again, just a quick shot. While I appreciate the discussion, it comes at one of the worst times of the year...
On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 6:18 PM, David Lang <[email protected]> wrote: > how is an Apache project more "open" than rsyslog currently is? > > Is it because it would allow companies to make proprietary forks of > rsyslog and not contribute back? (something that currently they need to get > a license from Adiscon to do) > That's not true. Adiscon canNOT license rsyslog to anyone under any other license than the one this is publically available. We had a couple of such request, and the funding would have been extremely useful, but we needed to decline this in all cases, because we DO NOT OWN the full code. That even got me into some big trouble with my peers, as actually more than 90 to 95% of the code lines are done as part of Adiscon sponsorship. I think it's a very important point here: we do NOT have any advantage over anyone else right now (except if we re-use our own code for some other things internally, which really hasn't happend and I doubt it will). We are very serious about doing this right, so I want to make sure everyone know that. Rainer > > or is there some other benefit? > > Rainer and Adiscon have been very open in terms of taking suggestions from > outside and implementing sponsored improvements when they decided that the > suggestions were too large a chunk to fit in the time budget for free. So > unless you expect more people to be able to tell Rainer what to work on, > the development direction would not be any more open than it is now. > > > > David Lang > > On Thu, 12 Dec 2013, Otis Gospodnetic wrote: > > Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2013 12:09:50 -0500 >> >> From: Otis Gospodnetic <[email protected]> >> Reply-To: rsyslog-users <[email protected]> >> To: rsyslog-users <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [rsyslog] Rsyslog => Apache? >> >> >> It does mean that. Anything that is pluggable and that is GPL and that >> doesn't have to be in the Apache repo and could be pulled in at "make >> time" >> could stay under any other license. I've seen this done before. >> >> Re 2-3 months of work. One way to look at this is that by opening up >> Rsyslog more you'd get more contributions (this *does* take time and >> nurturing effort, but it's a win in the long term). If I were you, I >> would >> specifically "advertise" pieces that are under GPL and that are top >> priority to rewrite. Not by opening a hard to spot issue, but in some >> much >> more prominent fashion. >> >> Otis >> -- >> Performance Monitoring * Log Analytics * Search Analytics >> Solr & Elasticsearch Support * http://sematext.com/ >> >> >> On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 5:37 AM, Rainer Gerhards >> <[email protected]>wrote: >> >> Let's keep the info flowing, but one important point: doesn't that mean >>> ASL >>> is required? That's a medium problem, would require roughly 2 to 3 month >>> of >>> re-coding (best guess) features that are currently covered by GPL code, >>> only. >>> >>> Any thoughts? >>> >>> Rainer >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 11:30 AM, Rainer Gerhards >>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>> Just a tiny note due to overload ;) >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 11:05 AM, Radu Gheorghe < >>>> [email protected] >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> I'll leave it to Otis to give more details, because he's an Apache >>>>> committer, but I believe there's a misunderstanding here. >>>>> >>>>> An Apache project can still be backed up by a commercial company. Lots >>>>> >>>> of >>> >>>> projects are, like Solr, Flume (another logging product!) and so on. The >>>>> main advantage I see is that it's easier for the community to >>>>> contribute >>>>> and drive the project forward. It's a model that seems to work for >>>>> open-source software, and lots of projects who got in there are doing >>>>> >>>> very >>> >>>> well - very active, growing, lots of people offering >>>>> consulting&support&professional services, building more complex >>>>> products >>>>> on >>>>> top of them, packaging them in various ways, etc >>>>> >>>>> I think this is an idea that would help drive more contributions and >>>>> hopefully solve the 24 hours/day problem that keeps popping up lately, >>>>> more >>>>> and more as rsyslog gets more attention. To prove the "attention" >>>>> >>>> theory, >>> >>>> let's look at some trends for rsyslog and some other products that came >>>>> >>>> up >>> >>>> in discussions lately: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=rsyslog%2C% >>> 20logstash%2C%20syslog-ng&cmpt=q >>> >>>> >>>>> And the mailing list traffic: >>>>> http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.comp.sysutils.rsyslog >>>>> >>>>> Maybe going to Apache would be a crazy idea in the sense that it >>>>> >>>> requires >>> >>>> following that procedure. And people already have too little time. >>>>> >>>> Maybe a >>> >>>> less crazy idea is just to put it on GitHub or somewhere similar where >>>>> >>>> it >>> >>>> would be easy to just send pull requests. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Well... done so 6 month ago ;) This is the initial blog post with some >>>> progress: >>>> >>>> http://blog.gerhards.net/2013/05/moving-to-github.html >>>> >>>> Was announced at several places. Overall feedback is "not bad, but no >>>> >>> real >>> >>>> difference". >>>> >>>> Rainer >>>> >>>> >>>> This will not only make code >>>>> patches easier, but I'm thinking at documentation, tests, issues, all >>>>> in >>>>> one place. >>>>> >>>>> Not only contributions would be easier, but it would make things would >>>>> >>>> be >>> >>>> more visible. Your github profile counts for many as some sort of CV. >>>>> >>>> The >>> >>>> more&better you contribute, the more awesome you are (think job >>>>> opportunities and such). For the project, it would make it easier to >>>>> see >>>>> how it evolves: contributions, issues, wiki - again, all in one place. >>>>> That >>>>> is familiar to many. >>>>> >>>>> Apache takes this idea to a higher level, as far as I understand, so >>>>> >>>> crazy >>> >>>> could be crazy-good. *Could be* - I don't know, really, I'm lacking >>>>> knowledge about how Adiscon and Apache works, although I have some idea >>>>> about both. Otis, maybe you can say some more about the advantages (and >>>>> disadvantages)? >>>>> >>>>> And I'm obviously curious about what the Adiscon guys have to say about >>>>> this. >>>>> >>>>> Best regards, >>>>> Radu >>>>> >>>>> 2013/12/11 Boylan, James <[email protected]> >>>>> >>>>> I agree with David. As a business who developsand supports a product, >>>>>> >>>>> I >>> >>>> can't see any reason for Adiscon to do so unless they decide to no >>>>>> >>>>> longer >>>>> >>>>>> support and develop the software. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- James >>>>>> -- Sent from my mobile -- >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Reply message ----- >>>>>> From: "David Lang" <[email protected]> >>>>>> To: "rsyslog-users" <[email protected]> >>>>>> Subject: [rsyslog] Rsyslog => Apache? >>>>>> Date: Wed, Dec 11, 2013 3:09 PM >>>>>> >>>>>> not being an adiscon person, my first question is why they would want >>>>>> >>>>> to do >>>>> >>>>>> that? >>>>>> >>>>>> David Lang >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, 11 Dec 2013, Otis Gospodnetic wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2013 16:05:11 -0500 >>>>>>> From: Otis Gospodnetic <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Reply-To: rsyslog-users <[email protected]> >>>>>>> To: rsyslog-users <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Subject: [rsyslog] Rsyslog => Apache? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Maybe this is a completely crazy question, but has Adiscon ever >>>>>>> >>>>>> considered >>>>>> >>>>>>> moving Rsyslog to Apache? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> Otis >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Performance Monitoring * Log Analytics * Search Analytics >>>>>>> Solr & Elasticsearch Support * http://sematext.com/ >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> rsyslog mailing list >>>>>>> http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog >>>>>>> http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ >>>>>>> What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards >>>>>>> NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a >>>>>>> >>>>>> myriad >>>>> >>>>>> of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you >>>>>> DON'T LIKE THAT. >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> rsyslog mailing list >>>>>> http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog >>>>>> http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ >>>>>> What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards >>>>>> NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a >>>>>> >>>>> myriad >>> >>>> of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you >>>>>> DON'T LIKE THAT. >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> rsyslog mailing list >>>>>> http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog >>>>>> http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ >>>>>> What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards >>>>>> NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a >>>>>> >>>>> myriad >>> >>>> of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you >>>>>> DON'T LIKE THAT. >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> rsyslog mailing list >>>>> http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog >>>>> http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ >>>>> What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards >>>>> NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a >>>>> myriad >>>>> of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you >>>>> DON'T LIKE THAT. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> rsyslog mailing list >>> http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog >>> http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ >>> What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards >>> NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a myriad >>> of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you >>> DON'T LIKE THAT. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >> rsyslog mailing list >> http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog >> http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ >> What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards >> NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a myriad >> of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you >> DON'T LIKE THAT. >> >> _______________________________________________ > rsyslog mailing list > http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog > http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ > What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards > NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a myriad > of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you > DON'T LIKE THAT. > _______________________________________________ rsyslog mailing list http://lists.adiscon.net/mailman/listinfo/rsyslog http://www.rsyslog.com/professional-services/ What's up with rsyslog? Follow https://twitter.com/rgerhards NOTE WELL: This is a PUBLIC mailing list, posts are ARCHIVED by a myriad of sites beyond our control. PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE and DO NOT POST if you DON'T LIKE THAT.
