> On 20 May 2019, at 19:15, John Clark <[email protected]> wrote: > > On Wed, May 15, 2019 at 10:35 AM Bruno Marchal <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > No, we can’t detect consciousness. I was saying that today positivisme is > > abandoned. It is the idea that we have to abandon the concept of > > consciousness because we can’t detect it which has been abandonned. > > Only a fool would abandon the concept of consciousness because everybody > knows of one example of consciousness that is unimpeachable.
Yes. > What has NOT been abandoned is the idea that if you wish to understand how > the world works the time spent pondering the mysteries of consciousness could > be much more productively spent thinking about other things. It depends of your goal. If it is to explore the universe, you are right. If the goal, consists to figure out where the apparent universe comes from, then consciousness must be taken into account, and some theories are needed, like mechanism. > > >Many people understand the “hard problem of consciousness” > > Nobody knows the answer to the "hard problem of consciousness" because nobody > knows exactly what the question is or what criteria is to be used to > determine if its been successfully answered. So you don’t understand it. It is not so astonishing. That explains your lack of interest in greek philosophy. The so called “hard problem of consciousness” is the materialist reformulation of the mind-body problem. Today we know that the physcalist solution works only by abandoning mechanism in cognitive science. > > > Mathematics is born from theology. > > Mathematics was born from practicality, If I have 4 sheep in my field when > the sun comes up I want to be sure I have 4 when the sun comes goes and for > that I need mathematics. That is how computing is born, in Babylon, Persia, much before Pythagorus and Euclid made it into a science, and it has only be accepted as such in the 19th century. And yet, some people like David Deutsch still believe that mathematics is not a science. > > >> Godel was one of the greatest mathematicians in the world but he was the > >> only type of theologian it is possible to be, terrible. > > >? > ! The worst theologian are those who claim to know the truth. That happens when theology is stolen by private interest. The worst of all theologian are the materialist, because not only they claim to know the truth, but claim that it is science, like in the expression “scientific materialism”. That is pseudo-science and pseudo-religion. Of course, you have decide that the notion of “god” cannot be improved, meaning that you are christian or something, and radical: no right to change or improve the theory, especially in front of contradiction. Atheism is radical post-529 christianism. Before 529, theology was still done with the greek method: discussion, theories, experimentation, and changing the theories/definitions each time a contradiction appears. Bruno > John K Clark > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv3%3DR-MZv_X6JJDYQivuJgwAffykJyeJQKZCbKHJcJZzhA%40mail.gmail.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv3%3DR-MZv_X6JJDYQivuJgwAffykJyeJQKZCbKHJcJZzhA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/64981721-EF06-45D0-9A5C-9693EDE0528E%40ulb.ac.be.
