Hi Linas

Tx for ur feedback. I approved it !

btw i've discussed with a friend of mine that is geneticist about the role
played by our hormones systèmes. Should we implement a Thyroid system into
the reflexion system (LIKE -> Hypophis -> Thyroid -> Hypothalamus ->
Exploration -> STATE -> Exploitation)  to the project to improve the human
like side ?

I'll biceps


Le dim. 17 mars 2019 à 03:20, Linas Vepstas <[email protected]> a
écrit :

> Thanks Sarah!
>
> The generation of ideas, and the representation of them as bits&bytes, and
> the curation of them (rejecting bad ideas) is one of the central tasks of
> AGI.
>
> -- All the truisms you can say about ideas are .. true.  Yes, they are a
> dime-a-dozen. Yes, sometimes they are really hard to stumble across. 1%
> inspiration, 99% perspiration. Yes, sometimes the best ideas are right
> under your nose, where you don't even notice them. It can take decades to
> get one good idea.
>
> -- Telling apart good ideas from bad ones can be really hard. Depends on
> how much feedback you get from nature. In engineering, bad ideas result in
> bridges that fall down and ships that sink. Feedback is pretty direct and
> punishing. In human biomedical research, feedback is poor: you get studies
> that have a 5% effect with p<0.05 for 48 subjects in 11 weeks.  That's a
> lot of work for questionable, mediocre results. In macroeconomics/politics,
> there's almost no feedback. Should we spend less? spend more? run a
> deficit? tighten our belts?  regulate banks? trade? deregulate banks,
> trade? Join the EU? Leave the EU?  Its almost total chaos, and darned
> little science.  And then there's the "global brain" -- i.e. the sum-total
> of facebook posts -- and the "ideas" it thinks about -- it is hallucinating
> flat-earth and anti-vaxx and moon-landing denial. The global brain is
> filled to the brim with new and exciting ideas, and a large fraction of
> those are insane. Some ideas are openly hostile to sanity: QAnon is
> designed to trigger and reinforce mental illness. And it's effective; it
> works. (Innoculate now.)  You really should think of the global-brain as
> proto-AGI, and then realize that proto-AGI will hallucinate.  And it risks
> taking the human race down with it.
>
> -- Capitalism. There's good, and there's bad. The good: buy something on
> Amazon, it arrives on your doorstep, and the incredibly vast complexity of
> generating that product is hidden behind a simple GUI.   It's great! As an
> intelligence, its nice to not deal with the mundane, and devote time/energy
> to "what really matters", to work without friction and impediment.
> Capitalism/money offers this. The bad:  Capitalism cannot tell the
> difference between beneficial behavior, and destructive behavior. What's
> the difference between an open-source coder, a musician, and a meth addict
> (vodka-drunk, for you eastern europeans)? Answer: None, as far as
> capitalism is concerned. All three use modest amounts of cash to buy just
> enough capitalist goods to survive.  De facto, we have no effective system
> for telling these three classes apart, and supporting the ones that we
> want. De facto, there's no coherent path forward from here, where we are,
> to a post-capitalist, woofie-based economy.
>
> -- Machine learning. A "good idea" is not the same thing as a "true idea
> that is not valuable". For example, algorithmic proof assistants can
> generate thousands of mathematical theorems in minutes, most of which are
> stunningly boring to humans. They may be true, but .. useless. Like
> spending all day doing deep fractal zooms... after a while, you realize
> that you've seen more-or-less the same thing over and over, even though
> they are each technically slightly different. Only a few are truly unique
> and worth noticing.  This problem of "all almost alike" plagues all aspects
> of machine learning:  there's combinatoric explosions, most of which are ..
> boring.  And we have no effective theory for taming them (aside from "lucky
> insights" like back-propagation, if you are lucky enough to spot a network
> structure and map back-propagation onto it.)
>
> Linas.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 15, 2019 at 1:09 PM Sarah Connorh <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Yeah pretty false, most of great ideas are shared by different creators
>> in the time. Look at our history, many concepts were created multiple times
>> at different location. Because we got "collective intelligence" and ideas
>> are shared by mans, you can't say that one idea is yours, because it is the
>> global knowledge of the entire humanity that put you there.
>>
>> Ideas litteraly fall from the sky. And many scientist can tell you they
>> discover something trying to do another things. That's life shit happened,
>> and good things thu.
>>
>> Btw i'm not a girl. I'm a cyborg.
>>
>> Everything is okey, but we can elevate the discussion above the "fok
>> communism bureaucracy" thing.
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>> Le ven. 15 mars 2019 à 18:54, Ivan V. <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>
>>> Sarah Connorh,
>>>
>>> I know you are a girl and therefore super-smart regarding to boys, but
>>> forgive me to be that much direct.
>>>
>>> It happens that I suspect how ideas and visions are born. There is some
>>> unwritten Universe rule that says that there is no white without black, no
>>> music without a noise, no smile without a tear, no birth without a death,
>>> and as everything else, no good idea without a junk mess. Ideas don't just
>>> fall from the sky. Someone somewhere did a freaking mess for someone else
>>> to get a freaking good idea (could be the same person, but not
>>> necessarily). I'm of opinion that that someone who suffered to conceive an
>>> idea is in complete ownership of the same, and should be consulted before
>>> using it.
>>>
>>> But that's not how humans behave. We use what we can to get the things
>>> we want. Bureaucracy tries to protect sides from exploiting, but the
>>> Universe is the one that levels everything afterwards (or beforewards).
>>>
>>> I hope this makes sense.
>>>
>>> In a hope that everything is OK,
>>> Ivan V.
>>>
>>> pet, 15. ožu 2019. u 18:00 Ivan V. <[email protected]> napisao je:
>>>
>>>> That's human burocracy mumbojumbo i don't believe in.
>>>>
>>>> If someone has dragged their soul through hell to produce an idea, is
>>>> it fair to be reluctant to use that idea without permission?
>>>>
>>>> pet, 15. ožu 2019. u 17:54 Sarah Connorh <[email protected]> napisao
>>>> je:
>>>>
>>>>> But you can't protect it. An idea belong to the  humanity and can't be
>>>>> copyrighted, only technical processes (linked to this idea) can be. (And
>>>>> even that, i don't share. I'm for open source in every fields, not only 
>>>>> IT,
>>>>> but i respect the choice of some people to get money for their work)
>>>>>
>>>>> Le ven. 15 mars 2019 à 17:51, Ivan V. <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>>>
>>>>>> Some ideas are result of a hard work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> pet, 15. ožu 2019. u 17:01 Sarah Connorh <[email protected]>
>>>>>> napisao je:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> PLUS : You gotta to know something. An IDEA CAN'T be protected, only
>>>>>>> a process. You can't protect the idea of "creating a Emotionnal AI" but 
>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>> can protect your source code.
>>>>>>> Your IDEA is NOT protectable. You have to know HOW to do it and
>>>>>>> protect the WAY you do it. :)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> cheers !
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Le jeu. 14 mars 2019 à 16:25, JRTA <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Funny thing is I do have a brand new idea but im not interested in
>>>>>>>> getting rich. It'ts probably stupid but I still wouldn't talk about it 
>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>> out protecting it.
>>>>>>>> ..
>>>>>>>> On Thursday, March 14, 2019 at 9:21:45 AM UTC-5, Sarah Connorh
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> JRTA : Sorry but we saw people like you everyday that have the
>>>>>>>>> brand new IDEA that will make them rich. And seriously, don't do ever 
>>>>>>>>> again
>>>>>>>>> the "come sign a contract" people will laugh the fuck out of you you 
>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>> even imagine.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Firstval a pathfinder isn't even an IA is just one of the basics
>>>>>>>>> concepts you have to understand before wanting to do a real IA. you 
>>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>> find more on : https://www.w3resource.com/c-programming-exercises/
>>>>>>>>> 2nd : If you are looking for a teacher this is the wrong place you
>>>>>>>>> should go on Teachers platform.
>>>>>>>>> 3rd : If you have so much money or so good idea don't ask people
>>>>>>>>> to sign contract or stuff like that. Prove yourself before trying to 
>>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>>> people tested.
>>>>>>>>> 4rd : La charue avant les boeufs is a french expression.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you need help i can provide you some advice in private message
>>>>>>>>> but i'm not a teacher i'm Engineer. (P.S i'm VERY expensive :p )
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'll be back.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Le mer. 13 mars 2019 à 20:54, JRTA <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I will say, also, that it does seem like I am in the wrong place.
>>>>>>>>>> Despite that fact I have picked up some great info from people that 
>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>> been very patient and helpful to a total noob.  I am really grateful 
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> the help I have received in pointing me in the right direction in a 
>>>>>>>>>> field
>>>>>>>>>> that is quite the rabbit hole. There are definitely other  ways to 
>>>>>>>>>> find the
>>>>>>>>>> people I am looking for.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Jason
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, March 13, 2019 at 8:50:33 AM UTC-5, Sarah Connorh
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hey guys, could you stop marijuana ? :D
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Firstval : opencog, even if i love you guys, that's a crap. The
>>>>>>>>>>> AGI isn't close to be finished.
>>>>>>>>>>> 2nd :  You can't pay someone to teach you everything, you have
>>>>>>>>>>> to work too.
>>>>>>>>>>> 3rd : Facial recognition voice recognition etc, are you even
>>>>>>>>>>> able to do a pathfinder bro ?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Don't put "la charue avant les roues" bro !
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ;)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Le mar. 12 mars 2019 à 20:03, JRTA <[email protected]> a écrit :
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thank you for the response Curtis.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I am going to stretch the definition of a mentor here
>>>>>>>>>>>> considerably.  Below is the start of what I hope to accomplish, 
>>>>>>>>>>>> and by
>>>>>>>>>>>> accomplish I mean "pay, and, or manage many other people doing" 
>>>>>>>>>>>> while
>>>>>>>>>>>> studying myself and
>>>>>>>>>>>> helping where ever I can through assignments you/others will
>>>>>>>>>>>> give me related to what ever task is priority.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> My ultimate goal is a crowd funded separate/related project
>>>>>>>>>>>> that is more NN, bottom up, but this is Opencog so lets talk on 
>>>>>>>>>>>> these
>>>>>>>>>>>> points for now.
>>>>>>>>>>>> If it seems like we are a fit and decide to move forward I will
>>>>>>>>>>>> need 2 personal references that I can verify by phone. Preferably a
>>>>>>>>>>>> supervisor and a pastor. We should work through rent-a-coder or a 
>>>>>>>>>>>> platform
>>>>>>>>>>>> like it.
>>>>>>>>>>>> I can provide you with references via a former employee and a
>>>>>>>>>>>> pastor from our church. I haven't had a supervisor since 1999.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> You can tell me your background through talking on each of
>>>>>>>>>>>> these points.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The AI:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 1. Friend
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2. Teacher
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 3. Located in the cloud to interact in the car/phone/home/space
>>>>>>>>>>>> ship (wink), etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 4. Facial recognition.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 5. Voice recognition
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 6. Able to recognize police cars.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 7. Recognize pedestrians
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 8. Assist like: "hey google", Cortana, and Seri, but more
>>>>>>>>>>>> comprehensive. No pun intended.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 9. Recognize bio signs, heart rate respiration, perspiration,
>>>>>>>>>>>> ect.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 10. Analyze user voice, and voices in conversation with it as
>>>>>>>>>>>> well as in the surrounding area surrounding area for emotional 
>>>>>>>>>>>> state and
>>>>>>>>>>>> anything else which it is able to discern. ( not for spying, but 
>>>>>>>>>>>> for the
>>>>>>>>>>>> safety of the user )
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 11. Recognize and respond to users emotional state both
>>>>>>>>>>>> therapeutically and in and effort to "relate" (for lack of a 
>>>>>>>>>>>> better word).
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 12. Utilize the users emotional state (as well as emotion in
>>>>>>>>>>>> general) as a physical/mathematical indicator for prioritizing 
>>>>>>>>>>>> decisions,
>>>>>>>>>>>> weighed against its own cognitive processes.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 13. The AI should actively "study" (what ever that looks like)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> consciousness
>>>>>>>>>>>> philosophy
>>>>>>>>>>>> love
>>>>>>>>>>>> music
>>>>>>>>>>>> religion
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> - and relate these back to theoretical and non theoretical
>>>>>>>>>>>> quantum physics
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I am entirely serious. Should we end up talking about my other
>>>>>>>>>>>> project later on this will all make more sense, but for now I can 
>>>>>>>>>>>> not wait
>>>>>>>>>>>> to hear what you have to say.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jason
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, March 11, 2019 at 2:37:33 PM UTC-5, Curtis Michael
>>>>>>>>>>>> Faith wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you are still looking let me know please. I have extensive
>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience in the codebase.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Curtis
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Mar 1, 2019 at 5:31 PM JRTA <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My coding experience is limited to the basics of Python,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> building a few web pages with Dreamweaver and some minor work 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> programming
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> micro processors. I have no formal computer science education, 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but seem to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pick things up intuitively once I spend a bit of time on 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything. I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> foremost a musician an  artist with a strong marketing 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> background.  I have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> launched and run several companies in my life and work well with 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a team. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have achieved many things with the help of others and by using 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> teams of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interns.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While overly ambitious, this project has been at the top of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my bucket list for a long time. I am willing to put some money 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> into this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project. I'm not wealthy by any means and have a moderate 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disposable
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> income. Right now I feel like I'm missing some parts of what is 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ubuntu just to get started. Most of the commands in the build 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> scripts are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not recognized. I am about 2 days into this, never worked with 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Linux before
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> either. Don't tell me I can't do it because I won't listen to 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that and will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> indeed do it. XD  I am just learning to find my way around the 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wiki and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have probably missed some essential basic starting pieces needed 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> before I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> can build the project. I did do the manual build and got most of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only to fail at the end.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I currently work nights Ubering in a bad ass sports car. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a good chunk of free time to work on this. I am going to 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> forgo video
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gaming and Netflix to focus on this. I strongly believe, despite 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my meager
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> qualifications, that I can become an asset to this project for 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the long
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> term and am willing to help others in any way I can.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
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>
> --
> cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you
>
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