ryhorikawa, Think of the teacher as simply a guide..someone to guide you in the dharma but not someone to cling to. The teacher is simply there to help you in your journey, to make sure you are sitting as strongly as possible. As to mind...I think mind is mind..logical or empty. It is just mind. One day it may be logical the next empty. When I sit during sesshin it changes from period to period. I too struggle with mind that chatters, but know that it is just mind. Eventually it settles down for a while. Don't worry about it. Just sit. I see you have a wisc.edu email address. Are you in Madison? The sangha I belong to owns a retreat center in Monroe about 2 hours away from Madison. Eventually our Roshi will be offering sittings and classes there. When she does would you be interested? I can let you know. In gassho, Jishin
ryhorikawa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: --- In [email protected], "Bill Smart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Zazen in an answer to that. I had the same problem. My professional > works requires a lot of logic and constant thinking. Zazen helps me > put that in its proper place. When I need my logic tools I can pull > them out; but I can also put them back in my toolbag when I'm > through. I've worked with koans in the past but now just sit 'shikan > taza' (empty mind). Both are equally effective. It helps A LOT!!! > > Find a teacher. Mayber he/she will assign you the koan Mu, maybe > not. It doesn't matter. He/she will instruct you in zazen and that > will help you quiet your mind. > > Gassho...Bill! Bill - As usual, thanks for your really thoughtful posts. You sent thanks out to ths listserv earlier but it should be returned to you as well. You certainly serve a bodhisattva role in this arena :-)! Shikan-taza?! So you're a Soto-Zen dude, huh? :-) Empty mind (mu-shin) - There we go with that naughty "mu" character again lol... Is a logical mind the realm of the "profane"?/ of phenomenal existence? Is the empty mind the realm of the "sacred"?/ of emptiness? Is the logical mind in "opposition" to empty mind? Is an "emptied" logical mind an "empty mind"? Is it possible to have a logical mind that is empty (but still logical)? What does it mean to quiet the mind? Can one have a quiet logical mind? The notion of a human teacher in Buddhism is problematic, isn't it? Two passages come to mind for me. The first is from the last sermon of the Buddha from the Theravada tradition: "Then the Bhagavan addressed the venerable Ananda: 'It may be, Ananda< that some of you may thing, The word of the Teacher is a thing of the past; we now have no Teacher. But that, Ananda, is not the correct view. The Dharma and the Vinaya which I have taught and enjoined upon you is your teacher when I am gone." The second is from a Mahayana sutra: "Rely on the teaching (dharma), not the teacher. Rely on the meaning (of the teaching) and not the letter Rely on the definitive meaning (based on personal experience) and not the interpreted meaning (based on someone's explanation)..." Many of us have heard this saying from India: "When the student is ready the teacher appears. The student does not find the teacher. The teacher finds the student." In India there is also this saying: "What appears to be coming at you, is really coming from you." Isn't the "mind", then, the teacher? What is the function of an external teacher in Zen? I don't know, that's why I'm asking... I can certainly throw out answers I think are "correct" but in all honesty they'll be parroted answer from the many books I've read and not anything based on personal experience.:-) Strugggling in the dharma, ryhorikawa Current Book Discussion: Appreciate Your Life by Taizan Maezumi Roshi SPONSORED LINKS Zen buddhism Zen practice Theravada buddhism Tibetan buddhism Zen alarm clock Zen garden --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "ZenForum" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Click here to rescue a little child from a life of poverty. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rAWabB/gYnLAA/i1hLAA/S27xlB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Current Book Discussion: Appreciate Your Life by Taizan Maezumi Roshi Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ZenForum/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
