I have been pondering this issue a bit and I am intrigued about how you
regard the problem space we inhabit. When you say things like ...
"Are you aware that If comp is true, that is if I am a machine ..."
I cannot fathom how you ever get to this point. This is a presupposition
that arises somehow in the lexicon you have established within your
overall framework of thinking. Let me have a stab at how my view and
In my view
A) There is a natural world.
We, Turing machines dogs, computers are all being 'computed' by it.
This is a set of unknown naturally occurring symbols
The natural 'symbols' interact naturally.
This is 'natural computation'. NOT like desktop computing.
Universe U ensues.
Scientist S is being computed within U
Scientist S can observe U from within.
U makes use of fundamental properties of the symbols to enable
.... observation, from within. Call this principle P-O
B) This is a symbolic description of U created by S from within U
S can concoct a description of the natural symbols in (A)
It need not be unique, many (B) correspond to one (A)
S can never know if it's completely done.
S can never know the real nature of the sybols in (A)
Descriptions (B), with P-O, explains observation and the observer S
C) There is a _second_ description
It is also concocted by S
These are the normal empirical laws we all know so well
It describes how the U appears to S from inside
It need not be unique, many (C) correspond to one (A)
No (C) ever explains observation.
In this framework
(i) a computer running description/rules (B) is not the natural world.
(ii) a computer running description/rules (C) is not the natural world.
(iii) a computer running descriptions (B) or (C) is 'artificially
(iv) (C) is physics that present day scientists construct
(v) (B) is physics of a natural world prior to an observer.
(vi) (A) is 'NATURALLY computing' in the sense that it is literally
'computing' scientist S.
These options are the logically justifiable position we can take when we
are, as we are, inside U trying to work U out from within, using an
observation faculty provided by U as part of (A). Empirical evidence
justifying (C) is normal overvation (contents of one or more
observer-agreed conscious experisnces). Empirical evidence justifying
(B) is implicit in the existence of an observer concocting a set (C).
You can't be confused about an bservation unless there is an observer to
All that said.....now ....
You mention "digital physics". You say "Are you aware that If COMP is
true, that is if I am a machine ..."
In terms of my framework....you are speaking of ...what?
(1) A 'Turing machine (digital computer)' inside U running (B)
(2) The natural computation itself, of kind (A)?
(3) Some kind of magical 'computer' in idea-space computing us as (A)?
i.e. A 'virtual machine' that 'acts as if' it generates an arbitrary
number of different U?
The COMP I talk about having refuted is in (i) or (ii) above.
I suspect this is not the COMP you are speaking of...
As far as I can tell we're not even on the same page. Maybe others here
are in a similar position and don't know it.
I hope you can help.
NOTE: When I say I want to build an artificial general intelligence, I
say I can build, within (A), using chunks of (A), an inorganic observer
of kind S, say S', that will also be able to observe and concoct (B)
and (C). S' will NOT be 'artificially computing' rules (B) or (C)! There
will be some symbolic manipulation in the hardware, but this is not S',
it merely drives some of the S' hardware, like the rules that drive
synaptic plasticity. Background housekeeping. In that event, in my
framework, the natural world (A) will be 'computing' S' too. The
properties of (A) called P-O above, that make S observe also operate
within S'. The explanation of HOW observation happens is in P-O as it is
configured in (B).
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