On 10 Dec 2012, at 19:03, Richard Ruquist wrote:
On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 11:42 AM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> wrote:Richard, On 10 Dec 2012, at 16:17, Richard Ruquist wrote:Roger Bruno, How is consciousness related to god? It seems like the beginning of an infinite god regression.God = Truth (Plato). OK? With the CTM, arithmetical truth is enough (and atiny provable part is enough for the ontology). I would say that consciousness is a form of knowledge.Knowledge intersects belief and truth. (It is a private undefinable notion,with CTM). The knower in you is the "inner God", which is God restricted by the universal window of your brain/body.I don't know if God (truth) is conscious, but without God (truth) I doubt I could be conscious, even if most of the content of my consciousness is wrong (except on the indubitable fixed point, and perhaops the sharablke oart ofmath, arithmetic, perhaps).I have no certainties, and that is why I use the arithmetical translation ofPlotinus in such conversation, with God = Arithmetical Truth Believable = (sigma_1) provable = universal (Löbian) machine Knowable = the same, but true (unlike proved) = the inner god = the universal soul intelligible matter = the same as 'believable", but together with consistence sensible matter = the same as intelligible matter, but as trueThat gives eight modalities, as they divided by incompleteness (except Godand the Soul).If Gödel's incompleteness theorem was wrong, all those modalities would collapse. Despite the modalities extension is the same set of arithmetical propositions, the machine cannot knows that, and this change drastically thelogic of the modalities.Roughly speaking, "God" obeys classical logic, the "Universal Soul" obeys intuitionist logic, and the two matters obeys (different) quantum logics,perhaps even linear (with some luck!)Bruno, thanks. That helps alot. In case you have not already guessed I am trying to marry CTM, string theory and monadology/Indra'sJewels, in order to improve my paper on incompletenes/consciousness: http://vixra.org/pdf/1101.0044v1.pdf
This will work only if you derived the axioms of string theory from arithmetic, unless your theory contradicts the comp or CTM theory.
I am not sure why you single out Peano Arithmetic in your paper. Logician use Peano Arithmetic like biologist use the bacterium Escherichia Coli, as a good represent of a very simple Löbian theory.
Gödel used Principia Mathematica, and then a theory like PA can be shown essentially undecidable: adding axioms does not change incompleteness. That is why it applies to us, as far as we are correct. It does not apply to everyday reasoning, as this use a non monotonical theory, with a notion of updating our beliefs.
Not all undecidable theory are essentially undecidable. Group theory is undecidable, but abelian group theory is decidable.
Bruno
RichardOn Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 9:56 AM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> wrote:On 10 Dec 2012, at 14:33, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Stephen P. King God is what/who is looking through the supreme monad, not the supreme monad itself. Nice! Even closer to CTM(*): God is what/who is looking through the supreme monads, not any supreme monad itself. Bruno (*) Alias comp, digital mechanism, .... CTM is for Computationalist Theory of Mind, and the "yes doctor" + Church thesis is among the weakestassumptions. CTM acronym might be better than "comp" to avoid confusionwithcomputationalist physicalism (digital physics, DP) which is sometimesconfused with comp. I have often explain why Digital Physics isself-contradictory (or made us into zombie, eliminate consciousness andfirst person). [Roger Clough], [[email protected]] 12/10/2012 "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen ----- Receiving the following content ----- From: Stephen P. King Receiver: everything-list Time: 2012-12-09, 13:05:26 Subject: Re: Avoiding the use of the word God On 12/9/2012 7:54 AM, Richard Ruquist wrote:Roger, The monads are collectively godDear Roger and Richard,This is what I have come to believe about Monads as well. They are collectively God, they do not have an absolute hierarchy. Their relationis more like what we see in a neural networkThat's is likely what Newton would believe and most likely what Liebnitz really believed in but was afraid to express. Richard On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 at 7:43 AM, Roger Clough <[email protected]> wrote:Hi Richard Ruquist Newton believed in numbers but was still a christian. [Roger Clough], [[email protected]] 12/9/2012 "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." -Woody Allen-- Onward! Stephen --You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups"Everything List" group.To post to this group, send email to [email protected] .To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. --You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups"Everything List" group.To post to this group, send email to [email protected] .To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ --You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups"Everything List" group.To post to this group, send email to [email protected] .To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.--You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups"Everything List" group.To post to this group, send email to [email protected] .To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ --You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups"Everything List" group.To post to this group, send email to everything- [email protected].To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.--You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group.To post to this group, send email to [email protected].To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en .
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