Sorry not trying to be anal ... http://www.rfwireless-world.com/Articles/difference-between-SISO-and-MIMO.html
it is my understanding that in MIMO, each antenna can tx on both polarities, and on the RX side each antenna can receive both polarities. it is hard to argue how the antenna elements are setup in side the radio.. but my understanding was that not so with the AF11X, but I guess it would be fair to assume that it is a MIMO inside the unit (recognizing it's heritage... :) ) Faisal Imtiaz Snappy Internet & Telecom 7266 SW 48 Street Miami, FL 33155 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: [email protected] > From: "Josh Reynolds" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 9:35:05 PM > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system > There's 2 diplexers per side, so that would be 2 channel pairs, right? 2xTx > 2xRx? MIMO-FD? > On Oct 24, 2016 8:32 PM, "Faisal Imtiaz" < [email protected] > wrote: >> Yes, full duplex (as in using one channel for Tx & one for RX) >> MIMO as in using both polarities.. yes >> but as in using both channels to send & receive ... no not as per their >> specs. >> Faisal Imtiaz >> Snappy Internet & Telecom >> 7266 SW 48 Street >> Miami, FL 33155 >> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 >> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: [email protected] >>> From: "Josh Reynolds" < [email protected] > >>> To: [email protected] >>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 8:51:52 PM >>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system >>> AF11X actually has two internal radios if my understanding of the platform >>> is >>> correct. It is Full Duplex + MIMO. >>> On Oct 24, 2016 7:03 PM, "Bill Prince" < [email protected] > wrote: >>>> It's not 100% clear from your description, but the AF11x is using both >>>> polarities. >>>> The Mimosa is a very strange duck. Even using 2 channels and 2 polarities, >>>> there >>>> is no way to actually run it full duplex. The high-latency half duplex is >>>> pretty much baked in. IMO, it squanders air bandwidth at the expense of >>>> cheapness. And it's highest modulation rate is still only 256QAM. We had >>>> serious trouble trying to even get 256QAM on a relatively modest distance >>>> link. >>>> bp >>>> <part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com> >>>> On 10/24/2016 4:28 PM, Faisal Imtiaz wrote: >>>>> I will take a crack at it... just to make sure that My understanding is >>>>> correct >>>>> too. >>>>> In licensed radio world, the default lingo is as follows:- >>>>> A single channel is actually two channels, one channel is used to >>>>> Transmit and >>>>> the other channel is used to receive. >>>>> and each of these channels pair can be either in V polarity or H polarity >>>>> (but >>>>> not mingled). >>>>> XPIC is used to describe a radio where you can mount two radios together, >>>>> one >>>>> using the H polarity and the other using V polarity, but the same >>>>> channel... >>>>> But still only one channel (H + V) is used to transmit and the other >>>>> channel is >>>>> used to Receive. (Thus Full duplex) >>>>> MIMO...., = One Channel, both H & V polarities are used, and either one >>>>> can be >>>>> used for Tx and Rx (thus half duplex) >>>>> AF11x = Traditional Licensed radio... one channel/polarity for TX and one >>>>> channel/polarity for RX >>>>> Mimosa B11 = Disruptive... a very odd animal... can be configured as... >>>>> Use one channel (both polarities) for TX and one channel (both >>>>> polarities) for >>>>> RX >>>>> or ... Use Two Channels, both polarities in each channel, and use either >>>>> one to >>>>> TX & RX (more like a dual channel MIMO) >>>>> AF5 = Uses one channel (both polarities) for Tx and one channel (both >>>>> polarities) for RX >>>>> AF24 = can be used as >>>>> One Channel (Dual Polarities) for TX and one Channel (Dual Polarities) >>>>> for RX >>>>> or can use the same one channel (dual polarities) for Tx and Rx. >>>>> Hope this is as clear as mud ! >>>>> :) >>>>> Faisal Imtiaz >>>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom >>>>> 7266 SW 48 Street >>>>> Miami, FL 33155 >>>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 >>>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: [email protected] >>>>>> From: "George Skorup" <[email protected]> >>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 7:09:11 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system >>>>>> What's so much different between XPIC and MIMO? I'm asking because I >>>>>> guess I'm >>>>>> just ignorant. MIMO = single carrier (is OFDM implied?), dual streams? >>>>>> And XPIC >>>>>> = dual carriers (is single-carrier QAM per channel implied?) and >>>>>> independent >>>>>> streams that are aggregated in hardware, perhaps as simple as a LAG on >>>>>> the >>>>>> internal switch? Or does XPIC add some more magic? >>>>>> So then what is the UBNT AF11X considered? Or the AF5 and 24 for that >>>>>> matter >>>>>> since they're also capable of FDD. >>>>>> On 10/24/2016 5:23 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: >>>>>>> Can a non-vendor tell me if at higher order modulations if there's >>>>>>> limiting gain >>>>>>> from co-channel XPIC? I assume it works to some degree because it's >>>>>>> marketed >>>>>>> (yes, I have a tub of salt over here), but at some point the >>>>>>> modulations would >>>>>>> be sensitive enough where the X-pol isolation isn't sufficient? >>>>>>> Okay, a vendor can if they're more technical than salesy. >>>>>>> I'm not meaning to imply John was salesy. >>>>>>> ;-) >>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>> Mike Hammett >>>>>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>>>>> Midwest Internet Exchange >>>>>>> The Brothers WISP >>>>>>> From: "John Seaman" <[email protected]> >>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 3:55:17 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system >>>>>>> Hi Ken, the Lynx and Orion are largely identical. The biggest >>>>>>> difference between >>>>>>> the two is that the Orion supports XPIC where as the Lynx does not. >>>>>>> Keep in >>>>>>> mind that either model can be set up for 2+0, but only with the Orion >>>>>>> can both >>>>>>> radios operate on the same channel. Other than that, the Orion does >>>>>>> offer >>>>>>> higher TX power (for certain frequencies) compared to the Lynx. However >>>>>>> with 6 >>>>>>> GHz, the TX frequency for Lynx and Orion are the same. Orion also >>>>>>> features >>>>>>> SynchE/1588 functionality which is not found on the Lynx. Both models >>>>>>> now >>>>>>> support buffer size up to 8 MB. >>>>>>> John Seaman | Sales | Trango Systems, Inc. | >>>>>>> +1-858-248-4006 >>>>>>> www.trangosys.com >>>>>>> Innovating Microwave Backhaul ™ >>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 11:38 AM, Ken Hohhof < [email protected] > wrote: >>>>>>>> Jeremy, I’m trying to remember, can you upgrade that Lynx to 2+0 with >>>>>>>> a license >>>>>>>> key as long as you don’t need XPIC? Trango doesn’t spell it out very >>>>>>>> well on >>>>>>>> their website, but it looks like the major differences between Lynx >>>>>>>> and Orion >>>>>>>> are buffer size, XPIC, and maybe the interface and powering options? >>>>>>>> So that >>>>>>>> you could still double the throughput as long as you can license a >>>>>>>> different >>>>>>>> frequency pair for the other polarization. And the issue of the wired >>>>>>>> interface >>>>>>>> speed. >>>>>>>> From: Af [mailto: [email protected] ] On Behalf Of Jeremy >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, October 21, 2016 10:16 PM >>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system >>>>>>>> I don't know who has the biggest or best, but my 6GHz Trango Apex Lynx >>>>>>>> has been >>>>>>>> rock solid for going on four years now. It does 700Mbps FDX. I believe >>>>>>>> that the >>>>>>>> Trango Orion has XPIC up to 1.5Gbps in a 56Mhz channel. >>>>>>>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Josh Reynolds < [email protected] >>>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>>>> Why in the world would they buy Exalt? >>>>>>>>> On Oct 21, 2016 8:10 PM, "Jaime Solorza" < [email protected] >>>>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I thought Crisco bought out Exalt >>>>>>>>>> On Oct 21, 2016 5:10 PM, "Ken Hohhof" < [email protected] > wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> I thought I got an ad recently from Exalt about a big sale through >>>>>>>>>>> the end of >>>>>>>>>>> the year on Extreme Air 6Hz. Oops, I just found the email, and it’s >>>>>>>>>>> everything >>>>>>>>>>> but 6 GHz. Not sure I’d buy Exalt anyway. Maybe someone else was >>>>>>>>>>> having an >>>>>>>>>>> overstock sale on 6 GHz? >>>>>>>>>>> From: Af [mailto: [email protected] ] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, October 21, 2016 5:50 PM >>>>>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system >>>>>>>>>>> First I have to find out if there are channels in this area. >>>>>>>>>>> Then I have a passive repeater to deal with... >>>>>>>>>>> Not a simple path to engineer. >>>>>>>>>>> From: Daniel White >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, October 21, 2016 4:33 PM >>>>>>>>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Highest capacity 6 GHz system >>>>>>>>>>> Well you can only use 60MHz channels max. That helps make it more >>>>>>>>>>> competitive. >>>>>>>>>>> 6GHz most likely precludes higher modulations… you just won’t have >>>>>>>>>>> the link >>>>>>>>>>> budget. Also depends if you’re going all outdoor or >>>>>>>>>>> split-mount/all-indoor. >>>>>>>>>>> I’d be shocked if there is a winner here – I’d go with the solution >>>>>>>>>>> your most >>>>>>>>>>> comfortable with. >>>>>>>>>>> My guess is you will end up with Ceragon/Cambium or SIAE. >>>>>>>>>>> DragonWave Harmony >>>>>>>>>>> Advanced is certainly worth a look, although I’m not sure about 6GHz >>>>>>>>>>> availability since it just started shipping. >>>>>>>>>>> Chuck feel free to contact me offlist and we could look at some >>>>>>>>>>> things. >>>>>>>>>>> Daniel White >>>>>>>>>>> Managing Director – Hardware Distribution Sales >>>>>>>>>>> ConVergence Technologies >>>>>>>>>>> Cell: +1 (303) 746-3590 >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>> ...
