Carl, I don't mind people paraphrasing what I said but I don't want anyone to associate the phrase 'what goes around comes around' with the concept of karma - at least not if you're attributing the statement to me.
...Bill! --- In [email protected], "Carl" <cjjohans@...> wrote: > > I disagree, what goes around comes around as Bill already mentioned (since > all is one). > > --- In [email protected], "Joe" <desert_woodworker@> wrote: > > > > Carl, > > > > The way you express what is I think your understanding of basic Buddhist > > tenets makes me think that you have them a little garbled. > > > > (but of course it's not necessary for a Zen practitioner to adopt those > > tenets in order to practice and definitely to awaken. Some find them > > useful, some don't. So let's leave them aside. The key thing is practice: > > effective practice). > > > > Alleviating the suffering of others is not a path to awakening. > > > > Losing -- utterly losing -- the view that there *are* "others" *is* > > Awakening. > > > > It does not come as an act of will. > > > > One must forget oneself. > > > > It is a re-joining of the family of all life. > > > > Zen practice can set you up, there. > > > > --Joe > > > > > "Carl" <cjjohans@> wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > I don't know that I agree with that view of nature, there are predators > > > and there are herbivores, the former inflict suffering and fear the > > > latter do not (in fact some plant life even "wants" to be consumed in > > > order to propagate). There are the hunting parent and the nurturing > > > parent. > > > > > > I also don't agree with the view that everyone who is not enlightened is > > > suffering. In fact I think there are plenty who are enjoying their lives > > > and seek every means to prolong it, who are even morally suspect. There > > > are of course also plenty who are suffering materially, but I would not > > > in general call them less enlightened. > > > > > > Since suffering and enlightenment are conceptually unrelated in my view, > > > alleviation of the suffering of others is one path but not the only path > > > to enlightenment to me. > > > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
