Il Sab 10 Dic 2022, 12:47 Jean-Baptiste Onofré <j...@nanthrax.net> ha scritto:
> Ok. Fair enough. > > Imho Karaf-jclouds is probably different as the number of users is very > very thin. > > But I understand your points. > > I will support of moving to attic anyway. Just wanted to give a chance for > the community to speak up. > > The users will find alternatives (maybe forking part of jclouds). > I think that forking jclouds is not a good solution, as you lose all the potential interactions with other users, for instance in case of security issues (cannot inform all the users, share patches in a coodinated way). I understand the points of the people in this thread that are skeptical about adding external people. Probably I would feel the same way. I believe that it is up to the jcloud PMC to decide on the destiny of the project and as JB is saying, users will find their solutions. My 2 cents Enrico > Thanks > Regards > JB > > Le sam. 10 déc. 2022 à 11:34, Ignasi Barrera <n...@apache.org> a écrit : > > > Even if it is maintenance, now it's not time for just good intentions > > (which are very much appreciated), but time for action, and action is not > > there and my confidence in it happening any time soon is very low. > > > > Let me give you a concrete example: > > > > * In 2019, we voted on moving jcloud-karaf under the Apache Karaf project > > [1] because we were not able to maintain the project properly. > > * The last commit in the transferred project [2] is from 2019 (3 years > > back). > > * That project is still in jclouds 2.2.0, whilst jclouds is in 2.6.0; > it's > > still 4 releases behind. > > > > There have been no feature additions, but over 3 years there haven't > > even been maintenance tasks done at all, even just to keep the project up > > to date with upstream jclouds. > > > > Although I appreciate all the good intentions of people volunteering, I > > don't see any action here (as Gaul also requested), and honestly, I think > > repeating the jcloud-karaf story will not do any favor to users. If we > > change the PMC and inactivity continues, jclouds will be even in a worse > > position than it is today: it will keep having an inactive PMC, but > > composed of people that are even less familiar/expert in its codebase. > > > > IMO, if we really care about users, we should see something here beyond > the > > much-appreciated good intentions, because we've tried this route in the > > past and it has not worked. > > > > > > [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/30770j9jwcn14vzczzkbhz37g8q2olc6 > > [2] https://github.com/apache/karaf-jclouds > > > > > > > > On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:58 AM Jean-Baptiste Onofré <j...@nanthrax.net> > > wrote: > > > > > That's a fair comment. As we are mostly talking about "maintenance", I > > > don't wait for any new big features in the short term. > > > As said, the main concern for these guys is about jclouds as an > > > important dependency in their project. > > > > > > I can't speak on their behalf, but I assume Pulsar and Brooklyng guys > > > (at least) want to maintain jclouds alive as dependency. > > > > > > Personally, I prefer to find other approaches (and it's what we do in > > > Apache Sunny and Apache Karaf). > > > > > > Regards > > > JB > > > > > > On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 6:55 PM Ignasi Barrera < > ignasi.barr...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > It's not about me, it's about people volunteering actually stepping > up > > > > and starting to take action, and that is not happening. > > > > > > > > You say: 'After some months, we will definitely see if the project is > > > still > > > > alive or not." > > > > It's been 2 months now. In your opinion, how many more months of > > inaction > > > > should we wait, and what's the reasoning behind that number? > > > > > > > > On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 6:01 PM Jean-Baptiste Onofré <j...@nanthrax.net > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > If you don't want to continue on jclouds (I fully understand this), > > > > > fair enough. But if people still want to maintain it, I don't see > any > > > > > issue there. > > > > > > > > > > Is a fork better ? I don't think so. Because, it might happen if we > > > > > retire the project. > > > > > > > > > > As I proposed earlier, if the current PMC members don't want to > > > > > continue on jclouds, but we have potential volunteers to take > over, I > > > > > think it's fair to try. Apache is community driven, if we have new > > > > > people in the jclouds community, willing to help, we could be > > > > > "welcoming". > > > > > After some months, we will definitely see if the project is still > > > alive or > > > > > not. > > > > > > > > > > If you absolutely want to retire the project, I'm with you, and > then > > > > > pulsar or brooklyn (or another project) will do a fork probably. > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > JB > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Dec 9, 2022 at 3:38 PM Ignasi Barrera <n...@apache.org> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree with Gaul's comments. > > > > > > > > > > > > If people wants to help, worth to see if it actually happens ;) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's been 2 months since the proposal of retiring the project and > > to > > > > > date, > > > > > > nothing real happened beyond "I'm in" comments. > > > > > > If at the time of discussing the project retirement, this is all > > the > > > > > energy > > > > > > that is around to maintain it, I don't think it is a setup for > > > success > > > > > and > > > > > > agree with Gaul that we will better serve users by retiring the > > > project. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > P.S. Geoff, really appreciate your honesty in accounting for your > > > > > bandwidth! > > > > > > > > > > >
