The flood may actually have happened. Several of the cultures around the Mediteranean talk of it. Think Gilgamesh and the disappearance of Atlantis. It's hypothesized that the the explosion of the island of Santorini. The island is the site of one of the largest volcanic eruptions in recorded history: the Minoan eruption (sometimes called the Thera eruption), occurred some 3600 years ago at the height of the Minoan civilization. The eruption left a large caldera surrounded by volcanic ash deposits hundreds of metres deep and may have led indirectly to the collapse of the Minoan civilization on the island of Crete, 110 km (68 mi) to the south, through a gigantic tsunami. The theory holds that the Thera eruption is the source of the legend of Atlantis.[3] Bill (not Bill!)
Find what makes your heart sing…and do it! ________________________________ From: mike brown <[email protected]> To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Sent: Fri, August 3, 2012 8:16:35 PM Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Chan and zen Bill!, That's an interesting idea. It sounds like something Joesph Campbell would say. Maybe our splitting from God represents the beginning of dualism and the desire for the search back to the One again? Interesting. Just as I'm sure people were awakened to Buddha Nature before Guatama, so to many of the stories in the Bible predate the first writing of the first scrolls. The Flood springs to mind. Still doesn't make the stories true tho. Mike ________________________________ From: Bill! <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, 4 August 2012, 2:01 Subject: [Zen] Re: Chan and zen Mike, I believe the story in the Bible of the 'Garden of Eden' is a mythologized description of what mankind's life was like before he became too dependent upon and attached to his rational mind (dualism - Knowledge of Good and Evil). Before that he lived at one with God - in the Garden of Eden. ...Bill! --- In [email protected], mike brown <uerusuboyo@...> wrote: > > Merle, > > It's a nice sentiment to try to do that, isn't it? I guess the problem is is >that we collect too much dust in our eyes as we acquire more of what the world >teaches us. I do have a vague memory/feeling tho, of playing in my parent's >garden and it being what the Garden of Eden must be like. I would've been less >surprised to come across the Cheshire Cat than I would if I'd come across the >tabby next door. > > Mike > > > > > > From: Merle Lester <merlewiitpom@...>To: "[email protected]" ><[email protected]> > > > Sent: Friday, 3 August 2012, 8:56 > Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Chan and zen > > >  > > >  look at life through the eyes of a young child... fresh, always alert and >forever curious..merle > > >  > Chris, > > >So I guess my question is that having now had a great deal more chance > to see from the non-dual perspective, do you find that the initial > experience you wrote about was really basically ordinary, but so far our of >your thinking that you were surprised at its nature?  Or do you find it >leaves >you feeling there is some progression to your practice and > > liberation, and your ordinary experience before that seeing is not like > your ordinary experience now? < > > Thanks for reading and asking questions. All I can say about it is that the >objects we normally take for granted were seen as they really are because the >web of concepts we usually overlay them with was removed. They just were. It >struck me at the time (during the episode) that seeing this way was the most >natural and real way of seeing, except not seeing with the eyes, and that it >was >all so obvious. It was more like the objects were and I wasn't (Which is why >Dogen's '10,000 things' resonates). I have to say that my ordinary experience >is >not like it was before, but neither is it like it was during the experience, >which is why I do feel there is some progression to my practice and >liberation. >It's not for the purpose of recapturing a past experience (like a drug high), >but to get to the bottom of what it's all about. In a way, I've answered 'yes' >to both your questions, but contradictions seem okay now, too. > > Mike > > > > ________________________________ > From: Chris Austin-Lane <chris@...> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Friday, 3 August 2012, 4:15 > Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Chan and zen > > >  > This thread has been very interesting, but I have a question for Mike.  I am >honored that you shared your experience with us, and I hope I can address a >question without antagonizing you - it's a real question I have, and I am >perfectly willing to hear any honest answer.  > > As far as I can tell, every time one slows down the rush of thinking a bit, > out >pops such a lovely universe as these dramatic experiences seem to highlight. > But, other than the strong emotions, I don't read anything in these mystical >experiences that isn't there each moment, in the quiet still space that >attending lets us notice.    After each exhalation, perfect stillness, >balanced on the burning tip of creation.  Something like that.  > > I've not had an enlightenment experience as a part of zen training*, but they >don't read as different from my frequent realizing I'm lost in day dreams and >returning to attentive zazen - tho that realization is rather dull, it has the >full sense of okness and the noticeable lack of distinct boundaries.  When I >stop crinkling up my mind, and attend to what Bill! calls raw sensory input, >living is awfully pretty and crystalline and wonderful; even in the middle of >an >argument with my wife or kids, here we are; how can I not smile a bit (unless >it >would upset the companions)?  I have a fairly pleasant and orderly life, to >be >sure, but even crashing on my bike is interesting.  That slight shift in >perspective happens many times a day, but each time I let go (of *my* >thoughts, >*my* preferences, *my* expectations), my ass unclenches and I find that the >moment is indeed complete and sufficient.  > > So I guess my question is that having now had a great deal more chance to see >from the non-dual perspective, do you find that the initial experience you >wrote >about was really basically ordinary, but so far our of your thinking that you >were surprised at its nature?  Or do you find it leaves you feeling there is >some progression to your practice and liberation, and your ordinary experience >before that seeing is not like your ordinary experience now? > > > Thanks, > > --Chris > chris@... > +1-301-270-6524 > > *I had a couple of "it's ok, all is one" experiences as a child, and >occasionally as a parent (being a parent seems to for me to bring out all >sorts >of states of love and wonder, due I guess to the physical exhaustion, total >dedication, and lack of personal wilfulness), that seem sort of like what >people >describe, tho of course it had nothing to do with zen training as I only >started >that a few years ago.  > > > On Thu, Aug 2, 2012 at 7:12 PM, Joe <desert_woodworker@...> wrote: > > Ed, > > > >Hugh bet that zen teachers use the word "samadhi'.  Not many talk > >about it.  Except in dokusan.  It's not a secret, but maybe since > >about half the folks on sesshin are pretty new, teachers do not make > >a big deal about it in public, while the old-timers of course are > >just bathed in it, to their eyebrows.  Or we can hope, so. > > > >--Joe > > > > > >"ED" <seacrofter001@> wrote: > >> > >> Mike, > >> > >> Samadhi has numerous meanings.  What do you mean by 'samadhi'?  Joe, > >> what do you mean by 'samadhi' ?   Do Zen masters ever use the term > >> 'samadhi'? > > > > > > > > > > > >------------------------------------ > > > >Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are >reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > The
