On 5/29/2012 11:52 PM, meekerdb wrote:

On 5/29/2012 8:11 PM, Aleksandr Lokshin wrote:The original poster introduces what free will means.1) Every choice which is allowed in physics is a random choice or adeterminate one.2) If human free will choice exists, it is agreed that it is notdetermined by some law and is not a random process.3)We have agfeed that the choice of "an arbitrary element" is not arandom chaice and is not a choice determinate by some law.We haven't even agreed that it is a choice. It's just using afunction, as in (. is an element of X) so (x is an element of X)->trueand (y is an element of X)->false. (all x |x an element of X) doesn'tinvolve choosing an element x, just specifying a function that definesX. Then it is a "choice determinate by some law." And whether X isinfinite or finite is a red herring. Suppose I said,"Consider anarbitrary person with no feet. Then he has no toenails." This is aperfectly valid inference whether there are finitely many orinfinitely many persons in the multiverse.Brent

Brent,

`You are assuming that there is no difference between an known and`

`an unknown quantity. A big mistake!`

4)Therefore I do call it "a free will choice in mathematics". One canconsider it as a definition of a specific "free will choice inmathematics".5) If one uses mathematics, then one operates with a process which isprohibited in physics. Therefore an investigator who uses mathematicscannot deny existence of mental processes which cannot be describedby physics (and, in particular, cannot deny existence of free will,even if "free will" is not introduced explicitly).Good luck.On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 6:39 AM, Stephen P. King<stephe...@charter.net <mailto:stephe...@charter.net>> wrote:On 5/29/2012 2:09 PM, Joseph Knight wrote:On Tue, May 29, 2012 at 12:52 PM, John Clark <johnkcl...@gmail.com <mailto:johnkcl...@gmail.com>> wrote: On Sun, May 27, 2012 Aleksandr Lokshin <aaloks...@gmail.com <mailto:aaloks...@gmail.com>> wrote: > All main mathematical notions ( such as infinity, variable, integer number) implicitlydepend on the notion of free will.Because nobody can explain what the ASCII string "free will" means the above statement is of no value. Precisely. The original poster should introduce some sensible definition of free will. Good luck!

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