The BMW UUC Digest Volume 2 : Issue 801 : "text" Format Messages in this Issue: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Re: [bmwuucdigest] digest(13 messages) Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) FS: 2000 528iT sports package
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 13:07:38 -0700 From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> IMHO the mechanical fan is over kill on an E36. If (big if) the electrical fan and temp switch are working as advertised the mech fan is redundant. You should really only need the fan at low speed, the 2 speed electrical fan should be fine. This isn't the first time I've heard of one coming apart and taking stuff with it. My CTS-V doesn't come with a mechanical fan. Marco -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 12:59 PM To: [email protected] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) I don't associate a clattering noise with water pump failure, but let me share a story with ya. My friend Bill recently purchased an E36 325is. He knew of the cooling system problems with this model and intended to change the water pump and radiator *real soon*. But before *real soon* actually happened, a radiator hose neck broke off, necessitating a tow. So he did the radiator, water pump, thermostat and thermostat housing. He figured he was now ready for years of cooling system trouble-free driving. He's on a vacation trip to Idaho. I got an e-mail earlier this week from him. He was between Crater Lake and Bend, Oregon when he heard a loud thwack noise. He pulled over, looked under the car and under the hood, saw nothing wrong, got back in and continued the trip. A while later he heard a couple more thwacks, followed by the temp gauge rising. Pulled over again, and under the hood, found that the engine-driven cooling fan had disintegrated. It also took out the overflow hose. He had it towed into Bend and found a German car repair place. The plan was to replace the fan and hose, and then pressure test the system to see if it still holds pressure. The mechanic was concerned that damage was done to the new radiator, in which case he'll be buying another one. So, 1) check your fan to see if it is coming apart and making contact with something under the hood. And, B), add the main cooling fan replacement to the list of cooling system parts that should be periodically changed as a preventative measure. Scott Miller GGC BMW CCA >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 07:00:39 -0700 (PDT) >From: P Kroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: UUC Digest <[email protected]> >Subject: E36 Noise (water pump?) >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >I know diagnosing a noise over the internet is >difficult, but my 96 328i is making a slight >clattering noise that can only be heard (for the most >part) when outside. My first thought is that it might >be the water pump. I thought that I heard that BMW >uses a plastic water pump that tends to brake apart. >I don't have any cooling issues (yet?). > >It is definitely coming from the front of the motor. >Does this sound like a water pump about to crap-out on >me? If it is the water pump, how hard are they to >change out. It looks to be pretty easy. > >Thanks, > >-Paul >96 328i >03 G35 >98 Panoz AIV Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 13:13:45 -0700 From: "Jason Knight" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Well if GM does it then it must be ok. ;-) Actually the cts-v is one of the few GM products I'd buy. Jason -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Marco Romani Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 1:08 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) My CTS-V doesn't come with a mechanical fan. Marco ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 13:45:42 -0700 From: Kazuto Okayasu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 01:07 PM 9/9/2005, you wrote: BMW figured this out, too. On the E46, only automatics have both a mechanical and an electric pusher fan. Manuals (like mine) only have a puller electric fan (which, incidentally, dropped like flies and was a recall item back in 01) >IMHO the mechanical fan is over kill on an E36. If (big if) the electrical >fan and temp switch are working as advertised the mech fan is redundant. >You should really only need the fan at low speed, the 2 speed electrical fan >should be fine. > >This isn't the first time I've heard of one coming apart and taking stuff >with it. > >My CTS-V doesn't come with a mechanical fan. > >Marco > >-----Original Message----- >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 12:59 PM >To: [email protected] >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) > > >I don't associate a clattering noise with water pump failure, but let me >share a story with ya. > >My friend Bill recently purchased an E36 325is. He knew of the cooling >system problems with this model and intended to change the water pump and >radiator *real soon*. But before *real soon* actually happened, a radiator >hose neck broke off, necessitating a tow. So he did the radiator, water >pump, thermostat and thermostat housing. He figured he was now ready for >years of cooling system trouble-free driving. > >He's on a vacation trip to Idaho. I got an e-mail earlier this week from >him. He was between Crater Lake and Bend, Oregon when he heard a loud >thwack noise. He pulled over, looked under the car and under the hood, saw >nothing wrong, got back in and continued the trip. A while later he heard >a couple more thwacks, followed by the temp gauge rising. Pulled over >again, and under the hood, found that the engine-driven cooling fan had >disintegrated. It also took out the overflow hose. He had it towed into >Bend and found a German car repair place. The plan was to replace the fan >and hose, and then pressure test the system to see if it still holds >pressure. The mechanic was concerned that damage was done to the new >radiator, in which case he'll be buying another one. > >So, 1) check your fan to see if it is coming apart and making contact with >something under the hood. And, B), add the main cooling fan replacement to >the list of cooling system parts that should be periodically changed as a >preventative measure. > >Scott Miller >GGC BMW CCA > > >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 07:00:39 -0700 (PDT) > >From: P Kroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >To: UUC Digest <[email protected]> > >Subject: E36 Noise (water pump?) > >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >I know diagnosing a noise over the internet is > >difficult, but my 96 328i is making a slight > >clattering noise that can only be heard (for the most > >part) when outside. My first thought is that it might > >be the water pump. I thought that I heard that BMW > >uses a plastic water pump that tends to brake apart. > >I don't have any cooling issues (yet?). > > > >It is definitely coming from the front of the motor. > >Does this sound like a water pump about to crap-out on > >me? If it is the water pump, how hard are they to > >change out. It looks to be pretty easy. > > > >Thanks, > > > >-Paul > >96 328i > >03 G35 > >98 Panoz AIV > > >Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > >__________________________________________________________________________ >In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > >UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate >Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! >908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > >Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > >__________________________________________________________________________ >In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > >UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate >Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! >908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com Kazuto Okayasu Manager, Desktop Support Services Administrative Computing Services, University of California, Irvine [EMAIL PROTECTED] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 17:16:52 -0400 From: "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> A mechanical fan pulls much more air than an electric one. I think its mostly needed for air conditioning in heavy traffic. If the electric fans are designed for the entire load, that is OK also. Gary Derian > IMHO the mechanical fan is over kill on an E36. If (big if) the > electrical > fan and temp switch are working as advertised the mech fan is redundant. > You should really only need the fan at low speed, the 2 speed electrical > fan > should be fine. > > This isn't the first time I've heard of one coming apart and taking stuff > with it. > > My CTS-V doesn't come with a mechanical fan. > > Marco > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 12:59 PM > To: [email protected] > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) > > > I don't associate a clattering noise with water pump failure, but let me > share a story with ya. > > My friend Bill recently purchased an E36 325is. He knew of the cooling > system problems with this model and intended to change the water pump and > radiator *real soon*. But before *real soon* actually happened, a > radiator > hose neck broke off, necessitating a tow. So he did the radiator, water > pump, thermostat and thermostat housing. He figured he was now ready for > years of cooling system trouble-free driving. > > He's on a vacation trip to Idaho. I got an e-mail earlier this week from > him. He was between Crater Lake and Bend, Oregon when he heard a loud > thwack noise. He pulled over, looked under the car and under the hood, > saw > nothing wrong, got back in and continued the trip. A while later he heard > a couple more thwacks, followed by the temp gauge rising. Pulled over > again, and under the hood, found that the engine-driven cooling fan had > disintegrated. It also took out the overflow hose. He had it towed into > Bend and found a German car repair place. The plan was to replace the fan > and hose, and then pressure test the system to see if it still holds > pressure. The mechanic was concerned that damage was done to the new > radiator, in which case he'll be buying another one. > > So, 1) check your fan to see if it is coming apart and making contact with > something under the hood. And, B), add the main cooling fan replacement > to > the list of cooling system parts that should be periodically changed as a > preventative measure. > > Scott Miller > GGC BMW CCA > >>Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 07:00:39 -0700 (PDT) >>From: P Kroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>To: UUC Digest <[email protected]> >>Subject: E36 Noise (water pump?) >>Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >>I know diagnosing a noise over the internet is >>difficult, but my 96 328i is making a slight >>clattering noise that can only be heard (for the most >>part) when outside. My first thought is that it might >>be the water pump. I thought that I heard that BMW >>uses a plastic water pump that tends to brake apart. >>I don't have any cooling issues (yet?). >> >>It is definitely coming from the front of the motor. >>Does this sound like a water pump about to crap-out on >>me? If it is the water pump, how hard are they to >>change out. It looks to be pretty easy. >> >>Thanks, >> >>-Paul >>96 328i >>03 G35 >>98 Panoz AIV > > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 14:35:33 -0700 From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> yep. I think that's one of the reasons the E36 electric fan is two speeds. I do have to caveat I never tested it out in Death Valley with the A/C on ;-) Marco -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Gary Derian Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 2:17 PM To: Marco Romani; [email protected] Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) A mechanical fan pulls much more air than an electric one. I think its mostly needed for air conditioning in heavy traffic. If the electric fans are designed for the entire load, that is OK also. Gary Derian > IMHO the mechanical fan is over kill on an E36. If (big if) the > electrical > fan and temp switch are working as advertised the mech fan is redundant. > You should really only need the fan at low speed, the 2 speed electrical > fan > should be fine. > > This isn't the first time I've heard of one coming apart and taking stuff > with it. > > My CTS-V doesn't come with a mechanical fan. > > Marco > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 12:59 PM > To: [email protected] > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) > > > I don't associate a clattering noise with water pump failure, but let me > share a story with ya. > > My friend Bill recently purchased an E36 325is. He knew of the cooling > system problems with this model and intended to change the water pump and > radiator *real soon*. But before *real soon* actually happened, a > radiator > hose neck broke off, necessitating a tow. So he did the radiator, water > pump, thermostat and thermostat housing. He figured he was now ready for > years of cooling system trouble-free driving. > > He's on a vacation trip to Idaho. I got an e-mail earlier this week from > him. He was between Crater Lake and Bend, Oregon when he heard a loud > thwack noise. He pulled over, looked under the car and under the hood, > saw > nothing wrong, got back in and continued the trip. A while later he heard > a couple more thwacks, followed by the temp gauge rising. Pulled over > again, and under the hood, found that the engine-driven cooling fan had > disintegrated. It also took out the overflow hose. He had it towed into > Bend and found a German car repair place. The plan was to replace the fan > and hose, and then pressure test the system to see if it still holds > pressure. The mechanic was concerned that damage was done to the new > radiator, in which case he'll be buying another one. > > So, 1) check your fan to see if it is coming apart and making contact with > something under the hood. And, B), add the main cooling fan replacement > to > the list of cooling system parts that should be periodically changed as a > preventative measure. > > Scott Miller > GGC BMW CCA > >>Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 07:00:39 -0700 (PDT) >>From: P Kroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>To: UUC Digest <[email protected]> >>Subject: E36 Noise (water pump?) >>Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >>I know diagnosing a noise over the internet is >>difficult, but my 96 328i is making a slight >>clattering noise that can only be heard (for the most >>part) when outside. My first thought is that it might >>be the water pump. I thought that I heard that BMW >>uses a plastic water pump that tends to brake apart. >>I don't have any cooling issues (yet?). >> >>It is definitely coming from the front of the motor. >>Does this sound like a water pump about to crap-out on >>me? If it is the water pump, how hard are they to >>change out. It looks to be pretty easy. >> >>Thanks, >> >>-Paul >>96 328i >>03 G35 >>98 Panoz AIV > > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > > Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 13:11:32 -0700 From: "Jason Knight" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> My e30 325i had the water pump go bad, resulting in the fan hitting the upper radiator hose (one of the multitude of hoses on that thing) and the radiator. I've never had to unbutton the M3, so I don't know if E36s have the same design. Speaking of which anyone need a fan that's missing a blade or a radiator with a circular area that has the cooling fins all flattened? Free to a good home... Jason -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, September 09, 2005 12:59 PM To: [email protected] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [UUC] E36 Noise (water pump?) I don't associate a clattering noise with water pump failure, but let me share a story with ya. My friend Bill recently purchased an E36 325is. He knew of the cooling system problems with this model and intended to change the water pump and radiator *real soon*. But before *real soon* actually happened, a radiator hose neck broke off, necessitating a tow. So he did the radiator, water pump, thermostat and thermostat housing. He figured he was now ready for years of cooling system trouble-free driving. He's on a vacation trip to Idaho. I got an e-mail earlier this week from him. He was between Crater Lake and Bend, Oregon when he heard a loud thwack noise. He pulled over, looked under the car and under the hood, saw nothing wrong, got back in and continued the trip. A while later he heard a couple more thwacks, followed by the temp gauge rising. Pulled over again, and under the hood, found that the engine-driven cooling fan had disintegrated. It also took out the overflow hose. He had it towed into Bend and found a German car repair place. The plan was to replace the fan and hose, and then pressure test the system to see if it still holds pressure. The mechanic was concerned that damage was done to the new radiator, in which case he'll be buying another one. So, 1) check your fan to see if it is coming apart and making contact with something under the hood. And, B), add the main cooling fan replacement to the list of cooling system parts that should be periodically changed as a preventative measure. Scott Miller GGC BMW CCA >Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2005 07:00:39 -0700 (PDT) >From: P Kroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: UUC Digest <[email protected]> >Subject: E36 Noise (water pump?) >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >I know diagnosing a noise over the internet is >difficult, but my 96 328i is making a slight >clattering noise that can only be heard (for the most >part) when outside. My first thought is that it might >be the water pump. I thought that I heard that BMW >uses a plastic water pump that tends to brake apart. >I don't have any cooling issues (yet?). > >It is definitely coming from the front of the motor. >Does this sound like a water pump about to crap-out on >me? If it is the water pump, how hard are they to >change out. It looks to be pretty easy. > >Thanks, > >-Paul >96 328i >03 G35 >98 Panoz AIV Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] __________________________________________________________________________ In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, founder of the BMW CCA. UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and home of the Ultimate Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 14:18:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Vince Leo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [bmwuucdigest] digest(13 messages) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Obviously mistype on my part... probably thinking about the old e30 :) Vince Uh, timing belt replaced in a 535? You may want to correct something in the post. Clarence West Bend, WI Vince Leo wrote: > I am selling my 1990 e34 535i 5 speed manual. The car > is black with a tan interior. Very good shape. New > Bilstein shocks with H&R sport springs - not harsh at > all, very comfortable ride, but sporty. > > Many normal wear items replaced in last couple years > including battery, driveshaft, timing belt, head > gasket, clutch, brakes, etc. Needs nothing. > > Approx 170K miles (so it only has about another 150K > left on the motor). > > Minor stone chips on the hood and a small scratch on > the right front fender. Leather is good with some > cracking on the driver side bolster. > > No rust on the door bottoms! > > $4,950 OBO. > > The car is located in Fairport (Rochester), NY 14450 > with a clean title. I can get pics by Monday. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 14:57:10 -0700 From: donna seeley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Subject: Re: E36 Noise (water pump?) Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Locals may remember I chased this problem on the E30 a couple of years ago, going through a few fans and hoses before finding the wobble in my newish aftermarket water pump. It wasn't severe enough to break the fan or make the fan cut through the hose quickly, so several of us missed it. Of course, when I gave up and brought it to Bill, it took him 5 minutes to find the problem. :( Donna On 9/9/05 12:59 PM, "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I don't associate a clattering noise with water pump failure, but let me > share a story with ya. > <snip story> > Pulled over again, and under the hood, found that the engine-driven cooling > fan had disintegrated. It also took out the overflow hose. > So, 1) check your fan to see if it is coming apart and making contact with > something under the hood. And, B), add the main cooling fan replacement to > the list of cooling system parts that should be periodically changed as a > preventative measure. > > Scott Miller > GGC BMW CCA ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:14:14 -0400 From: "Dennis Liu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "BMW List" <[email protected]> Subject: FS: 2000 528iT sports package Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Ok, ok, mea culpa, I've been kinda sorta threatening to sell this wagon for some time now, but the giant Family Truckster (first 2006 model year Nissan Armada) we ordered is finally here (in yet another demonstration of my remarkable market timing - yep, NOW get a giant SUV with bad gas mileage), so it's time to sell the sportwagon. Six vehicles for two adults is just ridiculous, not to mention the complete dearth of room to park everything, so . . . . It's a 2000 BMW 528iT sportwagon that I bought as a present to my wife two years ago (when she refused to get a mini-van). We're the 2nd owner, 59,800 miles, silver/black, excellent condition inside and out. Options include Sport package (inc. sport seats, M-steering wheel, sport suspension, shadowline sport trim, 17" BBS wheels), Steptronic transmission, heated seats, rain sensing wipers, self-leveling rear suspension, electrochromatic rear view mirror, metallic paint, power moonroof, premium audio system, rear side airbags, compact disc changer, and maybe one or two other options I've forgotten, though no ski sack for some reason. I also have a spare set of wheels with snow tires mounted. All services done and up to date. According to Edmunds.com, the wagon is worth $17,075 on trade-in, $19,183 as a private party sale, and $21,670 if one were to buy from a dealer. The Kelly Blue Book is broader, but the midpoint is close: $16,700, $20,180 and $24,115, respectively. First reasonable offer takes it, or else it gets traded in when I pick up the Truckster. Let me know if you're interested! (and/or if anyone has a good opinion on what it's worth, let me know.) Thanks, --Dennis West of Boston 2000 528iT 1995 740iL 1995 F355 Berlinetta 1995 F355 Challenge 1999 Porsche 911 Carrera 2006 Nissan Armada tow vehicle and baby schlepper ------------------------------ End of [bmwuucdigest] digest(9 messages) **********
