Well I don't expect waiting for answers on this mailing list is going to provide a very eventful outcome. I haven't seen an official Attachmate employee post to this group ever since I heard of the rumour that they laid off the entire MT team.
We need to open a dialogue with Attachmate on this issue and get a formal statement of how existing customers are meant to proceed on MonoTouch/MonoDroid technologies. Anyone got any ideas on how to do this? - Demis On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 8:45 PM, Justin Hansen <[email protected]> wrote: > I didn't say that Attachment doesn't suck and the product has a dead > future. > > NokNok is talking about law suits and fraud. Attachment doesn't have to fix > any bugs, they don't have to answer out emails and they don't have to care. > Nothing in any agreement with Novell said anything about any of that. We > purchased a product that works. I have apps in the app store made with it so > no one can say it isn't as advertised. Any technically for the time being it > still is. I wouldn't buy it. I would tell anyone else in the world not to. > But for those of us that did it just sucks. There is nothing that can be > done YET. They haven't done anything illegal YET. Wrong, definitely. > Immoral, sure. But nothing illegal or actionable has been done as far as > myself or my lawyer see it. > > Justin Hansen > > > On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Demis Bellot <[email protected]>wrote: > >> They have not killed the product yet. >> >> >> Which is a very real problem if they're still selling it given that.. >> >> >>> They just got rid of the team. >> >> >> Just? the reason why you would choose to develop software on a platform is >> that it remains a well-supported option >> >> They haven't said they won't get a new team. >> >> >> How can they possibly get a new team? all their expertise on the product >> has now vanished. This is not a drop-in tech for .NET devs on the street to >> fill. No Mono team means MonoTouch/MonoDroid will never be properly >> supported >> >> Also, their product still works. >> >> >> Where do we file bugs? and who will resolve them? >> >> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 8:36 PM, Justin Hansen <[email protected]>wrote: >> >>> I still disagree. That analogy makes no sense. Your car will definitely >>> need oil changes. Updating the product that they create is up to their >>> discretion. Also, the easy fix in your scenario would be to pay for your oil >>> change elsewhere. This also can't be done with the product we are talking >>> about without further agreement which may be in the works for all we know. >>> >>> It doesn't guarantee the release of updates, it guarantees that we will >>> have access to any that come out. >>> >>> Justin Hansen >>> >>> >>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:28 PM, NokNok Developer >>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>>> I dont know about that. If Im a consumer, looking to build .NET apps >>>> on MonoDroid, and I purchased MonoDroid last week, my expectation from the >>>> site is that I am paying for a product which includes 1 year of updates. >>>> >>>> If in fact, their is no-one to make such updates, nor is their "an >>>> intent" to provide updates over the year, then that my friend is fraud. >>>> >>>> So if they do not establish they HAVE intent, then in fact it would be >>>> like me selling you my car, with a year free oil changes, but I have no >>>> place to do the oil changes, i have no employees to do the oil changes, i >>>> have no intention of ever giving you an oil change. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 5/17/2011 3:09 PM, Justin Hansen wrote: >>>> >>>> They have not killed the product yet. They just got rid of the team. >>>> They haven't said they won't get a new team. Also, their product still >>>> works. >>>> >>>> They def haven't committed any fraud yet. >>>> >>>> I'm just as angry as the rest of you, I am just pointing out that all >>>> the conclusions that are being jumped to (that Attachment owes us something >>>> or fraud) just aren't true yet. They say we are entitled to any updates >>>> that >>>> come out for a year. The only way there is any fraud related to that is if >>>> an update does come out that is denied to us. They aren't guaranteeing that >>>> they will ever come out with an update. The discount code works, no fraud >>>> there. The product has not been officially killed for all we know they are >>>> hiring new people to take the product in a new direction. I doubt that's >>>> the >>>> case and wouldn't support them if they did, but since we can't prove any of >>>> this none of the below statement is true at this point. >>>> >>>> Justin Hansen >>>> >>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:03 PM, NokNok Developer <[email protected] >>>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> I dont know here, it would be to my thinking any company selling a >>>>> product claiming one year updates, and still providing the DISCOUNT CODE >>>>> for >>>>> existing TOUCH USERS - AFTER LETTING GO OF ENTIRE TEAM, AND KNOWINGLY >>>>> KILLED >>>>> THE PRODUCT - would be constituted as consumer fraud... >>>>> >>>>> Which all did occur... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 5/17/2011 2:59 PM, Justin Hansen wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I agree, I'm saying that Attachment has no obligation to us. >>>>> >>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 2:58 PM, Natalia Portillo <[email protected] >>>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> El 17/05/2011, a las 16:55, Justin Hansen escribió: >>>>>> >>>>>> >From my standpoint if monotouch doesn't come with guaranteed support >>>>>> why should they be obligated to do so? Esspecially since we agreed that >>>>>> they >>>>>> don't in the contract. I know that you can't have a contract that >>>>>> negates a >>>>>> law but there is no law that says a company must provide user support. >>>>>> >>>>>> That being said I'm from the U.S. so I can't speak to anything outside >>>>>> this country. I just know my lawyer pointed out that clause in 10 minutes >>>>>> and asked me about promised support. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> You still have the "one year of updates" >>>>>> >>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 11:52 AM, Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I spoke with a lawyer in brazil (where consumer rights are one of >>>>>>> the strongest) and he said that the above term is absurd... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> He said that a process can take really a long to court decide, but >>>>>>> can be a good pression. As I live in brasil, if I make something with >>>>>>> Novell, I will do here. So each one must do, I think, on tis living >>>>>>> country. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Karl >>>>>>> >>>>>>> From: Justin Hansen <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 11:47:56 -0400 >>>>>>> To: Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [MonoTouch] SPAM-LOW: Re: So..... what happens now? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Out of curiosity does monotouch come with one year of support or >>>>>>> just one year of upgrades? See below: >>>>>>> MAINTENANCE AND SUPPORT >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Novell has no obligation to provide support or maintenance unless You >>>>>>> purchase an offering that expressly includes support or maintenance >>>>>>> services. If You make such a purchase and no separate agreement >>>>>>> specifically applies to the support or maintenance services, then the >>>>>>> terms >>>>>>> of this Agreement will govern the provision of such support or >>>>>>> maintenance >>>>>>> services (“Services“). For more information on Novell's current support >>>>>>> offerings, see http://www.novell.com/support. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I can't see where on the site it says anything about guaranteed >>>>>>> support. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 11:40 AM, Karl Heinz Brehme Arredondo < >>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Maybe that… >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Karl >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Justin Hansen >>>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> MonoTouch mailing >>>>> [email protected]http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> MonoTouch mailing list >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Justin Hansen >>>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Justin Hansen >>> http://www.klickwerx.com >>> Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> MonoTouch mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://lists.ximian.com/mailman/listinfo/monotouch >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> - Demis >> >> http://twitter.com/demisbellot >> http://www.servicestack.net/mythz_blog >> >> > > > -- > Justin Hansen > http://www.klickwerx.com > Need some technology help? - http://www.betterfly.com/LearnTheWeb > >
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