On 30 January 2014 12:45, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 29, 2014 6:38:22 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: > >> On 30 January 2014 12:32, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2014 6:22:43 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: >>> >>>> On 30 January 2014 12:21, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2014 6:13:35 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On 30 January 2014 12:09, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2014 6:01:19 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 30 January 2014 11:39, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]>wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2014 5:38:04 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 30 January 2014 11:24, Craig Weinberg <[email protected]>wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2014 1:34:48 PM UTC-5, John Clark >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 9:35 AM, Craig Weinberg < >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> > NO ROOM CAN BE CONSCIOUS. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> And we know that because we can say it in all capital letters, >>>>>>>>>>>> or possibly from the teachings of two of your favorite subjects, >>>>>>>>>>>> astrology >>>>>>>>>>>> and numerology. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The all caps were in response to Bruno's all caps, and no, you >>>>>>>>>>> don't need astrology and numerology to understand that rooms are not >>>>>>>>>>> haunted by the spirits of system-hood. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Imagine a small, roughly spherical room made out of a fairly hard >>>>>>>>>> material something like limestone. Make a few holes in it, fill it >>>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>> some goop with the consistency of blancmange, decorate with sense >>>>>>>>>> organs >>>>>>>>>> and throw in a body. >>>>>>>>>> Et voila! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Voila, a cadaver. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Unless *all *such objects are cadavers, this "disproves" the >>>>>>>> statement that *no *room can be conscious. >>>>>>>> (I must admit the idea that "no room can be conscious" seems to >>>>>>>> demand qualification...) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> All such objects would be cadavers, in the absence of some >>>>>>> subjective experience which is being expressed. >>>>>>> >>>>>> What about anaesthesia and dreamless sleep? >>>>>> >>>>> Our personal level of awareness is not the totality of the awareness >>>>> that our lives consist of. We sleep, but if we have to pee, who wakes us >>>>> up >>>>> so we don't wet the bed? >>>>> >>>> So all such objects aren't cadavers. >>>> >>> If you are unconscious, you don't personally exist, but you exist >>> sub-personally and super-personally. A body has microscopic and macroscopic >>> scales, but those are only from the perspective which is available through >>> our body, and its use of other bodies. The difference between a cadaver and >>> a living person's body is not within the body, it is within experience. >>> It's aesthetic, not functional. Although the functional and aesthetic >>> perspectives can influence each other, as the cart can influence the >>> behavior of the horse, the cart is ultimately dependent on the horse rather >>> than the other way around. >>> >> >> One difference between an unconscious body and a dead one is that you can >> return an unconscious one to consciousness later. >> That sounds kind of functional to me. >> > > It's only functional if you assume that consciousness has value beyond the > operation of the body. The condition of being able to return though is not > necessarily part of the body. I can leave my house and the house will fall > into disrepair eventually, but that doesn't mean that I am part of my > house, or that there is some quality of my house which equals the fact of > my presence in it. > The quality is being in a state of good repair, surely? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
