My lawyer suggested against that but second opinion is never a bad thing. Justin Hansen
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 4:00 PM, Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo < [email protected]> wrote: > Maybe some kind of legal document/process/intervention made by a lawyer to > Novell/Attachmate. But I didn't succeed to contact my lawyer at this moment > to as that question… > > Karl > > From: Demis Bellot <[email protected]> > Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 20:50:28 +0100 > To: Justin Hansen <[email protected]> > > Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [MonoTouch] SPAM-LOW: Re: So..... what happens now? > > Well I don't expect waiting for answers on this mailing list is going to > provide a very eventful outcome. > I haven't seen an official Attachmate employee post to this group ever > since I heard of the rumour that they laid off the entire MT team. > > We need to open a dialogue with Attachmate on this issue and get a formal > statement of how existing customers are meant to proceed on > MonoTouch/MonoDroid technologies. > Anyone got any ideas on how to do this? > > - Demis > > > On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 8:45 PM, Justin Hansen <[email protected]> wrote: > >> I didn't say that Attachment doesn't suck and the product has a dead >> future. >> >> NokNok is talking about law suits and fraud. Attachment doesn't have to >> fix any bugs, they don't have to answer out emails and they don't have to >> care. Nothing in any agreement with Novell said anything about any of that. >> We purchased a product that works. I have apps in the app store made with it >> so no one can say it isn't as advertised. Any technically for the time being >> it still is. I wouldn't buy it. I would tell anyone else in the world not >> to. But for those of us that did it just sucks. There is nothing that can be >> done YET. They haven't done anything illegal YET. Wrong, definitely. >> Immoral, sure. But nothing illegal or actionable has been done as far as >> myself or my lawyer see it. >> >> Justin Hansen >> >> >> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Demis Bellot <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> They have not killed the product yet.. >>> >>> >>> Which is a very real problem if they're still selling it given that.. >>> >>> >>>> They just got rid of the team. >>> >>> >>> Just? the reason why you would choose to develop software on a platform >>> is that it remains a well-supported option >>> >>> They haven't said they won't get a new team. >>> >>> >>> How can they possibly get a new team? all their expertise on the product >>> has now vanished. This is not a drop-in tech for .NET devs on the street to >>> fill. No Mono team means MonoTouch/MonoDroid will never be properly >>> supported >>> >>> Also, their product still works. >>> >>> >>> Where do we file bugs? and who will resolve them? >>> >>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 8:36 PM, Justin Hansen <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>>> I still disagree. That analogy makes no sense. Your car will definitely >>>> need oil changes. Updating the product that they create is up to their >>>> discretion. Also, the easy fix in your scenario would be to pay for your >>>> oil >>>> change elsewhere. This also can't be done with the product we are talking >>>> about without further agreement which may be in the works for all we know. >>>> >>>> It doesn't guarantee the release of updates, it guarantees that we will >>>> have access to any that come out. >>>> >>>> Justin Hansen >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:28 PM, NokNok Developer <[email protected] >>>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> I dont know about that. If Im a consumer, looking to build .NET apps >>>>> on MonoDroid, and I purchased MonoDroid last week, my expectation from the >>>>> site is that I am paying for a product which includes 1 year of updates. >>>>> >>>>> If in fact, their is no-one to make such updates, nor is their "an >>>>> intent" to provide updates over the year, then that my friend is fraud. >>>>> >>>>> So if they do not establish they HAVE intent, then in fact it would be >>>>> like me selling you my car, with a year free oil changes, but I have no >>>>> place to do the oil changes, i have no employees to do the oil changes, i >>>>> have no intention of ever giving you an oil change. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 5/17/2011 3:09 PM, Justin Hansen wrote: >>>>> >>>>> They have not killed the product yet. They just got rid of the team. >>>>> They haven't said they won't get a new team. Also, their product still >>>>> works. >>>>> >>>>> They def haven't committed any fraud yet. >>>>> >>>>> I'm just as angry as the rest of you, I am just pointing out that all >>>>> the conclusions that are being jumped to (that Attachment owes us >>>>> something >>>>> or fraud) just aren't true yet. They say we are entitled to any updates >>>>> that >>>>> come out for a year. The only way there is any fraud related to that is if >>>>> an update does come out that is denied to us. They aren't guaranteeing >>>>> that >>>>> they will ever come out with an update. The discount code works, no fraud >>>>> there. The product has not been officially killed for all we know they are >>>>> hiring new people to take the product in a new direction. I doubt that's >>>>> the >>>>> case and wouldn't support them if they did, but since we can't prove any >>>>> of >>>>> this none of the below statement is true at this point. >>>>> >>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:03 PM, NokNok Developer < >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I dont know here, it would be to my thinking any company selling a >>>>>> product claiming one year updates, and still providing the DISCOUNT CODE >>>>>> for >>>>>> existing TOUCH USERS - AFTER LETTING GO OF ENTIRE TEAM, AND KNOWINGLY >>>>>> KILLED >>>>>> THE PRODUCT - would be constituted as consumer fraud... >>>>>> >>>>>> Which all did occur... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 5/17/2011 2:59 PM, Justin Hansen wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I agree, I'm saying that Attachment has no obligation to us. >>>>>> >>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 2:58 PM, Natalia Portillo < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> El 17/05/2011, a las 16:55, Justin Hansen escribió: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >From my standpoint if monotouch doesn't come with guaranteed support >>>>>>> why should they be obligated to do so? Esspecially since we agreed that >>>>>>> they >>>>>>> don't in the contract. I know that you can't have a contract that >>>>>>> negates a >>>>>>> law but there is no law that says a company must provide user support. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> That being said I'm from the U.S. so I can't speak to anything >>>>>>> outside this country. I just know my lawyer pointed out that clause in >>>>>>> 10 >>>>>>> minutes and asked me about promised support. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You still have the "one year of updates" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 11:52 AM, Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I spoke with a lawyer in brazil (where consumer rights are one of >>>>>>>> the strongest) and he said that the above term is absurd... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> He said that a process can take really a long to court decide, but >>>>>>>> can be a good pression. As I live in brasil, if I make something with >>>>>>>> Novell, I will do here. So each one must do, I think, on tis living >>>>>>>> country. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Karl >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> From: Justin Hansen <[email protected]> >>>>>>>> Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 11:47:56 -0400 >>>>>>>> To: Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo <[email protected]> >>>>>>>> Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [MonoTouch] SPAM-LOW: Re: So..... what happens now? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Out of curiosity does monotouch come with one year of support or >>>>>>>> just one year of upgrades? See below: >>>>>>>> MAINTENANCE AND SUPPORT >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Novell has no obligation to provide support or maintenance unless >>>>>>>> You purchase an offering that expressly includes support or maintenance >>>>>>>> services. If You make such a purchase and no separate agreement >>>>>>>> specifically applies to the support or maintenance services, then the >>>>>>>> terms >>>>>>>> of this Agreement will govern the provision of such support or >>>>>>>> maintenance >>>>>>>> services (“Services“). For more information on Novell's current >>>>>>>> support >>>>>>>> offerings, see http://www.novell.com/support. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I can't see where on the site it says anything about guaranteed >>>>>>>> support. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 11:40 AM, Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo < >>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Maybe that… >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Karl >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> MonoTouch mailing >>>>>> [email protected]http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Justin Hansen >>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>> [email protected] >>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> - Demis >>> >>> http://twitter.com/demisbellot >>> http://www.servicestack.net/mythz_blog >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Justin Hansen >> http://www.klickwerx.com >> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >> >> > > _______________________________________________ MonoTouch mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch > > _______________________________________________ > MonoTouch mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch > > -- Justin Hansen http://www.klickwerx.com Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb
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