Bill!,
I bring in the other word, "trust" because I think that, as many of us use the
words "belief" and "faith", we are leaning toward and meaning something more
like trust, and reliance.
I think that belief and faith -- as used in their more strict dictionary
sense(s) -- when used, say, by a young (or proselytizing) religionist, are most
often the naive emotions of a juvenile practitioner, or are presented for a
young newcomer to latch on to and use as tools.
After one has some experience, particularly, a "turnabout" experience or
episode, but not limited to that, one may still respond to and rely upon the
mysterious elements of life as a *source* of life, and of light. When one
regards them, one feels wonder, respect, awe, participation, and
responsibility. As one further regards them, one feels, I'd say, faith and
trust. Again, this is not "blind" faith! It is based on experience and the
most intimate sort of "knowledge", more akin to "being", one's being, once it
becomes clarified or simplified to its essential.
Translations sometime fail us when we read records of awakened teachers and
philosophers, and their teachings. For example, I think immediately of two
works in Buddhism, one by a Ch'an master, and one by and great Indian Buddhist
practitioner and Philsopher.
You are probably already very well familiar with the Ch'an work: the Hsin Hsin
Ming (FAITH IN MIND).
And, attributed to Asvaghosha, THE AWAKENING OF FAITH IN THE MAHAYANA, which
was originally written in Sanskrit, then translated to Chinese in 550 AD, and
following this the Sanskrit version was lost. He treats four faiths and five
practices. There is faith in: The Ultimate Source of things; in the Buddhas;
in the Dharma; and in the Sangha. Another way to say this is faith in Buddha
Nature, and in the Three Jewels, or Three Treasures, or Gems.
Well, one might question whether these faiths persist, mutate, evolve, or
disappear after awakening (or, at least, after one's first awakening). I
suppose it varies with causes and conditions!
--Joe
> "Bill!" <BillSmart@...> wrote:
>
> Of course both belief and faith have a component of trust. My distinction is
> just that faith is a type of belief that has no experiential, scientific or
> logical foundation. Trust can be well- or ill-founded.
>
> Hume's 'will the sun rise again tomorrow' is a good example. Whether you
> consider the answer to that (belief) something based on faith or not could be
> debated. I say it is.
>
> In any event the question of whether or not the sun will rise again tomorrow
> has nothing to do with zen practice.
>
> ...Bill!
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