Hi Bruno,

Maybe it's time to update your fractal zoom links :-)

http://vimeo.com/12185093

Here's a couple 3d "mandelbulb" worlds which no doubt require
significantly more than 1K to implement, but purely mathematical
nonetheless:

https://vimeo.com/18308069
https://vimeo.com/36857924

In general vimeo is superior to youtube because most video producers
create HD-quality video. All of these will benefit from watching in
full-screen.

These videos are a better answer to the question "what is god?" than
anything that could be expressed in words, imho.

Best,
Terren

On Tue, Sep 11, 2012 at 1:20 PM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote:
>
> On 11 Sep 2012, at 13:27, Roger Clough wrote:
>
> Hi Bruno Marchal
>
> If I ever doubt that there is a God,
> the regularity of Newton's physics or
> the microscopic structure of a snowflake
> dispels such doubt.
>
> These show design.
> Design cannot be made randomly.
> So there must be some intelligence interweaved in Nature.
> I call that God.
>
> That nature has structure and laws, to me indicates
> that there must be some superintelligence at work.
>
>
> OK. And with comp a case can be made that it is the intelligence innate to
> arithmetic.
>
> Look how lawful and rich a very simple program, less than 1K, can define:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTuP02b_a7Y
>
> It is a succession of different zoom on the Mandelbrot set, which is
> basically defined by the set of complex number c such that the iteration,
> starting from z = 0, of z_n = (z_n-1)^2 + c don't diverge.
>
> If you can see intelligent design in a snowflake, I can see intelligent
> design in the Mandelbrot set, and in the circle too. It abounds in math and
> in arithmetic.
>
> Bruno
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Roger Clough, rclo...@verizon.net
> 9/11/2012
> Leibniz would say, "If there's no God, we'd have to invent him
> so that everything could function."
>
> ----- Receiving the following content -----
> From: Bruno Marchal
> Receiver: everything-list
> Time: 2012-09-10, 13:17:52
> Subject: Re: The poverty of computers
>
> Roger,
>
> I agree with John here. Except that his point is more agnostic than atheist.
>
> A better question to John would be: explain where consciousness and
> universes come from, or what is your big picture. John is mute on this, but
> his stucking on step 3 illustrates that he might be a religious believer in
> a material universe, or in physicalism. Perhaps.
>
> To be clear on atheism, I use modal logic (informally). if Bx means "I
> believe in x", and if g means (god exists)
>
> A believer is characterized by Bg
> An atheist by B ~g
> An agnostic by ~Bg & ~B~g
>
> But you can replace g by m (primitive matter), and be atheist with respect
> of matter, etc.
>
> Someone who say that he does not believe in God, usually take for granted
> other sort of God, that is they make a science, like physics, which is
> irreproachable by itself, into an explanation of everything, which is just
> another religion or pseudo religion, if not assumed clearly.
>
> I advocate that we can do theology as seriously as physics by making clear
> the assumptions. Like with comp which appears to be closer to Bg than to Bm.
> But g might be itself no more than arithmetical truth, or even a tiny part
> of it.
>
> Bruno
>
>
>
> On 10 Sep 2012, at 18:27, John Clark wrote:
>
> On Mon, Sep 10, 2012  Roger Clough <rclo...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>>  > If you are an atheist, prove that God does not exist. If you can't, you
>> are a hypocrite in attacking those that do believe that God exists. You
>> haven't a leg to stand on.
>
>
> A fool disbelieves only in the things he can prove not to exist, the wise
> man also disbelieves in things that are silly. A china teapot orbiting the
> planet Uranus is silly, and so is God.
>
>  John K Clark
>
>
>
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