From: Colin Hercus
* Funny that this module should produce 20Kw if it's part of a 1MW
reactor and if it was then how much back pressure would that little steam
orifice generate and how much energy would the system lose as steam squeezes
out that orifice. There's so much unexplained and so
Horace
Too bad the money that went into Solyndra didn't go into nano-
capacitors. Energy storage is the key stumbling block now for EVs
and renewable energy projects.
I predict that this factory will be back in operation in 6 months. It is a
fabulous facility but with the wrong product
Jones, you're such a teez! :-)
-M
-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net]
Horace
Too bad the money that went into Solyndra didn't go into nano-
capacitors. Energy storage is the key stumbling block now for
EVs and renewable energy projects.
I predict
On Sep 16, 2011, at 7:07 AM, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint wrote:
Jones, you're such a teez! :-)
-M
I'll second that! 8^)
Tell us more Jones!
-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net]
Horace
Too bad the money that went into Solyndra didn't go into nano-
Nice to see you back in the sand box, Jones. I wuz beginning to get
concerned that you may have been abducted by aliens... perhaps for
consultation purposes concerning your legal expertise on human
affairs. Rumor has it that the Pleiadians and Zeta Reticulians are
sparing over the possession
Hey guys - isn't Rossi-mania already reading like a geek gossip column?
(Dear Daniel:)
The bogosity level hovering around the E-Cat is already so extreme that
further speculation pushes into the realm of Sci-Fi ... after all, I am just
re-interpreting a few published News stories already out
On 11-09-16 12:36 PM, Jones Beene wrote:
Hey guys - isn't Rossi-mania already reading like a geek gossip column?
(Dear Daniel:)
The bogosity level hovering around the E-Cat is already so extreme that
further speculation pushes into the realm of Sci-Fi ... after all, I am just
re-interpreting
Well, I am used to read computer news, so a little bit of Rossi-mania is
good for a change.
-- Forwarded message --
From: Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net
Date: 2011/9/16
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Hey guys - isn't Rossi-mania already reading
Oops - my mistake .
Should have been Dear Daniele
blog http://22passi.blogspot.com/
From: Daniel Rocha
Well, I am used to read computer news, so a little bit of Rossi-mania is
good for a change.
Hey guys - isn't Rossi-mania already reading like a geek gossip column?
From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net]
Hey guys - isn't Rossi-mania already reading like a geek gossip column?
You mean a greek geek gossip column!
-M
At 10:34 AM 9/16/2011, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint wrote:
From: Jones Beene
[
mailto:jone...@pacbell.net]
Hey guys - isn't Rossi-mania already reading like a geek gossip
column?
You mean a greek geek gossip column!
For Defkalion, it's a piqued greek geek gossip column!
I think CIHT is for Catalyst Induced Hydrino Transition.
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-243402945.html
Being slightly dislexic I'll have to watch out for exchanging the i
and the h, since I pronounce it with a soft c. 8^)
On Sep 16, 2011, at 8:53 AM, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote:
On
and temperature so why should there be a difference?
- Original Message -
*From:* Finlay MacNab finlaymac...@hotmail.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 14, 2011 8:49 PM
*Subject:* RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Excellent observation! If this was a closed system
.
- Original Message -
From: Finlay MacNab
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 8:49 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Excellent observation! If this was a closed system with no FLOWING WATER
EXITING THE SYSTEM you would have a point
Am 14.09.2011 22:31, schrieb Horace Heffner:
Sticking the one and only output measuring thermometer down inside the
device is still as useless as ever for calorimetry purposes. It
likely is directly heated by its metal surroundings. The water
pulsing out of the device is clearly not 130°C.
, 2011 8:49
PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at
Nyteknik
Excellent observation! If this was a closed system with
no FLOWING WATER EXITING THE SYSTEM you would have a point. As it is you
have only discredited your argument about thermal inertia.
Congratulations!
I find
Colin Hercus colinher...@gmail.com wrote:
Of all the demos reported this new one is the least convincing and is a
major disappointment.
I tend to agree, because power input was high and they did not measure total
enthalpy. However, the last 35 min. with no input power redeemed the test. I
do
It would have been nice to see two identical E-Cats, one is chosen at random
and charged with hydrogen, the other not... and power is added to both units
the same way. If the active one is clearly spewing more heat and steam,
anomalous heat would be assured.
Lets imagine that the next test shows
On Sep 15, 2011, at 9:11 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
Am 14.09.2011 22:31, schrieb Horace Heffner:
Sticking the one and only output measuring thermometer down inside
the device is still as useless as ever for calorimetry purposes.
It likely is directly heated by its metal surroundings. The
Am 15.09.2011 21:48, schrieb Horace Heffner:
On Sep 15, 2011, at 9:11 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
Am 14.09.2011 22:31, schrieb Horace Heffner:
Sticking the one and only output measuring thermometer down inside
the device is still as useless as ever for calorimetry purposes. It
likely is
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 8:49 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Excellent observation! If this was a closed system with no FLOWING
WATER EXITING THE SYSTEM you would have a point. As it is you have
only discredited your argument about thermal
On Sep 15, 2011, at 12:05 PM, Peter Heckert wrote:
Am 15.09.2011 21:48, schrieb Horace Heffner:
On Sep 15, 2011, at 9:11 AM, Peter Heckert wrote:
Am 14.09.2011 22:31, schrieb Horace Heffner:
Sticking the one and only output measuring thermometer down
inside the device is still as
at the same rate and temperature so why should there be a difference?
- Original Message -
*From:* Finlay MacNab finlaymac...@hotmail.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 14, 2011 8:49 PM
*Subject:* RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Excellent observation
Hi Jed,
But Mats did not measure steam during that 35 mins and if heat loss was just
the cold water in and hot out then the temp would decrease quite slowly.
Note we have at least 23kg of hot water and only 11kg/hr in. so 17% change
of water in 30 minutes. Input temp is 29C and if we allow
rate I
would be convinced.
From: colinher...@gmail.com
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2011 11:00:25 +0800
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Hi Finlay,
I mean if you take temperature of two chambers to be 130C at time power is
turned off, and allow cold water to flow in at 11l/h
Colin wrote: « Funny that this module should produce 20Kw if it's part of a
1MW reactor and if it was then how much back pressure would that little
steam orifice generate and how much energy would the system lose as steam
squeezes out that orifice. »
Rossi has said that his megawatt plant will
Mmm.. So you think if they'd used a smaller orifice and changed nothing else
the power would have jumped to 27KW?
On Fri, Sep 16, 2011 at 11:20 AM, Jouni Valkonen jounivalko...@gmail.comwrote:
Colin wrote: « Funny that this module should produce 20Kw if it's part of a
1MW reactor and if it was
In my opinion steam enthalpy is both necessary and sufficient. This is an
industrial test not a scientific one.
The question is if these two new surprisingly short tests are more
reliable and convincing than the former 7 ones.
to generate heat and to be a new energy source are not
identical.
Dear Horace,
Yes our points of view are quite similar.
These 2 tests can be characterized as partially aborted,
unfortunately.Or as an other disfunctionality starting with early DOING
AND NOT DOING in the same time, is the house's specialty.
Engineers are taught If you do something, do it well
Bologna April 19, 2011
Weight hydrogen bottle (attached, opened, closed, and detached):
- before: 13653.1 grams
- after: 13652.6 grams
Total loaded: 0.5 grams
Pressure H2 Bottle: 85 bar Reduced: 25 bar
Bologna April 28, 2011
Weight hydrogen bottle (attached, opened, closed, and detached):
-
These test results are indeed difficult to explain. I have one
question to those who have some or partial expert knowledge on steam
engineering: Does they use superheated steam or steam that is at
boiling point of local pressure? My guess is latter of course.
However, I cannot explain 130°C
Hi,
On 14-9-2011 12:05, Peter Heckert wrote:
Can this be? The Hydrogen bottle lost 25 bar of pressure and about 42
grams of hydrogen between April and September.
Does this make sense?
Well the following table is what the conditions might have been of the
bottle;
Presumed the contents of the
Peter Heckert peter.heck...@arcor.de wrote:
Can this be? The Hydrogen bottle lost 25 bar of pressure and about 42 grams
of hydrogen between April and September.
Does this make sense?
How much H2 is typically inside the bottle?
It is probably leaking a little. I have not seen the hardware,
whereas hydrogen at 60 bar
weighs 120 so you should see a gain.
- Original Message -
From: Jouni Valkonen jounivalko...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 8:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
These test results are indeed difficult
Hi,
On 14-9-2011 15:05, Joe Catania wrote:
I have to laugh at the hydrogen weight measurement in the Nyteknik
Preliminary Report. The report a 2.7 gram drop in weight after filling
with hydrogen. But an average air molecule weighs about 28 whereas
hydrogen at 60 bar weighs 120 so you should
inertia to CF in so
many words!
- Original Message -
From: Man on Bridges manonbrid...@aim.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 9:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Hi,
On 14-9-2011 15:05, Joe Catania wrote:
I have to laugh at the hydrogen weight
See the E-cat run in self-sustained mode
http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_miljo/energi/article3264362.ece
This video confirms my previous assumption above, that new E-Cat is
operating approximately 170 kPa overpressure. Also it confirms that
roughly 5 kW excess heat was produced. I have not
]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
See the E-cat run in self-sustained mode
http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_miljo/energi/article3264362.ece
This video confirms my previous assumption above, that new E-Cat is
operating approximately 170 kPa overpressure. Also it confirms that
roughly 5 kW excess heat
Joe Catania zrosumg...@aol.com wrote:
The E-Cat ran for 35 minutes without electrical power? Did anyone tell you
that the thermal inertia will run the E-Cat for that long?
At 22:35 input electric power was 2.5 kW. All electric power was cut off at
this time. The temperature dropped from
, September 14, 2011 10:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Joe Catania zrosumg...@aol.com wrote:
The E-Cat ran for 35 minutes without electrical power? Did anyone tell you
that the thermal inertia will run the E-Cat for that long?
At 22:35 input electric power was 2.5 kW. All
or growing perpendicular whiskers]
Fran
From: Joe Catania [mailto:zrosumg...@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 11:11 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
A) You're a fool to tell me that the E-Cat has no thermal inertia. It certainly
does
Amazing persistence with consistence by Rossi and unskilled observers,
as yet again a flawed demo that provides partial and inadequate
evidence and information for settling the issue of whether there is
indeed any excess heat or other anomalies...
Naturally, a pragmatic skeptic will consider how
: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Any mass has a certain gradient described in temp/time for thermal gain or
loss. I think Jed was specifying the period where the temperature rebounded
higher than it existed while being heated by input power. That seems anomalous
to me made more curious
At 05:00 AM 9/14/2011, Jouni Valkonen wrote:
These test results are indeed
difficult to explain.
And (regrettably) incomplete. We know that the power to the resistor was
being cycled on and off, but not the actual duty ratio!
Water came out -- but we don't know its temperature.
I have one
Mr. Catania,
What I found interesting about latest reply was the fact that you did
nothing more than restate your previous comment, basically that the
effects of thermal inertia in the recorded measurements have not been
accounted for. Meanwhile, Mr. Rothwell replied to your original
comment by
@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 1:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Mr. Catania,
What I found interesting about latest reply was the fact that you did
nothing more than restate your previous comment, basically that the
effects of thermal inertia in the recorded
OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote:
Meanwhile, Mr. Rothwell replied to your original comment by posting thermal
measurements that apparently reveal the interesting fact that thermal
inertia had already been taken into account when the temperature initially
dropped
Hello again, Mr. Catania,
I realize I'm just as guilty of using this term as you, but IMO the
continued use of the phrase, thermal inertia to explain the
interesting thermal temperature changes tends to confuse the issue
more than it helps. Technically speaking, what's happening here has
little
Am 14.09.2011 08:55, schrieb Peter Gluck:
a) See the E-cat run in the self sustaining mode
http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_miljo/energi/article3264362.ece
Here my Analysis:
At the end, when the water input valve is opened, then a mixture out of
water and steam comes out with
2011/9/14 Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com:
50% fluid water 2.5% drops 47.5% vapour
This must be noted that these estimations are when temperature was ca.
118 °C or 90 kPa overpressure. After that temperature rose to 133°C
and overpressure to 170 kPa. Therefore 60-80% of water was evaporated
and
inertia regime over
and the CF regime to have begun.
- Original Message -
From: Jed Rothwell
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 2:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote
, September 14, 2011 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Am 14.09.2011 08:55, schrieb Peter Gluck:
a) See the E-cat run in the self sustaining mode
http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_miljo/energi/article3264362.ece
Here my Analysis:
At the end, when
They admit themselves that steam quality could be as low as 59%. The
pressure in the E-Cat is probably near atmospheric.
- Original Message -
From: Jouni Valkonen jounivalko...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news
On Sep 14, 2011, at 6:11 AM, Jouni Valkonen wrote:
See the E-cat run in self-sustained mode
http://www.nyteknik.se/nyheter/energi_miljo/energi/article3264362.ece
[snip]
This video also disproofs wet steam hypothesis as steam and hot
water are clearly separated. There is definitely not Abd's
OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com
mailto:svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote:
Meanwhile, Mr. Rothwell replied to your original comment by posting
thermal measurements that apparently reveal the interesting fact
that thermal inertia had already been taken into account
2011/9/14 Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net:
I have to wonder if anyone associated with Rossi ever
going to actually do calorimetry on the output?
I will do it soon. Actually I am right now writing it. There are
plenty of ways to do calorimetry. Not all ways are written in the
engineer's
[mailto:zrosumg...@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 11:58 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
I think it caused a rise. There is no rise. Its your imagination. The
temperature at power off is too low and must be discarded. If I bring a
piece of metal
2011/9/14 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote:
Meanwhile, Mr. Rothwell replied to your original comment by posting
thermal measurements that apparently reveal the interesting fact that
thermal inertia had already been taken into
At 09:52 AM 9/14/2011, Rich Murray wrote:
Richard M. Any relation, I wonder?
September 14th, 2011 at 3:33 AM
Dear Mr. Andrea Rossi,
If you could spare a bit of time, I have a few questions.
1)Could you please inform us as to the reactor core volume of the new
E-Cat modules?
At 01:55 PM 9/14/2011, Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint wrote:
We know that the Setting is referring to the
duty cycle, but we do not know exactly what the
relationship is
since 9 is the MAXimum setting,
and Lewan states power was at this point
constantly switched on, then a setting of 9
is
Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com wrote:
Lewan did report that at setting 5 the ON and OFF times were equal.
So taking the duty cycle as PLC/9 is about as good as we can guess.
Lewan wrote that PLC/9 is full cycle. Also, that is a single digit decimal
display. It don't go any higher than 9. Nine
For once? I only been saying that one thing- many times. But you'd better
understand that from first principles not from a typo.
- Original Message -
From: Jed Rothwell
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 4:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news
On Sep 14, 2011, at 12:44 PM, Jouni Valkonen wrote:
2011/9/14 Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net:
I have to wonder if anyone associated with Rossi ever
going to actually do calorimetry on the output?
I will do it soon. Actually I am right now writing it. There are
plenty of ways to do
Well, at a setting of 9 you have the same temp rise in 35 minutes as
temperature fall in 35 minutes after power-off.
- Original Message -
From: Mark Iverson-ZeroPoint
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 4:55 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Wrong, nothing like that mass is necessary.
- Original Message -
From: Jouni Valkonen jounivalko...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
2011/9/14 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com:
OrionWorks - Steven
On 2011-09-14 23:18, Jed Rothwell wrote:
Lewan wrote that PLC/9 is full cycle. Also, that is a single digit
decimal display. It don't go any higher than 9. Nine is it. Back in the
day it would have gone all hexadecimal on you: 9, A, B, C, D, E, F.
The programmers would smile knowingly and the
They probably go from 80 to 100% in going from 8 to 9. So its obvious that
thermal inertia would take it out about 2hrs.
- Original Message -
From: Alan J Fletcher a...@well.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 5:07 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
From Catania:
For once? I only been saying that one thing- many times. But you'd better
understand that from first principles not from a typo.
From: Jed Rothwell
Okay, that's probably a typo, as shown in the video. For once
Catania is correct. The temperature did not drop suddenly and
then
On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 6:11 PM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson
svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote:
The implication I derive from Mr. Catania's response is
that he does not often seem to consider the possibility that his own
crafted assessments might occasionally be prone to similar mistakes.
It
, September 14, 2011 6:11 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
From Catania:
For once? I only been saying that one thing- many times. But you'd better
understand that from first principles not from a typo.
From: Jed Rothwell
Okay, that's probably a typo, as shown in the video. For once
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 6:11 PM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson
svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote:
The implication I derive from Mr. Catania's response is
that he does not often seem to consider the possibility that his own
crafted assessments might
Subject: Re: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
If you want the response from Sun Tzu study it yourself. If you have
nothing to say why refer me to Sun Tzu. Are you saying he does have
something to say?
- Original Message -
From: Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent
On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 6:40 PM, Joe Catania zrosumg...@aol.com wrote:
If you want the response from Sun Tzu study it yourself.
I have read the Art of War three times in my career of three decades
and learned much each time.
Regarding SVJ's ken, his art is his self awareness and his
If the input water is municipal water, then it contains minerals,
which will deposit out as boiler scale within the device, changing its
temperature flow characteristics and internal geometry -- for
instance, partially blocking and thus constricting the smallest outlet
diameter, increasing the
.
- Original Message -
From:
Mark
Iverson-ZeroPoint
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 4:55
PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at
Nyteknik
JC
stated:
“(and note that this
takes considerable time in the ramp up)”
Where
he
Its a first principle.
- Original Message -
From: Finlay MacNab
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2011 8:49 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Excellent observation! If this was a closed system with no FLOWING WATER
EXITING THE SYSTEM you
, September 14, 2011 8:49 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:E-cat news at Nyteknik
Excellent observation! If this was a closed system with no FLOWING WATER
EXITING THE SYSTEM you would have a point. As it is you have only discredited
your argument about thermal inertia. Congratulations!
I find your
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