I wish you a happy Thanksgiving Day all of you over there! :) 2012/11/21 Molly <[email protected]>
> Not sure if it a shield (that separates), rather a dynamic of > innocence (that unites) as we all have it in us. Sometimes it is > buried in limitation or corruption. That "innocence" as you say, is > simply the unlimited, or eternal in us. Simple recognition brings it > forth. The rational view is indeed, important overall. I have felt > myself to be the voice of reason more than once, and lately too. But > it includes, and does not limit what is possible for me. > > The diversity in this group has real value, to me anyway. So thank > you my friends. > > On Nov 20, 3:04 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > It's hard to know how we cope Moll. I don't do it like you - but have > > some kind of shield of innocence. Oliver Stone now says he was born > > into being a consevative Republican who believed he was fighting > > communism in Vietnam. Now he knows he was had by false history. Very > > few people seem to realise our current paedophile panic is nothing > > new, just another manifestation of our inability to grasp nettles. I > > don't go for religion where the issues are clearly practical - its > > rationalisation to me. > > > > On 20 Nov, 07:45, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > my view of the sacraments and rituals were far different years ago and > > > do seethe importance of them.. you can buy the missal, actually all > > > the official prayer books for your phone if you have android.. don't > > > know about apple as I don't have one.. > > > > > I used to love the prayers and Mass,, then evolution of beliefs > > > started again, with my vacation to Malta. An very interesting truth > > > saw reveled since then it does not read the same.. > > > > > oddly though my beliefs have returned full circle from where I started > > > 45+ years ago with a vision involving Jesus.. the The vision is still > > > valid but my interpretation of "I am the way the light and the truth." > > > has changed. > > > > > I am studying in a way the same thing.. The Buddhist teaching are > > > very correct.. in the path of salvation,, (looked up a word, only to > > > find it actually meant something different than what I had gained as > > > its meaning,) It was said that in the years before Jesus started > > > teaching he had traveled to India, I see tremendous similarities in > > > his teachings and those of Buddha.. I also see the influence of > > > people wanting a short cut to spirituality. > > > > > Though I never read or knew Merton I did have the privilege of > > > talking with people that did know him.. I could not afford his books > > > at the time. > > > > > Oddly I do believe with globalization and the greater access to > > > knowledge, beliefs are starting to change again. I see it in myself > > > and what is saw as the very core and foundation of belief. > > > Alllan > > > > > On Tue, Nov 20, 2012 at 12:26 AM, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > My husband and I are both reading seven story mountain, and I bought > a > > > > few more for Christmas presents: No Man is an Island; New Seeds of > > > > Contemplation; Contemplative prayer. I admire his translation of the > > > > sacraments and rituals to internal processes. > > > > > > What is often missed, is that the notion of heaven on earth does not > > > > ignore human shortcoming or suffering. It integrates and recognizes. > > > > Like a Bodhisattva, joyfully participating in the sorrows of the > > > > world. Allowing each his own, and knowing and feeling the connection > > > > of all. I don't dwell in despair. That doesn't mean it does not exist > > > > in the world. I work every day in downtown Detroit. And see much, > > > > but don't worry about the wrong or right of it. I just work each day > > > > in joy. People smile when they see (and feel) a genuine smile. > > > > > > On Nov 19, 3:45 pm, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Molly which one of Merton's books are you reading .. he is quiet > prolific.. > > > >> Allan > > > > > >> On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 2:03 PM, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> > I don't think that isolating like the Amish (who lead their > > > >> > ethnocentric group with control measures) or focusing on the ills > of > > > >> > government, law enforcement or narrow economic pictures give a > clear > > > >> > picture of what globalization means to humanity. Ultimately, > what is > > > >> > seen in separation, separates us. I feel toward humanity as > Thomas > > > >> > Merton: > > > > > >> > "There is in all things an inexhaustible sweetness and purity, a > > > >> > silence that is a fountain of action and joy. It rises up in > wordless > > > >> > gentleness and flows out of me from unseen roots of all created > > > >> > beings." > > > > > >> > The unseen roots unite us, and globalization is spirit in action > in > > > >> > the "rising up." How this manifests in our view is largely > dependent > > > >> > on our own given focus. If it is dismal we need to feel, we will > see > > > >> > the dismal every time. It doesn't change the fact that heaven on > > > >> > earth is ours for the taking. More spirit in action. > > > > > >> > "It doesn't matter which you heard, the holy or the broken > > > >> > Hallelujah." Both holy and broken co-exist. Both are holy in the > > > >> > unification. > > > > > >> > On Nov 19, 6:49 am, gabbydott <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> >> From my perspective this reborn metaphor is misleading, it leads > you to the > > > >> >> next level of happy self betrayal. The Amish community is a > wonderful > > > >> >> example of what it looks like when an evolving society allows a > small group > > > >> >> to conserve themselves in their own bubble and protects them > from natural > > > >> >> updating processes. I believe there is better ways to not forget > the values > > > >> >> of America's European history. > > > > > >> >> 2012/11/19 andrew vecsey <[email protected]> > > > > > >> >> > In my opinion opting out of their game is more like being > reborn than of > > > >> >> > going to your own funeral. The less defendant we are on others > or on > > > >> >> > things, the more free we are. We have grown to be so defendant > on the > > > >> >> > system that we are afraid that we can not survive without it. > The Amish > > > >> >> > community is an example that clearly demonstrates that we can > survive and > > > >> >> > even thrive without the system that I refer to as > globalization. It is > > > >> >> > dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket. > > > > > >> >> > On Monday, November 19, 2012 11:39:27 AM UTC+1, gabbydott > wrote: > > > > > >> >> >> It really is that simple. It is like going to your own > funeral. > > > > > >> >> >> 2012/11/19 andrew vecsey <[email protected]> > > > > > >> >> >> With drugs and mass media they control our desires and with > drugs and > > > >> >> >>> schools they control our thinking. The only simple solution > I can think of > > > >> >> >>> is not to play their game. Just refuse to buy what they > offer to sell. . > > > > > >> >> >>> On Sunday, November 18, 2012 9:47:11 PM UTC+1, Allan Heretic > wrote: > > > > > >> >> >>>> globalization can be very beneficial and granted there are > many self > > > >> >> >>>> centered individuals and corporations that have that have > little > > > >> >> >>>> concern for others or our world.. but one thing that is > coming out of > > > >> >> >>>> it they can not control what people thing and desire their > world to > > > >> >> >>>> be.. Little by little I see people reclaiming the dreams > of a better > > > >> >> >>>> world. > > > >> >> >>>> Oh well what can you expect from an old hippie > > > >> >> >>>> Allan > > > > > >> >> >>>> On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 7:43 PM, archytas <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > >> >> >>>> > Andrew is obviously right when one considers where our > wealth is > > > >> >> >>>> > ending-up. This group is broadly parochial, white and > barely > > > >> >> >>>> > understands what it excludes and how. We are reliant on > centralised > > > >> >> >>>> > technology that is soon to force us to a format we don't > want. > > > >> >> >>>> > Rigsy's question is about right. Previous globalisation > was > > > >> >> >>>> > colonising and I suspect most of what we are witnessing > now is in > > > >> >> >>>> that > > > >> >> >>>> > model. It would be good to make the move in emphasis > Molly suggests, > > > >> >> >>>> > but the signs in the underlying business model indicate > the opposite > > > >> >> >>>> > to me - currently remaining in advertising and making a > killing in > > > >> >> >>>> > market share. There is another (dated) form of > globalisation in the > > > >> >> >>>> > phrase 'workers of the world unite' and it must be clear > this has > > > >> >> >>>> been > > > >> >> >>>> > resisted by the powerful other than in their own > 'guilds'. My list > > > >> >> >>>> on > > > >> >> >>>> > what globalisation is would be long and rather vague - > including > > > >> >> >>>> > teaching foreign students with bare English textbook > answers I kn ow > > > >> >> >>>> > to be rot. James Bond has globalised but not decent > water, food and > > > >> >> >>>> > housing for all - let alone freedom from the kind of > idiots on all > > > >> >> >>>> > sides who keep such stuff as the Arab-Israeli conflict > going. > > > > > >> >> >>>> > We need realistic optimism - but this means embracing > really bad news > > > >> >> >>>> > on climate (worse than we think) and history (much worse > than we > > > >> >> >>>> > think) in order to see how we get some decent stuff done > amongst the > > > >> >> >>>> > enemies of open society. Globalisation is getting very > real in the > > > >> >> >>>> > sense of telepresence (I could be operated on in Bolton > by a surgeon > > > >> >> >>>> > in Madras) and other varieties of the embodiment of > knowledge that > > > >> >> >>>> > will allow remote and even home manufacturing. > > > > > >> >> >>>> > Postmodernism (which I regard as the move to modernism we > have never > > > >> >> >>>> > had) is bringing about a legitimation crisis. I am > broadly (but not > > > >> >> >>>> > completely) free of the religious dross taught in youth > and chronic > > > >> >> >>>> > copy-teachers who told me Julius Caesar invaded Britain > in 53AD and > > > >> >> >>>> > that humans have 24 pairs of chromosomes like other apes. > To > > > >> >> >>>> discover > > > >> >> >>>> > the extent of ideological dross in my education I > travelled. The > > > >> >> >>>> > Internet's supposedly global reach does not even > compare. How could > > > >> >> >>>> > anything be more parochial that Faceflop and Twatter? > What would be > > > >> >> >>>> > want to globalise - does anyone ever ask us? How about > freedom from > > > >> >> >>>> > work as means of income? > > > > > >> >> >>>> > On 18 Nov, 14:11, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> >> >>>> >> I disagree, Andrew, and take a view more like Alan's. > Globalization > > > >> >> >>>> >> occurs when more folks operate from a world-centric life > view (not > > > >> >> >>>> ego- > > > >> >> >>>> >> centric or ethno-centric), more countries are > > > > ... > > > > read more ยป > > -- > > > > --
