On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 2:56 PM, Loup Vaillant <> wrote:

> Le 01/03/2012 22:58, Casey Ransberger a écrit :
>  Below.
>> On Feb 29, 2012, at 5:43 AM, Loup Vaillant<>  wrote:
>>  Yes, I'm aware of that limitation.  I have the feeling however that
>>> IDEs and debuggers are overrated.
>> When I'm Squeaking, sometimes I find myself modeling classes with the
>> browser but leaving method bodies to 'self break' and then write all of the
>> actual code in the debugger. Doesn't work so well for hacking on the GUI,
>> but, well.
> Okay I take it back. Your use case sounds positively awesome.

It's fun:)

>  I'm curious about 'debuggers are overrated' and 'you shouldn't need one.'
>> Seems odd. Most people I've encountered who don't use the debugger haven't
>> learned one yet.
> Spot on.  The only debugger I have used up until now was a semi-broken
> version of gdb (it tended to miss stack frames).

Oh, ouch. Missed frames. I hate it when things are ill-framed.

I can't say I blame you. GDB is very *NIXy. Not really very friendly to
newcomers. Crack open a Squeak image and break something. It's a whole
different experience. "Where is this nil value coming from?" is a question
that I can answer more easily in a ST-80 debugger than I can in any other
that I've tried (exception of maybe Self.) The button UI on the thing could
probably use a bit of modern design love (I'm sure I'm going to be trampled
for saying so!) but otherwise I think it's a great study for what the
baseline debugging experience ought to be for a HLL (why deal with less
awesome when there's more awesome available under the MIT license as a
model to work from?)

Of course, I'm saying *baseline.* Which is to say that we can probably go a
whole lot further with these things in the future. I'm still waiting on
that magical OmniDebugger that Alessandro Warth mentioned would be able to
deal with multiple OMeta-implemented languages;)

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