On 06 Aug 2014, at 16:02, Platonist Guitar Cowboy wrote:
On Wed, Aug 6, 2014 at 3:58 AM, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote:
What does level of substitution have to do with it. You've defined
the correct level substitution as one below which consciousness is
unchanged. So the the definition already requires that we know what
it means for a consciousness to be the same, i.e. unchanged.
Then the 1p recognizance criteria is very simple. All the copies
are declared the same person as the one copied, except that now
they differentiate.
And that can help to understand that we are all already the same
person, having multiplied and differentiate.
I guess it would if I were a copy of somebody.
Then computer science shows that there is indeed a universal notion
of first person, given by the knowability (non arithmetic)
operator, provided by the definition of knowledge by Theaetetus.
Having a notion of person doesn't imply that all persons are the
same person.
I don't see why all the convolution in this thread around ambiguity
of notion of person is required. It just makes unnecessarily complex
what seems ambiguous at the start.
Assume some emergence phenomenon and you risk reductionism at
fundamental problem of identity, and the usual fascisms of
discrimination can follow. Assume some universal person and you
aren't a step further dealing with problems of evil and difference.
What "universal person" has that "emergence" doesn't is a reason to
foster empathy in fundamental/primitive sense, underneath some
utility derivative from evolution, as is the case with some
emergence interpretations. But does this even matter?
The Bee Gees made approximation of stating this ambiguity and sold
millions of records with the kitschy:
How deep is your love
I really need to learn
'Cause we're living in a world of fools
Breaking us down
When they all should let us be
We belong to you and me
And because it's a kitschy song, no need to take literally or feel
smart :-)
Like Telmo said, if I recall correctly, it's super easy to fall into
taking sides on these issues without knowing it... which I guess I
do too. Thus don't really have anything solid to say about these
things + wonder if it matters at all.
It does not matter to get grasp the reversal (uda).
Then the S4Grz logic is the logic of a universal person, that plays a
role in (auda). But it does not matter if S4grz is *the* universal
person, although it match well Plotinus "Inner God", the soul of the
world, or the universal soul.
No smart-ass "hehe, those guys are definitely idiots compared to my
privileged position of experience and knowledge, stupid dreamers/
factualists/realists/emergence materialists etc." from here... which
just covers up the ambiguity for some security ruse in the mirror
the speaker holds up to themselves in some funk. PGC
Lol
Bruno
Brent
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