On Wednesday, October 2, 2002, at 08:36  AM, Chip Scheide wrote:

> I currenlty support 35 macs + my own,

Then your cost to upgrade is not $4,600; it is no more than $1,400.  
(There's a retail "Family Pack" that contains licenses for up to five 
Macs; it retails for $199.  And, as I mentioned in my previous message, 
Apple most likely has site licenses for larger installations.

> * the Dock - when hidden pops up, when not applications either during
> launch or when they want attention 'bounce'. Also no way to turn this
> peice of junk off.

The bounce can be turned off when launching.  The bounce when they want 
attention is no different from the flashing menu icon in earlier OSs.  
And the Dock is not a piece of junk; it's one of the best UI features 
ever to appear.

> * the "toolbar" - unneeded repitition of commands.  Most of the toolbar
> functions already exist in the primary menubar - where they belong 
> since
> they apply to all objects in the interface (such as view settings).

The toolbar can be hidden--that's what the oval button on the top right 
is for.  Further, in almost every application, it can be customized.

Further, redundancy is not bad.  It gives you a choice of how to do 
things, and has been with the Mac from day one in one form or another.  
Command keys are a redundancy to the menus.  Floating tool bars, such 
as in Emailer, are another.

Just because you don't use a feature doesn't mean that the feature is 
bad; there are other people who would complain if that feature didn't 
exist.

> * Wasted interface space - the area the toolbar takes since all the
> commands are already elsewhere all that spece is wasted - it is also
> cuttered

You're repeating yourself.  besides, as I said, you can hide the 
toolbar.

> Break from existing (previous) interface - WITH OUT good (exteme) 
> reason

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean that there's no good 
reason.  I had the same concern as you do about the controls being too 
close together; turns out that it's not a concern at all for me; I just 
do not hit the wrong button.

> Additonally Apple put the stupid toolbar button in the
> location that the previous interface had the minimize/resize buttons.

Why is that button stupid?  And it took me about three minutes or less 
to adjust to the new positions of buttons in the title bar.  Big deal, 
ho hum.

> Removal of existing functionality
> * window shade

Minimizing works better; you don't have a window's title bar cluttering 
the screen.

> * apple menu (customizable)

Dock works just as well--better, actually.

> * application menu

Dock works just as well--better, actually.

> * tabbed windows

Most stupid thing Apple ever had; they cluttered the screen and didn't 
offer very much to the user experience.  A waste of time and 
engineering resources.

> Ok - so now the new machine I just spent a minimum of $1200 on does not
> have enough RAM torun the OS that comes installed on it?!?! this is a
> good selling point.

That was true of OS 9 as well.  I had to upgrade my iMac to 384 megs to 
get reasonable functionality; that same 384 megs works very well with 
OS X, so I didn't have to add more RAM when I switched OSs.

>> - I need to reboot once a week due to swap files adding up. I suspect
>> this is because 352 MB is too little RAM for OS X.
> and this is something extra wondeful! -
> I have machines here at work, and my machine at home (before installing
> X) which ran for months with out ever being turned off (or rebooted or
> crashed) under OS 9.

I averaged a crash every second day with earlier OS versions, but have 
never had a system crash with OS X.  And I've never had a crashing 
application take down the entire system under OS X; I can't say the 
same for earlier OS versions.

It seems to me that you expect Apple to design an OS to meet your needs 
and wants, and to ignore what anyone else may need or want.

The bottom line, though, is if what you have serves your purposes, 
stick with it.  I talked my best friend out of upgrading to OS X 
because she doesn't need it.  It would have been a waste of money for 
her.

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