2013/12/1 meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net>

>  On 11/30/2013 7:36 PM, Jason Resch wrote:
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 4:40 PM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>>  On 11/30/2013 4:06 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
>>
>>
>>  In fact, materialism cannot explain matter, either. Worst, it avoids
>> trying to explain it at the start.
>>
>>
>>  It's not worse, it's logic.  Whatever is taken as fundamental in a
>> theory is not something explained in the theory.  Your theory takes numbers
>> and arithmetic for granted.
>>
>>
>  It is logical in the case of arithmetical realism to assume numbers are
> fundamental because it is provable that the numbers cannot be explained in
> terms of anything simpler,
>
>
> I'd like to see that proof.  I don't think 'red' can be explained in terms
> of something simpler - but that doesn't mean it's fundamental nor that it
> can't be explained.  "Simpler" can be a complicated concept.
>
>
>   but there is no known proof (or even an argument offered by
> materialists) that matter cannot be explained in terms of something simpler.
>
>
> Of course not.  That would the point the it's fundamental.
>

The point of Jason if I may, is that there is no way to explain numbers
without assuming them... but there are ways to explain matter without
assuming it.

Quentin


>
> Brent
>
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