I do not know who Stanley Hauerwas is. Oh I was teasing this morning. Kind of... I have grown to respect your position more and more. It is a middle way. Maybe not what I always appreciate in the moment; I may snarl, but it is often the best choice.
I don't suppose some know how very happy I am to be in this forum. I have no where else to go to talk of these matters. I consider myself to be extremely fortunate. - Even my snarling skills have improved. Be well Ian. Marsha On Oct 20, 2010, at 7:28 AM, Ian Glendinning wrote: > That Marsha, is why I often say (sincerely) that I think you do really get it. > > You (like all of us) often bring an "attitude" to the particular > arguments with particular individuals on MD .... which gets you lashed > and ridiculed too. > > I my case the "attitude" would appear to be "cute" or "smart-ass" or > "superior & knowing" ;-) We all have our cross to bear, but in general > (with one lone exception) I believe (trust) we are all sincere. > > But that's only my opinion. BTW did you see the Stanley Hauerwas joke ? > "When Bush came to power I concluded he was sincere about his > Christian faith. I also concluded it showed how little sincerity had > to do with Christianity." > > Ian > > On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 12:11 PM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Ian, >> >> I see the hope in the enigma, that science is beyond "making sense." >> It might be a time for a paradigm shift in thinking. There's hints and hope. >> I love the quantum micro and macro, though. It's all very exciting as >> scientists >> become entangled in their own beliefs. >> >> There does seem to be a false dichotomy in the air: objective science OR >> subjective god. That's why I love and respect the MoQ and Buddhism.. >> There's a better/middle way. And why I go on about reification/som. Break >> that habit and you have a whole new and improved game to play. But, as >> I've read and know first-hand, it is a hard habit to break. imho. >> >> >> Marsha >> >> >> >> >> >> On Oct 20, 2010, at 6:48 AM, Ian Glendinning wrote: >> >>> Marsha, >>> >>> DMB has his own agenda (and style of ridicule), in particular in this >>> context defending scientific rationality against anti-intellectual attacks >>> from the right, and spurious god / religion / theology arguments. There are >>> millions of people in that debate right now - my lone voice in support of >>> enlightened rationality will not be missed. >>> >>> I'm focussed on making science better (in whatever small ways I can) ... >>> better understand itself and its relation to the mythos ... so that it >>> doesn't fall into the idolatrous trap of absolute intellectual superiority >>> like any two-bit religion. (In doing so, I do risk appearing not to support >>> the first argument .... but nothing could be further from the truth.) >>> >>> If I wrote so dmb could understand me, I think our differences would be >>> purely tactical - choosing our battlegrounds. >>> >>> Standing by for DMB's ridicule. >>> Ian >>> On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 11:35 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> Geez, someone criticized Hawking in this forum and was soundly ridiculed >>>> by dmb? I have watched all the Hawking dvd programs available; one more >>>> to go. Find it important to know where I am pointing my skepticism. - >>>> It's >>>> interesting story-telling. Once upon a time there was singularity... >>>> >>>> Wallace's book was great! - I can only change myself, which may be the >>>> best way to assist social change. When in public I _try_ to spread good >>>> cheer. >>>> >>>> >>>> Marsha >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Oct 20, 2010, at 6:21 AM, Ian Glendinning wrote: >>>> >>>>> Agreed. Hawking (media superstar) is part of the problem of current day >>>>> science, all he can do is deepen the hole it's in. >>>>> >>>>> Science will rise to its true position if it winds back 80 years or so. >>>> The >>>>> problem with science now is that it is (in its own mind and in public >>>>> consciousness and media generally) too exalted. Unfortunately, to be >>>> called >>>>> scientific is to be praised - hallelujah. Idolatry in action. >>>>> >>>>> But - let's try and do something about it - do as we would be done by. >>>>> Look at the specific scientific error in the big bang stuff (I provided >>>> 10 >>>>> or more links) ... and use it as an example to spread awareness of the >>>>> problem. >>>>> >>>>> Ian >>>>> >>>>> On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 11:05 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Sorry. I meant science. It will take much more than >>>>>> Hawking hawking its theories to resurrect science to >>>>>> an exalted position. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Oct 20, 2010, at 5:55 AM, Ian Glendinning wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Marsha, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Wallace book, I've heard of, but ... >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Resurrect "it" - what's "it" ? >>>>>>> Whose comments on what programme ? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Regards >>>>>>> Ian >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 20, 2010 at 10:37 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Ian, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The Wallace book 'Choosing Reality' was enlightening. It will take >>>>>>>> much more than a Hawking to resurrect it. It's hard to keep from >>>>>>>> laughing at his program comments. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Marsha >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Oct 20, 2010, at 5:33 AM, Ian Glendinning wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> If science is right it appears Copernicus was right all along, and >>>> the >>>>>>>> Earth >>>>>>>>> really is the centre of the universe. >>>>>>>>> http://www.psybertron.org/?p=3589 >>>>>>>>> (Clue - science is wrong - shock, horror ;-o ) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Ian >>>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>>>>>> Archives: >>>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ___ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>>>>> Archives: >>>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>>>> Archives: >>>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ___ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>>> Archives: >>>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>>> >>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>> Archives: >>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___ >>>> >>>> >>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>> Archives: >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>> >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> >> >> >> ___ >> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
