--- Victor Zalakos <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have a problem with the whole foundaion of this argument - that we
> somehow have a right to use lethal force.
*We do have the right... Can and do participate in the use
of leathal force and we will be judged. We in the US pledge our
allegience to our flag and the nation.. with Liberty and justice
for all.
Justice is swift and sure, and in yesterdays firefight of Saddamn's
boys. The soldiers were under the orders and command of GW Bush
commander in chief of US armed forces. GW Bush is the "selected" head
of our executive branch of goverment. We Americans... rightly or wrongly
are formed from the will of the People.. with rights and
responceibilities.
It may be that for reasons of conscience you feel a religious duty
requires you to not own a gun or use deadly force.. *But preserveing
your right to abstain is our national document of liberty that was
made law by the use of force to claim our sovern title and homeland.
Our former holders of land claims released us with treaties signed at
the conclusion of our War of Independence. When our nation split apart
there was a civil war where brothers and fathers and sons fought with
force to again settle political and social issues.
Law Enforcement is granted the right to use deadly force for self
protection
and in protecting the life and safety of others in peril. For the cause
of social order, and the preservation of general civility, *Force is
granted
as a backbone to our laws.
In a passive sence, those in prison are limited in freedom and confined
by force... following conviction and sentence by those granted authority
over us. God tells us to be in subjection to authority, but we have
no compelling reason to stand by as evil men usurp the authority from God
to end our lives by murder.
God would have us speak righty, and shoot straight.
> I wonder how this equates to a new testament mindset.
> I don't see Jesus condoning or using lethal force.
The swords he told his men to carry was not for opening letters
or sliceing apples<G> It was ment for defence of life, and was
used in the garden at his betrayal.
> I see Jesus ordering me to love, to be as one and to turn the other
> cheek.
>
Yes... 7 times 7 *then.. the instruction become vague and we must use
our own descression. *Murder implies a spirit that enters the heart
and mind.. Killing is different. A soldier may be required to kill
or to be killed. This is his duty... *And we as family men and honorable
citizens must face our duty as well to protect and preserve the peace.
*Someone must pack a gun.
The gun is but a tool.. with zero "manna" or "juju" but only a gas
operated tube to project a bullet on a predictible course...
It is the "Someone" who acts as the authority for the direction and
release of the potential leathal object.
> My position is that I would not ever use lethal force. Surely that's a
> saner position than saying "I will..."
Agreed... let us pray that force should never be required. However,
let us be READY for anything.
> But that position has not been tested. Who knows under what provication
> I
> might.
>
> Show my how killing lines up with Jesus' teaching in the New Testament?
>
> Victor.
>
Ok.. first~
Guns punching holes in cans and paper targets.. *No problem
Guns being owned,stored, maintained in the home. *No problem
Guns carried leagaly in cars and on the hip. *No problem
Guns at the ready in the home during a riot.. *No problem
12 guage shotgun in my tent at ready on a float
trip through the John Day Oregon wilderness *A "comfort"
"Killing a evil doer" followed by arrest. *$10,000 in leagal
fees to defend my
rights.
Killing a wild skunk in the chicken coop *no problem...
Useing a gun to create a climate of fear... *Sin-
Useing a gun to rob,rape, or in crime *Sin-
Murder? *Death penalty
=====
*High MORALE is the Index of effective Leadership.
--------------********+********--------------------
Morale raises belief of the Leader in the follower,
of the follower in the Leader, of each in themself,
and both in the .....cause!
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