> On 25 Apr 2019, at 18:41, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List > <[email protected]> wrote: > > I don't understand anything. Where is consciousness in all that you said ?
I did not aboard this in this post, but have already describe to you, I think, that I define consciousness as something which, from the point of view of the machine appears to be - true - immediately knowable, - indubitable, - non provable to any other being, - non definable (but meta-definable with a reference to truth, which is itself non definable (cf Tarski)). Then it is a theorem, and some standard definition, that all universal machine is conscious, and all Löbian machine (those who know that they are universal) self-conscious. Bruno > > On Thursday, 25 April 2019 18:04:49 UTC+3, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 23 Apr 2019, at 19:54, 'Cosmin Visan' via Everything List >> <[email protected] <javascript:>> wrote: >> >> That's just a random definition that doesn't mean anything. >> >> On Friday, 19 April 2019 12:27:18 UTC+3, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> With mechanism, the observer is just a number/machine, relative to some >> other numbers/machines. > > You ignore that the notion of computation is a purely arithmetical notion. > > Fix one universal machinery (an enumeration of all programs in some Turing > universal formalism, like the recursive enumeration of the program (with one > natural number input) of the programs written in LISP, say, or take the > combinator (see the recent thread on them). I note phi_i the corresponding > functions (computes by those programs). We can identify the natural number I > with the program computing ph_i, then a universal number u is a program such > that phi_i(<x, y>) = phi_x(y). U emulates x on y, and is universal, as it > does that for all x. <x, y> is a fixed bijection between NxN and N. > > The number is the code that the digitalist surgeon might temporarily put on > some disk, and which will be emulated by Nature when you are reconstituted, > like after a Digital brain transplant (which is possible, as I assume > Mechanism). > > Note that the relation phi_x(y) = z is definable in pure arithmetic. No need > of any assumption in physics to define the notion of digital machine. > > You might need to study some introduction to theoretical computer science, > like the very good book by N. Cutland > > https://www.amazon.com/Computability-Introduction-Recursive-Function-Theory/dp/0521294657 > > <https://www.amazon.com/Computability-Introduction-Recursive-Function-Theory/dp/0521294657> > > > Bruno > > > >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected] <javascript:>. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >> <javascript:>. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list >> <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout >> <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
