total agree. Those in hiring positions must look at all aspects of the job requirement and fill the position with the person that best fit the job requirement. The way I look at it, businesses have a need and we fill the need. The experience and certification help propective employers make the right choices in making their decisions.
My orginal post was not intended to take anything away from those experienced knowledge workers. It was specific to how does one show both MCSE tracks on their business cards. I don't like clutter on my business card. When we only had the MCSE for NT it was clean. I didn't even have the multi-color logo on the card, just my job title and the words MCSE beside it. It's good to have it as it builds trust in any client relationship position. Now, it's not that simple to show that I have NT and 2000. Cheers, Leonard Lee > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Ben Winzenz > Sent: March 28, 2002 11:01 AM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > > Depends on the company. A good company that is looking for > someone who > knows what they are doing would conduct the interview in a > way that a paper > MCSE would get seeded out during the interview process. Now, > if it comes > down to 2 people who both have experience, and one has the > cert, I think the > company would tend to choose the person with the certs over > just experience. > But it isn't really fair to compare experience only vs. Cert > only with no > experience. > > Ben Winzenz, MCSE > Network/Systems Administrator > Peregrine Systems > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leonard Lee [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 7:21 AM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > Sorry Larry, I think you are in the minority. It seems to me > that those > that with MCSE get on first string, while those that think > that the trench > experience is all they need, sit on the sidelines. > > Not to say trench experience is worthless. I hope it counts > for something > since I have 15+ years of it. My last position was as a > Solutions Architect > with Compaq...so how's that for trench experience. But I > think an MCSE > still has value. It shows that you have a BASE knowledge. > It's a starting > point in a conversation. > > Cheers, > Leonard > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Larry A. Duncan > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 8:42 PM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > > Sorry Leonard, I just don't see it that way. This is thread > is beginning to > scream "how can I show I have both". That type of "showiness" > just doesn't > cut it with a lot of the 'old timers'. You prove yourself in > the trenches - > not in your signature line. > > > Larry A. Duncan > Field Systems Engineer, Southeast Region > Altiris Inc. > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > T: 615.599.5031 > T: 800.869.9747 > F: 615.599.5259 > > Have you maximized your investment in SMS, MOM and other > Windows Mgmt tools? > Get expert answers, hands-on training, and great utilities at > the Microsoft > Management Summit. Register today at > http://www.altiris.com/aem/mmsconf2002/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Leonard Lee > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 7:21 PM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > I understand the guidelines regarding the use of the logo. > However, I don't > think Microsoft have sufficiently addressed the problem of > differentiating > the two groups: NT and 2000. Before the MCSE 2000 track, an > MCSE at the end > of your name meant you had the base knowledge for NT. A > person with an MCSE > at the end of his/her name did not have to explain anything. > Now, you can't > tell if the person has NT or 2000 or both (from just looking > at the MCSE at > the end of their name). > > If Microsoft had kept their word and de-certified the NT > group from using > the MCSE logo(at the end of last year if they had not > re-certified under the > 2000 track) then the MCSE designation would remain clear. > Never-the-less, > it did not happen, and that made the use of the MCSE logo, by itself, > unclear. > > Don't get me wrong, I am glad Microsoft still recognizes the MCSE > certification for the NT track. I think those with MCSE on > NT have skills > that will be needed for many more years then all of us want > to happen. I > know of migration projects still involving NT3.51/MS Mail > environments. > There are a lot more NT 4.0 system deployed then NT 3.51 > systems, so one can > only imagine how long it will take for the world to be rid of > NT 4...if > ever. > > Certification enables us to differentiate our acquired based > knowledge by > tagging a few captialized words at the end of our name. A > person with MCSA > at the end of the name means that person is a Microsoft > Certified Systems > Administrator. I know that person has written at lease four > exams on the > certification track. I know they have studied how to > install/configure/administrate Windows 2000 Professional and > Server, as well > as they have the base networking course, and they have done > at lease one > elective of their choice. The same can be said about MCSD, > MCAD, and MCDBA. > As for the MCSE certification...it's not clear. > > I think the person who has achieved their MCSE from the NT > and 2000 track > has the right to SHOW that they have achieved a level of base > knowledge that > neither an MCSE NT only or an MCSE 2000 only has attained. I > also think > that the MCSE designation is less meaningful if you allow > these three groups > to use the same MCSE logo. > > > Regards, > Leonard Lee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Larry A. Duncan > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 2:44 PM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > > All the guidelines regarding the use of your logo and > certifications can be > found here: > > Microsoft Certified Professional Logo Guidelines > http://www.microsoft.com/traincert/mcpexams/policies/logo.asp > > > > Larry A. Duncan > Field Systems Engineer, Southeast Region > Altiris Inc. > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > T: 615.599.5031 > T: 800.869.9747 > F: 615.599.5259 > > Have you maximized your investment in SMS, MOM and other > Windows Mgmt tools? > Get expert answers, hands-on training, and great utilities at > the Microsoft > Management Summit. Register today at > http://www.altiris.com/aem/mmsconf2002/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of James Winzenz > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 1:27 PM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > If you have both certs, according to Microsoft (IIRC), you > are supposed to > list them separately on your resume or business card . . . like > > MCSE NT 4.0 > MCSE Windows 2000 > > James Winzenz, MCSE, A+ > Associate Systems Administrator > Peregrine Systems, Inc. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Menke, John [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 2:25 PM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > > I have been interviewing lately and they seem to like the > fact I out MCSE > 4\2k on resume > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 1:52 PM > To: NT 2000 Discussions > Subject: RE: MCSE Certification > > > I use: > > MCSE, nya-nya nya-nya-nya :-p > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Leonard Lee [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 1:33 PM > > To: NT 2000 Discussions > > Subject: MCSE Certification > > > > > > For those that have done the MCSE for NT and 2000, how are > > you showing it on > > your business cards? > > > > ie. > > MCSE (NT+2000) > > MCSE NT+2000 > > MCSE (NT/2000) > > MCSE NT/2000 > > MCSE NT MCSE 2000 > > MCSE NT 2000 > > MCSE > > or any other way? > > > > Regards, > > Leonard Lee > > > > > > > > > > ------ > > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > --- > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.343 / Virus Database: 190 - Release Date: 3/22/2002 > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.343 / Virus Database: 190 - Release Date: 3/22/2002 > > > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > --- > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.343 / Virus Database: 190 - Release Date: 3/22/2002 > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.343 / Virus Database: 190 - Release Date: 3/22/2002 > > > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > > ------ > You are subscribed as [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp > To unsubscribe send a blank email to %%email.unsub%% > ------ You are subscribed as [email protected] Archives: http://www.swynk.com/sitesearch/search.asp To unsubscribe send a blank email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
