Comment embedded below. At 05:23 PM 12/17/2007, you wrote: > [Marsha] > > Dropouts. It's waking up from the social dream. > > It's to have you > > value system unglued. "It's not this! It's not > > that! What the hell > > is going on???" > > [SA currently] > This 'dropping out' can happen socially and >intellectually. By intellectually, this is what I >refer to as 'moving on'. When the intellect drops >away from what the intellect knew, it is the same as >having an empty cup of tea ready to be filled. > Social drop-outs don't leave their intellect in >the society in which they are dropping out of. Social >drop outs, as Ron points out, are mainly mentally >unstable and drug addicts and he points out these can >feedback into each other too. I would also add family >problems for the youth of today are where children on >the streets come from. Their father beats them >(sexually abuses them: I am very surprised still to >this day by the number of children that come to >placement with problems rooted in their father, >step-father, brother, or others sexually abused them >while they were 4 years old, 6, 8, 12, or older, yes, >4 - on the unit of ten girls I work on now two of the >girls had a father or adoptive father that sexually >abused them while they were 4 years old), their mother >isn't around (whether she works, does drug, or is >dead, etc...) or they don't have anybody to care for >them - CARE/Quality... sounds familiar. > For instance, tonight most of the residents are >going out to eat and to a movie. A Steeler bought out >a restaurant and a movie theater for the residents. > >From the director where I work, he is emphasizing the >social remodeling that the staff will be able to >positively give back to the youth, as well as, the >people involved (the Steeler, his wife and little >daughter) will be providing a positive socially >behaved experienced as gift. Notice the social >remodeling - that's what's being marketed to these >youth. There are those in society that have a deep >sense that these residents are at the fringe of >society, and don't get much positive feedback as to >how this society can be enjoyable. The value of this >society in the eyes of many is disappearing - why! >Pirsig says lack of care! I agree with him. >Experiencing and understanding care goes a long way. >As long as a metaphysics and a forum can spread a >lacking focus in people's lives today - a lack in >knowing and living a caring life. A life that can be >of quality, valuable, and still morally attainable. >Who teaches care in your neighborhood?
Greetings SA, One can intellectually drop out. One can socially drop out independently for reasons of violence or no one caring. But one can drop out socially as a result of intellectually dropping out. One example might be, if one no longer shares a common understanding of the language being used because nothing has yet intellectually replaced its meaning and you're still in the confusion of the vacuum. Or if one has adopted a different world-view and the concepts in your mind no longer coincide with the general culture's. While to a great extent you may still be dependent on the culture for the biological essentials, you are also separated from it in a meaningful way. This is one reason why painting and this forum are important to me. And why I think of this forum as a sangha. Buddhism doesn't feel right, but these discussions do. Am I making sense? Or just repeating what you've already said? Thanks, Marsha > [Marsha] > > I imagine it can happen under many different > > circumstances. Combat, with its death and > > destruction, might be a > > situation that can send you mind into a spin. > > Sometimes it might be > > a single question that can't be answered that can > > shatter the whole > > system. Reactions probably vary. > > [SA currently] > Exactly Marsha. This is what I'm trying to point >out. It's not always these bums under the bridge, >it's the bums in the high rise that can't wait to get >away from the hardships of the daily grind and >traffic. It's anybody that just wants to get away >from the mess of the cultural hardships. How many are >just trying to get away? Vacations are a must in this >society. Without them people get frustrated and >blow-up. > > > > [Marsha] > > If you're not prepared for it, it > > may be quiet a violent shock. I wonder about the > > kid that randomly > > shot people at a mall. Timothy McVeigh? Etc. > > > [SA currently] > Exactly!!! Why this need to kill people in ones >own culture? The push from ones culture to evolve >better can be violent or discussed on forums such as >this. > > > > [Marsha] > > When it's gone what > > do you hold on to? And then for the lucky ones, > > what kind of restructuring occurs. > > [SA currently] > Yes, it's this letting go that everybody talks >about. Is it a letting go and restructuring in the >art room or is it in the bomb room? > > [Marsha] > > I try not to judge dropouts, or "bums". I have no > > idea of their > > experience. I am more saddened by the people who > > buy the social > > dream, hook, line and sinker. It sustains the mess. > > > [SA currently] > I agree. Looking at this culture as if it's some >kind of divine caste system (as in India) and saying >it's a persons place to be a bum or an executive, >etc... doesn't cut it for me. The way I see this, >somebody has to put the hamburger patty on the bun in >McDonalds, as long as this culture supports a >McDonalds. Somebody is a bum in this culture due to >the expectations that this culture has and some people >can't meet them. To stomp on bums and others and >blame it all on their lack of something is >disheartening. What if people cared more? What if >this culture allowed for a quality way of living to be >tried? Wouldn't it be different than the valueless, >stuck, moraless way this culture is today? I know >it's a dream, but is it a good dream? If Buddha was >enlightened and then thought, oh what use is this >enlightenment anyways and then he didn't try to care >and share his wisdom, or any other good hearted person >stared at bums and said, oh it's their fault anyways >and went into the store to buy a new toy - sad. > > > [Marsha] > > I dropped out, > > but it was comparably gentle and with some luck. > > And I had books to > > keep me warm. Krishnamurti, Nietzsche, Pirsig!!! > > There was someone there to say it's okay. > > > [SA currently] > That's what I think most people need. Somebody >to say, "it's okay". Simple, wise, and compassionate. > > >woods, >SA > > > >____________________________________________________________________________________ >Be a better friend, newshound, and >know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it >now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > >Moq_Discuss mailing list >Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >Archives: >http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
