Questions and comments for both Bo and Krimel as
follows:
[Bo]
> Well, my view is that comparing the MOQ to either
> Buddhism or
> Taoism is (not exactly wrong, but) unnecessary, the
> MOQ
> transcends SOM in a way that leaves it less
> "mystical", more
> suited the Western - um - mind.
Bo, what is mystical?
[Krimel]
> Taoism is not part of Buddhism. Taoism is not
> necessarily mystical. ZMM is
> clearly rooted in Taoism. Pirsig states this
> explicitly not only in ZMM but
> in his letters to Ant.
"Like Confucianism, Daoism was not solely a
philosophical system. In an interesting historical
accident, by the early third century B.C.E, perhaps
because the Daodejing had been drafted into the
service of Legalist thinkers arguing against the
Confucian model of statecraft, Laozi came to be allied
with Huangdi, the Yellow Emperor, who was said to have
brought humankind not only military, magical, and
medical arts, but also statecraft modeled on objective
patterns in nature, not subjective morality. Thus, in
spite of the Zhuangzi's explicit denunciation of the
Yellow Emperor, late-Han Daoism came to be associated
with medicines, magic, spirit travel, and alchemy - an
association that persisted in and became a driving
force of the religious dimension of Daoism that
developed from the second century C.E. onward."
You see Krimel, if I'm not correct fill me in,
but I see you as Zhuangzi in this instance. Your
trying to uphold the Daoist tradition that Zhuangzi
and Laozi saw. You might disagree with Laozi and/or
Zhuangzi on certain issues, I don't know, but in this
instance above Zhuangzi (an originator of Daoism) saw
the legist and the Yellow Emperor as taking Daoism
somewhere Zhuangzi disagreed with. I don't know all
the details on this issue, but it would seem Zhuangzi
pointing at the daodejing saying to the Yellow Emperor
something along the lines of this helps relate daoism,
and the religious connotation that became associated
with daoism is something Zhuangzi was explicitly
against (again, there may be certain aspects of this
religious daoism that holds some goodness, I'm not
sure, but Zhuangzi was getting at something here).
[Krimel]
> Lila, with its focus on SQ and DQ is clearly an
> extension of this Taoist
> line of thinking from ZMM. Where Yin is the passive
> principle and Yang is
> the Active principle.
> Levels and speculations beyond these principles are
> mostly centered on the
> "what if" games Pirsig plays after establishing
> this.
These "what if" games, are these projections,
rationals that help encourage certain perspectives,
but are not to be taken too literal?
woods,
SA
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