On Wednesday, January 27, 2021 at 5:14:33 AM UTC-7 Quentin Anciaux wrote:
> > > Le mer. 27 janv. 2021 à 12:19, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> a > écrit : > >> >> >> On Wednesday, January 27, 2021 at 3:56:50 AM UTC-7 Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> Le mer. 27 janv. 2021 à 11:54, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> a >>> écrit : >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tuesday, January 12, 2021 at 10:19:59 PM UTC-7 Pierz wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Monday, January 4, 2021 at 12:09:06 PM UTC+11 [email protected] >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Sunday, January 3, 2021 at 3:56:51 PM UTC-7 [email protected] >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, Jan 3, 2021 at 5:21 PM Alan Grayson <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *> The MWI doesn't guarantee that these subsequent measurements, for >>>>>>>> subsequent horse races say, are occurring in the SAME OTHER worlds as >>>>>>>> trials progress, to get ensembles in those OTHER worlds. * >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I don't know what you mean by "SAME OTHER worlds", the same as what? >>>>>>> In one world Alan Grayson remembers having seen the electron go left, >>>>>>> in >>>>>>> another world Alan Grayson remembers having seen the electron go right, >>>>>>> other than that the two worlds are absolutely identical, so which one >>>>>>> was >>>>>>> the "SAME OTHER world"? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > You seem to avoid the fact that no where does the MWI guarantee >>>>>>>> [...] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Quantum mechanics is not in the guarantee business, it deals with >>>>>>> probability. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *> I don't think you understand my point, which isn't complicated. * >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yes, your point is very simple indeed, but the word simple can have >>>>>>> 2 meanings, one of them is complementary and the other not so much. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> In first trial, the MWI postulates other worlds comes into existence. >>>>>> Same other worlds in second trial? Same other worlds in third trial, >>>>>> etc? >>>>>> Where does the MWI assert these other worlds are the SAME other worlds? >>>>>> Unless it does, you only have ONE measurement in each of these worlds. >>>>>> No >>>>>> probability exists in these other worlds since no ensemble of >>>>>> measurements >>>>>> exist in these other world. AG >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> You grossly misunderstand MWI. There are no "same other" worlds. The >>>>> worlds that arise at each trial are different in precisely one way and >>>>> one >>>>> way only: the eigenvalue recorded for the experiment. The different >>>>> eigenvalues will then give rise to a "wave of differentiations" as the >>>>> consequences of that singular difference ramifies, causing the different >>>>> worlds generated by the original experimental difference to multiply. >>>>> "World" really means a unique configuration of the universal wave >>>>> function, >>>>> so two worlds at different trials can't possibly be the "same world", and >>>>> yes, there is only one measurement in each. >>>>> >>>> >>>> *If there is only one measurement in each other world -- which has been >>>> my claim throughout -- how can Born's rule be satisfied in the MWI? AG* >>>> >>> >>> Every world has a past... So if you do n experiments after n trials you >>> have 2^n number of worlds each having a past of n trials. >>> >> >> *On the second trial and another splitting, what is the assurance that >> the new other world is the same as that created on the first splitting, so >> a sequence of measurement history exists? AG* >> > > It has the same past, if you say you'll do 9 trials in advance, then most > "worlds" after your 9 trials will have done 9 trials(without considering > ultra low probability worlds) and all nine worlds will share the same past > before any trials. > *So the assurance I seek is simply your claim that it is so? AG * > >> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> That is precisely the stipulation of MWI. If we have a quantum >>>>> experiment with two eigenvalues 1 and 0, and each is equally likely per >>>>> the >>>>> Born rule, then the MWI interpretation is that - effectively - two worlds >>>>> are created. You, the experimenter, end up in both, each version knowing >>>>> nothing about the other. So, in the "objective world" (the view from >>>>> outside the whole wave function as it were), no probability is involved. >>>>> But if you repeat this experiment many times, each version of you will >>>>> record an apparently random sequence of 1s and 0s. Your best prediction >>>>> of >>>>> what happens in the next experiment is that it's a 50/50 toss up between >>>>> 1 >>>>> and 0. Objectively there's no randomness, subjectively it appears that >>>>> way. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> John K Clark See my new list at Extropolis >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/g/extropolis> >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>> >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Everything List" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/d71dbf38-5943-4f9f-9f1a-f7c5ea822c4cn%40googlegroups.com >>>> >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/d71dbf38-5943-4f9f-9f1a-f7c5ea822c4cn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> > To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/2038e98e-2690-4a12-9516-43691b1694aan%40googlegroups.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/2038e98e-2690-4a12-9516-43691b1694aan%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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