On 12/23/2013 11:33 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote:

2013/12/23 meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net <mailto:meeke...@verizon.net>>

    On 12/23/2013 10:55 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote:
    2013/12/23 Edgar L. Owen <edgaro...@att.net <mailto:edgaro...@att.net>>


        The question of whether God exists is meaningless without first giving 
        definition of what is meant by God, of how God is defined. Otherwise 
        is talking about different things and nothing will go anywhere.

        If you need a God there is only one possible rational definition and 
that is to
        just define God as the universe itself. First there is now absolute 
        that God does exist

    Well no... It is certain that I experience a reality but that there exists a
    consistent physical universe defined everywhere is not certain...

    Is your experience consistent, i.e. describable without contradictions?  
OK, then
    how you conceive it is your model of reality and the universe.  If it 
    things independent of your thoughts external to you, and other people that 
agree on
    these things, then that's the physics of it.  Whether it's 'defined 
    would depend on your model.

I agree but any model is *far* from certainty... so defining "God" as meaning the universe doesn't settle at all that it exists...

I agree. In fact it tends to drag a lot of bronze age tribal baggage into scientific questions - which is why I wish Bruno would stop casually using religious metaphors.


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