The Xtians do Xmas quite well Lee - though it is in fact the Anglo- Saxon New Year.
On 7 Dec, 16:35, Lee Douglas <[email protected]> wrote: > Haha whatever gave you that impression Allan? > > Really though you don't think that female priests represent a change in > theology? I know both gay men and gay woman who are preists, this is known > and excepted in the Anglican church. I don't know one Christian who keeps > the sabath, rather than do a spot of shopping, do you? > > > > > > > > On Friday, 7 December 2012 14:01:48 UTC, Allan Heretic wrote: > > I know you dis agree .. birth control and woman bishops effectively no > > more than administration. How has those events changing the theology? They > > still strickly following the rules unchanged since early centuries > > Allan > > > Matrix ** th3 beginning light > > On Dec 7, 2012 1:35 PM, "Lee Douglas" <[email protected] <javascript:>> > > wrote: > > >> You are joking right Allan? > > >> The changes are only in administration? So Catholics the world over are > >> not using contraception in spite of what the pope says? No such change I > >> think is driven and will be further driven by the faiths followers more > >> than it's leaders. When the new Arch Bishop of Canterbury leaves his new > >> post any changes that he has affected will still be there, one day woman > >> Bishops will be common place, despite any changes in administration. > > >> Besides if you think of religous ideas in the same way as any and all > >> other ideas, then it is clear to see that such ideas will evolve or die. > >> We no longer belive that the Earth is the center of the universe, that > >> right there is a dead religous idea. Yet Catholosism is still very much > >> with us, and that right there is an example of evolotion of the idea rather > >> than the admisistration. > >> On Friday, 7 December 2012 11:40:07 UTC, Allan Heretic wrote: > > >>> The changes are only in administration,, to me that is not evolutionary > >>> type change > >>> Allan > > >>> Matrix ** th3 beginning light > >>> On Dec 7, 2012 11:51 AM, "Lee Douglas" <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>>> Hahah maybey, maybe. I am though the eternal optimist so I see things > >>>> differantly. > > >>>> The Anglican church in particular are making some good moves. > > >>>> There are though only two things I wish to comment on at this momnet. > > >>>> My career in IT support thus far informs me that people do seem to have > >>>> an inbuilt resistance to change, and ultimatly the Christian church in > >>>> particular but of course all other dogmatic religions need to change or > >>>> they risk dieing out. > >>>> On Friday, 7 December 2012 10:02:37 UTC, Allan Heretic wrote: > > >>>>> From what I have seen it does evolve.. it seems mostly in the > >>>>> negative directions.. probably because of greed and a desire to > >>>>> control rather than spirituality.. there are exceptions but they are > >>>>> rare. > >>>>> Allan > > >>>>> On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 10:45 AM, Lee Douglas <[email protected]> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>> > And in truth Allan religion does evolove, perhaps slowly but evolove > >>>>> it > >>>>> > does. > > >>>>> > On Thursday, 6 December 2012 19:21:35 UTC, Allan Heretic wrote: > > >>>>> >> I think that religion should evolve..just like the rest of the > >>>>> >> universe.. when the evolution stops it begins to die.. a good > >>>>> example > >>>>> >> of dead beliefs is those our fundamentalist friend is presenting. > >>>>> >> Recite the magickal incantation and and every thing will be all > >>>>> >> right.. this statement to me is one of a dead faith' > >>>>> >> Allan > > >>>>> >> On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 at 6:31 PM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > >>>>> >> > Biology is describing a 'co-evolution arms race'. Religious > >>>>> notions > >>>>> >> > of the eternal have a lot in common with Popper's 'World 3' and > >>>>> what > >>>>> >> > we can regard as 'objective' and 'factual' I'm as sure as you > >>>>> about > >>>>> >> > the 'meanness' you often describe and believe the way through it, > >>>>> past > >>>>> >> > it, whatever - is spiritual - maybe a kind of dawning. > > >>>>> >> > There's a joke in the new Batman film (other 2 hours plus > >>>>> rubbish) - > >>>>> >> > when the bad guys raid the stock exchange a trader says there is > >>>>> no > >>>>> >> > money there for them to steal - the answer is that there must be > >>>>> - > >>>>> >> > otherwise the traders wouldn't be there. I think economics is > >>>>> largely > >>>>> >> > a fetish designed around libidinal and domination 'needs' - but > >>>>> even > >>>>> >> > organised religion becomes such. My guess is we need a spiritual > >>>>> >> > democracy and finance is set against this forcing us into > >>>>> compliance > >>>>> >> > with its control fraud much as many routinely bend their knees in > >>>>> >> > religious observance. Science, admittedly as reliably as a > >>>>> double- > >>>>> >> > glazing salesman, is suggesting human-biological intelligence is > >>>>> >> > already giving way to more machine-substrates that offer quasi- > >>>>> >> > immortality and intellect beyond a singularity we can hardly > >>>>> imagine. > >>>>> >> > In my science fiction dreaming we may discover the alien life on > >>>>> Earth > >>>>> >> > is actually ours and we have only been used by another, more > >>>>> worthy > >>>>> >> > consciousness.. > > >>>>> >> > On 6 Dec, 12:26, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > >>>>> >> >> Many things are best guesses.. are the foundation to many > >>>>> things along > >>>>> >> >> what has been observed .. and there is nothing wrong with that > >>>>> .. many > >>>>> >> >> ideas have evolved from the instinct for survival .. from that > >>>>> has come > >>>>> >> >> selfishness which has lead to the excessive uncaring greed we > >>>>> see > >>>>> >> >> today... > >>>>> >> >> sacrificing the other ant. > >>>>> >> >> Allan > > >>>>> >> >> Matrix ** th3 beginning light > >>>>> >> >> On Dec 6, 2012 11:09 AM, "archytas" <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>>>> >> >> > Sounds like something Pontius Pilate might have used. > > >>>>> >> >> > I guess that David Deutsch and constructor theory tries to get > >>>>> back > >>>>> >> >> > to > >>>>> >> >> > reminding science about its root guesses Allan. I take from > >>>>> >> >> > 'Spartacus Ants' sacrificing themselves to destroy slaver ants > >>>>> that > >>>>> >> >> > pre-human biology 'knows' something of survival instinct. > > >>>>> >> >> > Descartes had it that until we could get to a point of > >>>>> re-evaluating > >>>>> >> >> > against his radical doubt one had to trust in a beneficent > >>>>> god. > >>>>> >> >> > Whilst we can criticize his system, I think anti-religious > >>>>> science > >>>>> >> >> > misses the beat on issues of how we can live until we know > >>>>> more. The > >>>>> >> >> > spiritual thus has its place. There is plenty to avoid in its > >>>>> history > >>>>> >> >> > of control fraud, abuse, sexism and war crimes - but plenty to > >>>>> learn > >>>>> >> >> > in terms of grace and fellowship. > > >>>>> >> >> > On 6 Dec, 08:15, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > >>>>> >> >> > > it is not for cleaning hands ,, it just gets rid of smell > >>>>> that > >>>>> >> >> > > you > >>>>> >> >> > > can not get rid of no matter how much you wash.. you just > >>>>> wash > >>>>> >> >> > > after > >>>>> >> >> > > youor hands are clean,, then the smell is gone. > >>>>> >> >> > > Allan > > >>>>> >> >> > > On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 11:27 PM, gabbydott < > >>>>> [email protected]> > >>>>> >> >> > > wrote: > >>>>> >> >> > > > Hm, I have never thought of using a steel soap bar for > >>>>> cleaning > >>>>> >> >> > > > my > >>>>> >> >> > hands. I > >>>>> >> >> > > > use it occasionally for my pots and pans. And for the more > >>>>> >> >> > > > difficult > >>>>> >> >> > dirt on > >>>>> >> >> > > > my hands I use a pumice stone or lemon. And more and more > >>>>> often I > >>>>> >> >> > > > wear > >>>>> >> >> > > > gloves or buy frozen and precut garlic and onion. But > >>>>> thanks for > >>>>> >> >> > > > the > >>>>> >> >> > tip. > >>>>> >> >> > > > I'm sure that one day I'll make use of it. Why not steel > >>>>> instead > >>>>> >> >> > > > of > >>>>> >> >> > stone, > >>>>> >> >> > > > you're right. > > >>>>> >> >> > > > On Tuesday, December 4, 2012 7:54:42 PM UTC+1, Allan > >>>>> Heretic > >>>>> >> >> > > > wrote: > > >>>>> >> >> > > >> Well actually Gabby I have this stainless steel soap bar > >>>>> used > >>>>> >> >> > > >> for > >>>>> >> >> > > >> getting rid of ordure off your hands things like onion, > >>>>> Garlic > >>>>> >> >> > > >> ,, > >>>>> >> >> > > >> any strong ordure ,, just tried it on the epoxy smell > >>>>> left > >>>>> >> >> > > >> over from > >>>>> >> >> > > >> fixing my maxi egg coddler. > > >>>>> >> >> > > >> now one of the greatest mysteries of the universe,, how > >>>>> does it > >>>>> >> >> > > >> work? > >>>>> >> >> > > >> Allan > > >>>>> >> >> > > >> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 6:38 PM, gabbydott < > >>>>> [email protected]> > >>>>> >> >> > > >> wrote: > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > The pointlessness of the points' business. Like Lee, I > >>>>> find > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > the God > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > concept > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > much more to the point. :) > > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > I don't follow Lee's sequencing model - first spirit, > >>>>> then > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > matter - > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > though. > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > This sounds very man-made to me. ;) > > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > As for the storytelling aspect, yes, the Chronos story > >>>>> is much > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > more > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > vivid > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > than the "God created (x) and saw it was good" story. > >>>>> That's > >>>>> >> >> > > >> > true. > >>>>> >> >> > But > > ... > > read more » --
