2015-01-14 11:00 GMT+01:00 Telmo Menezes <[email protected]>: > > > On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 7:28 AM, Quentin Anciaux <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Well we will never agree, you've decided it was free so you conclude it >> was. >> > Free for the purpose of our discussion: free enough so that sellers can > use deceptive practices without consequence, but they mostly don't, which > is the empirical point being made. > > Otherwise we live in a non-free world, and that is going to interface with > any attempt like silk road. But then the objection becomes circular: free > markets would never work because there is no free market. > >> You've asked how someone could control a decentralized anonymous market. >> I did tell you how which you did conflate with government intervention >> where I only said you just had to control the material supply chain, >> nowhere did I said anything about government. >> > Yes you did, because the reason cartels control certain supply chains is > prohibition. >
No the only reason it that they have the power to control it using coercion... as the world wil not become by miracle free from powerful people unwilling to comply to care bear dreams, they will be able to still use coercion to control... as you have absolutely no means to compelled them to be ideal rational agent then it can't work. How to control a market, control the supply chain... how to control the supply chain, you must be powerful enough to make supplier comply to your control... as long as you can't constrain that, you can't have free market... and as *no 100%* of the population can be rational agent working for their own interest, then what you're talking about is just dream... that's why some people do terrorist attack where in the end they'll die... it's *not rational*, yet they do it... > In a free market *maybe* the same individual self-interest that leads most > sellers not to cheat on customers would lead honest traders to outnumber > cartels, because there would be more profit to be made in playing fair. > >> The thing is your free from anything except coercion market you like is >> bound to be subverted because we don't live in a care bear world.... proof >> is silkroad is closed. >> > But it's not really. A number of functional clones already spawned. > >> Don't tell me it is the fault of government... thing is it is closed. >> > Well but the first one was objectively closed by the government, was it > not? What we've seen so far: the government creates a very hostile > environment but free trade is such a powerful idea that it still survives > in one form or another. > > Cheers > Telmo. > >> Regards >> Le 14 janv. 2015 01:00, "Telmo Menezes" <[email protected]> a écrit >> : >> >> >>> >>> On Tue, Jan 13, 2015 at 8:18 PM, Quentin Anciaux <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> 2015-01-13 16:24 GMT+01:00 Telmo Menezes <[email protected]>: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Jan 12, 2015 at 6:14 PM, Quentin Anciaux <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 2015-01-12 18:01 GMT+01:00 Telmo Menezes <[email protected]>: >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Ok, I think we ended up deviating from the reason why I introduced >>>>>>> the silk road theme. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You argued that free markets are not possible, that force is >>>>>>> necessary to prevent unethical agents from destroying the market. >>>>>>> Alberto >>>>>>> did to. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> You did not provide proof that it is possible and stable and no >>>>>> powerful agent would in fine control it. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I don't see how I could prove such a thing -- or how anyone could >>>>> proves such a thing about any system. >>>>> What I offer is empirical evidence: yes it's possible. It existed and >>>>> it exists again today. It's been stable for some years, even against a >>>>> very >>>>> hostile environment. >>>>> >>>>> Could a powerful agent gain control of a decentralised, global and >>>>> anonymous market? I don't see how. Can you suggest a strategy? >>>>> >>>> >>>> By being the only one able to provide the products... as it is the case >>>> with drugs such as cocaine and heroine... in the end you sell material >>>> goods who are not decentralised. >>>> >>> >>> So you're saying that a free market won't work because government >>> intervention can kill it? >>> The mafias are the only ones capable of providing some products because >>> of prohibition, not because of the free market. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I presented silk road as a counter-example. Due to its >>>>>>> circumstances, the identity of its participants was unknown. It was >>>>>>> unknown >>>>>>> to governments and mafias (until the FBI finally figured out a way to >>>>>>> crack >>>>>>> this anonymity). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There was not way to use force on silk road. Mafias could not >>>>>>> prevent you from selling drugs there by physical violence, >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> But mafias *used* it... the drug sold on silk road was not from a >>>>>> free market in the first place, it cannot be rendered free after... >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> You're using the term "free" as if it were some mystical property like >>>>> "kosher" or "halal". A free market is simply free from regulation from a >>>>> central authority, that's all. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Then any illegal market is free... that's nonsensical. >>>> >>> >>> I said that an illegal market could be a free market, not that an >>> illegal market implies a free market. >>> >>> >>>> Free means everyone has access to it and the same information >>>> available... that's barely the case with silkroad where only illegal goods >>>> mainly provided by markets controlled by mafia where available... >>>> >>>> >>>>> The silk road is free from regulation. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Any illegal market is free from regulation.. as they are illegal. >>>> >>> >>> Many illegal market are controlled by illegal central authorities. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Anyone can participate, including mafias. If mafias couldn't >>>>> participate, it wouldn't be a free market. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Well I don't want a free market then... >>>> >>> >>> You should be free not to participate. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> because they had no way of discovering your identity. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Still, silk road did not collapse under unethical sellers receiving >>>>>>> payment for cannabis and sending packs of dried lawn grass instead. Why? >>>>>>> Because the reputation system was enough. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> If you convince of that... >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Do you have any evidence to the contrary? How do you explain the >>>>> enormous wealth that the creator of the market had amassed in commissions >>>>> when he was arrested? >>>>> >>>> >>>> Because every he got a tax on every illegal transactions, like a >>>> pimp... >>>> >>> >>> He provides an essential service that enables the market and charges a >>> fee for it. He does not have the power to tax. If his fees become >>> unreasonable, a competitor will takes his place. This is a crucial point >>> that distinguishes his actions from taxation. >>> >>> The pimp is like the drug cartel: a side-effect of government >>> interference in private transactions. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Surely the thing would collapse quickly if people were being ripped >>>>> off? >>>>> >>>> >>>> Surely people who wanted to bough anonymously drugs while where they >>>> were it was difficult were happy sure... you can't go to the hypermart next >>>> door to buy cocaine... so what ? >>>> >>> >>> So bad behaviour is prevented solely individual self-interest. This is >>> the entire reason why I brought this topic, to provide a counter-example to >>> something you and Alberto claim to be impossible. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> That was the point. It has nothing to do with the origin of the >>>>>>> drugs >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> It does, because if the origin is a controlled non-free market, the >>>>>> enduser market cannot be a free market... do you deny this ? >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Only if the participants in the upstream market are prevented from >>>>> sourcing their wares elsewhere. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Could you give me an adress where cocaine and heroine are harvested and >>>> transformed in a free environment and where I can buy it being sure all the >>>> chain was free from coercion ? >>>> >>> >>> This restriction is imposed on some of the products by the government. >>> The other products are also traded without the market collapsing under >>> mis-behaviour. >>> >>> The fact that a couple of specific drugs have monopolistic suppliers >>> because of the government does not invalidate my argument. It just >>> distracts from the central point, that you refuse to face. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> This is not the case with silk road. Even if it's impractical to >>>>> escape the mafias with things like cocaine and heroin, there are many >>>>> other >>>>> classes of drugs that can and are trivially produced and sold on silk >>>>> road. >>>>> >>>> >>>> So you have proof those drugs where being manufactured free from any >>>> coercion ? do you ? >>>> >>> >>> It's impossible to have such a proof due to the nature of the market, >>> that provides string anonymity. I know there's a shop in front of my house >>> that sells industrial sizes cannabis growing equipment. They have been >>> there for years, so I assume they have clients. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> We've been through this, you just refute it with arguments from >>>>> authority. >>>>> >>>> >>>> I don't, you claim something extraordinary, you have to give evidence >>>> of your claim. >>>> >>> >>> I did. People could send tea leaves instead of cannabis on silk road >>> with no consequences. They mostly didn't, because repeated business is more >>> valuable. This is an easily verifiable fact if you can use google. It is >>> irrelevant to the relevance of this empirical evidence if the wholesaler of >>> the goods is a clan of evil alien lizards. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Yet it is trivially true. A lot of people admit to growing cannabis in >>>>> their homes, for example, and it is now legal in several parts of the >>>>> world. >>>>> >>>> >>>> A lot of people grow cannabis for their personal use, not a lot of >>>> people at all are dealer of cannabis... and all the dealers I've ever >>>> approached to buy cannabis, where not growing it themselves... >>>> >>> >>> Cannabis can be grown easily and anywhere. It just doesn't seem to make >>> economical sense that it would be a viable target for a cartel to control. >>> How could it prevent smaller local operations from existing? There is no >>> bottleneck for them to be the gatekeepers. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Only where cannabis is *legalized* such thing could be true and >>>> verified it was free from coercion... any illegal market is bound to be >>>> controlled at least with how the products are available to it... >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> or on weather they are bad or good for you. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I don't care also, and this is not part of the argument... also I >>>>>> find it odd to call me a prohibitionist when I explitely says I'm against >>>>>> prohibition... but it's not because of that that everything is good and >>>>>> canabis could be sold like chocolate bar in a supermarket. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I did not call you a prohibitionist, nor did I attack or defend the >>>>> merits of cannabis or any other drug. I entered this discussion purely to >>>>> give an example on how reputation-based markets can replace force. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> These things are irrelevant to the argument I was making. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Still I didn't see how silkroad which was an illegal "market", with >>>>>> product coming for the large part from illegal controlled market, could >>>>>> be >>>>>> free at all ! >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> It depends on what you mean by free. For the purpose of my argument >>>>> it's free enough -- >>>>> >>>> >>>> Well I don't want your "free" market then... >>>> >>> >>> Nor am I trying to convince you to join. I deeply respect your freedom >>> to do whatever you want, as long as it doesn't interfere with mine to do >>> the same. And vice-versa, of course. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Telmo. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Quentin >>>> >>>> >>>>> nobody can prevent you from selling or buying there, not even the >>>>> mafias. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> which was prohibited and owner by mafias market... Are you implying >>>>>>>> you can *ḧere and now* sell cocaine and heroine without resorting with >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>> various mafias ? That's what you're saying ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> How the hell do you suppose dealers had drugs in the first >>>>>>>>>>>>>> place ? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not an expert by any means, but I can speculate. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Some drugs like cocaine or heroin require plants that can only >>>>>>>>>>>>> be grown in specific geographic regions, so it's likely that >>>>>>>>>>>>> mafias control >>>>>>>>>>>>> those supply chains. But other drugs can be grown in people's >>>>>>>>>>>>> houses, >>>>>>>>>>>>> synthesised by amateur chemists, legally bought with a >>>>>>>>>>>>> prescription, >>>>>>>>>>>>> geo-arbitrated (drug laws vary a lot across the world) etc etc. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah, yeah, silk road was provided with drug with chemist >>>>>>>>>>>> apprentice in their garage... you got better joke ? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> It's ok that you don't know certain things, my knowledge has >>>>>>>>>>> gigantic gaps too. What I don't understand is why you embarrass >>>>>>>>>>> yourself >>>>>>>>>>> without at least googling a bit. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> https://www.google.com/search?q=amphetamine+lab+arrests >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Yeah and so these lab are not done under mafias controls ? you're >>>>>>>>>> joking surely... it's well known dealers make their own canabis and >>>>>>>>>> amphetamine in their garage and don't respond to anyone else except >>>>>>>>>> themselves, the ndrangheta does not exists, it's a chimera. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Also you use a bully strategy by picking little things I say and >>>>>>>>>>> trying to make them sound silly. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Right. Maybe Quentin had too many discussion with... oh, never >>>>>>>>> mind. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm not bullying anyone, I don't buy something that present silk >>>>>>>> road as a free market without any evidence of it, and just saying >>>>>>>> mafia is >>>>>>>> something inexistent. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On the other side of the street from my home there is a large >>>>>>>>>>> store purely dedicated to selling equipment to grow cannabis. In >>>>>>>>>>> countries >>>>>>>>>>> like Mexico, pharmacies will sell you almost anything. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Either you've got infinite bad faith here, or you so naive >>>>>>>>>>>>>> that it can't be so... so I'm left with bad faith here. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I may be wrong, but I don't think it's fair to assume bad >>>>>>>>>>>>> faith on my part. I don't think I've made any unreasonable >>>>>>>>>>>>> statement. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> It's unreasonable to say silk road was a free market.. it was a >>>>>>>>>>>> controlled mafia market that's all, and if that is an example of >>>>>>>>>>>> free >>>>>>>>>>>> market... then I don't want to be in ! >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> You provide no evidence or arguments for this. You just keep >>>>>>>>>>> repeating it. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> You provide absolutely nil evidence, that silk road was a free >>>>>>>>>> market not under the influence of the mafias at the base level of the >>>>>>>>>> products that were available on it.. please do. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Law enforcement has indicated over and over in the press how they >>>>>>>>> had to develop new strategies for Silk Road phenomenon. This implies >>>>>>>>> somewhere that traditional police work has to change to combat as it >>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>> "not usual methods" as title implies: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-03/fbi-snags-silk-road-boss-with-own-methods.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> You keep going on tangents when you don't like the outcome of >>>>>>>>>>>>> the debate. We started discussing Silk Road as an example of how >>>>>>>>>>>>> a free >>>>>>>>>>>>> market works without force. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Silk road *wasn't* a free market. So, it seems you don't like >>>>>>>>>>>> the obvious fact, not me who don't like the outcome of a debate. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Do you have any argument to support your assertion that silk >>>>>>>>>>> road was not a free market? Or should I just take your word for it? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I have the first argument that nearly 100% of the market of >>>>>>>>>> cocaine/heroine/amphetamine is controlled under various mafias... the >>>>>>>>>> ndrangheta is know to control 80% of the market trade of cocaine in >>>>>>>>>> europe... any dealers who was selling that type of drugs could not >>>>>>>>>> have >>>>>>>>>> done so without mafias oversight... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> You condemned Cannabis as horrible drug, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> What ? I've never done that... I am a ext user of such drug... I'm >>>>>>>> in favor of legalizing it... what I'm not in favor of, is saying there >>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>> absolutely no danger, and that it is *good*... it's not, and certainly >>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>> the way it is most used in the western world (in an abusive manner). >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> plus so-called "hard" substances are widely being sold via >>>>>>>>> prescription; strong opiates like fentanyl for various conditions, >>>>>>>>> operations, and weapons... ritalin, and amphetamine for ADHD etc. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> if you had stole them their market like you said it was, they >>>>>>>>>> would have get back at you and take you the market by the only way >>>>>>>>>> it has >>>>>>>>>> ever been done, by forcing you... they are not day dreamer, you piss >>>>>>>>>> them >>>>>>>>>> off, they kill you, as simple as that... you can dream all you want, >>>>>>>>>> that's >>>>>>>>>> the bare world we live in. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> No, I don't read stories of Mafia killing patients or attacking >>>>>>>>> hospitals using opiates routinely, even though hospitals and illegal >>>>>>>>> pharma >>>>>>>>> are competing with heroin sale. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So the market of cocaine and heroine is not owned by the mafias ? >>>>>>>> That's what you're saying ? So I see absolutely no reason to legalize >>>>>>>> it, >>>>>>>> as you imply it is already a sane market... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Sensational, but rather simplistic. If this satisfies you, fine. I >>>>>>>>> don't consider most of your statements to be based on credible facts >>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>> this area. Especially the "evil of cannabis" tone you struck. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I've never used such a tone, you either make a mistake or >>>>>>>> misunderstood what I say... But that's true I'll never say, cannabis >>>>>>>> is OK >>>>>>>> there is absolutely no danger and no problem... that's false... but if >>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>> want to believe, I've no problem... but I'll tell you that it's not >>>>>>>> because >>>>>>>> you can manage your consomation of cannabis that anybody can and that >>>>>>>> most >>>>>>>> user can... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> hose arguments have been clearly debunked, even on this list. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> As I've never made such statement... what I made (and they are >>>>>>>> backed) is that cannabis is linked with depression and can enhance it >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> various studies back it up. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://scholar.google.be/scholar?q=cannabis+and+depression&hl=fr&as_sdt=0&as_vis=1&oi=scholart&sa=X&ei=oumzVNfvHYnwUILpgZgF&ved=0CBwQgQMwAA >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> But if you don't want to believe it... fine. What I say is that I'm >>>>>>>> relieve to be an ex canabis addict, and that over usage didn't help me >>>>>>>> at >>>>>>>> all and certainly if not the cause did enhance the problem... do what >>>>>>>> you >>>>>>>> want with that. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Quentin >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Open problem of accessibility of reliable statistics to base our >>>>>>>>> assertions on are hard to come by because of prohibition. Especially >>>>>>>>> on the >>>>>>>>> accounting and liquidity fronts of global illegal/legal poison >>>>>>>>> distribution. This seems more than black and white, especially this >>>>>>>>> type of >>>>>>>>> program: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ATF_gunwalking_scandal >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Such program and scandals exist since decades and are not really >>>>>>>>> statistically accessible or transparent. You could be more accurate >>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>> references and why you think it makes prohibition + effects >>>>>>>>> transparent, >>>>>>>>> which mostly only Telmo has been providing. PGC >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>>>> [email protected]. >>>>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list >>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy >>>>>>>> Batty/Rutger Hauer) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>>> [email protected]. >>>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>> [email protected]. >>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy >>>>>> Batty/Rutger Hauer) >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>>>> . >>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy >>>> Batty/Rutger Hauer) >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy Batty/Rutger Hauer) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
