Sure. But you'd also have to implement a reflexion system. -- linas

On Sun, Mar 17, 2019 at 2:07 AM Sarah Connorh <[email protected]> wrote:

> Hi Linas
>
> Tx for ur feedback. I approved it !
>
> btw i've discussed with a friend of mine that is geneticist about the role
> played by our hormones systèmes. Should we implement a Thyroid system into
> the reflexion system (LIKE -> Hypophis -> Thyroid -> Hypothalamus ->
> Exploration -> STATE -> Exploitation)  to the project to improve the human
> like side ?
>
> I'll biceps
>
>
> Le dim. 17 mars 2019 à 03:20, Linas Vepstas <[email protected]> a
> écrit :
>
>> Thanks Sarah!
>>
>> The generation of ideas, and the representation of them as bits&bytes,
>> and the curation of them (rejecting bad ideas) is one of the central tasks
>> of AGI.
>>
>> -- All the truisms you can say about ideas are .. true.  Yes, they are a
>> dime-a-dozen. Yes, sometimes they are really hard to stumble across. 1%
>> inspiration, 99% perspiration. Yes, sometimes the best ideas are right
>> under your nose, where you don't even notice them. It can take decades to
>> get one good idea.
>>
>> -- Telling apart good ideas from bad ones can be really hard. Depends on
>> how much feedback you get from nature. In engineering, bad ideas result in
>> bridges that fall down and ships that sink. Feedback is pretty direct and
>> punishing. In human biomedical research, feedback is poor: you get studies
>> that have a 5% effect with p<0.05 for 48 subjects in 11 weeks.  That's a
>> lot of work for questionable, mediocre results. In macroeconomics/politics,
>> there's almost no feedback. Should we spend less? spend more? run a
>> deficit? tighten our belts?  regulate banks? trade? deregulate banks,
>> trade? Join the EU? Leave the EU?  Its almost total chaos, and darned
>> little science.  And then there's the "global brain" -- i.e. the sum-total
>> of facebook posts -- and the "ideas" it thinks about -- it is hallucinating
>> flat-earth and anti-vaxx and moon-landing denial. The global brain is
>> filled to the brim with new and exciting ideas, and a large fraction of
>> those are insane. Some ideas are openly hostile to sanity: QAnon is
>> designed to trigger and reinforce mental illness. And it's effective; it
>> works. (Innoculate now.)  You really should think of the global-brain as
>> proto-AGI, and then realize that proto-AGI will hallucinate.  And it risks
>> taking the human race down with it.
>>
>> -- Capitalism. There's good, and there's bad. The good: buy something on
>> Amazon, it arrives on your doorstep, and the incredibly vast complexity of
>> generating that product is hidden behind a simple GUI.   It's great! As an
>> intelligence, its nice to not deal with the mundane, and devote time/energy
>> to "what really matters", to work without friction and impediment.
>> Capitalism/money offers this. The bad:  Capitalism cannot tell the
>> difference between beneficial behavior, and destructive behavior. What's
>> the difference between an open-source coder, a musician, and a meth addict
>> (vodka-drunk, for you eastern europeans)? Answer: None, as far as
>> capitalism is concerned. All three use modest amounts of cash to buy just
>> enough capitalist goods to survive.  De facto, we have no effective system
>> for telling these three classes apart, and supporting the ones that we
>> want. De facto, there's no coherent path forward from here, where we are,
>> to a post-capitalist, woofie-based economy.
>>
>> -- Machine learning. A "good idea" is not the same thing as a "true idea
>> that is not valuable". For example, algorithmic proof assistants can
>> generate thousands of mathematical theorems in minutes, most of which are
>> stunningly boring to humans. They may be true, but .. useless. Like
>> spending all day doing deep fractal zooms... after a while, you realize
>> that you've seen more-or-less the same thing over and over, even though
>> they are each technically slightly different. Only a few are truly unique
>> and worth noticing.  This problem of "all almost alike" plagues all aspects
>> of machine learning:  there's combinatoric explosions, most of which are ..
>> boring.  And we have no effective theory for taming them (aside from "lucky
>> insights" like back-propagation, if you are lucky enough to spot a network
>> structure and map back-propagation onto it.)
>>
>> Linas.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 15, 2019 at 1:09 PM Sarah Connorh <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah pretty false, most of great ideas are shared by different creators
>>> in the time. Look at our history, many concepts were created multiple times
>>> at different location. Because we got "collective intelligence" and ideas
>>> are shared by mans, you can't say that one idea is yours, because it is the
>>> global knowledge of the entire humanity that put you there.
>>>
>>> Ideas litteraly fall from the sky. And many scientist can tell you they
>>> discover something trying to do another things. That's life shit happened,
>>> and good things thu.
>>>
>>> Btw i'm not a girl. I'm a cyborg.
>>>
>>> Everything is okey, but we can elevate the discussion above the "fok
>>> communism bureaucracy" thing.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>>
>>>
>>> Le ven. 15 mars 2019 à 18:54, Ivan V. <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>
>>>> Sarah Connorh,
>>>>
>>>> I know you are a girl and therefore super-smart regarding to boys, but
>>>> forgive me to be that much direct.
>>>>
>>>> It happens that I suspect how ideas and visions are born. There is some
>>>> unwritten Universe rule that says that there is no white without black, no
>>>> music without a noise, no smile without a tear, no birth without a death,
>>>> and as everything else, no good idea without a junk mess. Ideas don't just
>>>> fall from the sky. Someone somewhere did a freaking mess for someone else
>>>> to get a freaking good idea (could be the same person, but not
>>>> necessarily). I'm of opinion that that someone who suffered to conceive an
>>>> idea is in complete ownership of the same, and should be consulted before
>>>> using it.
>>>>
>>>> But that's not how humans behave. We use what we can to get the things
>>>> we want. Bureaucracy tries to protect sides from exploiting, but the
>>>> Universe is the one that levels everything afterwards (or beforewards).
>>>>
>>>> I hope this makes sense.
>>>>
>>>> In a hope that everything is OK,
>>>> Ivan V.
>>>>
>>>> pet, 15. ožu 2019. u 18:00 Ivan V. <[email protected]> napisao je:
>>>>
>>>>> That's human burocracy mumbojumbo i don't believe in.
>>>>>
>>>>> If someone has dragged their soul through hell to produce an idea, is
>>>>> it fair to be reluctant to use that idea without permission?
>>>>>
>>>>> pet, 15. ožu 2019. u 17:54 Sarah Connorh <[email protected]>
>>>>> napisao je:
>>>>>
>>>>>> But you can't protect it. An idea belong to the  humanity and can't
>>>>>> be copyrighted, only technical processes (linked to this idea) can be. 
>>>>>> (And
>>>>>> even that, i don't share. I'm for open source in every fields, not only 
>>>>>> IT,
>>>>>> but i respect the choice of some people to get money for their work)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Le ven. 15 mars 2019 à 17:51, Ivan V. <[email protected]> a
>>>>>> écrit :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Some ideas are result of a hard work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> pet, 15. ožu 2019. u 17:01 Sarah Connorh <[email protected]>
>>>>>>> napisao je:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> PLUS : You gotta to know something. An IDEA CAN'T be protected,
>>>>>>>> only a process. You can't protect the idea of "creating a Emotionnal 
>>>>>>>> AI"
>>>>>>>> but you can protect your source code.
>>>>>>>> Your IDEA is NOT protectable. You have to know HOW to do it and
>>>>>>>> protect the WAY you do it. :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> cheers !
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Le jeu. 14 mars 2019 à 16:25, JRTA <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Funny thing is I do have a brand new idea but im not interested in
>>>>>>>>> getting rich. It'ts probably stupid but I still wouldn't talk about 
>>>>>>>>> it with
>>>>>>>>> out protecting it.
>>>>>>>>> ..
>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, March 14, 2019 at 9:21:45 AM UTC-5, Sarah Connorh
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> JRTA : Sorry but we saw people like you everyday that have the
>>>>>>>>>> brand new IDEA that will make them rich. And seriously, don't do 
>>>>>>>>>> ever again
>>>>>>>>>> the "come sign a contract" people will laugh the fuck out of you you 
>>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>>> even imagine.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Firstval a pathfinder isn't even an IA is just one of the basics
>>>>>>>>>> concepts you have to understand before wanting to do a real IA. you 
>>>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>>> find more on :
>>>>>>>>>> https://www.w3resource.com/c-programming-exercises/
>>>>>>>>>> 2nd : If you are looking for a teacher this is the wrong place
>>>>>>>>>> you should go on Teachers platform.
>>>>>>>>>> 3rd : If you have so much money or so good idea don't ask people
>>>>>>>>>> to sign contract or stuff like that. Prove yourself before trying to 
>>>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>>>> people tested.
>>>>>>>>>> 4rd : La charue avant les boeufs is a french expression.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If you need help i can provide you some advice in private message
>>>>>>>>>> but i'm not a teacher i'm Engineer. (P.S i'm VERY expensive :p )
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'll be back.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Le mer. 13 mars 2019 à 20:54, JRTA <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I will say, also, that it does seem like I am in the wrong
>>>>>>>>>>> place. Despite that fact I have picked up some great info from 
>>>>>>>>>>> people that
>>>>>>>>>>> have been very patient and helpful to a total noob.  I am really 
>>>>>>>>>>> grateful
>>>>>>>>>>> for the help I have received in pointing me in the right direction 
>>>>>>>>>>> in a
>>>>>>>>>>> field that is quite the rabbit hole. There are definitely other  
>>>>>>>>>>> ways to
>>>>>>>>>>> find the people I am looking for.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jason
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, March 13, 2019 at 8:50:33 AM UTC-5, Sarah Connorh
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hey guys, could you stop marijuana ? :D
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Firstval : opencog, even if i love you guys, that's a crap. The
>>>>>>>>>>>> AGI isn't close to be finished.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2nd :  You can't pay someone to teach you everything, you have
>>>>>>>>>>>> to work too.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 3rd : Facial recognition voice recognition etc, are you even
>>>>>>>>>>>> able to do a pathfinder bro ?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't put "la charue avant les roues" bro !
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ;)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Le mar. 12 mars 2019 à 20:03, JRTA <[email protected]> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> écrit :
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you for the response Curtis.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am going to stretch the definition of a mentor here
>>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably.  Below is the start of what I hope to accomplish, 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> and by
>>>>>>>>>>>>> accomplish I mean "pay, and, or manage many other people doing" 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> while
>>>>>>>>>>>>> studying myself and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> helping where ever I can through assignments you/others will
>>>>>>>>>>>>> give me related to what ever task is priority.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> My ultimate goal is a crowd funded separate/related project
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that is more NN, bottom up, but this is Opencog so lets talk on 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> these
>>>>>>>>>>>>> points for now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> If it seems like we are a fit and decide to move forward I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> will need 2 personal references that I can verify by phone. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Preferably a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> supervisor and a pastor. We should work through rent-a-coder or a 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>> like it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can provide you with references via a former employee and a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> pastor from our church. I haven't had a supervisor since 1999.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> You can tell me your background through talking on each of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> these points.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The AI:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1. Friend
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2. Teacher
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3. Located in the cloud to interact in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> car/phone/home/space ship (wink), etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4. Facial recognition.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5. Voice recognition
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 6. Able to recognize police cars.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 7. Recognize pedestrians
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 8. Assist like: "hey google", Cortana, and Seri, but more
>>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive. No pun intended.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 9. Recognize bio signs, heart rate respiration, perspiration,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ect.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 10. Analyze user voice, and voices in conversation with it as
>>>>>>>>>>>>> well as in the surrounding area surrounding area for emotional 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> state and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything else which it is able to discern. ( not for spying, but 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> safety of the user )
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11. Recognize and respond to users emotional state both
>>>>>>>>>>>>> therapeutically and in and effort to "relate" (for lack of a 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> better word).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12. Utilize the users emotional state (as well as emotion in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> general) as a physical/mathematical indicator for prioritizing 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> decisions,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> weighed against its own cognitive processes.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 13. The AI should actively "study" (what ever that looks like)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> consciousness
>>>>>>>>>>>>> philosophy
>>>>>>>>>>>>> love
>>>>>>>>>>>>> music
>>>>>>>>>>>>> religion
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> - and relate these back to theoretical and non theoretical
>>>>>>>>>>>>> quantum physics
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am entirely serious. Should we end up talking about my other
>>>>>>>>>>>>> project later on this will all make more sense, but for now I can 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> not wait
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to hear what you have to say.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jason
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:37:33 PM UTC-5, Curtis Michael
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Faith wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you are still looking let me know please. I have extensive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience in the codebase.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Curtis
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 5:31 PM JRTA <[email protected]>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My coding experience is limited to the basics of Python,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> building a few web pages with Dreamweaver and some minor work 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> programming
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> micro processors. I have no formal computer science education, 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but seem to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pick things up intuitively once I spend a bit of time on 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> foremost a musician an  artist with a strong marketing 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> background.  I have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> launched and run several companies in my life and work well 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a team. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have achieved many things with the help of others and by using 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> teams of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interns.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While overly ambitious, this project has been at the top of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my bucket list for a long time. I am willing to put some money 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> into this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project. I'm not wealthy by any means and have a moderate 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disposable
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> income. Right now I feel like I'm missing some parts of what is 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ubuntu just to get started. Most of the commands in the build 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> scripts are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not recognized. I am about 2 days into this, never worked with 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Linux before
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> either. Don't tell me I can't do it because I won't listen to 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that and will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> indeed do it. XD  I am just learning to find my way around the 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wiki and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have probably missed some essential basic starting pieces 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed before I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> can build the project. I did do the manual build and got most 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only to fail at the end.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I currently work nights Ubering in a bad ass sports car. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a good chunk of free time to work on this. I am going to 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> forgo video
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gaming and Netflix to focus on this. I strongly believe, 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> despite my meager
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications, that I can become an asset to this project for 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the long
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> term and am willing to help others in any way I can.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> .
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>>
>>
>> --
>> cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you
>>
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