On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 1:02 PM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On 10/20/2013 10:51 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > > On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 12:11 AM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote: > >> On 10/20/2013 8:18 PM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >>> If the first person views/memories are not integrated, they are not >>> experienced by the Jupiter brain, only instantiated, and it learns nothing >>> of what it is like to *be* the beings it discovers. >>> >> >> ?? How is an experience instantiated without being experienced? Sounds >> like double talk. > > > All experiences are experienced, but the question in this case is by > whom? Who can rightfully be said to be an owner of that experience? > > > Makes not sense at all. If people are just sequences of experiences > (dispensing with the physical as secondary) then there is no sense in > asking who owns an experience. > The same experience can be part of different sequences. E.g. (1, 6, 7, 19, 11) and (2, 3, 14, 19, 23) are two different sets, or sequences, (analogous to two different persons by your definition), but they both contain the same number 19 (the same experience). Thus the experience belongs can be said to be "owned" or "had" by more than one person. So asking who owns an experience is equivalent to identifying the possible chains of experience that contain a given experience. Let me know if this still makes no sense. > > > > There are two minds in this case: There is the Jupiter brain's mind, and > there is Brent Meeker's mind. The Jupiter brain might choose to simulate > all of Earth, and thus it will instantiate yours, mind, and all earthlings' > brains. > > > But now you're invoking brains to distinguish which mind is which. I'm > afraid your theory is incoherent. > It is unfortunate that the term "Jupiter Brain" contains the word "brain" in it, but treat the above cases of "Jupiter brain" as simply a label for something with unfathomable computational resources and intelligence, the word "brain" is not relevant to this discussion. To use the sets of numbers analogy, a Jupiter brain that experiences other perspectives is like a very large set of experiences. > > > And so Brent Meeker will experience what it is like to be Brent > Meeker. But the mind of the Jupiter brain will not be able to remember > what it is like to be Brent Meeker without creating some kind of bridge to > make Brent's memories and experiences accessible to that mind. > > Brent Meeker is always an owner of Brent Meeker's experiences, but there > may be other entities who can rightfully be said to be owners of those > experiences, by virtue of having memory of having been Brent Meeker, for > example. > > > >> >> >> >>> But that is beside the point, even if this brain was not integrating the >>> experiences into a single view, and instead was morphing its brain such >>> that it experiences one lifetime after, this activity creates a chain of >>> connections that goes through all the observer's lifetimes it ever >>> experiences. >>> >> >> Why do experiences need some outside agent, "this brain" to integrate >> them? > > > > They only need to be integrated if you want the experience to belong to > other minds. > > > >> I thought the idea was that experiences formed a chain by their inherent >> content. >> > > Think of a it like this: > Imagine a youtube of the future that enabled full sensory immersion. Now > there are millions of experiences uploaded to this site, and each of the > experiences has been viewed thousands of times, by any of millions of > different real-world observers. > > > Who are sitting in a big Cartesian theater. > > > Who then are the true owners of the experience? When the experience > ends the playback, you don't know which of the thousands of viewers you > will then discover yourself to be. > > > No, sensory immersion is not the same as experience immersion. Because of > my memories and structure, experiences will be uniquely mine even though > the sensory input is shared. > Imagine the downlaoded experiences encode your memories too, and when viewed restrict the memories of the viewer to those of the uploader. Jason > > Brent > > A complex and highly connected web is formed between all the observers, > as they are connected through the shared experiences. The chain of > experience bifurcates at the end of each uploaded experience, branching to > any of the thousands of people who have seen, or ever will see this > experience. The Jupiter brains that exist throughout mathematical reality > (or in the arithmetic in computationalism) are like these "Youtube of the > future" users, who not only see vast numbers of experiences, but come > across the same experiences and hence link themselves to other jupiter > brains in the same way the users of this website link themselves together. > > Jason > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 2014.0.4158 / Virus Database: 3614/6765 - Release Date: 10/19/13 > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
