On Mon, Jan 13, 2014 at 1:20 PM, Edgar L. Owen <edgaro...@att.net> wrote: > Bruno, > > I use computation in the STANDARD sense of computer science. Computer > programs compute results.

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Computers compute results. Computer programs describe how computers compute results. This is all circular and nothing was defined, in my view. > Reality computes the current state of the > universe. This is a big problem. There is no reason to assume that the universe has a current state. > It's very simple, straightforward and standard usage. So what? Telmo. > See my other post on the same topic for more detail..... > > Edgar > > > > On Friday, January 10, 2014 5:05:31 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 10 Jan 2014, at 04:16, Edgar L. Owen wrote: >> >> Liz, >> >> So? I'm not really interested in Bruno's comp as I don't think it actually >> applies to reality. I'll stick with my computational reality for the time >> being at least... >> >> >> But, please, define it. Nobody has the slightest idea of what you are >> talking about. Computation is a standard term in mathematical logic, and >> refer to the Church thesis. >> >> You can use a word with a different meaning, but then you have to provide >> the meaning that you are using. We cannot guess it. >> >> Also, "reality" is what we search, starting from statement on which we can >> agree (if only momentarily). >> You talk all the time like if yo, or we, knew what is reality. We don't. >> That's why we do research. >> >> Bruno >> >> >> >> >> Edgar >> >> On Thursday, January 9, 2014 10:05:03 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: >>> >>> Well, that's OK then. >>> >>> Now we've cleared that up, I can repeat my original point: >>> >>> On 10 January 2014 15:34, Edgar L. Owen <edga...@att.net> wrote: >>>> >>>> Liz, >>>> >>>> No, that's not the only way to falsify it. One merely needs to show it >>>> doesn't properly describe reality as I've just done. If you even assume a >>>> computational universe in the first place you have to assume (you are >>>> assuming) that it computes reality. The fact that reality exists is >>>> conclusive proof. >>>> >>> That doesn't work for [Bruno's] comp, however, which doesn't assume a >>> computational universe. The assumptions it makes are a lot simpler than >>> that. I believe they are >>> >>> The Church-Turing thesis >>> Elementary arithmetic >>> That consciousness is a form of computation >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. >> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> >> >> http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ >> >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.