected]> wrote: From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release To: [email protected] Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 3:36 AM Wow, Thank you ED. I have watched the first one. HuangDi Neijing said it very clearly for 2,000 years, "Our Shen, or inner divine, requires the support of Qi or Chi." Personally, having a high tech BG, it took me 6 years to wake up to the fact that our Teaching is not about our mind. It is about our entire being. And at the center of it, is our heart. That's my witness. Now there is someone else too. Thank you again, ED. Lovely day today. :-) JM BTW, I was just informed that our version of Diamond Sutra is on youtube with English subtitle. http://www.youtube.com/joycedaolian#p/u/4/ROkmtB1fB8I Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com http://www.heartchan.org On 4/14/2011 10:25 AM, ED wrote: Mike, two more tapes by Empty_Grace. I experience this guy as knowing what he is talking about. JM, he has good things to say about the Heart. --ED The Three Dimensions of Release http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejQsIFDrb4M&NR=1 Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-4Vw54Dabw&feature=related Part 2
