Zaid, youre talking out of my heart unfortunately the problem you mentioned is not limited to this group ;)
When I began programming I used to hate people like us who talked that way (in good old English said RTFM), however once I became a better programmer and noticed that I do have (at least for our region) an above average knowledge for someone in my age (and years of experience) people started to only ask questions rather than just look it up anywhere. I spent the past half year training my colleagues to first look at the manual, then common forums, then google before they asked me (or anyone else). A note by side Zaid, I loved your answer simply stating the guide-line questions, even I forget from time to time to actually ask myself, what I need from a specific component. Cheers, Mozzy From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of zaid emeish Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 8:29 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [JoPHP] Re: Are database abstraction layers worth it? to be honest with u man. and we discussed this on the phone many times. that these guys don't want to spend time researching. and i think it's not just their fault. its the educational programming they got in school, college.... etc. so here is what u need to do guys. there is a business rule. it's called the 80 - 20 (eighty twenty rule). what this means. in business 80% of the income is generated by 20% of the customers. and u should apply this to programming. spend 80% of ur time on research and reading. and 20% actually programming. and when u have a specific problem that u can't solve. and can't find the solution on Google (which I doubt). then come here and ask the question. u have some great great developers here that have huge knowledge and can help. but you have to ask the right question. Guys I am sorry if I am too honest with u. but if u keep asking vague questions. u will get vague answers. use this group wisely. Absorb Ammars knowledge and mine as much as u can. we worked on huge complex projects. and we can help. but only if u ask the right question and put the right effort. --Zaid On 10/17/07, Ammar Ibrahim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I totally agree on what you've said. The problem is that most programmers confuse DB Abstraction Layers, with Database Wrappers. There are many approaches to simplify, unify & extend Database functionality. I generally think a DB Abstraction Layer is very useful if you're developing a *product* that needs to run with different databases. Managing the differences in SQL dialects is a nightmare! I would rather use some sort of a layer to handle that, and I certainly wouldn't write my own, unless I know exactly why I need to do that. As far as I know, MDB2 & ADOdb are the two most mature, full fledged abstraction layers out there. That said, it doesn't mean you shouldn't abstract Data Access (Models). Abstracting data from the application is a must, in MVC terms, that would be writing models. You can still write excellent models using native DB functions, e.g. mysql_* - Ammar On 10/17/07, zaid emeish < [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: Ok. for a start. there are no rules in programming. there are only guide lines. so if you are looking to use a DB layer. you should ask urself a few questions: 1- Do I really need a DB layer? 2- If Do I use one. is it gonna make my job easier? 3- What exactly do I want this layer to do? --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jordan PHP Users Group" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/JoPHP http://Jolug.org/ -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
