That' riht. Once saned down, the edge of the repir will be vey difficult to dicern.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron L'Herault" <[email protected]> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 4:23 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain colors > And, if I am understanding the technique correctly, this is why you sand > the > original to a feather edge. There is no abrupt change in level and the > patch can be then sanded to a feather edge to blend it in, right? > > Ron L > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]]on Behalf Of Doug > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 3:45 PM > To: Antique Phonograph List > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain > colors > > > Not rerally thin stuff. You'll want to use veneer pieces at least as thick > as the original . When you clamp it down, it will sink into the little > well > in the existing veneer. That's why you use a soft rubber piece to push it > into place when it's glued and clamped. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Wright" <[email protected]> > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 3:10 PM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain colors > > >> Sage advice from an abominable wretch! I love radios too, though I don't >> have any anymore. My first was a Silvertone (I know, I know) >> AM/78rpm/wire >> recorder (I said I know!) that I intended to completely re-veneer with a >> very pronounced grain of some kind... maybe green or purple varnish... >> *ahem*. Hey, I was young and needed the money. If it hadn't been >> missing >> a >> couple of teeth on the gear that undulated the wire recorder head, I >> probably would've (egads) finished the thing. I wish now I would have -- >> with you guys and gals, it would've been worth a good laugh or two. And >> you >> KNOW I woulda put it up on eBay at some point. >> >> I did get about 5 pieces of it veneered, though, and Doug's patching >> advice >> would've come in handy. Hey Doug, is there any special trick to get the >> veneer soft enough to really fill the hole exactly, or do you just use >> extremely thin veneer? >> >> Best, >> Robert >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Doug" <[email protected]> >> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 1:41 PM >> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain colors >> >> >>> Let me insert another thought or two if I may. I'm one of those >>> abominable >>> wretches who collects and restores those things called Radios. But, the >>> similarity comes with refinishing or repairing cabinets. >>> >>> Firstly, phonographs and radios both never were varnished. While there >> might >>> have been an isolated exception, shellac was used prior to 1925, and >>> nitrocellulose lacquer after that year. There were some hangers-on after >>> '25, of course. You can use Varnish, of course, but you're just making >> life >>> hard for yourself .I used to use varnish, until I learned the facts. >>> >>> Now, on the veneer grafting issue. If you want to patch in veneer, >>> first, >>> you'll want to get a piece that matches the surrounding grain that you >>> are >>> repairing. Then, with possibly 220 grade wet-dry sandpaper, feather-edge >> the >>> periphery of the hole in the cabinet veneer (the area that you're going >> to >>> repair). Then, take the patching piece, cut a little bigger than the >>> area >>> to be filled. and glue it over the hole, overlapping the edges. Clamp >>> it, >>> using a piece of soft rubber, so as to press the new patch into the >>> "welled" area. Let it harden, at least overnight. After the glue is well >>> set, block sand the patch to where it blends into the rest of the >>> veneered >>> surface. It works like a champ. I',ve done it a few times, and the >>> repair >> is >>> all but imperceptable. I use Franklin's Titebond. but there are other >>> good >>> glues that do just as well. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "bob" <[email protected]> >>> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 11:55 AM >>> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain >>> colors >>> >>> >>> > Matching old finishes is pretty tricky. I find the best way to do >>> > this >> is >>> > to use old veneer that is similar the original used on the piece. I >>> > try >>> > to >>> > save veneer from old pieces that are too far gone to restore. Most >>> > old >>> > veneer is finished with a stain varnish. It can be sanded off easily. >>> > The >>> > key is not to remove the filler in the veneer.. I cut the section to >>> > be >>> > patched with razor blade held at a 45 degree angle. Then I feather >>> > sand >>> > the >>> > edge of the patch at a similar angle. If the veneer is too thick, >>> > sand >> it >>> > form the back side with coarse sandpaper. When it fits properly you >>> > can >>> > glue it in with white glue. You can then use any stain you like to >> darken >>> > the patch to match the piece if necessary. I usually use gel stains >> that >>> > can be wiped on with a rag. After a few minutes you can wipe off the >>> > excess. The more you remove the lighter the color will be. When >>> > your >>> > satisfied with the color you can clear coat the area to achieve a >>> > gloss >>> > similar to the rest of the piece. The clear coat may darken the color >>> > a >>> > little so it's best to make some sample pieces with both the stain and >>> > clear >>> > coast finish on them before you finish the patches on your piece. I >> think >>> > this technique will also work on a complete piece if you can find a >> piece >>> > of >>> > old veneer large enough to cover a new piece of wood. >>> > RMV >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > From: "Mark Albertson" <[email protected]> >>> > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> >>> > Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 11:30 PM >>> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain >> colors >>> > >>> > >>> >> Ken: >>> >> >>> >> I see that no one is jumping in here. So I will try to give you some >>> >> pointers. >>> >> >>> >> Each collector has his or her preference as to finishes. Some use >>> >> original >>> >> shellac (orange or clear). Others like oils, and yet others like >> lacquer >>> >> based products for big jobs such as cabinets or uprights. When it >> comes >>> >> to >>> >> these choices, the size of the job matters as does what one is most >>> >> comfortable with. The application also matters...ie: spray vs. >>> >> rubbed >> on >>> >> vs. ragged on. >>> >> >>> >> So, choosing your refinishing medium is really a personal choice as >>> >> to >>> >> what >>> >> your comfortable with and trying to accomplish. >>> >> >>> >> By the sounds of it, you have original finish machines that need a >>> >> replacement board here or there and the question is how to "match" >>> >> finishes...new to the old. Well, my experience suggests a great deal >> of >>> >> patience, a practice board, and a variety of lighting conditions. >>> >> Patience >>> >> is obvious as is a practice board identical to the wood you will be >>> >> working >>> >> with. Different lighting (natural vs. fluorescent, vs. incandescent) >>> >> will >>> >> cause colors to act differently, so it's important to go slow and >>> >> check >>> >> in >>> >> different lights at different times using the medium of your choice. >> But >>> >> you need a product to mix with your shellac, minwax oil >>> >> etc........read >>> >> on. >>> >> >>> >> I have found that the best product for dialing in and matching >>> >> finishes >>> >> is >>> >> an alcohol based anyline dye specifically made by the Wood Finish >> Supply >>> >> Company. They sell a metalized extract concentrate dye mixed in MEK. >>> >> The >>> >> advantage of these dyes is that they dissolve in any base medium you >> like >>> >> to >>> >> work in (shellac, oil, lacquer..etc.) and come in a host of colors >>> >> for >>> >> very >>> >> precise color control (one drop at a time). In addition, the company >>> >> provides baseline quantity combinations for most wood colors you will >> be >>> >> seeking. I would recommend starting with four colors...black, warm >>> >> brown, >>> >> yellow, and red.....each in 8oz bottles). From there you can nail >>> >> down >>> >> most >>> >> all the colors we see in phonos except green oak. >>> >> >>> >> Used alone, the dye will flash off and evaporate too fast for custom >>> >> applications, so you need to use a baseline medium and then add dye >> drops >>> >> to >>> >> that for your precision control of color. >>> >> >>> >> Again, take a spoonful of patience before starting and have fun. >>> >> >>> >> You can check out Wood Finish Supply Co. at www.woodfinishsupply.com >>> >> I >>> >> would >>> >> also suggest calling them. They are very helpful. Again, the >>> >> product >> is >>> >> "Metalized Extract Concentrate Dye in MEK"....Get the four colors to >>> >> start. >>> >> >>> >> Best >>> >> >>> >> Mark Albertson >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> ----- Original Message ----- >>> >> From: "Ken Danckaert" <[email protected]> >>> >> To: <[email protected]> >>> >> Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 3:57 PM >>> >> Subject: [Phono-L] Need advice on finishing and matching stain colors >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>>I can do almost anything with metal but I have a devil of a time with >>> >>> the cases. When you have to make a new wood part for a cabinet, it >>> >>> is >>> >>> really difficult to color match close to the original. I would >>> >>> really >>> >>> like to see suggestions from you all on how you get wood parts to >>> >>> match. Maybe someone knows a good source for stains or finishes >>> >>> that >>> >>> help you get a match. Is there a magical technique out there? My >> brute >>> >>> strength approaches usually get me close but they are very time >>> >>> consuming and chancy. Any suggestions? >>> >>> >>> >>> Ken Danckaert >>> >>> Severna Park, MD >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Phono-L mailing list >>> >>> [email protected] >>> >>> >>> >>> Phono-L Archive >>> >>> http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >>> >> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> Phono-L mailing list >>> >> [email protected] >>> >> >>> >> Phono-L Archive >>> >> http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> -- >>> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >>> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >>> >> Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 267.15.0/248 - Release Date: >> 2/1/2006 >>> >> >>> >> >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Phono-L mailing list >>> > [email protected] >>> > >>> > Phono-L Archive >>> > http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Phono-L mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> >>> Phono-L Archive >>> http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Phono-L mailing list >> [email protected] >> >> Phono-L Archive >> http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ >> > > _______________________________________________ > Phono-L mailing list > [email protected] > > Phono-L Archive > http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/ > > _______________________________________________ > Phono-L mailing list > [email protected] > > Phono-L Archive > http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/
