Re: Stus-List Espar furnace repairs

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Unfortunately yes. It was an experience shared by every live aboard on the 
dock. You could almost set your watch by it back in 2001 or so.

Hopefully they are better now.

John

> On Nov 25, 2017, at 7:43 AM, Daniel Cormier <dgcorm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Oh my god, that's a ridiculously short lifespan for an electric motor... I 
> hope they're still available... did you have to do that before?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Nov 25, 2017, at 7:18 AM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> 
>> Just know you will need to replace the bower motor after 1000 hrs or on the 
>> coldest night of the year - whichever comes first :)
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> On Nov 25, 2017, at 12:40 AM, Daniel Cormier via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>>> I need this thing to last all winter so to avoid the risk of creating 
>>> problems, if the power goes out I'll run the engine on the startup cycle 
>>> just to be safe, then crank the furnace up so it doesn't restart after I 
>>> shut off the engine. I'm not winterizing the engine due to the fact that 
>>> it's located in the main cabins and the furnace duct work is doing a really 
>>> great job of heating it just by proximity so I can use it when needed.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Nov 25, 2017, at 1:32 AM, Jim Watts via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I'm glad I'm not alone. I took mine apart a couple of years ago and 
>>>> cleaned it out. Cleaning the glow plug got me a couple of years of 
>>>> starting from battery power alone, but it's back to crawling out to start 
>>>> the motor now. 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Jim Watts
>>>> Paradigm Shift
>>>> C 35 Mk III
>>>> Victoria, BC
>>>> 
>>>> On 24 November 2017 at 20:19, William Walker via CnC-List 
>>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>>> Thanks, that's what I do too.
>>>> Bill
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
>>>> 
>>>> On Friday, November 24, 2017 billbruce--- via CnC-List 
>>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>>> Mine does the same...it's my practice to start the engine, than the 
>>>> furnace, than shut the engine off after a bit. The Heater draws a lot of 
>>>> power on the start cycle and unless you have a large house bank, it will 
>>>> under power and fail to light off. 
>>>>  
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Re: Stus-List Espar furnace repairs

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Just know you will need to replace the bower motor after 1000 hrs or on the 
coldest night of the year - whichever comes first :)

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 25, 2017, at 12:40 AM, Daniel Cormier via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I need this thing to last all winter so to avoid the risk of creating 
> problems, if the power goes out I'll run the engine on the startup cycle just 
> to be safe, then crank the furnace up so it doesn't restart after I shut off 
> the engine. I'm not winterizing the engine due to the fact that it's located 
> in the main cabins and the furnace duct work is doing a really great job of 
> heating it just by proximity so I can use it when needed.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Nov 25, 2017, at 1:32 AM, Jim Watts via CnC-List  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I'm glad I'm not alone. I took mine apart a couple of years ago and cleaned 
>> it out. Cleaning the glow plug got me a couple of years of starting from 
>> battery power alone, but it's back to crawling out to start the motor now. 
>> 
>> 
>> Jim Watts
>> Paradigm Shift
>> C 35 Mk III
>> Victoria, BC
>> 
>>> On 24 November 2017 at 20:19, William Walker via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> Thanks, that's what I do too.
>>> Bill
>>> 
>>> Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
>>> 
>>> On Friday, November 24, 2017 billbruce--- via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> Mine does the same...it's my practice to start the engine, than the 
>>> furnace, than shut the engine off after a bit. The Heater draws a lot of 
>>> power on the start cycle and unless you have a large house bank, it will 
>>> under power and fail to light off. 
>>>  
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and 
>>> every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use 
>>> PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>> 
>>> 
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>>> 
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>>> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
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>>> 
>> 
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Re: Stus-List Sail Drives in general > Maintenance?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Personally I would look for shaft.  To have saildrive is to truly understand 
fear of electrolysis.  I also miss the prop walk.  Replacing the seals is an 
every 8 yr project according to Volvo and cost 4,500 last time I did it.  Only 
real advantage is for the builder.  They do however open up the back cabin.

Just my 2 cents

Jersey he


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 21, 2017, at 9:41 AM, Nauset Beach via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Am beginning to look for the “next” boat [this winter’s armchair boat project 
> vs. the real ones] and have come across some that have sail drives, though 
> most are traditional shaft drives. 
>  
> What is the group’s experience with sail drives from any engine builder?  
> Google has revealed Volvo and Yanmar have the bulk of the market and sail 
> drives are becoming the rule vs. the exception on newer boats over the past 
> 10 years or so.  While they are reported to be quieter / less vibration than 
> traditional shafts, from what I have read  the maintenance beyond changing 
> the oil in the drive unit annually [just as one would for the engine] is not 
> really a DIY project.  Replacing the 2 seals, particularly the one keeping 
> the water out of the boat, sounds like they are a yard job – and expensive 
> ones at that; on the order of $2 - $5k depending on the location of the yard. 
>  And the “recommended” seal replacement interval is reported at every 5 to 7 
> years…   While many owners may go well beyond that, what happens to an 
> insurance claim if one has exceeded the manufacturer’s “recommended service” 
> interval? 
>  
> Any experience / information with sail drives is appreciated. 
>  
> Thanks,
> Brian
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Rod 
> Stright via CnC-List
> Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2017 7:21 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Rod Stright 
> Subject: Stus-List Volvo Penta Sail Drive
>  
> Anyone out there have any experience at replacing a Volvo Penta Sail Drive 
> and transmission?  Recommendation on a good source for parts and expertise 
> hopefully on the east coast.?
>  
> Thanks
> Rod
> 2004 C 99
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Volvo Penta Sail Drive

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

McMichael in Mamaroneck, NY did the seal on my Volvo saildrive.  Good people.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 21, 2017, at 7:20 AM, Rod Stright via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Anyone out there have any experience at replacing a Volvo Penta Sail Drive 
> and transmission?  Recommendation on a good source for parts and expertise 
> hopefully on the east coast.?
>  
> Thanks
> Rod
> 2004 C 99
>  
>  
>  
> 
> 
>   
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. 
> www.avast.com
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: Stus-List Refrigeration Wiring

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

M.  Hot fudge

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 20, 2017, at 7:41 PM, svpegasus38 via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Darn, and here I was hoping for fudge. 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
> Doug Mountjoy 
> POYC 
> Pegasus (sale pending) 
> Lf38 
> Rebecca Leah 
> LF39 
> 
>  Original message 
> From: bwhitmore via CnC-List 
> Date: 11/20/17 16:23 (GMT-08:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: bwhitmore 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Refrigeration Wiring
> 
> Darn spell check!  The fridge, not fudge...  ;)
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
> 
>  Original message 
> From: bwhitmore via CnC-List 
> Date: 11/20/17 6:55 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: bwhitmore 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Refrigeration Wiring
> 
> Hi Ed,
> 
> The fudge in my 1994 C 37/40+ draws no more than 5 to 7 amps.  It's 
> entirely possible that I missed your prior posts for background, but please 
> feel free to contact me off list if I can provide insights.
> 
> Bruce Whitmore
> 
> 847.404.5092
> 
> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
> Date: 11/20/17 5:38 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
> Cc: Edd Schillay 
> Subject: Stus-List Refrigeration Wiring
> 
> Listers,
> 
> As it is wired now (probably by the previous owner), the only way to switch 
> on the refrigerator on the Enterprise is to open up the Ship’s Circuits panel 
> and flip on the circuit breaker deep inside. As the fridge is high amps, I 
> can understand the need to go through extra steps to turn it on or off, but I 
> was looking to do something more convenient. 
> 
> So here’s the plan:
> 
> Since the compressor itself is located in a locker adjacent to the galley, I 
> was thinking of putting a flip-open-covered blue LED push button latching 
> ON-OFF switch in the galley, which would then activate a relay, which, when 
> the button is pressed, would connect the positive lead to the fridge 
> compressor. 
> 
> Here is the switch: 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00EJWVBPS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8=1
>  
> 
> Here is the cover: 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TK0WFEA/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8=1
>  
> 
> It looks like the switch can handle the loads without burning out, but I 
> think I’m best off getting a relay as well. I like the idea of the cover so 
> it can’t accidentally be bumped into, turned on and drain the battery during 
> a long day of sailing. 
> 
> Any thoughts? Sound like a good plan? Am I missing something? 
> 
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Edd
> 
> 
> Edd M. Schillay
> Starship Enterprise
> C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, NY 
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
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Re: Stus-List Refrigeration Wiring

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

It’s not that high of a load Ed.  How much does your refrigerator draw?  It 
just sounds like overkill. 

John


Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 20, 2017, at 5:38 PM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Listers,
> 
> As it is wired now (probably by the previous owner), the only way to switch 
> on the refrigerator on the Enterprise is to open up the Ship’s Circuits panel 
> and flip on the circuit breaker deep inside. As the fridge is high amps, I 
> can understand the need to go through extra steps to turn it on or off, but I 
> was looking to do something more convenient. 
> 
> So here’s the plan:
> 
> Since the compressor itself is located in a locker adjacent to the galley, I 
> was thinking of putting a flip-open-covered blue LED push button latching 
> ON-OFF switch in the galley, which would then activate a relay, which, when 
> the button is pressed, would connect the positive lead to the fridge 
> compressor. 
> 
> Here is the switch: 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00EJWVBPS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8=1
>  
> 
> Here is the cover: 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00TK0WFEA/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8=1
>  
> 
> It looks like the switch can handle the loads without burning out, but I 
> think I’m best off getting a relay as well. I like the idea of the cover so 
> it can’t accidentally be bumped into, turned on and drain the battery during 
> a long day of sailing. 
> 
> Any thoughts? Sound like a good plan? Am I missing something? 
> 
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Edd
> 
> 
> Edd M. Schillay
> Starship Enterprise
> C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, NY 
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
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Re: Stus-List Standing Rigging Question From a Former C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Can’t imagine that to be the case.  The bolt would be several bolts in the 
first good breeze.  it would shear right off.  I suspect the po planned to 
install a different mast fitting but that is only my guess.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 16, 2017, at 9:24 PM, bobmor99 . via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Hurricane Irma claimed Ox, my beloved 33-1. 
> In its place I now have a 1979 Cal-31.
> I am hoping for some sympathy-advice regarding the standing rigging on my new 
> boat.
> Below is the as yet unanswered question I posted on the Cal user group site:
> ---
> Greetings,
> My new-to-me 31 came with an oversized, uninstalled, brand new set of shrouds.
> The mast ends have beefy eye fittings.
> The existing lowers terminate with jaws that connect to rectangular plates 
> (port and stbd) that are bolted together through the mast.
> I am wondering if the intent was to do away with the plates and run the bolt 
> directly through the four eyes (two eyes on each side, of course).  :-)
> Any thoughts or ideas are most welcomed.
> Cheers,
> --Bob M
> 
>  
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Re: Stus-List Removing and replacing windows on a 2004 C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Yes, have the same issue on the 121.  Tried a light fine sanding last spring 
but it had minimal impact.  I think we need to treat exactly as cloudy 
headlights on a car but need to do more research.  If it ain’t leaking I’m not 
inclined to replace.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 16, 2017, at 8:37 PM, Rod Stright via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Glazed over may come back but don’t look great now
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Nov 16, 2017, at 9:25 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Joking aside I’m kind of surprised you have the issue on a 2004.  Much 
>> smaller windows than the Niagra boats.  Cracking or just glazed and ugly 
>> looking?
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Nov 16, 2017, at 8:14 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Removing - hammer and good aim
>>> Installing - lots of braces and weights
>>> 
>>> Any particular concerns?
>>> 
>>> Joh
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Nov 16, 2017, at 7:39 PM, Rod Stright via CnC-List 
>>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Does anyone out there have any tips on removing and replacing windows on a 
>>>> 2004 C vintage sailboat
>>>>  
>>>> Thanks
>>>> Rod C 99
>>>>  
>>>> 
>>>>Virus-free. www.avast.com
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>>>> 
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>>>> and every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - 
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Re: Stus-List Removing and replacing windows on a 2004 C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Joking aside I’m kind of surprised you have the issue on a 2004.  Much smaller 
windows than the Niagra boats.  Cracking or just glazed and ugly looking?

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 16, 2017, at 8:14 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Removing - hammer and good aim
> Installing - lots of braces and weights
> 
> Any particular concerns?
> 
> Joh
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Nov 16, 2017, at 7:39 PM, Rod Stright via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Does anyone out there have any tips on removing and replacing windows on a 
>> 2004 C vintage sailboat
>>  
>> Thanks
>> Rod C 99
>>  
>> 
>>  Virus-free. www.avast.com
>> ___
>> 
>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions.  Each and 
>> every one is greatly appreciated.  If you want to support the list - use 
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Re: Stus-List Removing and replacing windows on a 2004 C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Removing - hammer and good aim
Installing - lots of braces and weights

Any particular concerns?

Joh

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 16, 2017, at 7:39 PM, Rod Stright via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Does anyone out there have any tips on removing and replacing windows on a 
> 2004 C vintage sailboat
>  
> Thanks
> Rod C 99
>  
> 
>   Virus-free. www.avast.com
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Re: Stus-List Stove

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

That is a good point Jack and thanks for reminding everyone.  Very easy to let 
your guard down with these little butane canisters.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Oct 28, 2017, at 4:23 PM, Steve Thomas via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Natural gas is lighter than air, but both butane and propane are heavier.
> 
> Steve Thomas
> C MKIII
> 
>  "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List"  wrote: 
> I think butane is lighter than air (unlike propane), but I could be wrong.
> 
> From: jackbrennan via CnC-List 
> Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2017 2:33 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: jackbrennan 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Stove
> 
> I hope everyone using portable stoves fueled by butane or small propane 
> canisters is taking the appropriate safety precautions. Both types of stoves 
> can cause explosions.
> 
> The canisters should not be stored inside the boat unless it is an isolated 
> locker with a drain to the outside.
> 
> I keep mine, for a rail grill, in a large pvc pipe tied to the rail with 
> holes in the bottom for any stray gas to drain. A couple of years ago, a 
> canister malfunctioned. 
> 
> I was really happy it was not down below. It would have filled the boat with 
> propane..
> 
> Jack Brennan
> Former C 25
> Shanachie, 1974 Bristol 30
> Tierra Verde, Fl.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
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> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
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Re: Stus-List News story

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I still think it’s bs.  They were in too good of shape .  Even an inexperienced 
sailor would have figured something out after 3 or 4 months :)

John


Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 28, 2017, at 11:22 AM, coltrek via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> That was my impression also. The main looked perfectly furled on the boom, it 
> looked like the jib was rolled up on the forstay-  My impression was that 
> they might have lost a halyard. I can't believe they didn't have other 
> halyards, or at least something to get up the Mast. Or at least be able to 
> get that main up enough to put a little bit of a reef in it or something. 
> Anything. And yes, I think they were clueless.
> 
> 
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Bill Coleman 
>  C 39
> 
> 
>  Original message 
> From: "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List"  
> Date: 10/28/17 11:15 (GMT-05:00) 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: "Matthew L. Wolford"  
> Subject: Re: Stus-List News story 
> 
> I read a story in this morning’s paper about the two rescued women.  Sounds 
> like they took enough food to last a year based on advice they received from 
> experienced ocean-crossing sailors (which these women were not).  The article 
> left the impression that the women were relatively clueless about boat 
> handling.  It also said that the “rigging was damaged.”  My guess is that an 
> experienced sailor would have figured out a way to repair the rigging 
> sufficiently to sail the boat in some conditions.
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
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> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List News story

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

But I am happy to report that both human and canine crew appear quite buff and 
dapper after the ordeal.  Also from photos in news the main was nicely flaked.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 26, 2017, at 9:13 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5021671/Two-sailors-rescued-stranded-5-MONTHS.html
> 
> https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2017/10/26/navy-rescues-2-americans-and-their-dogs-who-were-lost-sea-months/803593001/
> 
>> On Thu, Oct 26, 2017 at 6:01 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>> Ok, wtf? Story on news tonight about a sailboat that was stranded in the 
>> Pacific for 5months after their engine broke down on an otherwise functional 
>> boat.  Apparently the crew survived as they had a water maker and a year’s 
>> supply of oatmeal.  Something not add up here?  And who really has a 1 year 
>> supply of oatmeal for two people and a dog?
>> 
>> Gotta be more coming on this one...
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> ___
>> 
>> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
>> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
>> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send 
>> contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
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> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Stus-List News story

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Ok, wtf? Story on news tonight about a sailboat that was stranded in the 
Pacific for 5months after their engine broke down on an otherwise functional 
boat.  Apparently the crew survived as they had a water maker and a year’s 
supply of oatmeal.  Something not add up here?  And who really has a 1 year 
supply of oatmeal for two people and a dog? 

Gotta be more coming on this one...

John


Sent from my iPad
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Re: Stus-List Stove

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I’d 2nd that.  We have a little Pearson 27 that we keep for day sailing and we 
just went with a little butane 1 burner for the occasional weekend and, my 
case, tea.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Oct 26, 2017, at 3:49 PM, Bill Dakin via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> How about this one...
> http://www.coleman.com/butane-stove/220951.html?cgid=coleman-stovesandgrills#pmax=25=0=1
> 
> Bill Dakin
> S/V Tapestry
> 25MKII
> 
>> On Thu, Oct 26, 2017 at 2:21 PM, Kyle Davis via CnC-List 
>>  wrote:
>> Hello everyone...new owner of a 1977 C 26. I have owned a Bayliner 
>> sailboat and still have a Catalina 25. Really excited about this C, but 
>> I’m working on where to install a stove. I’m located in Washington State and 
>> coffee is a must. I mostly prepare food on a grill in the cockpit. So I 
>> could use a single burner. Just looking for advice and ideas. 
>> 
>> The boat has never had a name and I’m considering using my first grandson’s 
>> name, Killian. 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
>> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
>> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send 
>> contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Bill Dakin
> Tapestryaussies.org
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
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> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Fundraising results

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Well said Bill and I’m a beancounter!

John

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 26, 2017, at 1:19 PM, Bill Bina - gmail via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> We lived through this discussion a long time ago at very great length. We do 
> not need to re-litigate it again. We were all originally on a group hosted by 
> Sailnet. Sailnet changed hands, and we were essentially left homeless. At 
> that time, we had a long debate   about where to go. Google really 
> didn't exist then. The big player was Yahoo. There were a few other options, 
> including staying with the new owners of Sailnet, even though they had dumped 
> our archives. Having been burned badly by allowing someone else to host us, 
> we were all very happy to have Stu   provide us a stable home, where 
> some outside bean-counter would never again have the option to exterminate 
> us, and throw our content in the trash. Stu has done an amazing job all these 
> years, and at one time mentioned that there was a succession plan in place. 
> Anyone who thinks this is in any way a "business" for Stu should just go back 
> out whatever door they came in. He has put an enormous amount of time and 
> effort into keeping us together, and I would be shocked if the bottom line 
> has not been a bit of red ink for him. Stu has formal arrangements for use of 
> the official C material on his website and use of the logo for various 
> items he occasionally makes available as modest fund raisers. The founders 
> and principal players of the old C have expressed gratitude for Stu's 
> efforts in keeping their legacy alive. Our old C's are also more saleable, 
> and at a higher price, thanks to Stu's generous work. 
> 
> Bill Bina
> 
>> On 10/26/2017 12:54 PM, Kevin Driscoll via CnC-List wrote:
>> Stu, Thank you for what you do. No offense intended, but this is my 
>> perspective:
>> 
>> Mike,
>> 
>> I have lots of stuff on Google drives. This does not make it Google's 
>> property. This email list, in support of a brand of sailboats, is a 
>> Community of people who share a common passion. I personally do not think 
>> one person should own, control, and profit? from the experiences shared by 
>> many, for free, in support of a brand of sailboats we all love. 
>> 
>> God forbid something happens to Stu, but if it did this list would evaporate 
>> unless there is a succession plan that I am unaware of. Stu does not own the 
>> intellectual property on this list and does not own any part or version of 
>> the actual C brand to my knowledge. If anything we should be sending money 
>> to Rob Ball, Cuthbertson's family,   etc. for the designs they 
>> labored over and executed so well. 
>> 
>>  Cloud storage is storage. That's all. 
>> 
>> I have asked twice about what it costs to run the list. An answer hasn't 
>> been provided. 
>> 
>> Thank you.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Wed, Oct 25, 2017, 5:26 PM Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List 
>>>  wrote:
>>> This is stus list and moving to cloud may make it their list.
>>> 
>>> I have met people through this list that I have later met in 
>>> person who are now friends. I have met people who I have never met in 
>>> person who are friends  I have solved engine problems due to input from 
>>> this list and learned that cows do better foredeck work than 
>>> me. I have learned a lot.
>>> 
>>> This list is stus and we have all benefited. Moving to cloud 
>>> makes it not stus. I am happy to support for all the c my family and i 
>>> have owned or sailed on and the ones that are not c I believe strongly 
>>> that this list is so good because of Stu
>>> 
>>> I also wonder if cows live on foredeck in Mexico
>>> 
>>> Mike Hoyt
>>> The most consistent not currently c poster
>>> The biggest interloper
>>> One of the strongest believers in what Stu has built
>>> 
>>> 1987 non c
>>> Persistence
>>> Out of the water today
>>> Halifax, ns
>>> _
> 
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
> --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
___

The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
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Re: Stus-List C 30 MKII - 3 questions

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

First off - welcome to the list.  Specific to your three questions:

(1) The usual suspects for a 30 year old boat - cored hull, rig condition, 
engine, keel joint, de-lamination and portlights.  Have a good yard or a 
surveyor take a long hard look.  I go against conventional wisdom and vote for 
a good yard over a survey.  that’s just me.
(2) Can’t help - its different for everyone. Don’t be shy about getting into a 
berth when boat shopping
(3) I assume you mean the Bahamas.  In terms of seaworthiness it will be fine, 
so yes.  Cargo capacity will be the biggest issue but that will be true with 
any 30’ boat that can actually sail.  The tankage issue always amazes me.  My 
experience is that cruisers fall into 2 camps - those that spend 80% of their 
time in a marina and those that spend less than 10%.  Neither group cares about 
capacity; one for obvious reasons, the second because they are more concerned 
with a plan to refill the tanks.  Nobody actually drinks that stuff in the 
tanks (back to cargo).

All of the above is FWIW, YMMV and hopefully worth at least what you paid for 
it.

If you like the 30 I’d say go for it.  It sails well and is well built.  Enjoy, 
have fun and tell stories.

John


> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:27:53 -0400
> From: mp...@aol.com 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Subject: Stus-List C 30 MKII
> Message-ID: <15f49d8eb7d-c0f-f...@webjas-vaa086.srv.aolmail.net 
> >
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
> 
> Greetings,
> 
> New to the list and hoping to be a new owner for a C 30 MKii 1988. It is a 
> nicely appointed sailboat in great shape for its age and no visible, walk 
> away concerns.  I was hoping for comments from anyone with experience and 
> insights to offer, peeves, joys etc.  that would be super appreciated.
> 
> 3 quick questions though:
> 
> 1) knowing the boat, what would be a definite concern that you would look at, 
> stuff that has failed or gives grief?
> 2) The front berth dimension is difficult to assess but it is sufficient for 
> a couple of average size, height? 
> 3) Would you do a jump to the Caribbean from the ICW on such a boat?
> 
> Such a nice cruiser/racer though!  
> 
> Thank you for any information you can share!
> 
> Maurice Poulin 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
> --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
> --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
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--   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Compatibility between refrigeration brands

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

When we were cruising we ended up with two of the Dometec portable units - the 
one’s that look like igloo chests with a baby compressor built in.  Think they 
were 48 qt each.  We just kept them in the aft cabin with Styrofoam taped 
around for extra insulation and another piece cut to fit inside and lay on top. 
 Unless you have a really good box, the two will likely draw less than trying 
to cool the “big" built in box.  We used one for deep freeze - yep, ice cream 
on board in the Caribbean.

Just something to think about.

John


> On Oct 23, 2017, at 12:05 PM, David via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> If you old unit used Freon, forget using the existing evaporator.  Not 
> compatible with the new gases.   
> 
> 12 volt units are incredibly easy to install.  Compressor, evaporator, and 
> thermostat.  Plug and play. Buy it via mail order and off you go.  
> 
> You may be able to re-use your thermostat but it is so cheap you may want to 
> buy it new.
> 
> Oh and make sure you have a good battery bank to handle the amp consumption.
> 
> Good luck.
> 
> 
> 1981 40-2
> David F. Risch
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List  on behalf of Bruno Lachance 
> via CnC-List 
> Sent: Monday, October 23, 2017 9:38 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Bruno Lachance
> Subject: Stus-List Compatibility between refrigeration brands
>  
> Hi,
> 
> Maybe this has been discussed before, but to be sure to have a clear and 
> complete answer, because yes this list is full of knowledge! Here is my 
> question to the list.
> 
> We have an Isotherm refrigeration onboard but it is not working as it should. 
> It runs, but it's not cooling and it's loud, the fan has been replaced in the 
> past. My girlfriend has to keep very expensive medication between 2 and 8 
> degrees Celsius, so a reliable unit is essential. I say this because I want 
> to explain that we can not afford to cheap on this as in trying to refill the 
> unit, etc...just bought the boat, don't know the history.
> 
> So the options are to change everything, or to evaluate the condition of the 
> plate and see if changing the compressor unit only can be done if there not 
> sign of damage that could cause a leak.
> 
> Oh, and since we are in Grenada, the choices are very limited. SO...Is it 
> possible to plug a Dometic compressor unit (available) or other brand to my 
> isotherm control and plate ( year 2002) ? Are the connections universal and 
> is the control working with the same wiring, amperage, etc...
> 
> Thank you for your help.
> 
> Bruno Lachance
> Bécassine, C 33 mkII on her trailer in Canada 
> Sv Gros Loup, jeanneau sunfast 43 for the next 10 months in the islands.
> 
> 
> 
> Envoyé de mon iPad
> 
> Le 12 mai 2017 à 09:12, Pete Shelquist via CnC-List  > a écrit :
> 
>> Or are you missing any shackles on the backstay that could have been used as 
>> spacers? 
>>   <>
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>> ] On Behalf Of Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List
>> Sent: Friday, May 12, 2017 7:40 AM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> Cc: Hoyt, Mike >
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Backstay length and tension
>>  
>> Hi Dave
>>  
>> Is it possible that there is a mast step adjustment and the step has been 
>> moved aft further than desired?
>>  
>> Have you tried running the main halyard aft and tightening the halyard?  
>> Attaching it to an aft cleat or something very solid and then using the 
>> halyard winch should help bring mast tip back.  I am not very familiar with 
>> the rig on the 34+ but am assuming that like most of the pre Tartan C the 
>> spreaders are not swept back.  Also .. a very dumb question .. do you have 
>> any jib or spin halyards attached to any point forward of the mast?
>>  
>> Mike
>> Persistence
>> Halifax, NS
>>  
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>> ] On Behalf Of David Knecht via 
>> CnC-List
>> Sent: Friday, May 12, 2017 9:05 AM
>> To: CnC CnC discussion list
>> Cc: David Knecht
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Backstay length and tension
>>  
>> Dear listers- Thanks for all the advice and observations.  I actually worked 
>> on it for a few hours yesterday afternoon and now I really don’t know what 
>> is going on.  I checked the mast with no backstay on and it still showed a 
>> few inches of rake.  The forestay had a significant arc to it and felt very 
>> loose.  I had previously taken most of the tension off the shrouds.  I tried 
>> to pull one side of the split backstay and could not pull it far enough to 
>> pin it.  I don’t know how you could possibly do this with the adjuster 
>> attached as there is no way to get it out of the way and near a neutral 
>> position until both backstays are attached- so I 

Re: Stus-List C 99 owners

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Congrats!  Still have my 121 but a different beast.

John

> On Oct 23, 2017, at 3:11 PM, Rod Stright via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Just bought a C 99.  Are there any owners still on this mailing list, would 
> like to connect with you
>  
> Regards
> Rod
> Halifax
>  
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Virus-free. www.avast.com 
> 
>  
> ___
> 
> The bills have started coming in for the year 2018 and have gone up again.  
> October will be our fund raising month.  Please consider sending a small 
> contribution to help keep this list running.  Use PayPal to send contribution 
> --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
> All contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

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All contributions are greatly appreciated!

Stus-List Oh noooo... he’s back

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Hey folks had to take a break from all the e-mails.   But i still have my 121 
and Paws is doing well.  Been an interesting (and really good) season so I have 
a lot to think about over the winter.

John


Sent from my iPad
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Re: Stus-List Splicing RG58 coax

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Josh said it best.  You'd be amazed at the crap that actually works somehow in 
a ham shack.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 18, 2016, at 8:13 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> The "right" way to splice it is with 2 male PL259 connections on both cut 
> ends and then a double female to connect them together.
> 
> In reality the center conductor carries the signal and the outer is the 
> shield.  The signal from the antenna really isn't a high frequency signal 
> requiring a shielded connection with high signal to noise ratio.  I agree 
> with your bayou brethren, just split out the center conductor and shield.  
> Solder independently and heat shrink.  It will probably work though it may 
> not get a gps fix as quick and the signal may not be as strong... Oh well.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> 
>> On Nov 18, 2016 8:03 PM, "Dennis C. via CnC-List"  
>> wrote:
>> My old Garmin text only GPS quit acquiring satellites.  I tried a spare 128 
>> with the same result.  Aha, bad antenna.  I bought a cheap Chinese knock off 
>> replacement.  
>> 
>> When I went to pull the old antenna out, I discovered the cable somehow got 
>> cut by the steering system.  (I think it was a leprechaun or boat gremlin 
>> but not sure.)
>> 
>> So, the old antenna is probably still good and I'd like to fix it as a 
>> spare.  With a new antenna costing only $30, it doesn't pay to invest in 
>> pricey splice connectors, etc.  My buddies on the bayou and some internet 
>> research say the RG58 AU cable can be spliced by soldering.
>> 
>> Seems simple enough.
>> Peel back the outer covers and shields
>> Strip the insulator to expose the center conductors
>> Solder the center conductors together
>> Build up the insulator with Teflon tape, heat shrink tubing, etc
>> Pull one shield down
>> Pull the other shield over it and solder
>> Finish with heat shrink
>> Like this only neater:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vYcYz9pbTE
>> 
>> This is more of a curiosity project than a necessity.  Just chunking the old 
>> one in the trash is also OK.
>> 
>> Any other ideas?  I see cheap connectors on mouser.com etc but don't see a 
>> butt splice thingie.  I saw a video using two female connectors and a barrel 
>> connector.
>> 
>> Dennis C.
>> Touche' 35-1 #83
>> Mandeville, LA
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
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> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List 1991 C 51

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

My 51 with a shoal fin (no centerboard) rated between 33 and 66 depending on 
area.  Sailed like a bat out of hell.  Of course, “shoal draft” was 7’-3”

John



> On Nov 17, 2016, at 12:23 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> How does she perform though?  Seems like a short keel for such a large boat.  
> I think my 37+ draws more.
> 
> Josh
> 
> 
> On Nov 17, 2016 11:56 AM, "Allen Miles via CnC-List"  > wrote:
> It is a beauty.  I was on a sister ship in Tortola BVI back in the 90s.  Even 
> more impressive on board.
> 
> Allen Miles
> S/V Septima
> C twenty one feet shorter
> 
> On Thu, Nov 17, 2016 at 8:19 AM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List 
> > wrote:
> wow!  thats quite a boat!  I could live on it!!  LOL  thanks for sharing!!
> 
> On 11/16/2016 11:43 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List wrote:
>> I'm only 1 hour away.  I'd be happy to go look at it.  You know for anyone 
>> that is interested. 
>> 
>> 
>> On Nov 16, 2016 11:13 PM, "Josh Muckley via CnC-List" > > wrote:
>> I like to drool and dream.  Thought you might want to join me.
>> 
>> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1991/C%26C-51-2940801/Annapolis---Jabins/MD/United-States#.WCyPGneZNE4
>>  
>> 
>> Josh Muckley
>> S /V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
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> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List 1991 C 51

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Too funny.  I did live on a 51 for 7 years - was great.  Actually met this boat 
in the BVI.  Believe it was originally named Spice.  Owners did a great job 
restoring her.  

John

> On Nov 17, 2016, at 8:19 AM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> wow!  thats quite a boat!  I could live on it!!  LOL  thanks for sharing!!
> 
> On 11/16/2016 11:43 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List wrote:
>> I'm only 1 hour away.  I'd be happy to go look at it.  You know for anyone 
>> that is interested. 
>> 
>> 
>> On Nov 16, 2016 11:13 PM, "Josh Muckley via CnC-List" > > wrote:
>> I like to drool and dream.  Thought you might want to join me.
>> 
>> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1991/C%26C-51-2940801/Annapolis---Jabins/MD/United-States#.WCyPGneZNE4
>>  
>> 
>> Josh Muckley
>> S /V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>> 
>> 
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>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List 33-2 original cove stripe cover

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Great piece of trivia and a nice post.  Thanks!

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 15, 2016, at 7:33 PM, henry evans via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> When I first joined C Yachts in 77, I think the coves and stars (arrows) 
> were painted. They went to mylar for the stripes shortly thereafter.  A few 
> years later they put a gap in the cove so the boat name could be painted 
> there. The stars remained gold painted.  Later on we offered the cove and 
> stars in a variety of colors to match boot stripes.  The stars remained 
> painted long after the coves went to mylar, but eventually they went mylar 
> tape too. 
> 
> It is interesting that the stars and diamond next to them were never 
> standardized.  If you look at C's over the years some of the stars are 
> short and stubby, some of them are long and pointed and everything in 
> between.  I remember suggesting to George, Rob and David that the stars had 
> become a "signature" of C and should be standardized.  That never happened 
> while I was there. I think it depended on who was making the hull plug and 
> the hull molds as to how the stars looked. 
> 
> A side story about coves and stars :  Butch Cannon headed up a very 
> successful, nationwide architectural firm and was a Past Commodore of the 
> Youngstown Yacht Club in Youngstown, N.Y. which is right across the river 
> from Niagara On The Lake where C's were built. He was also a member of 
> RCYC, a legendary racer on Lake Ontario and had many C's over the years. 
> While I was working there, he went to RCR Yachts for a new C 37. Don Finkle 
> at RCR Yachts in Youngstown sold him the boat and sent Butch over to see me 
> at the NOTL plant to work out the details of what he wanted on the boat.  
> After all the specifics of winches, halyards, etc. he pulled a grey plastic 
> vacuum cleaner nozzle out of his brief case and said "Hank, this is the color 
> I want my boot stipe, cove and stars".  I told him we would try and later in 
> the day went to the plant manager with the nozzle and told him what Butch 
> wanted.  Everyone at C knew Butch and the plant manger just nodded and took 
> the nozzle with a smile. The 37 was about 80% complete when Butch again 
> visited the plant to see her abuilding.  He looked at the boot top, cove and 
> stars and questioned if that was the right color grey ?  I just happened to 
> have the vacuum nozzle in my pocket, pulled it out and held it up to the 
> stars.  The color match was perfect !  Butch just smiled and I handed him 
> back his nozzle.  Butch did well racing his 37 and became a good friend and 
> mentor when I served as Commodore of the Youngstown Yacht Club in 1985.  We 
> lost him about five years ago, well into his 80's. 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, November 15, 2016 2:57 PM, doug.welch--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> I am sprucing up our 33-2 and am looking for input on the cove stripe and 
> diamond and star colours. I have two boot stripes, the bottom being bright 
> red and the upper a light blue. The imperial polishing compound has brought 
> them up nicely. The cove stripe is mylar and the same color as the boot 
> stripe and the diamonds and stars painted gold. I plan a new red mylar cove 
> stripe, but am undecided about the gold. Can anyone tell me if the gold was 
> original? I would like to restore to original?
> 
> Any other relevant advice welcome
> 
> Cheers,
> Doug
> Celtic Knot
> 85 33-2 cb
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> 
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Re: Stus-List Good news

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Oh, it's a certainly a cruising dock given its shoal keel.  Think it phrf's 
around 4,350

Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 8, 2016, at 9:14 PM, Russ & Melody via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi John,
> 
> Good news indeed. What's the local rating for that dock, racing or cruising 
> model?
> 
> Cheers, Russ
> Sweet 35 mk-1
> 
> At 03:37 PM 08/11/2016, you wrote:
>> So it looks like I just bought a 35' dock on the lower Hudson.  Building my 
>> very own little condo empire.
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
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>> 
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>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Stus-List Good news

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So it looks like I just bought a 35' dock on the lower Hudson.  Building my 
very own little condo empire.

John


Sent from my iPad
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Re: Stus-List Anchor test - recommended lunch hook/kedge?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Rick pretty much nailed it.  Also the reason so many folks carry both fortress 
and cqr variety.   It really is amazing how well even a smaller anchor holds 
once properly set.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 27, 2016, at 8:42 PM, Rick Taillieu via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> The primary anchor on the 25 that I had was a 25lb CQR with 23ft of chain
> and 150ft of rode and I never dragged when I had proper scope out.
> My lunch hook was a 5kg Bruce that I hauled up from the bottom one day and
> it held almost as well as the CQR.
> Danforth/Fortress anchors work well in sand and mud but are useless in rock
> and weeds.
> 
> 
> Rick Taillieu
> Shearwater Yacht Club
> Halifax, NS.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of
> Syerdave--- via CnC-List
> Sent: August-27-16 21:08
> To: C Stus List
> Cc: syerd...@gmail.com
> Subject: Stus-List Anchor test - recommended lunch hook/kedge?
> 
> Interesting few hours today doing an anchor test.   A young guy at  port
> Whitby marina was looking for an anchor for his tanzer 26, to replace the
> really tiny and cheap ski-boat danforth type that came with his boat (and
> had proved impossible to set).  We had discussed over beverages a few times.
> 
> I thought to try my (never tried) fortress fx-7 lunch hook - 120' rode, 10'
> chain.   We dragged it all over the bay at 8:1 or better scope.  Could feel
> it bumping along a hard bottom.It finally hooked up and was kinda
> sideways.   Now the bottom is, I think, a rock shelf under silt and clay,
> but I don't really know.  
> We parked his boat and returned with Windstar (my 33 mkii) and her 10kg
> Bruce with 50' heavy chain.  (Plus 150' rode) Let out the chain only,
> dragged 20' and set hard.  You could feel and hear it bumping over a very
> hard bottom before it did so.   Should have tried in 2 or 3 locations to
> prove it was not a fluke.   (So to speak) 
> He now wants a load of chain and a 10kg anchor for his 4000lb boat!
> Lol
> Anyway, the fortress isn't going to work for me.  What do folks use and
> trust as a lunch hook/kedge?  As always, thanks.   
> Dave.
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions
> are greatly appreciated!
> -
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2016.0.7752 / Virus Database: 4647/12892 - Release Date: 08/27/16
> 
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 


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Re: Stus-List Grand adventure/ long distance sailing in a C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Forgot his passport?

John


> On Aug 23, 2016, at 10:01 AM, robert via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Don't ask me why he did it (I don't know) but a local sailor here some years 
> back sailed his C 27 MKI, single handed, to England from Halifax, N.S. 
> rounded a buoy in the English Channel and sailed back home.
> 
> Rob Abbott
> AZURA
> C 32 - 84
> Halifax, N.S.
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>> ] On Behalf Of Free Girls Sailing via 
>> CnC-List
>> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2016 12:33 PM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> Cc: Free Girls Sailing  
>> 
>> Subject: Stus-List Grand adventure/ long distance sailing in a C
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> My partner are planning a trip from where we are at in Superior Wisconsin 
>> through the Great Lakes and to the Atlantic and then south and beyond. 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> What's the furthest anyone has traveled in their C? Any ocean crossings?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Jessica 
>> 
>> 1975 C 33
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> 
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Re: Stus-List Grand adventure/ long distance sailing in a C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

My 34+ went direct to USVI (and back) from NY.  In my 51 I made it as far as 
St. Lucia via Bermuda.  I ran out of juice long before the boat did.  No 
shortage of Bermuda veterans on this list.  So yeah, pick the right boat and no 
worries.  Cargo capacity will be the issue for most, not seaworthiness.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 22, 2016, at 5:50 PM, david via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> I met a guy in the marina in Chemanius this spring that had a very nice 38 
> MKII. He told me he had sailed the boat to the South Pacific, I think he said 
> Fiji, and back. I don't recall the name of the name of the boat nor know if 
> he is a lister. Had a dark green hull.
> 
> There was also another west coast sailor Robert Peterson who circumnavigated 
> in a 38 named Topaz. In fact this same boat was circumnavigated single handed 
> by another sailor named Ken Hellewell who wrote a book about preparing a boat 
> for cruising.
> 
> David
> Former C 26
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Andrew Burton via CnC-List 
> Date: 2016-08-22 14:48 (GMT-07:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Andrew Burton 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Grand adventure/ long distance sailing in a C
> 
> My wife and I just sailed from Newport to SW Harbor, Maine. Left Friday 
> afternoon and took two nights to get here. Pick your weather and it's easy. 
> 
> Andy
> C 40
> Peregrine 
> 
> Andrew Burton
> 61 W Narragansett
> Newport, RI 
> USA02840
> 
> http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/
> +401 965-5260
> 
>> On Aug 22, 2016, at 13:22, Daniel Sheer via CnC-List  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I bought Pegathy in Ft. Lauderdale and sailed her up to Baltimore. Last 
>> year, sailed to Nantucket and back. Coasting is fun and pretty easy. Best to 
>> have 4 or more crew when you overnight offshore, even coasting. Active 
>> Captain is a great app, best if you're computer or tablet has a GIS 
>> reciever.  Pick your weather when you're coasting, BECAUSE YOU CAN! Read the 
>> book Storm Tactics. Make allowance for gear failure. Carry extra fuel and 
>> water. 
>> 
>> Fair winds and following seas to you.
>> 
>> Dan Sheer, 
>> Pegathy LF38 - Rock Creek off the Patapsco
>> ___
>> 
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>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
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Stus-List 34 Centerboard

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

If anyone is looking for a 34 centerboard I came across what looks to be a nice 
one down in Virginia.

John


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Re: Stus-List LED masthead lights and steaming/deck light

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Orca green (OGM).  Pricey but really, really nice.  Have used them on the last 
two boats.

John

> On Aug 9, 2016, at 9:27 PM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Joel,
>  
> I went with Marine Beam for my tricolor and anchor lights.  Easy to swap out 
> and pretty bright.
>  
> Jake
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Joel Aronson via CnC-List
> Sent: Tuesday, August 9, 2016 09:22
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Joel Aronson >
> Subject: Stus-List LED masthead lights and steaming/deck light
>  
> It will be too hot in Annapolis for me this weekend, so I want to start on my 
> boat show shopping list.  I want to replace my anchor light with an LED 
> anchor/Tri combo and replace the steaming light with a steaming/deck light.
>  
> Any favorites?  Any dogs to avoid?
>  
> -- 
> Joel 
> 301 541 8551
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat - now 33'

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Hear you Josh.  The Tartan boats are nice - just don’t have the level of 
woodwork of the original.

John

> On Aug 9, 2016, at 8:29 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Did you say 121?  I don't NEED a 121 but I also don't need a new wife... 
> Doesn't mean I don't like to look.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> 
> On Aug 9, 2016 7:50 PM, "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> Ok, forget what I said.  The 33’ is just too damned pretty.  Let me know if 
> anyone knows of a centerboard version somewhere near the east coast.  I see 
> the one in Buffalo.  Also, if anyone is interested in a 121…
> 
> John
> 
> 
>> 
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
>> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
>> Cc: "John Pennie" <j...@svpaws.net <mailto:j...@svpaws.net>>
>> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 20:09
>> Subject: Stus-List Help me pick next boat
>> 
>> 
>> > Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
>> > criteria…
>> >
>> > Draft - no more than 4.5’
>> > Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
>> > Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
>> > Cost < $25k
>> > Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails, 
>> > occasional weekend trips
>> > Good in a chop
>> > No restriction on age
>> > Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
>> > Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint
>> >
>> > So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a 
>> > Beneteau first 285.
>> >
>> > Thanks in advance
>> >
>> > John
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> ___
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
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> 
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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat - now 33'

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Ok, forget what I said.  The 33’ is just too damned pretty.  Let me know if 
anyone knows of a centerboard version somewhere near the east coast.  I see the 
one in Buffalo.  Also, if anyone is interested in a 121…

John


> 
> - Original Message - 
> From: "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
> To: <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
> Cc: "John Pennie" <j...@svpaws.net <mailto:j...@svpaws.net>>
> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 20:09
> Subject: Stus-List Help me pick next boat
> 
> 
> > Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
> > criteria…
> >
> > Draft - no more than 4.5’
> > Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
> > Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
> > Cost < $25k
> > Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails, 
> > occasional weekend trips
> > Good in a chop
> > No restriction on age
> > Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
> > Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint
> >
> > So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a 
> > Beneteau first 285.
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > John
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks - sounds like the 27 is the overwhelming favorite from this impartial 
crowd :)

Will take a look

John

> On Aug 9, 2016, at 9:52 AM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> 
> 27-V 4'10" draft but is one of the best sailing boats C made.  I have one 
> that may be for sale at end of season.  Very nice condition with Yanmar 1G 
> diesel.   Jerry J
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> To: cnc-list <cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> Cc: Chuck Gilchrest <csgilchr...@comcast.net>
> Sent: Mon, Aug 8, 2016 10:14 pm
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat
> 
> Mk V C 27. Ticks all the boxes and puts money back in your pocket. My 
> friend Bill Dingwell bought one after selling his C 40 and still kicks butt 
> in local PHRF on Buzzards Bay. Chuck Gilchrest Padanaram, MA Sent from my 
> iPhone > On Aug 8, 2016, at 8:09 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > > Ok, so situations change and the boat 
> needs to change with it. Here’s the criteria… > > Draft - no more than 4.5’ > 
> Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2 > Easy to 
> daysail, PHRF competitive > Cost < $25k > Coastal cruising only. Primarily 
> daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails, occasional weekend trips > Good in a 
> chop > No restriction on age > Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard 
> please > Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint > > 
> So that’s it. What would you do? Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
> first 285. > > Thanks in advance > > John > > > > > > 
> ___ > > This list is supported by 
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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

That’s interesting boat Randy.


> On Aug 8, 2016, at 9:43 PM, RANDY via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> Lorne you're getting out already?  Didn't you just buy that boat?
> 
> John - how about an Islander 28?  It's a Robert Perry design.  Here's one for 
> sale in TX: 
> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1985/Islander-28-2799836/TX/United-States#.V6k0xscnuq0
> 
> Cheers,
> Randy
> 
> From: "Lorne Serpa via CnC-List" 
> To: "cnc-list" 
> Cc: "Lorne Serpa" 
> Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 6:48:14 PM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat
> 
> For 25K, that is, sorry not free.
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 8:47 PM, Lorne Serpa  > wrote:
> You can have my 1988 MkII in Jan/Feb.  It's a 30' and in great shape, works 
> great for racing (proven winner) and I currently live on it, fridge, hatch 
> AC, very very good shape!  Have to wait though as it's my house.  Lots of 
> extra sails, way too many recent things to mention.
> ​
> 
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Good boat, but can’t do it Fred. You know me and Sabre just don’t get along. 
Would love a 33 mkIi centerboard but a bit bigger and a bit pricier than I’m 
thinking right now

John

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 8:19 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> 
> How about a Sabre 28?
> 
> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1982/Sabre-28-2984425/Erie/PA/United-States#.V6khP2Xiucw
>  
> <http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1982/Sabre-28-2984425/Erie/PA/United-States#.V6khP2Xiucw>
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 7:09 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
>> criteria…
>> 
>> Draft - no more than 4.5’ 
>> Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
>> Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
>> Cost < $25k
>> Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails,  
>> occasional weekend trips
>> Good in a chop
>> No restriction on age
>> Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
>> Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint
>> 
>> So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
>> first 285.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance
>> 
>> John
> 
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> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
criteria…

Draft - no more than 4.5’ 
Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
Cost < $25k
Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails,  
occasional weekend trips
Good in a chop
No restriction on age
Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint

So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
first 285.

Thanks in advance

John





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Re: Stus-List Autopilot Update

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

oh good god i just had a flashback!  

I feel your pain Edd

John

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 12:37 PM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Fred,
> 
> It was corroded wire that was the initial problem. Plenty of voltage there 
> now. And yes, a very old drive. I may need to send it to Canada for 
> repair/refurb, but wanted to see if any suggestions hit before I disconnect 
> the hoses and wires. 
> 
> One thing is for sure - I’m getting tired of being in this position: 
> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-t84cI65qdtE/TaxAHhoNrgI/BdY/74WdK5ON_Rc/s1600/photo.JPG
>   
> 
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Edd
> 
> 
> Edd M. Schillay
> Starship Enterprise
> C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, NY 
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 12:29 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> Edd — the Octopus drives only have about eight moving parts, so there’s not 
>> a lot that can fail on them.  This is an older Octopus drive, right?  Maybe 
>> it would be worth sending it to them for diagnosis and possible 
>> repair/refurb.  Also, have you checked voltage at the solenoid and drive 
>> leads while connected to the drive?  Maybe you have some corroded wire 
>> somewhere that’s causing a voltage drop.  You need to have good sized wire 
>> for the drive; not so large is needed for the solenoid.  I think we covered 
>> that in an earlier email off-list.
>> 
>> — Fred
>> 
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>> 
>>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 10:48 AM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Listers,
>>> 
>>> Thanks to the advice here and from Gary at Octopus, I did some testing. I 
>>> was able to get the solenoid on the Octopus drive to click on and off, and 
>>> the autopilot did get the motor on the drive going (I could hear it.) 
>>> 
>>> But, the wheel did not move. I added some hydraulic oil, but still no joy. 
>>> Maybe the system needs to be bleeded? I also did the test in very rough 
>>> conditions at the mooring, even though the instructions say it should be 
>>> dockside. I’m close. I can feel it. 
>>> 
>>> Any suggestions appreciated. 
>>> 
>>> All the best,
>>> 
>>> Edd
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Edd M. Schillay
>>> Starship Enterprise
>>> C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>>> City Island, NY 
>>> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
>> _
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Defiant - 86 C 41

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

That's just wrong Aaron.  How do you repair a flagpole anyway? :)

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Jul 7, 2016, at 6:16 PM, Aaron Rouhi via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> "...a really nice boat that should not need any major projects for a while."
> 
> Wouldn't that be nice? My slip neighbor has a much newer boat. His major 
> summer project was repairing and varnishing the flag pole... I only wish...
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Aaron R.
> Admiral Maggie,
> 1979 C 30 MK1 #540
> Annapolis, MD
> 
> 
> From: Jean-Francois J Rivard 
> Sent: Thursday, July 7, 2016 10:19 AM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: dblair...@gmail.com; admiralmag...@outlook.com
> Subject: Stus-List Defiant - 86 C 41
>  
> Gorgeous boat and definitely priced to move. Too bad I don't need a bigger 
> boat that's a very sweet deal on a really nice boat that should not need any 
> major projects for a while.  
> 
> Perhaps David (On Copy) knows about it as he lives in the area.
> 
> 
> Francois Rivard 
> 1990 34+ "Take Five" 
> Lake Lanier, GA
> 
>  
> 
> 
> Subject: Stus-List Defiant - 86 C 41
> Message-ID:
> 
> 
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Hello,
> 
> Just wondering if anybody knows this boat (Defiant - 86 C 41)... Good 
> friend of mine (a current 35-1 owner) is seriously considering a trip to 
> Vancouver from Galveston to see it and I'm just trying to get some background 
> information... Any help is greatly appreciated...
> 
> 
> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1986/C%26C-41-2984102/Mill-Bay/Canada#.V33C8awrKUl
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Was Sail Cover, now In Boom Furling

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks Josh been down that road multiple times.  Just not the right solution 
for us.  If only

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Jul 5, 2016, at 8:56 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> John,
> 
> Have you tried a sail pack?  It's a considerably less expensive option.  
> Maybe something to consider before committing a bunch of boat bucks.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> On Jul 5, 2016 7:03 PM, "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> Thanks folks.  It's really coming down to furl boom or the Schaefer system.  
> I will not consider forespar after my experience(s) with their customer 
> support - on a system I paid for.
> 
> Furl boom had issues in the past but seems to be improved. Schaefer seems to 
> have a very good reputation but the booms just seem a bit chunky to me (no 
> taper) - perhaps they have improved that.  Both are priced about the same. 
> Any issues with the foil on the mast?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Jul 5, 2016, at 5:12 PM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>> 
>> A Shaffer system came on our new boat as well. I have to say I really like 
>> it. We've been playing around with it trying to get used to it and get it 
>> adjusted to the right angle to take the sale in properly. They claim the 
>> sail can furl at any point of sail but, I found that not to be the case. You 
>> still have to go head to wind and take the pressure off the sail and it'll 
>> go down nicely.
>> 
>> I found Tom's comments to be the same on mine that the boom furler is just 
>> capable of handling the mai sail within the housing.  its very tight at the 
>> end. I also had to have a smaller furling line made up because it got real 
>> tight  up on the furler. 
>> 
>> Although, they did make a good main sail for the furler.  when I brought it 
>> in for service Steve Thurston said it was a very nice sail and built 
>> properly.
>> 
>> Boom furling was something I always dreamed of having. However, I never 
>> thought I would ever pay that price. Now I don't have too!
>> 
>> When this thing is dialed in and you push a button and the main sail comes 
>> down its amazing!
>> 
>> I have also found Shaffer customer service to be very good on a product I 
>> didn't even buy for myself.
>> 
>> Danny
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
>> 
>>  Original message 
>> From: Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
>> Date: 7/5/16 12:53 PM (GMT-05:00)
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Cc: Tom Buscaglia <t...@sv-alera.com>
>> Subject: Stus-List Was Sail Cover, now In Boom Furling
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> We have a Schaefer system 
>> https://www.schaefermarine.com/our-products/boom-furlers/ .  It was 
>> installed by the PO.  So, I did not do any prepurchase research on it, but 
>> we like it.  The electric winch that was also installed is a great addition 
>> to the boat as well.  Schaefer customer support has been great.  Especially 
>> considering the fact that I am not the original purchaser and it is about 10 
>> years old.  
>> 
>> The issues we have had are in two areas.  First, the PO went with Beta, the 
>> smaller of the two sizes offered, which puts our 45' luff right at the top 
>> of the size for the diameter of the boom.  This results in the luff tape 
>> gets tightly rolled up and barely fits.  I also had to downsize the furling 
>> line because it was having a similar issue on the furling drum.  If you have 
>> anything close to 44' best to go with the Gamma.  It costs about 6 boat 
>> bucks more, but it's you boat, damnit.
>> 
>> Next PO error was going cheap on the sails.  The main was not built to the 
>> Schaefer specs and I had to have it rebuilt twice.  Why anyone would spend 
>> that kind if $ on the in boom furling and then go cheap on sails is beyond 
>> me...  We finally tossed the old sails last year in favor of a new set from 
>> the UK loft in Sidney BC.  (I nice discount and the favorable exchange rate 
>> closed the deal for me.)  Stu did a great job on the new main.  But I have 
>> only had it up a few times.  We cruise throughout August.  So, I'll have a 
>> better opinion afterwards.  
>> 
>> You will also probably need a new boom vang.  Either a fixed vang like we 
>> have or one with a limited range of adjustment.  This is due to the fact

Re: Stus-List Was Sail Cover, now In Boom Furling

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks folks.  It's really coming down to furl boom or the Schaefer system.  I 
will not consider forespar after my experience(s) with their customer support - 
on a system I paid for.

Furl boom had issues in the past but seems to be improved. Schaefer seems to 
have a very good reputation but the booms just seem a bit chunky to me (no 
taper) - perhaps they have improved that.  Both are priced about the same. Any 
issues with the foil on the mast?

Thanks

John






Sent from my iPad

> On Jul 5, 2016, at 5:12 PM, Danny Haughey via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> A Shaffer system came on our new boat as well. I have to say I really like 
> it. We've been playing around with it trying to get used to it and get it 
> adjusted to the right angle to take the sale in properly. They claim the sail 
> can furl at any point of sail but, I found that not to be the case. You still 
> have to go head to wind and take the pressure off the sail and it'll go down 
> nicely.
> 
> I found Tom's comments to be the same on mine that the boom furler is just 
> capable of handling the mai sail within the housing.  its very tight at the 
> end. I also had to have a smaller furling line made up because it got real 
> tight  up on the furler. 
> 
> Although, they did make a good main sail for the furler.  when I brought it 
> in for service Steve Thurston said it was a very nice sail and built properly.
> 
> Boom furling was something I always dreamed of having. However, I never 
> thought I would ever pay that price. Now I don't have too!
> 
> When this thing is dialed in and you push a button and the main sail comes 
> down its amazing!
> 
> I have also found Shaffer customer service to be very good on a product I 
> didn't even buy for myself.
> 
> Danny
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
> 
>  Original message 
> From: Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List 
> Date: 7/5/16 12:53 PM (GMT-05:00)
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: Tom Buscaglia 
> Subject: Stus-List Was Sail Cover, now In Boom Furling
> 
> John
> 
> We have a Schaefer system 
> https://www.schaefermarine.com/our-products/boom-furlers/ .  It was installed 
> by the PO.  So, I did not do any prepurchase research on it, but we like it.  
> The electric winch that was also installed is a great addition to the boat as 
> well.  Schaefer customer support has been great.  Especially considering the 
> fact that I am not the original purchaser and it is about 10 years old.  
> 
> The issues we have had are in two areas.  First, the PO went with Beta, the 
> smaller of the two sizes offered, which puts our 45' luff right at the top of 
> the size for the diameter of the boom.  This results in the luff tape gets 
> tightly rolled up and barely fits.  I also had to downsize the furling line 
> because it was having a similar issue on the furling drum.  If you have 
> anything close to 44' best to go with the Gamma.  It costs about 6 boat bucks 
> more, but it's you boat, damnit.
> 
> Next PO error was going cheap on the sails.  The main was not built to the 
> Schaefer specs and I had to have it rebuilt twice.  Why anyone would spend 
> that kind if $ on the in boom furling and then go cheap on sails is beyond 
> me...  We finally tossed the old sails last year in favor of a new set from 
> the UK loft in Sidney BC.  (I nice discount and the favorable exchange rate 
> closed the deal for me.)  Stu did a great job on the new main.  But I have 
> only had it up a few times.  We cruise throughout August.  So, I'll have a 
> better opinion afterwards.  
> 
> You will also probably need a new boom vang.  Either a fixed vang like we 
> have or one with a limited range of adjustment.  This is due to the fact that 
> the boom must be at a precise 87 degree angle to the mast to properly furl 
> the full battens into the boom.
> 
> That said, it is really great for us.  I am not sure I would have spent the 
> money to install it.  But now that we have it, I would not hesitate to do it. 
>  My wife and I cruise alone almost exclusively and she doesn't feel 
> comfortable at the helm.  So instead of her having to go up on deck to the 
> mast and manually cranking the sail up she sits snugly under the dodger and 
> pushes a button to raise the sail.   Reefing is a breeze as well.
> 
> I am getting better at tuning  the main, but it is not as versatile as a 
> topping lift or even a fully adjustable vang.  But I am learning that some 
> tuning is possible by tightening down the furler, using a tweeker on the boom 
> and using the baby stay.  We don;t have them but I am sure that having 
> adjustable back stays would give even  more options.  
> 
> Tom B
> 
>   
> At 09:00 AM 7/5/2016, you wrote:
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 10:47:09 -0400
>> From: John Pennie 
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Sail cover
>> Message-ID: 

Re: Stus-List Sail cover

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Tom:

Which furling system dud you go with and how do you like it?  We’re considering 
adding this to the 121.  We had a leisure furl system on a previous boat which 
we liked very much (bud didn’t care for the manufacturer).

John

> On Jul 4, 2016, at 5:40 PM, Tom Buscaglia via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I was digging around in the recesses of my garage looking for the two gallons 
> of bottom pain that I seem to have misplaced and ran across our old sail 
> cover from Alera.  With the in boom furling, dom't need it or want it.  
> 
> If you want it, just cover the shipping cost and it's yours.  It's in  really 
> good shape...see for yourself.
> 
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/37365243@N00/27805231910/in/dateposted-public/
> 
>  
> Tom
>  B
> Tom Buscaglia
> SV Alera
> 1990 C 37+/40
> Vashon Island WA
> (206) 463-9200
> www.sv-alera.com
>  ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Stus-List Latest C

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So hull #1 of the new redline is already on the brokerage market?   Anyone know 
the story?

John


Sent from my iPad

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Re: Stus-List Danforth Anchor

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Len:

A little surprised by the comment.  What limitations are you referring to? 
Danforth may not be the sexiest anchor but they are versatile.  Biggest 
obstacle to them is grass I've found.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Jun 11, 2016, at 1:12 PM, Mitchell's via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Gary, You probably already know this but the Danforth has some pretty serious 
> limitations. I think you would be OK holding your dinghy with a 20 pounder, 
> if it's not windy! 
> Sand bottom with no weeds, chain and a long rode. I learned the hard way and 
> I couldn't sleep on the hook until I bought a better anchor (on a previous 
> boat). Just be careful relying on it. I hope it's a second or third anchor. 
> Len 
> 1989 37+
> Crazy Legs
> Midland On
> 
> Sent from my mobile device.
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 


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Re: Stus-List Deck Waste fitting dilemma

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

WD40?

> On Jun 6, 2016, at 1:43 PM, David via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> FWIW:
> 
> Perhaps one more try with PB Blaster?
> 
> Unscrew fitting and twist the fitting off of the hose?
> 
> Tap into the cap holes and screw in some substantial bolts...use a large 
> lever to persuade it off?
> 
> Worse case unscrew the fitting, cut hose where you can see it and pull the 
> whole dang thing out.  Of course that necessitates you replacing the whole 
> hose.   Not a bad thing (especially when I am not the one doing it!).
> 
> Good luck.
> 
> David F. Risch
> 1981 40-2
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
> 
> Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2016 12:15:20 -0400
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Deck Waste fitting dilemma
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> CC: dainyr...@icloud.com 
> 
> Also, a good spanner wrench (and a hammer) may do the trick...
> 
> Bob Boyer
> s/v Rainy Days
> C Landfall 38 (Hull # 230)
> Annapolis, MD (presently in Baltimore)
> blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com 
> email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
> 
> On Jun 6, 2016, at 11:06 AM, Andrew Burton via CnC-List 
> > wrote:
> 
> Chuck, I've had good luck using a couple of punches the right size to fit the 
> holes and then using a large screwdriver between them to lever the plate 
> open. 
> I have found oxygenating tablets work very well to eliminate the smell from 
> the tank. I would think any methane would be eliminated through the vent.
> Can you follow the hose to find the deck plate? It sounds like it's time to 
> replace it anyway.
> 
> Andy
> C 40
> Peregrine
> 
> On Mon, Jun 6, 2016 at 10:57 AM, Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
> > wrote:
> Suggestions needed:
> I purchased the new to me C Landfall 35 that had been “sitting” for a 
> number of years.  I’ve painstakingly gone through systems to get everything 
> functional and replaced items that needed updates.  
> So, after several outings on the boat, it was determined that it may be a 
> good idea to pump out the holding tank to reduce a growing odor in the boat.
> Well the one thing that wasn’t checked in my systems review was the waste 
> fitting at the deck which our harbormaster and I have determined has corroded 
> itself closed over the years of inactivity.  I’ve tried several deck keys and 
> tools (also using a vise grip to serve as an extension to the tool), an 
> application of liquid wrench, and finally a punch with a plastic tipped 
> mallet to try and free the deck fitting.  No luck.  I just can get enough 
> purchase on the tips of the tool into the holes in the deck fitting lid as 
> they’re only several mm deep.  Should I drill the holes deeper?
>  
> My next approach is going to involve heat, but here’s where the dilemma 
> begins-  Is adding heat to the deck fitting something that may ignite the 
> build-up of methane inside the tank?  Can I possibly blow myself and the boat 
> up using a butane torch to heat the fitting before beating it into 
> submission?   I’ve generally had good luck with applying heat to free 
> corrosion caused by dissimilar metals, but the fill cap and flange both 
> appear to be chromed bronze and I suspect the bonding has occurred due to the 
> corrosive nature of what’s in the tank.   Has anyone come up with a “super 
> tool” that can unscrew the most stubborn deck fills?
> I also haven’t found below deck access to the deck fitting flange, so I have 
> no idea if it is through bolted to the deck with nuts below, or if it is 
> simply screwed in place?
> While I don’t think the tank is anywhere near full, I’d prefer not to spend 
> the entire summer on a boat that smells like a dog kennel so whatever help is 
> out there, I’m open to suggestions.
> Chuck Gilchrest
> Half Magic
> 1983 LF 35
> Padanaram, MA
>  
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Andrew Burton
> 61 W Narragansett Ave
> Newport, RI
> USA 02840
> http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ 
> 
> phone  +401 965 5260
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___ This list is supported by the 
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> for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
>  
> 

Stus-List Stripping Cabin Sole

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Has anyone used a water based paint stripper to remove varnish from the cabin 
sole?  I’m going to have to refinish them in place so I’m concerned about any 
stripper that might seep through and end up in the bilge. Lots of plastic stuff 
down there that may not react too well.

John


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Stus-List Paws Electronics Upgrade Continues

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks again Fred.  I don’t think I’ll be able to do what I was hoping. Bellow 
is a summary from the B manual.  It’s a circa 1999 H1000 system.  I was just 
going to connect the wires and see what data is available - maybe I have a 
newer version than detailed below (don’t crush my dreams!).  All of this is a 
bit greedy - just trying to eliminate one display head from the helm.  Really 
don’t want to spend the boat dollars on a new AP and I need another project 
like a hole in the head.

John


NMEA output (transmitted) summary


NMEA Sentence


Message Description

DPT

Transducer Depth and Offset

GGA

Global Positioning System Fix Data

GLL

Geographic Position, Latitude and Longitude

HDG

Heading Magnetic, Deviation and Variation

HDM

Heading, Magnetic

HDT

Heading, True

MT W

Water Temperature, °C

MWD

Wind Direction and Speed (TWD °M / °T and TWS)

MW V

Wind Speed and Angle (AWS and AWA, flag set to R) 

RMB

Recommended minimum navigation information

RMC

Recommended minimum specific GNSS data

VHW

Water Speed and Heading (°M / °T)

VLW

Distance Travelled through the Water

VT G

Course Over Ground and Speed Over Ground

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Paws Electronics Upgrade Continues

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks.   Just knowing “RSA” is a help!  Will let you know what I find out and 
how it all goes.

John

> On May 14, 2016, at 7:30 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> 
> John — you’ll have to check whatever documentation you can find on the B, 
> and see if it: #1 — even has an NMEA0183 output; and #2 — can output the 
> “RSA” (rudder sensor angle) sentence.
> 
> Usually, NMEA0183 implementation on older autopilots is limited to input of 
> NMEA0183 sentences having to do with navigation to a waypoint.
> 
> If you find documentation and need some translation, let me know.
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
> 
>> On May 14, 2016, at 6:00 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks Fred.  It is a 9” plotter for that very reason.  It is connected to 
>> wind.
>> 
>> I’m not even thinking about steering to a waypoint - I just want a rudder 
>> angle display on the plotter! 
>> 
>> So I should not expect any input from the AP?
>> 
>> John
>> 
>>> On May 14, 2016, at 6:32 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> John — which a Series plotter have you got?  The 7” variants do NOT have 
>>> NMEA0183 on them, which you’ll need for the B pilot.  The larger a Series 
>>> variants do have NMEA0183 on them.
>>> 
>>> As far as the extent of talking to each other, it’s going to be a one-way 
>>> conversation; the MFD will output bearing to a waypoint and cross-track 
>>> error, and the pilot will steer to it when enabled.  That’s it, unless you 
>>> have a wind instrument tied to the plotter, and the B will steer to wind 
>>> angle.
>>> 
>>> — Fred
>>> 
>>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Paws Electronics Upgrade Continues

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks Fred.  It is a 9” plotter for that very reason.  It is connected to wind.

I’m not even thinking about steering to a waypoint - I just want a rudder angle 
display on the plotter! 

So I should not expect any input from the AP?

John

> On May 14, 2016, at 6:32 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> 
> John — which a Series plotter have you got?  The 7” variants do NOT have 
> NMEA0183 on them, which you’ll need for the B pilot.  The larger a Series 
> variants do have NMEA0183 on them.
> 
> As far as the extent of talking to each other, it’s going to be a one-way 
> conversation; the MFD will output bearing to a waypoint and cross-track 
> error, and the pilot will steer to it when enabled.  That’s it, unless you 
> have a wind instrument tied to the plotter, and the B will steer to wind 
> angle.
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
> 
>> On May 14, 2016, at 4:43 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Just not sure how much control I can have via the plotter with just a nmea 
>> 183 interface.  Will hook it all up and see to what extent they talk to each 
>> other.
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Stus-List Paws Electronics Upgrade Continues

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Just a quick update as so many folks here have been helpful in this project.  
The electronics upgrade continues and we’ve now completed the second milestone. 
 We got the new instruments in last fall (ugly project) and just today 
completed the chart plotter installation at the helm.  Hats off to Raymarine as 
this stuff really is plug and play.  We thought the hardest part would be 
running new wiring through the pedestal (and it was a bear) but that was 
nothing compared to pulling out all the old wiring.  They seemed to love wire 
ties, caulk and electrical tape and used all with abandon.  I was never overly 
pleased with the electrical and/or wiring work on my Tartan built C so 
yanking it all out was satisfying.  The built in GPS in the Ray A unit seems to 
work well so I don’t see a need for an additional GPS head. 

Next step is to resurrect the B autopilot and figure out to what extent I can 
interface it with the chart plotter.  It’s a 15 year old pilot but works well 
and I really don’t want to replace it. The B ram is a thing of beauty.  When 
we removed all the old B instruments last fall we cut the AP head off from a 
power source.  Apparently it’s not happy about that.  Will reinstall this week. 
 I really like the clean look of the helm with just the plotter so I’m hoping 
to find some other home for the AP head.  Just not sure how much control I can 
have via the plotter with just a nmea 183 interface.  Will hook it all up and 
see to what extent they talk to each other.

Hopefully the next update will be next weekend!

John




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Re: Stus-List Australian Cup Wing Keel

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Had to google it.  It was a 4th Stars & Stripes (87).  Had to google it but I 
believe the boat you’re thinking of is Tom Blackaller’s Heart of America.

John

> On May 1, 2016, at 1:16 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Actually I thought Young America was the boat with the forward rudder. old 
> age is terrible as I can’t recall the skipper’s name - very famous and 
> talented fellow.  Conners went with a 2nd Stars & Stripes.
> 
> John
> 
>> On May 1, 2016, at 12:37 PM, Chuck S via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Agree, 
>> John Bertrand wrote a book that described the design process of the 
>> Australian winged keel, the controversy around it, and he stated the keel 
>> was chosen to get more sail area within the rule, and the hull was very fast 
>> and another keel might have improved it further.  That keel was weird, long 
>> along the bottom and narrow where it met the hull.  Bertrand did a Herculean 
>> job overcoming several breakdowns including his bowman breaking his arm 
>> while aloft, which were all forgotten when the keel was unveiled.  Liberty 
>> was a slower boat and Conners was challenged to defend the cup with his 
>> superior crew but inferior boat.  Years later, Conners won the preliminary 
>> Cup races, and then switched to a faster boat.  I think it was Young 
>> America.  
>> 
>> Later, Hunter and Catalina produced many production boats with short winged 
>> keels.  The Rob Ball winged keel of the 1988 to 1995 vintage has much 
>> thicker wings and the PHRF ratings prove better performance.  He managed to 
>> get the weight very low without increasing the displacement very much.
>> 
>> 
>> Chuck
>> Resolute
>> 1990 C 34R
>> Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md
>> 
>> From: "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
>> Cc: "John Pennie" <j...@svpaws.net>
>> Sent: Sunday, May 1, 2016 12:03:43 PM
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?
>> 
>> Your dates are right but I don’t believe there was any magic to the wing 
>> keel - other than a way around the 12 meter measurement rule,  I believe 
>> they referred to them as winglets.  The also used a film on top of the keel 
>> called “riblets”- really.
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On May 1, 2016, at 11:35 AM, robert via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> The America's Cup left the NYYC in 1983 but I believe Dennis Conner won it 
>> back in Perth, Aus, in 1987.   
>> 
>> So, correct, it did not return to New York City but I am confident the 
>> Americans won it back with an even different keel..I have a book 
>> somewhere on the keel he used in Perth..it's like a fin keel with an 
>> extension that goes back.there a name for it.they kept it under raps 
>> until after the races.  I'll look it up later.
>> 
>> Conner's tested it in Hawaii before bringing it to Perth..it worked.
>> 
>> Rob Abbott
>> AZURA
>> C 32 -84 
>> Halifax, N.S.
>> 
>> On 2016-04-30 4:27 PM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List wrote:
>> (Sorry - first posted this as reply to wrong posting).   Keel lift is a 
>> horizontal, not vertical force.   Keels are hydrodynamic foils - when they 
>> are moved through water they cause both lift and drag forces to develop. 
>> Lift is the positive lateral force that allows a boat to move to windward - 
>> drag is the negative, resisting force.  A good sailboat keel design has a 
>> high lift-to-drag ratio.  Wing keels were developed by the Australians to 
>> win the 1983 America's Cup (first U.S. loss) by getting around the keel 
>> depth rules.  When the boat heels, the wings increase the draft of the keel 
>> creating additional lift.   This being said, I'm sure the angle at which the 
>> wing cuts into the water does have an effect but that is not what is meant 
>> by keel lift.   The America's Cup left NY in 1983 never to return but this 
>> May there will be some preliminary cup races in NY Harbor with boats that 
>> truly do lift out of the water.Jerry
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Lorne Serpa via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
>> To: cnc-list <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
>> Cc: Lorn

Re: Stus-List Australian Cup Wing Keel

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Actually I thought Young America was the boat with the forward rudder. old age 
is terrible as I can’t recall the skipper’s name - very famous and talented 
fellow.  Conners went with a 2nd Stars & Stripes.

John

> On May 1, 2016, at 12:37 PM, Chuck S via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Agree, 
> John Bertrand wrote a book that described the design process of the 
> Australian winged keel, the controversy around it, and he stated the keel was 
> chosen to get more sail area within the rule, and the hull was very fast and 
> another keel might have improved it further.  That keel was weird, long along 
> the bottom and narrow where it met the hull.  Bertrand did a Herculean job 
> overcoming several breakdowns including his bowman breaking his arm while 
> aloft, which were all forgotten when the keel was unveiled.  Liberty was a 
> slower boat and Conners was challenged to defend the cup with his superior 
> crew but inferior boat.  Years later, Conners won the preliminary Cup races, 
> and then switched to a faster boat.  I think it was Young America.  
> 
> Later, Hunter and Catalina produced many production boats with short winged 
> keels.  The Rob Ball winged keel of the 1988 to 1995 vintage has much thicker 
> wings and the PHRF ratings prove better performance.  He managed to get the 
> weight very low without increasing the displacement very much.
> 
> 
> Chuck
> Resolute
> 1990 C 34R
> Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md
> 
> From: "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: "John Pennie" <j...@svpaws.net>
> Sent: Sunday, May 1, 2016 12:03:43 PM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?
> 
> Your dates are right but I don’t believe there was any magic to the wing keel 
> - other than a way around the 12 meter measurement rule,  I believe they 
> referred to them as winglets.  The also used a film on top of the keel called 
> “riblets”- really.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> On May 1, 2016, at 11:35 AM, robert via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> 
> The America's Cup left the NYYC in 1983 but I believe Dennis Conner won it 
> back in Perth, Aus, in 1987.   
> 
> So, correct, it did not return to New York City but I am confident the 
> Americans won it back with an even different keel..I have a book 
> somewhere on the keel he used in Perth..it's like a fin keel with an 
> extension that goes back.there a name for it.they kept it under raps 
> until after the races.  I'll look it up later.
> 
> Conner's tested it in Hawaii before bringing it to Perth..it worked.
> 
> Rob Abbott
> AZURA
> C 32 -84 
> Halifax, N.S.
> 
> On 2016-04-30 4:27 PM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List wrote:
> (Sorry - first posted this as reply to wrong posting).   Keel lift is a 
> horizontal, not vertical force.   Keels are hydrodynamic foils - when they 
> are moved through water they cause both lift and drag forces to develop. Lift 
> is the positive lateral force that allows a boat to move to windward - drag 
> is the negative, resisting force.  A good sailboat keel design has a high 
> lift-to-drag ratio.  Wing keels were developed by the Australians to win the 
> 1983 America's Cup (first U.S. loss) by getting around the keel depth rules.  
> When the boat heels, the wings increase the draft of the keel creating 
> additional lift.   This being said, I'm sure the angle at which the wing cuts 
> into the water does have an effect but that is not what is meant by keel 
> lift.   The America's Cup left NY in 1983 never to return but this May there 
> will be some preliminary cup races in NY Harbor with boats that truly do lift 
> out of the water.Jerry
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Lorne Serpa via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> To: cnc-list <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> Cc: Lorne Serpa <lorne.se...@gmail.com> <mailto:lorne.se...@gmail.com>
> Sent: Sat, Apr 30, 2016 2:47 pm
> Subject: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?
> 
> So, working on buying my 1st sailboat greater than 15'.  It's a 1988 30MkII.
> It has a wing keel.  I read somewhere that a wing keel generates some lift.
> So
> Does a wing keel create lift?
> Should I have more heavy stuff at the back of the boat for increased angle of 
> attack on the keel?
> Or..
> don't be silly.. its a 8,000lb boat going 5 knots.  It does nothing.
>  
> Lorne
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pa

Re: Stus-List Australian Cup Wing Keel

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I was at a presentation many years ago where they spoke about Liberty.  
Apparently she had a list from day one which they had to compensate for with 
ballast.  Liberty ended up being a heavier boat with less sail area than 
Australia II.  Really not a fair fight.  The fact it went to seven races is a 
testament to Conners and team’s mastery (and protest skills).  It did prove to 
be the wake up call the America’s Cup needed however.  Agree it was a funky 
looking keel but suspect it was all about getting the weight low.

Interesting period with some of the most beautiful boats ever designed imho.  
87 was great fun to watch.

John

> On May 1, 2016, at 12:37 PM, Chuck S via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Agree, 
> John Bertrand wrote a book that described the design process of the 
> Australian winged keel, the controversy around it, and he stated the keel was 
> chosen to get more sail area within the rule, and the hull was very fast and 
> another keel might have improved it further.  That keel was weird, long along 
> the bottom and narrow where it met the hull.  Bertrand did a Herculean job 
> overcoming several breakdowns including his bowman breaking his arm while 
> aloft, which were all forgotten when the keel was unveiled.  Liberty was a 
> slower boat and Conners was challenged to defend the cup with his superior 
> crew but inferior boat.  Years later, Conners won the preliminary Cup races, 
> and then switched to a faster boat.  I think it was Young America.  
> 
> Later, Hunter and Catalina produced many production boats with short winged 
> keels.  The Rob Ball winged keel of the 1988 to 1995 vintage has much thicker 
> wings and the PHRF ratings prove better performance.  He managed to get the 
> weight very low without increasing the displacement very much.
> 
> 
> Chuck
> Resolute
> 1990 C 34R
> Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md
> 
> From: "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: "John Pennie" <j...@svpaws.net>
> Sent: Sunday, May 1, 2016 12:03:43 PM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?
> 
> Your dates are right but I don’t believe there was any magic to the wing keel 
> - other than a way around the 12 meter measurement rule,  I believe they 
> referred to them as winglets.  The also used a film on top of the keel called 
> “riblets”- really.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> On May 1, 2016, at 11:35 AM, robert via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> 
> The America's Cup left the NYYC in 1983 but I believe Dennis Conner won it 
> back in Perth, Aus, in 1987.   
> 
> So, correct, it did not return to New York City but I am confident the 
> Americans won it back with an even different keel..I have a book 
> somewhere on the keel he used in Perth..it's like a fin keel with an 
> extension that goes back.there a name for it.they kept it under raps 
> until after the races.  I'll look it up later.
> 
> Conner's tested it in Hawaii before bringing it to Perth..it worked.
> 
> Rob Abbott
> AZURA
> C 32 -84 
> Halifax, N.S.
> 
> On 2016-04-30 4:27 PM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List wrote:
> (Sorry - first posted this as reply to wrong posting).   Keel lift is a 
> horizontal, not vertical force.   Keels are hydrodynamic foils - when they 
> are moved through water they cause both lift and drag forces to develop. Lift 
> is the positive lateral force that allows a boat to move to windward - drag 
> is the negative, resisting force.  A good sailboat keel design has a high 
> lift-to-drag ratio.  Wing keels were developed by the Australians to win the 
> 1983 America's Cup (first U.S. loss) by getting around the keel depth rules.  
> When the boat heels, the wings increase the draft of the keel creating 
> additional lift.   This being said, I'm sure the angle at which the wing cuts 
> into the water does have an effect but that is not what is meant by keel 
> lift.   The America's Cup left NY in 1983 never to return but this May there 
> will be some preliminary cup races in NY Harbor with boats that truly do lift 
> out of the water.Jerry
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Lorne Serpa via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> To: cnc-list <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
> Cc: Lorne Serpa <lorne.se...@gmail.com> <mailto:lorne.se...@gmail.com>
> Sent: Sat, Apr 30, 2016 2:47 pm
> Subject: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?
> 
> So, working on buying my 1st sailboat greater than 15'.  It's a 1988 30MkII.
> It has a wing keel.  I read somewhere that a wing keel generates some lift.
> So
&

Re: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Your dates are right but I don’t believe there was any magic to the wing keel - 
other than a way around the 12 meter measurement rule,  I believe they referred 
to them as winglets.  The also used a film on top of the keel called “riblets”- 
really.

John



> On May 1, 2016, at 11:35 AM, robert via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> The America's Cup left the NYYC in 1983 but I believe Dennis Conner won it 
> back in Perth, Aus, in 1987.   
> 
> So, correct, it did not return to New York City but I am confident the 
> Americans won it back with an even different keel..I have a book 
> somewhere on the keel he used in Perth..it's like a fin keel with an 
> extension that goes back.there a name for it.they kept it under raps 
> until after the races.  I'll look it up later.
> 
> Conner's tested it in Hawaii before bringing it to Perth..it worked.
> 
> Rob Abbott
> AZURA
> C 32 -84 
> Halifax, N.S.
> 
> On 2016-04-30 4:27 PM, Jerome Tauber via CnC-List wrote:
>> (Sorry - first posted this as reply to wrong posting).   Keel lift is a 
>> horizontal, not vertical force.   Keels are hydrodynamic foils - when they 
>> are moved through water they cause both lift and drag forces to develop. 
>> Lift is the positive lateral force that allows a boat to move to windward - 
>> drag is the negative, resisting force.  A good sailboat keel design has a 
>> high lift-to-drag ratio.  Wing keels were developed by the Australians to 
>> win the 1983 America's Cup (first U.S. loss) by getting around the keel 
>> depth rules.  When the boat heels, the wings increase the draft of the keel 
>> creating additional lift.   This being said, I'm sure the angle at which the 
>> wing cuts into the water does have an effect but that is not what is meant 
>> by keel lift.   The America's Cup left NY in 1983 never to return but this 
>> May there will be some preliminary cup races in NY Harbor with boats that 
>> truly do lift out of the water.Jerry
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Lorne Serpa via CnC-List  
>> 
>> To: cnc-list  
>> Cc: Lorne Serpa  
>> Sent: Sat, Apr 30, 2016 2:47 pm
>> Subject: Stus-List Wing Keel Lift?
>> 
>> So, working on buying my 1st sailboat greater than 15'.  It's a 1988 30MkII.
>> It has a wing keel.  I read somewhere that a wing keel generates some lift.
>> So
>> Does a wing keel create lift?
>> Should I have more heavy stuff at the back of the boat for increased angle 
>> of attack on the keel?
>> Or..
>> don't be silly.. its a 8,000lb boat going 5 knots.  It does nothing.
>>  
>> Lorne
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List 30-1 Mainsail Foot Length

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Looks short to me.  Prior owner trying to “tame” the boat or perhaps make it 
more balanced with a smaller headsail?

John

> On May 1, 2016, at 11:45 AM, Randy Stafford via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Listers-
> 
> I posted a few pictures from my first race in my new-to-me 30-1 (hull #7) 
> last Wednesday night at 
> https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-NqAxQ6JxFTeUlmcm1IX1c5ZHc 
> 
> 
> You can see the foot of my mainsail is considerably shorter than my boom.  
> I'm wondering if that's "normal" for 30-1s (or other C for that matter).  
> It doesn't really look normal judging by brochure photos and drawings.
> 
> A previous owner had also raised the boom at least a foot from its original 
> height, as the C itself did on later C 30s.
> 
> When I get a new mainsail I'd like to increase its area by both returning the 
> boom to its original height, and increasing the length of mainsail's foot.  
> I'm thinking more area equals more power equals more speed.  And I can live 
> with a lower boom.
> 
> Any words of wisdom to share?
> 
> Thanks,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C 30-1 #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List New C 37 Owner

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

+1 on the KISS counterpoise.  Yes, you can make one yourself but the pre-made 
thing is nicely finished.  Certainly beats running miles of copper tape!

John
  
> On Apr 26, 2016, at 1:44 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Jim — welcome to the list!  You may want to take a look at the following 
> link for SSB info:
> 
> http://www.farallon.us/webstore/Pcup%20SSB.pdf 
> 
> 
> And the KISS ground-plane system seems to be a nice and simple way to set up 
> your ground plane:
> 
> http://www.kiss-ssb.com 
> 
> — Fred
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
> 
>> On Apr 26, 2016, at 12:36 PM, Jim Eagon via CnC-List > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all:
>> 
>> I just purchased "Trinity", a 1984 C7C 37, from her original owner.
>> She's in top shape and I want to get some things going for this coming 
>> summer.
>> My first question is: where can I find a copy of the original owner's manual 
>> for the boat?
>> I have already looked at the c site but the 37 seems to be missing?
>>  
>> Also, are there any experts out here who have installed SSB? I have some 
>> ideas for 
>> an antenna, but I really would like to know what people have done. I want to 
>> work 10m-80m
>> and, with the rod rigging, I'm not sure how to string a wire antenna.
>>  
>> Thank you all for your comments and shared wisdom - I have enjoyed reading 
>> the posts so far.
>>  
>> Fair winds and 73... 
>> Jim Eagon [K6JFE]
>>  
>> I'd rather be sailing!
> 
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> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List New C 37 Owner

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Congrats on the new boat.

I think you will find several Ham and marine operators on the list.  On my last 
boat, I went with the traditional insulated backstay which was fine.  As I’m 
not cruising anymore my 706 is now just attached to a long wire which I run up 
a spare halyard when I want to play.

Not sure pictures are encouraged due to bandwidth so you may wish to tread 
lightly.

John




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Re: Stus-List C 37+ or XL Refrigeration

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Ed:

If it’s water cooled you would see a line running off the compressor and 
(hopefully) to a thru-hull.  Assuming you’re just seeing 2 wires and the copper 
refrigerant lines (2) you’re good to go in the water as it is air cooled. 

John

> On Apr 20, 2016, at 10:48 AM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Listers,
> 
> One of my near-future projects on the Enterprise is to replace the 
> refrigeration unit which broke some years ago. The one I have appears to be 
> two pieces - a panel/basket in the ice chest and a compressor in the aft 
> cabin hanging locker. I have no idea if it is water cooled or air cooled (I 
> can’t see any through hull lines or any venting) and, since I know nothing 
> about it, did not want to pull the old one out in fears of turning the boat 
> into a liquid asset. 
> 
> So: 1. Is it safe to pull out the old unit while the boat is in the water? 
> and 2. Can anyone recommend a good replacement unit that will keep the chest 
> cool? 
>   
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Edd
> 
> 
> Edd M. Schillay
> Starship Enterprise
> C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
> City Island, NY 
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Rudder replacement/repair

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Great shots and very educational Josh - thanks for sharing.  Metal looked to be 
in remarkably good shape.

John

> On Apr 19, 2016, at 9:08 PM, Rick Rohwer via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Thanks for sharing the pictures Joh!  Very interesting.
> 
> Rick
> Paikea 37+
> Poulsbo, WA
> 
>> On Apr 18, 2016, at 9:17 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> My rebuild was ~$5k.  Seeing what the professionals do was definitely an 
>> education.  Not hard, just a lot of work.
>> 
>> https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8pEh5lnvP1yVUdWUDNxVGFUcDA 
>> 
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>> 
>> On Apr 18, 2016 10:11 PM, "Eugene Fodor via CnC-List" > > wrote:
>> Trying to get an idea of the cost for rudder replacement or repair.  The 
>> boat I'm close to purchasing has some brown drainage from the rudder after 
>> drilling the bottom which tells me there is some corrosion in the steel 
>> webbing. I'm handy unsure if this is better left to a marina shop or not 
>> salvageable long term. Thoughts?
>> 
>> Gene
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Meet Glen and His Very Interesting C & C...

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks for sharing Glen - welcome.

John

> On Apr 15, 2016, at 11:53 AM, Joel Aronson via CnC-List 
> > wrote:
> 
> Glen
> 
> Very cool!  Welcome!
> 
> Joel
> 35/3
> Annapolis 
> 
> On Friday, April 15, 2016, David via CnC-List  > wrote:
> All,
> 
> Please welcome Glen!
> 
> My name is Glen Miller. I bought the 3/4T from the shop and John 
> Burns was the salesman. I met with Erich and Martin at the shop, and 
> watched it being laid up, and completed. I lived in Mississauga at the 
> time. I raced String of Pearls in Lake Ontario for a while then moved to 
> San Francisco.
>  
> Here is my web site for the 3/4T. It was built in  Dec 74 and is hull #15 
> of 15 built at Bruckmans. I have kept it all these years, sailing 12,000 
> miles 
> in the Pacific and Caribbean. Some of the stories and photos are on the web 
> site.
>  
> 
> http://waeshael.com/waeshael.com/Welcome_Cruisers.html 
> 
>  
> 
> David F. Risch
> 1981 40-2
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
>  
> 
>Virus-free. www.avast.com 
> 
>  
> 
> -- 
> Joel 
> 301 541 8551
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Bilge pump capacity?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Agree on the broken pump comment but...

The bigger pump does exactly what you said - buys time while you make a repair. 
 As you know it's not always as simple as sticking a nice tapered plug into a 
nice round hole.  This is especially true in the event of a collision (shipping 
container, etc) where the temporary repair may take a little more creativity, 
time ... and trial and error.   Obviously the further offshore the more of an 
issue this can become.

John

Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 14, 2016, at 6:10 PM, Patrick Davin via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Interesting. That's basically what I was wondering. I was looking for a 
> calculator, but I found 
> this: http://www.whsyc.org/Flooding/Flooding.html
> 
> A 1.5" hole 2 feet below waterline results in 62.5 gpm (per minute!) = 3750 
> gph. Even 4000 gph capacity wouldn't keep up with that, after accounting for 
> efficiency losses. 
> 
> So why do some people go for high bilge pump capacities? (like 2000-4000 gph 
> total)
> 
> Sure it gives you a bit more time, but if I'm not at the boat it's probably 
> not going to make a difference (there's often no one on our dock for 12+ 
> hours between say 8pm and 8am), and if I am, it will only make a small 
> difference. (ex,  the difference between 800+800gph vs 800+2000gph... 
> assuming 75% efficiency that's 1200gph vs 2100gph). 
> 
> So with that 1.5" hole I'd take on net water of ~42.5 gpm vs 25.8 gpm. So 
> whether 42 gallons per minute are coming in, or 25 gallons per minute, I 
> still need to plug it really friggin quickly. 
> 
> I do have the StaPlug btw, and Stay Afloat putty. 
> Just having a hard time imagining scenarios where an 800+2000 would make a 
> critical difference vs an 800+800, and wondering if this is just one of those 
> things where boaters are a bit paranoid and choosing the "bigger is better" 
> approach when that's not necessarily true. From what I can tell, *broken* 
> bilge pumps are the biggest issue (clogged, burnt out, bad wiring, etc). 
> 
> 
>> On Thu, Apr 14, 2016 at 1:22 PM,  wrote:
>> From: Josh Muckley 
>> To: "C List" 
>> Cc: 
>> Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2016 16:21:23 -0400
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Bilge pump capacity?
>> You'll have a shockingly hard time keeping up with a 1.5 inch hole no matter 
>> what size bilge pump you have.  Plugging the hole is always better.  Its 
>> gonna sink if the seacock disintegrates while you're not there.
>> 
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Bilge pump capacity?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Patrick:

I don't think anything will keep the boat afloat if a 1-1/2" thru hull 
disintegrated.  

I do understand your concern but given the difficulty have you considered 
adding a third pump slightly higher as an emergency pump?  As you will be 
running new plumbing anywhere that is convenient you can make it as big as you 
like.

John

Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 14, 2016, at 3:40 PM, Patrick Davin via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I've been debating my bilge pump plan for a few months now, and having 
> trouble deciding. What have others here decided is sufficient pump capacity?  
> 
> I have two Rule 800s now and am considering upgrading one to an 1100 or 2000 
> gph, as a high water alarm. That will require upgrading the hose from 3/4" to 
> 1 1/8", and enlarging the thruhull at the toerail. One of the bilge hoses 
> runs through the stbd head (into the head cubbies) and the other runs through 
> the hanging locker fwd of the head. Upgrading will require enlarging some of 
> the hose holes in the boat's liner (below the cabin sole) probably, and of 
> course hole sawing a larger thru hull. So it's a good deal more work than 
> just replacing bilge pumps, their wiring, and adding a float switch + alarm. 
> 
> From Wally's page I know he installed a Rule 2000. 
> http://www.wbryant.com/StellaBoat/Projects/bilgepmp/bilgepmp.htm
> However it sounds like Wally's LF38 had his hoses run differently - to the 
> stern quarter - while mine are to stbd mid-ships. 
> 
> With two 800's I'm at the low end of the 1600-2000 gph capacity range 
> recommended by West Marine (and yes I've read all about how actual capacity 
> may be much lower, due to voltage drop, head pressure, etc). I've also heard 
> it doesn't make much sense to say that bigger boats need bigger bilge pumps - 
> a 20' boat will sink just as fast (or faster) with a 1.5" hole as a 38' one 
> will.
> 
> I'm more concerned with having the capacity to prevent the boat from sinking 
> at dock if say a 1.5" thruhull disintegrated somehow. Less concerned with 
> emergency pumping while onboard, because I'm not going far offshore and I 
> have a lot of emergency hole plugging options to try (putty, foam, wood 
> bungs, carrots, etc). 
> 
> -Patrick
> 1984 C Landfall 38
> Seattle, WA
> 
> 
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> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Pacific Cup: Stowing Type 1 PFDS

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Pretty much what we did - every crew member got one to store with personal 
gear; usually as padding for some unprotected corner.

John

> On Apr 13, 2016, at 4:33 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Kevin — I’ve got a half-dozen of these onboard, with lights attached:
> 
> http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1%7C135%7C2290066%7C2290073=724798
>  
> 
> I don’t think putting “Type I” and “spatially efficient” in the same sentence 
> is quite correct…  I just shove mine in the locker under a quarter-berth’s 
> bunkboards.  You could always put them in a spare sail bag, and use them for 
> additional cushioning in a berth when sleeping (or as a pillow, as Martin 
> said).
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
> 
>> On Apr 13, 2016, at 3:22 PM, Kevin Driscoll via CnC-List 
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> I am on a crew for Pacific Cup this year (a J42, not C) and wondered about 
>> buying and stowing (6) Type 1 Inherently buoyant PFD's. 
>> 
>> Nearly everyone on the crew is using a Spinlock Hammar or Pro Sensor, which 
>> are ISO certified, and ISAF approved and widely regarded as *superior to 
>> nearly everything else, but do not meet USCG requirements. So, the Spinlocks 
>> cover the SER (safety equipment requirements) for racing, but would not 
>> cover us if boarded the USCG. 
>> 
>> I am sure other offshore racers have dealt with this same dilemma, but 
>> wondered how so. Any recommendations on the most cost and spatially 
>> efficient Type1's to buy and stow? 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Kevin 
>> C 30-2, Osprey
>> Portland, OR
>> 
>> *please start another thread if you own an inflatable other than Spinlock 
>> and wish to protest it's superiority ;) thx.
> 
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> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List C 41 Wing Keel

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I don't think this is model specific.  You won't notice any difference once the 
wind picks up.  The wing keel will need a little more speed to develop lift so 
light air pointing will suffer.  10 knots true is likely the break even point.  
Even then the skill of the sailor and sail condition will have more of an 
impact than the wing.  Like all wing keels grounding is more of a disaster.  I 
would not expect any difference in terms of tenderness.  I've had a boat with 
7'+ draft and it is something that can get in the way.  6' ish isn't exactly 
shoal draft either and with the wing and all that weight down low I would 
expect fine performance and a very stiff ride.

I don't think you're giving up anything unless you're in a very light air.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 10, 2016, at 1:00 PM, Doug Allardyce via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Checking to see if anyone has experience with C 41's with the wing keel
> (6'2" draft) . I'm interested in the overall performance and stability. I'm
> just trying to get a feel for what I might be giving up with the wing, and
> to know how tender the boat might be.
> 
> 
> Doug
> _/)~~~_/)
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!


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Re: Stus-List 29-2 genoa sheets

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I would assume 45' and whatever diameter your hands and your winches are 
comfortable with.

John

Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 10, 2016, at 10:56 AM, Bev Parslow via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Every year the running rigging is taken down and washed. Unfortunately it 
> seems that the washing machine must have eaten the jib sheets. What length 
> are they and what diameter?
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Re: Stus-List Boom fittings for reefing attachments

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

If you draw that out I believe it’s 3 X 180 degree turn, 3 X 90 degree turn and 
one nominal 30 degree deflection.  Personally I would opt for 2 line but I’m 
biased toward that anyway.

John



> On Apr 8, 2016, at 2:50 PM, Marek Dziedzic (hotmail) via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> My single line reefing works almost exactly as you describe (at the mast end, 
> the line goes down to the mast collar, then up to the reefing cringle 
> (actually a dog bone there)). The only difference is that I have a car inside 
> the boom, so the line is split. It works just fine. You can reef from the 
> cockpit, without leaving it. The real main advantage is that you just crank 
> it up and eventually it is done; no need to adjust this then something else. 
> This might be an advantage for larger sails (larger boats).
>  
> Not that I am a single-line reefing advocate (or that the fact that I use it 
> is an argument for it).
>  
> The main arguments for two-line reefing is that it is simpler; does not 
> require any modifications to the boom and potentially allows for a better 
> shape of the reefed sail. You don’t even need a line up front if you have a 
> gooseneck reefing hook.
>  
> Marek
>  
> From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
> Sent: Friday, April 8, 2016 14:24
> To: C List 
> Cc: Josh Muckley 
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Boom fittings for reefing attachments
>  
> Awesome guys! Thanks everyone for the input. It looks like "that's just the 
> way it is". Nobody in the industry has necessarily come up with anything 
> earth shatteringly better.
> As I think I eluded to earlier, I'm averse to whimsically drilling holes in 
> the boom. Besides, I'm not sure a track or block necessarily looks cleaner so 
> I'll probably stick with a tied on method.
> Does anybody have any thoughts on using a soft shackle and an eye splice to 
> attach the reefing lines around the boom?
> I was also considering a single line reefing system. One challenge is that 
> where most setups have the line exit the boom at the mast and turn up to the 
> reef cringle, my boom is solid on top AND my aversion to drilling holes 
> extends to the mast as well. So if I tried a single line reef, it would have 
> the line turn down to the mast collar (like it did previously) but instead of 
> simply running back to the cabin (winch and jammer), the line would run back 
> up to the reef cringle, and back down on the other side of the boom to 
> another turning block which would lead back to the winch and cleat where it 
> would finish.
> Thoughts on my plan?
> Thoughts on single line reefing? I've heard some pretty strong arguments 
> against and only a few advocates.
> Thanks again, 
> Josh
> On Apr 8, 2016 1:49 PM, "Martin DeYoung via CnC-List"  > wrote:
>> >...1 1/4 inch, t track mounted on the side of the boom...
>> 
>> Calypso's boom has a similar T track on each side of the boom. I still tie 
>> the reefing lines around the boom and have seen very little paint wear.
>> 
>> The tracks on Calypso's boom were installed long ago and may also act as 
>> stiffeners as the mid boom main sheet attachments are near the tracks.
>> 
>> Best regards,
>> 
>> Martin
>> Calypso
>> 1971 C 43
>> Seattle
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>> ] On Behalf Of Robbie Epstein via 
>> CnC-List
>> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 7:48 AM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> Cc: Robbie Epstein
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Boom fittings for reefing attachments
>> 
>> My 40 has a 1 1/4 inch, t track mounted on the side of the boom with a 
>> Schaefer Jiffy reef slide/bail that slides up and down the track so you can 
>> position the clew attachment point for multiple mainsail reef points. The 
>> reefing line goes through a hook that you use to select which reefing 
>> cringle you want to use.
>> 
>> Robbie Epstein
>> 
>> 1980 C 40
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
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> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Boom fittings for reefing attachments

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Not too keen on the single line reefing arrangement.  You're adding another 180 
degree bend into a system that is already loaded with friction.

I do have single line reefing and with a block at the luff and an electric 
winch it's fine for the first reef, marginal for the second.

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 8, 2016, at 2:23 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Awesome guys!  Thanks everyone for the input.  It looks like "that's just the 
> way it is".  Nobody in the industry has necessarily come up with anything 
> earth shatteringly better. 
> 
> As I think I eluded to earlier, I'm averse to whimsically drilling holes in 
> the boom.   Besides, I'm not sure a track or block necessarily looks cleaner 
> so I'll probably stick with a tied on method. 
> 
> Does anybody have any thoughts on using a  soft shackle and an eye splice to 
> attach the reefing lines around the boom?
> 
> I was also considering a single line reefing system.  One challenge is that 
> where most setups have the line exit the boom at the mast and turn up to the 
> reef cringle, my boom is solid on top AND my aversion to drilling holes 
> extends to the mast as well.  So if I tried a single line reef, it would have 
> the line turn down to the mast collar (like it did previously) but instead of 
> simply running back to the cabin (winch and jammer), the line would run back 
> up to the reef cringle, and back down on the other side of the boom to 
> another turning block which would lead back to the winch and cleat where it 
> would finish.
> 
> Thoughts on my plan?
> 
> Thoughts on single line reefing?  I've heard some pretty strong arguments 
> against and only a few advocates.
> 
> Thanks again, 
> Josh
> 
>> On Apr 8, 2016 1:49 PM, "Martin DeYoung via CnC-List" 
>>  wrote:
>> >...1 1/4 inch, t track mounted on the side of the boom...
>> 
>> Calypso's boom has a similar T track on each side of the boom.  I still tie 
>> the reefing lines around the boom and have seen very little paint wear.
>> 
>> The tracks on Calypso's boom were installed long ago and may also act as 
>> stiffeners as the mid boom main sheet attachments are near the tracks.
>> 
>> Best regards,
>> 
>> Martin
>> Calypso
>> 1971 C 43
>> Seattle
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Robbie 
>> Epstein via CnC-List
>> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2016 7:48 AM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Cc: Robbie Epstein
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Boom fittings for reefing attachments
>> 
>> My 40 has a 1 1/4 inch, t track mounted on the side of the boom with a 
>> Schaefer Jiffy reef slide/bail that slides up and down the track so you can 
>> position the clew attachment point for multiple mainsail reef points.  The 
>> reefing line goes through a hook that you use to select which reefing 
>> cringle you want to use.
>> 
>> Robbie Epstein
>> 
>> 1980 C 40
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Ground loop?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Sure does sound like a radio ground although I’m not sure why it is connected 
to the electrical ground.  

John

> On Apr 7, 2016, at 6:58 PM, Ken Heaton via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Did the boat ever have a shortwave radio?
> 
> Was a previous owner afraid of a lightning strike?
> 
> Just guessing.
> 
> Ken H.
> 
> On 7 April 2016 at 18:20, Ryan Doyle via CnC-List  > wrote:
> Hey everyone, 
> 
> I am in the home stretch of re-wiring my entire boat.  The wiring was in 
> frightening shape when I bought it back in October - much of it was corroded 
> and probably original, and there were numerous "bad fixes" that I didn't like 
> the looks of.  So, I ripped it all out and started anew with a whole bunch of 
> Ancor marine wire, a BlueSea panel, BlueSea fuse blocks, and went about 
> re-wiring.
> 
> All negative wires connect back to the nut at the back of my A4 motor, which 
> is also connected to my battery negatives.  All good.
> 
> However, there is one large gauge (maybe 10 gauge?) old wire going from the 
> nut on the back of my A4 to a nut attached to a metal plate that is attached 
> to the outside of the hull.  This metal plate is located slightly forward and 
> to starboard of the front of the A4.  Another wire coming from the nut over 
> this metal plate is also connected to a keel bolt.
> 
> I don't see this plate or wire on the original C wiring diagram for the 
> boat.  And from what I know, having more than one negative point outside the 
> hull will create a ground loop.  
> 
> Any thoughts on why someone did this?  
> 
> Thanks, 
> Ryan
> Nobody's Bargain
> 1976 C 30 mki
> New York
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks Josh - the ham in me just needs to understand the how.

John

> On Apr 6, 2016, at 9:17 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Yep that's right.
> 
> Josh
> 
> On Apr 6, 2016 8:26 PM, "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> I guess the more accurate way of saying this is that the solenoid can only be 
> closed by one source bank; however it’s wired.
> 
> John
> 
>> On Apr 6, 2016, at 8:14 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> So if I understand this correctly it isn’t a 2-way street.  When a charging 
>> source is connected to the house bank the rise in voltage will close the 
>> solenoid and the two bank are now joined.  The voltage “sensor” is only on 
>> the house bank side.  So if the starting bank is at 14 volts and the house 
>> bank is at 12v the circuit will remain open and the banks will remain 
>> isolated.  Do I have this right?
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 6, 2016, at 3:56 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> It is safe to switch between 1-ALL-2 as long as everything is working as 
>>> designed.  You also have to be very careful not to accidentally overshoot 
>>> to the off position.  What isn't safe is turning the ignition switch to off 
>>> while the engine is running, or as mentioned turning the batt switch to off 
>>> while the engine is running.
>>> 
>>> The only concern about mixed types of batteries is various chemistries.  A 
>>> leaf acid starting battery and a lead acid deap cycle battery are the same 
>>> chemistry so you're fine.
>>> 
>>> Josh Muckley
>>> S/V Sea Hawk
>>> 1989 C 37+
>>> Solomons, MD
>>> 
>>> On Apr 6, 2016 3:48 PM, "Bruce Pope via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Is it safe to switch between 1-BOTH-2 while the engine is running?  I have 
>>> gotten mixed messages about that.  Haven't tried and am starting/charging 
>>> in the BOTH position assuming therefore that banks are in parallel and both 
>>> are charging.   But, read somewhere that it is bad form to charge different 
>>> types of batteries (starter/deep cycle house) this way.
>>> 
>>> From: CnC-List <cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>>> <mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>> on behalf of Josh Muckley via 
>>> CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 7:58 PM
>>> To: C List
>>> Cc: Josh Muckley
>>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay
>>>  
>>> It's not "smart" it always starts charging the "primary" bank first.  Once 
>>> the primary battery is full (ish) it combines the second battery.
>>> 
>>> Josh
>>> 
>>> On Apr 5, 2016 9:50 PM, "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> Thanks Gary.  I get that and I suppose it certainly simplifies the wiring - 
>>> you essentially have one bank for charging purposes.  No opinion at this 
>>> point although I do feel silly having spent the last year dutifully 
>>> switching between 1-both -2.  I assume it’s just a relay that connects the 
>>> circuit at a set voltage.  Not sure how it can be smart enough to determine 
>>> which bank to charge first but perhaps they are more than just a relay.
>>> 
>>> John
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 5, 2016, at 9:13 PM, Gary Russell via CnC-List 
>>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi John,
>>>>  I've had ACRs on my boats for the last 15 years and I think they are 
>>>> one of the best upgrades you can do.  When I bought "Kaylarah" (formerly 
>>>> "High Maintenance",adding and ACR was one of my first upgrades.  They are 
>>>> usually wired to charge the house bank first, then the start bank.  If 
>>>> your start bank was very low, you could could still use a combine switch 
>>>> to get the engine started.  I have never had a problem with the ACRs and I 
>>>> can't say the same about a 1-BOTH-2 switch.  All you have to do is forget 
&

Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I guess the more accurate way of saying this is that the solenoid can only be 
closed by one source bank; however it’s wired.

John

> On Apr 6, 2016, at 8:14 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> So if I understand this correctly it isn’t a 2-way street.  When a charging 
> source is connected to the house bank the rise in voltage will close the 
> solenoid and the two bank are now joined.  The voltage “sensor” is only on 
> the house bank side.  So if the starting bank is at 14 volts and the house 
> bank is at 12v the circuit will remain open and the banks will remain 
> isolated.  Do I have this right?
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 6, 2016, at 3:56 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> It is safe to switch between 1-ALL-2 as long as everything is working as 
>> designed.  You also have to be very careful not to accidentally overshoot to 
>> the off position.  What isn't safe is turning the ignition switch to off 
>> while the engine is running, or as mentioned turning the batt switch to off 
>> while the engine is running.
>> 
>> The only concern about mixed types of batteries is various chemistries.  A 
>> leaf acid starting battery and a lead acid deap cycle battery are the same 
>> chemistry so you're fine.
>> 
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>> 
>> On Apr 6, 2016 3:48 PM, "Bruce Pope via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Is it safe to switch between 1-BOTH-2 while the engine is running?  I have 
>> gotten mixed messages about that.  Haven't tried and am starting/charging in 
>> the BOTH position assuming therefore that banks are in parallel and both are 
>> charging.   But, read somewhere that it is bad form to charge different 
>> types of batteries (starter/deep cycle house) this way.
>> 
>> From: CnC-List <cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>> on behalf of Josh Muckley via 
>> CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 7:58 PM
>> To: C List
>> Cc: Josh Muckley
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay
>>  
>> It's not "smart" it always starts charging the "primary" bank first.  Once 
>> the primary battery is full (ish) it combines the second battery.
>> 
>> Josh
>> 
>> On Apr 5, 2016 9:50 PM, "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> Thanks Gary.  I get that and I suppose it certainly simplifies the wiring - 
>> you essentially have one bank for charging purposes.  No opinion at this 
>> point although I do feel silly having spent the last year dutifully 
>> switching between 1-both -2.  I assume it’s just a relay that connects the 
>> circuit at a set voltage.  Not sure how it can be smart enough to determine 
>> which bank to charge first but perhaps they are more than just a relay.
>> 
>> John
>> 
>>> On Apr 5, 2016, at 9:13 PM, Gary Russell via CnC-List 
>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi John,
>>>  I've had ACRs on my boats for the last 15 years and I think they are 
>>> one of the best upgrades you can do.  When I bought "Kaylarah" (formerly 
>>> "High Maintenance",adding and ACR was one of my first upgrades.  They are 
>>> usually wired to charge the house bank first, then the start bank.  If your 
>>> start bank was very low, you could could still use a combine switch to get 
>>> the engine started.  I have never had a problem with the ACRs and I can't 
>>> say the same about a 1-BOTH-2 switch.  All you have to do is forget to 
>>> switch to 1 or 2 after you shut the engine off and you can kill both 
>>> batteries while sitting on a hook.  That won't happen with and ACR.  I 
>>> think you will come to like them.
>>> 
>>> Fair winds,
>>> Gary
>>> S/V Kaylarah
>>> '90 C 37+
>>> East Greenwich, RI, USA
>>> 
>>> ~~~_/)~~
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2016 at 8:38 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>> So while connecting batteries today i discovered, to my surprise, that Paws 
>>> has an automatic charging relay betw

Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So if I understand this correctly it isn’t a 2-way street.  When a charging 
source is connected to the house bank the rise in voltage will close the 
solenoid and the two bank are now joined.  The voltage “sensor” is only on the 
house bank side.  So if the starting bank is at 14 volts and the house bank is 
at 12v the circuit will remain open and the banks will remain isolated.  Do I 
have this right?

John



> On Apr 6, 2016, at 3:56 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> It is safe to switch between 1-ALL-2 as long as everything is working as 
> designed.  You also have to be very careful not to accidentally overshoot to 
> the off position.  What isn't safe is turning the ignition switch to off 
> while the engine is running, or as mentioned turning the batt switch to off 
> while the engine is running.
> 
> The only concern about mixed types of batteries is various chemistries.  A 
> leaf acid starting battery and a lead acid deap cycle battery are the same 
> chemistry so you're fine.
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> On Apr 6, 2016 3:48 PM, "Bruce Pope via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> 
> Is it safe to switch between 1-BOTH-2 while the engine is running?  I have 
> gotten mixed messages about that.  Haven't tried and am starting/charging in 
> the BOTH position assuming therefore that banks are in parallel and both are 
> charging.   But, read somewhere that it is bad form to charge different types 
> of batteries (starter/deep cycle house) this way.
> 
> From: CnC-List <cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com>> on behalf of Josh Muckley via 
> CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 7:58 PM
> To: C List
> Cc: Josh Muckley
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay
>  
> It's not "smart" it always starts charging the "primary" bank first.  Once 
> the primary battery is full (ish) it combines the second battery.
> 
> Josh
> 
> On Apr 5, 2016 9:50 PM, "John Pennie via CnC-List" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> Thanks Gary.  I get that and I suppose it certainly simplifies the wiring - 
> you essentially have one bank for charging purposes.  No opinion at this 
> point although I do feel silly having spent the last year dutifully switching 
> between 1-both -2.  I assume it’s just a relay that connects the circuit at a 
> set voltage.  Not sure how it can be smart enough to determine which bank to 
> charge first but perhaps they are more than just a relay.
> 
> John
> 
>> On Apr 5, 2016, at 9:13 PM, Gary Russell via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
>> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi John,
>>  I've had ACRs on my boats for the last 15 years and I think they are 
>> one of the best upgrades you can do.  When I bought "Kaylarah" (formerly 
>> "High Maintenance",adding and ACR was one of my first upgrades.  They are 
>> usually wired to charge the house bank first, then the start bank.  If your 
>> start bank was very low, you could could still use a combine switch to get 
>> the engine started.  I have never had a problem with the ACRs and I can't 
>> say the same about a 1-BOTH-2 switch.  All you have to do is forget to 
>> switch to 1 or 2 after you shut the engine off and you can kill both 
>> batteries while sitting on a hook.  That won't happen with and ACR.  I think 
>> you will come to like them.
>> 
>> Fair winds,
>> Gary
>> S/V Kaylarah
>> '90 C 37+
>> East Greenwich, RI, USA
>> 
>> ~~~_/)~~
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, Apr 5, 2016 at 8:38 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> So while connecting batteries today i discovered, to my surprise, that Paws 
>> has an automatic charging relay between the two battery banks.  Yes, I’m 
>> still learning this boat.  So as I understand it, once voltage hits 13.6 
>> volts (or 13.0 for 2 minutes) the relay will automatically combine the two 
>> banks to share the changing source.  Not sure how I feel about that.
>> 
>> On the plus side, I guess it’s great that I don’t have to worry about moving 
>> a battery selector switch while the engine is running.  On the down side -
>> 
>> How does a battery charger monitoring two banks handle this?  I just seems 
>> it has to screw up the logic on the charger.
>> Essentially there is no 

Re: Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks Gary.  I get that and I suppose it certainly simplifies the wiring - you 
essentially have one bank for charging purposes.  No opinion at this point 
although I do feel silly having spent the last year dutifully switching between 
1-both -2.  I assume it’s just a relay that connects the circuit at a set 
voltage.  Not sure how it can be smart enough to determine which bank to charge 
first but perhaps they are more than just a relay.

John

> On Apr 5, 2016, at 9:13 PM, Gary Russell via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Hi John,
>  I've had ACRs on my boats for the last 15 years and I think they are one 
> of the best upgrades you can do.  When I bought "Kaylarah" (formerly "High 
> Maintenance",adding and ACR was one of my first upgrades.  They are usually 
> wired to charge the house bank first, then the start bank.  If your start 
> bank was very low, you could could still use a combine switch to get the 
> engine started.  I have never had a problem with the ACRs and I can't say the 
> same about a 1-BOTH-2 switch.  All you have to do is forget to switch to 1 or 
> 2 after you shut the engine off and you can kill both batteries while sitting 
> on a hook.  That won't happen with and ACR.  I think you will come to like 
> them.
> 
> Fair winds,
> Gary
> S/V Kaylarah
> '90 C 37+
> East Greenwich, RI, USA
> 
> ~~~_/)~~
> 
> 
> On Tue, Apr 5, 2016 at 8:38 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> So while connecting batteries today i discovered, to my surprise, that Paws 
> has an automatic charging relay between the two battery banks.  Yes, I’m 
> still learning this boat.  So as I understand it, once voltage hits 13.6 
> volts (or 13.0 for 2 minutes) the relay will automatically combine the two 
> banks to share the changing source.  Not sure how I feel about that.
> 
> On the plus side, I guess it’s great that I don’t have to worry about moving 
> a battery selector switch while the engine is running.  On the down side -
> 
> How does a battery charger monitoring two banks handle this?  I just seems it 
> has to screw up the logic on the charger.
> Essentially there is no way to isolate charging?  So if I know I only have 
> limited time to charge and want to concentrate on one bank I have no choice?
> 
> What I missing?
> 
> John
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Stus-List Automatic Charging Relay

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So while connecting batteries today i discovered, to my surprise, that Paws has 
an automatic charging relay between the two battery banks.  Yes, I’m still 
learning this boat.  So as I understand it, once voltage hits 13.6 volts (or 
13.0 for 2 minutes) the relay will automatically combine the two banks to share 
the changing source.  Not sure how I feel about that.

On the plus side, I guess it’s great that I don’t have to worry about moving a 
battery selector switch while the engine is running.  On the down side - 

How does a battery charger monitoring two banks handle this?  I just seems it 
has to screw up the logic on the charger.
Essentially there is no way to isolate charging?  So if I know I only have 
limited time to charge and want to concentrate on one bank I have no choice?  

What I missing?

John


___

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List *****SPAM***** Re: Bluetooth Speakers on Deck

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Also give a listen to the UE speakers.   They come with a bit of shock chord 
that easily wraps around a pulpit.

John

> On Apr 4, 2016, at 8:48 AM, Dreuge via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> Have you heard of the Amazon Tap?
> 
> It is an Alexa enabled bluetooth speaker with claims of a 9hr battery life 
> and can be charged via a USB cable. 
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00VXS8E8S/?ref_=pe_1457740_187773290_ods_em_ha_fx_strt_ecg
>  
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Paul E.
> 1981 C 38 Landfall 
> S/V Johanna Rose
> Carrabelle, FL
> 
> http://svjohannarose.blogspot.com/ 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 3, 2016, at 9:07 PM, cnc-list-requ...@cnc-list.com 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> From: Jim Giffing via CnC-List > >
>> To: cnc-list >
>> Cc: Jim Giffing >
>> Sent: Sat, Apr 2, 2016 8:18 pm
>> Subject: Stus-List Bluetooth Speakers on Deck
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Anyone have any experience with portable bluetooth speakers on deck?
>> Been considering mounting one on my stern pulpit,
>> Want something with long battery life... full day
>> Will pair it with my iphone which I will likely leave below deck
>> And care about sound quality with rich bass, etc,
>> 
>> 
>> Just wondering --- been googling reviews, but nope found for boats.
>> 
>> ___
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

___

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List *****SPAM***** Re: stoves

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

And then you can turn to ex propane locker into a beer cooler!

John

Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 4, 2016, at 12:28 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> You're welcome to shoot me a price for my good condition Force 10 and I'll 
> replace it with a Wallas.
> 
> Josh
> 
>> On Apr 4, 2016 12:22 AM, "Russ & Melody via CnC-List" 
>>  wrote:
>> Hi Pete,
>> 
>> you can be confident in a Force 10 replacement. It's what I would consider 
>> as first choice, but look at the others.
>> 
>> Cheers, Russ
>> 
>> At 08:19 PM 03/04/2016, you wrote:
>>> Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
>>> boundary="=_NextPart_000_000D_01D18DF6.EB822060"
>>> Content-Language: en-us
>>> 
>>> I’m considering replacing the propane stove.  Any advice or strong 
>>> opinions on make/model?
>>> Thanks,
>>> ___
>>> 
>>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
>>> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All 
>>> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
>> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
>> are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List *****SPAM***** Re: A little help from our neighbors up north...

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks all - very very helpful.

Sounds just like Jersey City!

John

> On Apr 2, 2016, at 6:12 PM, Dave Syer via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> A beautiful part of the world, though I may be biased.   As mentioned 
> previously, the fundy side is a tide and fog (and whale) festival - beautiful 
> country but navigation and currents can be tricky close inshore.
> If you are sailing north you will probably be intending to make your first 
> landfall somewhere between Yarmouth and Halifax.   That stretch of coast is 
> known as the "south shore" and has great harbours civilized small towns, huge 
> secluded beaches and really beautiful scenery.  (full disclosure, I have a 
> house in that area)  
> Be ready for morning fogs inshore.  You are certainly not likely to be 
> becalmed, but before mid july you are not guaranteed sunny days, weather is 
> better in August, and at least on land, September is fantastic.You have a 
> great piece of coast there to cruise and anchor, stopping in at towns all 
> along the way.   Shelburne is great, has a friendly yachtclub, all services, 
> one of the largest natural harbours in the world.  (was a marshalling point 
> for WWII convoys)  Halfway up the harbour Wave to my house as you pass the 
> 19th century lighthouse, look across the harbour, and wave to my dad.   If 
> you see a tan coloured steel trawler yacht "J. Michael" on a mooring in his 
> "front yard" it's his.  Check out what's going on at The Osprey Theatre,  
> have dinner at Charlotte lane.  Reserve both in advance.  A short hop up the 
> coast and anchor at carter's beach.   Dinghy to dinner dinner at "The Quarter 
> Deck".   I can vouch for the anchorages in both places.  (Dad was a 
> steel-sailboated ocean cruiser - and has coastal cruised this neighbourhood 
> many times, by sail and now by trawler.)
> Keep going up the coast to Mahone bay, check out when the wooden boat 
> festival is, hit the bakery, and continue to chester, check when race week 
> is.  closest thing to Newport I suppose.  ooops, I missed very beautiful 
> Lunenburg, but don't you miss that, and when you are there you must check out 
> the fisheries museum of the Atlantic.  OK, back on track, by now you are at 
> Halifax.  Lots to do there, great downtown, and don't miss the market.  
> Dinner at the bicycle thief.  Your next stretch of coast is more remote and 
> rural.  How's that for a start?
> Real - Nova Scotians - I don't know all the anchorages, there are many many, 
> (Jordan bay and the LeHave River come to mind) but otherwise, how'd I do?  ;-)
> 
> Another thought - look at your chart and see the birthplace of Joshua Slocum 
> (yes, he was Canadian - ) Brier Island.   It is at the end of a chain of 
> islands and truly feels like the end of the world, You can see the shop where 
> he toiled as a child (mentioned in SAATW) and understand why he might have 
> got the urge to ramble.   If you can, go whale watching from there, and go by 
> zodiac, not on one of the big cape islanders. (local inshore fishing boat 
> type)   Have done this twice with visitors and it has been amazing, both 
> times.  
> 
> Oh yeah - you can get some pretty good seafood in the area. ;-)
> 
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2016 09:18:29 -0300
> From: Ken Heaton >
> To: cnc-list >
> Subject: Re: Stus-List A little help from our neighbors up north...
> Message-ID:
> 

Re: Stus-List welcome Northern Light

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Chris - welcome to the list and congrats on the new boat.  It sounds like we 
have similar cruising plans. I now sail a Tartan built C and the list 
grudgingly tolerates me.  You can’t find a better source of information.

John

> On Mar 31, 2016, at 9:02 PM, Chuck S via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Chris,
> Congratulations on the new boat. 
> I learned a lot from this list and appreciate the many different approaches 
> to problem solving.
> 
> Edson can tell you which cable you need by the model of your boat. I think 
> they have two lengths.
> 
> I don't have a windless.  We usually anchor in 12 feet of water, boat weighs 
> 11,000# so my racing rode has no chain and my cruising setup has 18 ft.  The 
> rest is 1/2" nylon twisted.  I tried heavier 5/8" rode and found it a problem 
> tying to cleats.  I learned a few tricks for raising the anchor without 
> strain and never looked back, 12 years.  
> 
> Martin,  who cruises the very deep waters of Seattle stated he carries 90' of 
> chain and the rest I guess is nylon three strand twisted.  
> That makes more sense to me.  I don't believe chain in the vertical part of 
> the rode improves the holding power and nylon stretches and absorbs shocks 
> better.  My 2 cents.  
> 
> Don't take this wrong, but I am curious how you will load 300 feet of chain 
> onto your boat?
> 
> Best of luck,
> 
> Chuck Scheaffer
> Resolute
> 1990 C 34R
> Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List A little help from our neighbors up north...

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Ok, I think I can survive the temperature.  So what are the prevailing winds in 
Nova Scotia? (Mid-May - Mid Sept, south coast).  I won’t even ask about tides 
(and I’m coming from Long Island).  Yes, I know I can get all this from a 
cruising guide and already to some extent  have but I thought I might ask folks 
who actually live there.

John


> On Mar 31, 2016, at 8:52 PM, Ken Heaton  wrote:
> 
> For most of Nova Scotia, Lobster Season ends by mid July so no traps and trap 
> lines to worry about after that.
> 
> However, different regions have different seasons, a few radically different 
> than the others.
> 
> An overview listing is here: 
> http://thisfish.info/fishery/species/atlantic-lobster/ 
> 
> 
> Ken H.
> 
> On 31 March 2016 at 21:37, John Sandford via CnC-List  > wrote:
> Was sailing last year from April 20th to Nov 4th. Nicer winds in the fall.
> Have an Espar which was nice for October along with Merino layers.
> Watch out for Lobster trap floats and leaders if you are sailing inside the 
> limit.
> http://www.tastelobster.ca/images/fishing_regions.pdf 
> 
> Come on up, you will enjoy it. Friendly folk and no Donald Trump.
> 
> John
> St Margarets Bay
> Nova Scotia
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: John Pennie [mailto:j...@svpaws.net ]
> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2016 7:46 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Subject: Stus-List A little help from our neighbors up north...
> 
> So I’m starting to get Paws (and me) ready for the next round of extended 
> cruising.  It took eight years to recover from the last one.  Anyway, the 
> thought is to head north this time - Maine, Nova Scotia, potentially 
> Newfoundland.  So here’s the question - how long is the sailing season in 
> that area.  I’m not talking sailing for Canadians, I’m talking sailing season 
> for sissy-boy I won’t wear socks Americans.  Joking aside, I would assume 
> some kind of diesel heat for nights is pretty much prerequisite.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List A little help from our neighbors up north...

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks Ken.  How early does the season start?   I would expect to move the boat 
to Mass or so the fall before.  We’ll be leaving from New York.

John

> On Mar 31, 2016, at 8:01 PM, Ken Heaton <kenhea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Atlantic Coast of Nova Scotia, the season lasts into mid September without 
> some heat source.  Bras d'Or Lakes of Cape Breton Island, mid September 
> without some sort of heat, with diesel heat your're good to the end of 
> September, the first week or two of October perhaps.
> 
> The Bras d'Or Lakes are an amazing, 450 square mile oasis, a refuge, an 
> escape from the fog, rough seas and cold water of the open coastline.  The 
> east and west coasts of Cape Breton Island are also warmer and sunnier than 
> Maine even though further north.
>  
> "A basin ringed by indigo hills laced with marble. Islands within a sea 
> inside an island."
>  
> A local online resource, maintained by volunteers from the Dobson Yacht Club 
> in Sydney Harbour is Cruising Cape Breton. It is a cruising guide that can be 
> used online OR downloaded to your computer. It is constantly updated, to make 
> sure the information is always current.
>  
> Among other things it contains hundreds of detailed charts of the multitude 
> of anchorages in the Bras d'or and around Cape Breton Island. You can use it 
> directly off your computer or print the chartlets, etc. to have paper backup 
> if you wish.
>  
> Link to Cruising Cape Breton here: http://www.cruising-cape-breton.info/ 
> <http://www.cruising-cape-breton.info/>
> 
> Ken Heaton & Anne Tobin
> S/V Salazar - Can 54955
> C 37/40 XL - Hull # 67
> Cape Breton Island, Nova Scotia
> 
> http://www.racethecape.ca/the-race/entrants/salazar/ 
> <http://www.racethecape.ca/the-race/entrants/salazar/>
> 
> On 31 March 2016 at 19:45, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> So I’m starting to get Paws (and me) ready for the next round of extended 
> cruising.  It took eight years to recover from the last one.  Anyway, the 
> thought is to head north this time - Maine, Nova Scotia, potentially 
> Newfoundland.  So here’s the question - how long is the sailing season in 
> that area.  I’m not talking sailing for Canadians, I’m talking sailing season 
> for sissy-boy I won’t wear socks Americans.  Joking aside, I would assume 
> some kind of diesel heat for nights is pretty much prerequisite.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> John
> 
> 
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> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 

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Stus-List A little help from our neighbors up north...

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So I’m starting to get Paws (and me) ready for the next round of extended 
cruising.  It took eight years to recover from the last one.  Anyway, the 
thought is to head north this time - Maine, Nova Scotia, potentially 
Newfoundland.  So here’s the question - how long is the sailing season in that 
area.  I’m not talking sailing for Canadians, I’m talking sailing season for 
sissy-boy I won’t wear socks Americans.  Joking aside, I would assume some kind 
of diesel heat for nights is pretty much prerequisite.  

Thanks in advance

John


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Re: Stus-List Possible offer on a 86' C MKIII - with photos/video

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Make no mistake this boat is going to be a project.  There are some areas that 
look lovingly restored.  Others, well, not so much.  I suspect everything, 
repeat everything leaks.  Whenever I see a tarp over a cabin I get nervous.  If 
the deck is sound it’s just a lot of removing fixtures, clean, caulk and rebed. 
 If the deck is wet, fasten your seat belt.

Gooseneck (boom hinge) I didn’t see a picture of.  Worst case is a new fitting 
which isn’t terrible.
Engine paint - probably not a concern but you want to know the cause
Port lights - see comment above
Loose stanchions - that’s a big question mark.  It could be a sign of a wet 
deck, it could be just a different definition of loose.  Investigate
Original standing rigging - it should probably be replaced once every 30 years 
if it needs it or not.

If the price is right is could be a fun project and a rewarding boat.  You do 
have to ask yourself if you’re willing to take on the project and learn the 
skills required.  This lists a tremendous resource and others, far more 
knowledgeable, will chime in I’m sure.

The  big plus is the newer engine.

Good luck

John

> On Mar 30, 2016, at 6:38 PM, CHRIS HOBSON via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hoping to get some perspective from the group on a boat I’m interested in. 
> I’m not a surveyor but I took some photos and video (in the link below) of a 
> 86’ C MKIII I'm considering making an offer on. And would really appreciate 
> some thoughts on it to save me the hassle of paying a surveyor if something 
> is obviously wrong with it. The possible areas of concern without a proper 
> survey and my limited knowledge are:
> 
> - water in the core of the deck around the mast (see photos) haven’t tested
> - corroded boom (hinge?) 
> - some bubbling/corrosion under paint on engine
> - bad seal around two large side port-lights, interior I saw silicone around 
> perimeter 
> - few loose stanchions 
> - original (I think) standing rigging
> 
> Short story is owner bought it a year ago didn’t sail it much or from what 
> I’ve seen, maintain it. Here is a link to view the photos/video I took. I did 
> not do a correct test with a hammer or moisture reader on deck but did walk 
> around quite a bit and there was nothing obvious in the way of soft spots. 
> 
> Anyway here is the link would love to hear what others think:
> 
> https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0Bx6tzmnoism-Y2g1UERWXzZ6NXM=sharing
>  
> 
> 
> Cheers
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Best material for battery compartment shelf?

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So your battery compartment gets a hardwood floor, the cabin gets plywood?  
That’s gotta be a happy battery.

John

> On Mar 28, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Charlie Nelson via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Considering this is a one-time job, I would forget about any laminated wood 
> product in a marine environment. 
> 
> I used 1" solid red oak, epoxy sealed, as backing plates for my Lewmar 
> primary winches (#50s?). Much stiffer for its thickness than starboard, it 
> cannot delaminate, lighter than aluminum for similar stiffness but it can be 
> worked like any piece of wood. For all practical purposes, the winch and the 
> wood backing plate are now 'one' and if the winch ever leaves the boat 
> (without first removing the backing plate), it will leave the boat with the 
> backing plate attached!
> 
> A few pieces of this stuff or similar would barely notice the battery weight 
> IMHO.
> 
> Charlie Nelson
> 
> 
> 
> cenel...@aol.com 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Jake Brodersen via CnC-List 
> To: cnc-list 
> Cc: Jake Brodersen 
> Sent: Mon, Mar 28, 2016 9:04 pm
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Best material for battery compartment shelf?
> 
> Joel,
>  
> Mine rotted and collapsed last season too.  I’m thinking about plywood cover 
> with epoxy.
>  
> Jake
>  
> Jake Brodersen
> C 35 Mk-III “Midnight Mistress”
> Hampton VA
>  
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Joel Aronson via 
> CnC-List
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 12:41
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Joel Aronson >
> Subject: Stus-List Best material for battery compartment shelf?
>  
> I need to replace the shelf in the battery compartment  on my other boat.  
> Plywood with epoxy?  Starboard?  Something else?
>  
> Thanks!
>  
> Joel 
> 301 541 8551
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Subject: Re: Hull color inquiry

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Richard:

If you go dark - just remember to build a couple of hundred into the budget for 
the really nice fender covers at Maine Pointe.  Also, if your dock line will 
rub on the transom Boat Leather makes an excellent chafe guard with fleece.  
No, you can’t use old socks or West Marine covers on a flag blue hull - it’s 
illegal in 49 states.

I hate to even mention this one but do you race?

John


> On Mar 28, 2016, at 11:42 AM, kelly petew via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Richard, 
>  
> If you like the color, go for it.  
>  
> I didn't start at specifically looking for a blue boat, but that's what I 
> have, and I like it.   It's flag blue. 
> While your "experts" are probably correct, their reasons are more technical 
> than substantive.  
> Any scratches won't be visible unless the observer is far too close.  And 
> hotter, possibly, but I doubt any difference would be perceptible.  
>  
> I bought my boat 13 years ago, and its blue hull wasn't pretty, but I started 
> using Poli-Glo years ago, and I refer to it as the "poor man's awlgrip".   It 
> does a pretty good job of hiding all but the worst scratches, and again, 
> beyond 10 feet, no one will see them.
>  
> Other listers have commented on Poli-Glo's benefits as well.
>  
> I can send you "Before" and "After" pics if you like.
>  
> Fair Winds,
>  
> Pete W.
>  
> Siren Song
> 91 C 30-2
> Deltaville, Va.  
>  
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Hull color inquiry

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

After two flag blue hulls I can’t say I noticed them being any hotter.  As was 
mentioned, this is more an emotional emotional issue as the brain would tell 
you anything but white gelcoat makes no practical sense whatsoever. 

My current boat is gray which I actually like very much.  It is easier to keep 
clean than the darker colors but still has some personality.  It wasn’t by 
choice - it’s just the color the boat was when I found the right boat for me.  
Be prepared to rinse the boat off after sailing as salt shows on the blue 
(however the dark streaks from the slotted toe rail are less noticeable!)

John



> On Mar 28, 2016, at 10:30 AM, Andrew Burton via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> I never noticed them being much hotter in the boats I ran, even in the 
> Caribbean sunshine, with the balsa cored hulls, they are well insulated, but 
> they are certainly harder to keep looking good. Also, they are more likely to 
> show print-through, where you see the pattern of the roving beneath the gel 
> coat.
> But man, does a dark hull look pretty on a C!
> 
> Andy
> C 40
> Peregrine
> 
> On Mon, Mar 28, 2016 at 10:24 AM, Richard N. Bush via CnC-List 
> > wrote:
> Dave's post reminded me...I am going to be in a situation where most or all 
> of my hull may need repainting; (blemishes on hull from dock piling); so I 
> began looking at other boats for ideas; I have always been enamored with the 
> dark hulls, especially the Flag Blue ones like Dave Risch's boat; however, I 
> have been warned by the local "experts" that they are difficult to maintain 
> and show scratches way more than the lighter colors; also , that they are 
> hotter in the summer...; so my question to those of you with darker 
> hulls...how much of the above is true? Would you go back with a darker color 
> if you had the chance?  Any other factors I am missing? Many thanks as 
> always 
> 
> Richard
> 
> Richard N. Bush Law Offices 
> 2950 Breckenridge Lane, Suite Nine
> Louisville, Kentucky 40220-1462 
> 502-584-7255 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: David via CnC-List  >
> To: CNC CNC >
> Cc: David >
> Sent: Mon, Mar 28, 2016 9:48 am
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Auto pilot installation
> 
> Same here.   Never had a need to change.
> 
> David F. Risch
> 1981 40-2
> (401) 419-4650  (cell)
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Andrew Burton
> 61 W Narragansett Ave
> Newport, RI
> USA 02840
> http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/ 
> 
> phone  +401 965 5260
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
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Re: Stus-List 27mkIII part out

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Lol - I was going to say this wasn't a great idea until I actually read the ad. 
 It's worth it just for the fittings!

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 28, 2016, at 8:41 AM, Stevan Plavsa via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> On Kijiji, in waterloo ON:
> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-sailboat/kitchener-waterloo/parting-out-everything-from-c-c-27-mk-iii-updated/1094723097?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
> 
> $200 for all the standing rigging. If I had a 27mkIII I'de spring $200 for a 
> spare set of standing rigging, sure.
> 
> Steve
> Suhana, C 32
> Toronto
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Rolly Tasker Sails

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Pretty much mirrors everything I’ve heard on the subject.  With that said, I 
went with Dacron.  It is noticeable in light air. 

John

> On Mar 27, 2016, at 11:45 AM, Rick Brass via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> I had a preliminary conversation with my local sailmaker about a new suit of 
> sails for Imzadi. He was also very down on using a Dacron sun cover for the 
> headsail. His opinion was that they are typically good for 5-6 years or less, 
> and better suited to use on sails used for club racing and not left for long 
> term on the furler. He said Sunberlla is heavier, stiffer, and more expensive 
> (which increases initial cost of the sail and slightly decreases 
> performance), but very much more durable (and a better value in the long run 
> if you are a cruiser). 
>  
> Rick Brass
> Washington, NC
>  
>  
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Frederick G Street via 
> CnC-List
> Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2016 5:43 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Frederick G Street >
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Rolly Tasker Sails
>  
> You get sun in Seattle?   :^)   I’ve been there a fair amount, usually either 
> in March/April or August, and I’ve actually seen the sun quite a lot.  All of 
> Mount Rainier, too.
>  
> I’ve also been in contact with RT sails; they have been really pushing 
> against me getting a Dacron sun cover, preferring the Sunbrella instead.  
> They say they’ve had issues with the longevity of the Dacron.
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
>  
>> On Mar 26, 2016, at 4:20 PM, Andrew Means via CnC-List 
>> > wrote:
>>  
>> Our sailing season is just starting, but even in the off season we’ll find 
>> days to get out and take the boat for a spin. We’ve done a few sails already 
>> this year. We have new sunbrella sail covers so the main will pretty much 
>> always be dry and protected from the sun.
>>  
>> -- 
>> Andrew Means
>> S.V. Safari - 1977 C 34 Mk I
>> Seattle, WA
> 
>  
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> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
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Re: Stus-List now cored hulls

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Tim - Well that’s gotta suc…  If you’re writing the checks you can hate all you 
want.  Am curious however how much of the issue was in the hull itself.  I 
would have thought most of the bilge sump sections would be areas of solid 
laminate.

Sorry to hear of your problems.

John (not the guy looking at the 35-3)


> On Mar 25, 2016, at 7:11 PM, Tim Goodyear <timg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Not being an owner of a C any more, you may lump me with the haters, but I 
> am really looking forward to delivering Mojito (C 35-3, the same as you're 
> looking at) from Branford CT up to Newport for her final trip with us in a 
> couple of weeks.  Having said that, I have spent more than the purchase price 
> replacing core in the hull and the decks, so get a good surveyor, who know 
> what they are doing on 30 year-old cored hulls, and go into the purchase 
> informed!  The interior skin on the 35-3 is fairly thin and the repairers 
> seem to think initial moisture intrusion was from that direction, not from 
> outside.  I couldn't see anywhere that fasteners had been used 
> inappropriately to cause the damage.
> 
> Tim
> Ex Mojito
> C 35-3
> 
> 
> On Mar 25, 2016, at 3:01 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> 
>> So this really does beg the question.  Has anyone had firsthand experience 
>> with a hull core issue?  Decks are understandable - lots of holes from 
>> hardware.  Rudders are understandable - big post.  But as I think about this 
>> (and despite all the internet chatter on the subject) I can only recall a 
>> very few stories and have never had any first hand issues with the hull 
>> itself.  Curious what everyone else’s experience has been.  
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> 

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Re: Stus-List now cored hulls

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So this really does beg the question.  Has anyone had firsthand experience with 
a hull core issue?  Decks are understandable - lots of holes from hardware.  
Rudders are understandable - big post.  But as I think about this (and despite 
all the internet chatter on the subject) I can only recall a very few stories 
and have never had any first hand issues with the hull itself.  Curious what 
everyone else’s experience has been.  

John



> On Mar 25, 2016, at 2:43 PM, Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Chris, 
> 
> C pretty much invented using cored hulls on production sailboats, that was 
> previously reserved for high end offshore racing powerboats.. Their 
> fiberglass layups were also 2nd to none.. They really did put in the extra 
> effort and you can see that when you start looking at the details. 
> 
> You read the cored hulls horror stories on other forums, mostly from internet 
> "experts" that have never seen a C up-close. They typically just see us 
> from a distance while we're blowing them away. :-)  
> 
> Seriously, if the boat has been reasonably well taken care of it will last a 
> long long time
> 
> Make sure you get a good survey and ask lots of questions from the prior 
> owner.. 
> 
> Antoine Rose crossed the Atlantic twice in a 1973 C 30 MK I. He sailed it 
> from Montreal QC to Brest France.  Read the story of the way from Canada to 
> France here http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/CnC30_Crosses_Atlantic/index.pdf 
> 
> 
> He's brought it back since.. 
> 
> -Francois Rivard
> 1990 34+ "Take Five"
> Lake Lanier, GA 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> > On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 12:01 PM, Chris Hobson via CnC-List <
> > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> >
> > I?m new to C world, recently narrowed down my boat search to a C and
> > currently have my eye on two that are on the market: a 1986 C 35 MKIII
> > and a 1979 C 36. Have heard the good/bad and I?m told it all comes down
> > to a good surveyor (if anyone knows a good surveyor with C knowledge
> > please send them my way!) and I have to say I?m a bit apprehensive about a
> > 30+ year old boat with cored hull and topsides. But I?m curious what others
> > have to say about this topic or if there?s anything they might expand upon
> > outside of what I?ve noted above.
> >
> >
> > Many thanks,
> > Chris
> >
> >
> > Chris Hobson, Owner
> > HobsonBuildsCo.com >
> > ch...@hobsonbuildsco.com
> > 416-436-1037
> >
> Regards
> François Rivard4111 Northside Pkwy, Nw
> 
> Big Data Black BeltAtlanta, 30327-3015
> IBM Sales & Distribution, Software Sales   Usa
> Mobile:   770-639-0429
> e-mail:   jfriv...@us.ibm.com 
>  
>  
> 
> 
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Re: Stus-List Rudder replacement

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

I seriously considered this on my 51.  Even had Rob design the new rudder.  In 
the end I decided that I couldn't justify the cost.

Why are you looking to change?

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 18, 2016, at 12:14 PM, Brian Fry via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Has anyone replace their rudder on a 37/40 with a different model/shape?
> Got a decent quote on a replacement which is not an exact copy. Weighing the 
> pros and cons.
> 
> -- 
> Brian Fry
> S/V La Neige
> 1993 C 37/40XL
> HdG Maryland
> ___
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Re: Stus-List Docks are in!

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thank the ground hog!

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 18, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Dropped by my club today at noon and my finger pier is now in and waiting for 
> me!  This is over one full month ahead of last year
>  
> Guess I had better get busy
>  
> Mike
> Persistence
> Halifax
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Re: Stus-List Docks are in!

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Good eats?

Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 18, 2016, at 1:00 PM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> When the groundhog stuck his head out of the hole this year I shot him. 
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of John 
> Pennie via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, March 18, 2016 1:42 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: John Pennie
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Docks are in!
>  
> Thank the ground hog!
>  
> John
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Mar 18, 2016, at 12:33 PM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Dropped by my club today at noon and my finger pier is now in and waiting for 
> me!  This is over one full month ahead of last year
>  
> Guess I had better get busy
>  
> Mike
> Persistence
> Halifax
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Rudder replacement

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

When I was working with Rob on the 51, he freely admitted that rudder design 
back then was more art than science.  That's not to say slap anything on but I 
wouldn't feel obliged to duplicate your existing rudder to perfection if the 
mold isn't available.

On the post and structure inside the rudder you really won't know until the 
skins are removed and you get to see it.  Hopefully all is fine but given your 
comments...  Who knows, maybe you get to have the fun of deciding on a 
stainless vs. Carbon post! Is there a local designer you can speak with or a 
yard that frequently handles such work?

Good luck and sorry to hear of the problem.

John






Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 18, 2016, at 1:30 PM, Brian Fry via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Rudder is in need of major repair. Got a quote for a replacement for less 
> than a repair, but not an exact copy (they don't have a mold). Also 2/3 the 
> cost of having a mold made and then a replacement made from that.
> I had drilled a dozen  holes to drain water over the winter to avoid freeze 
> expansion causing more damage. Found many of the holes drilled had just voids 
> behind them, no foam, others had a gritty white material that was saturated 
> with water. Saw pictures here and elsewhere of same rudder repair needed.
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2016 12:21:42 -0400
> From: John Pennie 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Rudder replacement
> Message-ID: <2c82d7c8-8e02-4d7f-aec5-d405a536d...@svpaws.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> I seriously considered this on my 51.  Even had Rob design the new rudder.  
> In the end I decided that I couldn't justify the cost.
> 
> Why are you looking to change?
> 
> John
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List To foam or not to foam...

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Have to agree.  For my area, I’ve been a huge fan of 120 + main for cruising.  
On a landfall the 135 may be the better option and I would probably pass on 
either foam or rope. I’m basing that on the assumption that the landfall will 
reef later than most but I’ve never sailed one so don’t really know.  At 150 I 
would definitely go with something to take up the extra fabric but would let 
the sailmaker decide between the two options.  Both work well so it’s whatever 
they’re more comfortable with.

Just another $0.02

John


> On Mar 17, 2016, at 8:43 PM, dwight veinot via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> get the foam luff if you intend to sail with the jib
> furled...otherwise get a 110% and enjoy sailing
> Dwight Veinot
> C 35 MKII, Alianna
> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
> d.ve...@bellaliant.net
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 1:30 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List
>  wrote:
>> I’m going to be ordering a new furling 135% headsail for my LF38, and would
>> like everyone’s input on whether or not to pay the extra $$$ for a foam
>> luff.  In the past, I haven’t relied much on furling, knowing that
>> regardless of the foam luff (or not), a furled sail’s shape isn’t going to
>> be ideal.
>> 
>> Thoughts?
>> 
>> — Fred
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI   :^(
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
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Re: Stus-List Wiring an inverter

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks Dennis

Got the first part - you effectively created a sub panel for loads allowed to 
be fed by the inverter.

For shore power, it sounds like you are feeding the HL panel directly (after 
the main breaker) and then jumping to the rotary switch which then directs 
either inverter or shore power to the sub panel.  Did I read that correctly? 

John



> On Mar 12, 2016, at 5:43 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> Mine doesn't have the internal switch but I wired it to ONLY the AC 
> receptacles via a rotary switch and the receptacles breaker.  I did the same 
> with a friend's boat.
> 
> That is, the switch is between the breaker panel supply buss and the line 
> side of the AC receptacle breaker.  The high amp AC users can never be 
> powered by the inverter.  The receptacles are always protected by the breaker 
> whether fed by shore power or inverter.
> 
> On my friend's boat, we cut the buss bar on his breaker panel and wired it so 
> the bottom 2-3 breakers were dedicated to the receptacles only.  The top part 
> of the supply buss fed the hot water heater, air conditioner, and other high 
> amp AC users.
> 
> Dennis C.
> Touche' 35-1 #83
> Mandeville, LA
> 
> On Sat, Mar 12, 2016 at 3:54 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> So I'm n the process of upgrading the electrical panel on Paws.  DC is 
> straightforward using the new 360 panel from Blue Sea (really nice stuff).
> 
> I do want to add a small inverter (~1000 watts) routed to the main panel.  
> Yes I know it won't run air conditioning.
> 
> So the plan is to route the AC out from the inverter to a  DP breaker to a DP 
> rotary source selector switch to the  AC main panel.  The problem is that 
> every mid sized inverter I've seen (such as the Xantrex Pro series) wants to 
> control everything via the transfer switch in the inverter.  I don't want a 
> $300 inverter to have that much control.
> 
> Can you simply by-pass the built in transfer switch by not connecting the 
> inverter "in" line?
> 
> Feel free to tell me I'm an idiot.  Already been flamed on CF.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
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> 
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Re: Stus-List Wiring an inverter

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Thanks - will definitely compare.  Scary when you start to add up all the 
"little" pieces.  It's going to be a fortune just in shrink terminals!

John


Sent from my iPad

> On Mar 13, 2016, at 11:10 AM, Bill Coleman via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> 
> Just a note here, I notice Del City is now handling a lot of Blue Sea
> inventory.
> 
> http://www.delcity.net/productsearch?search=blue+sea=0=0=#search=blue
> %20sea=72
> 
> Don't know how their prices compare.
> 
> 
> Bill Coleman
> C 39 Erie, PA
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of John
> Pennie via CnC-List
> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2016 4:55 PM
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: John Pennie
> Subject: Stus-List Wiring an inverter
> 
> So I'm n the process of upgrading the electrical panel on Paws.  DC is
> straightforward using the new 360 panel from Blue Sea (really nice stuff).  
> 
> I do want to add a small inverter (~1000 watts) routed to the main panel.
> Yes I know it won't run air conditioning.
> 
> So the plan is to route the AC out from the inverter to a  DP breaker to a
> DP rotary source selector switch to the  AC main panel.  The problem is that
> every mid sized inverter I've seen (such as the Xantrex Pro series) wants to
> control everything via the transfer switch in the inverter.  I don't want a
> $300 inverter to have that much control.  
> 
> Can you simply by-pass the built in transfer switch by not connecting the
> inverter "in" line?
> 
> Feel free to tell me I'm an idiot.  Already been flamed on CF.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
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> 
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Stus-List Wiring an inverter

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So I'm n the process of upgrading the electrical panel on Paws.  DC is 
straightforward using the new 360 panel from Blue Sea (really nice stuff).  

I do want to add a small inverter (~1000 watts) routed to the main panel.  Yes 
I know it won't run air conditioning.

So the plan is to route the AC out from the inverter to a  DP breaker to a DP 
rotary source selector switch to the  AC main panel.  The problem is that every 
mid sized inverter I've seen (such as the Xantrex Pro series) wants to control 
everything via the transfer switch in the inverter.  I don't want a $300 
inverter to have that much control.  

Can you simply by-pass the built in transfer switch by not connecting the 
inverter "in" line?

Feel free to tell me I'm an idiot.  Already been flamed on CF.

John


Sent from my iPad
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Stus-List Back on the list

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

So after a few months on another forum I find myself returning to the grown-ups 
of the Internet world (that really is a sincere compliment).

John
C 121 Paws
Previous C 51 Penceler
Previous C 34+ Paws

Sent from my iPad
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Re: Stus-List Fitting a Solent stay

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Not a huge fan of the solent solution.  For light air, I think you are far 
better off with a furling spinnaker, Doyle UPS, etc.  For a storm sail solution 
it really depends.  For constant use a dedicated inner forestay is preferable.  
For the cruising I did, (offshore to the BVI followed by island hopping) a 
“semi permanent” inner stay was the solution. When we knew we were going 
offshore one off us would go up the mast and install it; simple turnbuckle on 
the deck side.  For island hopping we would take it down and have all the 
benefits of a clear foredeck.

Just an opinion.

John

> On Oct 14, 2015, at 6:35 PM, corralmaduzi via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi there sailors,
> I've eventually become the proud owner of a C 40 and would like to know who 
> has fitted a Solent-stay and if they could share the info on how to go about 
> it.It will be for cruising and used either for going up-wind with a smaller 
> Genoa or a storm-jib when necessary. I would appreciate any info.
> Thanks. 
> Saltyspearo.
> 
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9305T on the Telstra 4G network
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Bow Thrusters

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

OK, I had to look up the word ”luddite”. I don’t think anyone is arguing the 
use of machinery here.  It’s a cost/complexity/benefit issue.  Never 
underestimate the impact of complexity.  I’d go on my rant about steering 
systems here but that’s a whole other subject.

John


> 
>> On Sep 28, 2015, at 7:14 AM, Bill Bina - gmail via CnC-List 
>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Some people retire from sailing, or buy a trawler prematurely, because they 
>> eschewed equipping their boat with whatever was needed to make it less 
>> physically demanding to sail. Luddites be damned! There are plenty of 
>> sailors who will tell you that a GPS and RADAR are wastes of money, too. 
>> 
>> Bill Bina
>> 
>> On 9/27/2015 2:56 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List wrote:
>>> Ed:
>>> 
>>> I sailed/lived aboard a 51 for many years.  Everyone thought we were crazy 
>>> when we removed the bow thruster (it didn’t work anyway).  I can say I 
>>> never missed it.  They do add some drag - probably not as much as you would 
>>> expect.  I would think a pod hanging down would be worse.  Nevertheless,I 
>>> just don’t see the need and I sail in the same area as you.  It sounds 
>>> strange, but my experience has been the tighter the slip the easier it is 
>>> to get into. There just isn’t as much room to screw up!  Yes, there has 
>>> been the rare occasion where it would have been helpful coming in.  Leaving 
>>> a dock it serves no purpose as god invented spring lines.  To me, the 
>>> complexity of the systems, to say nothing of the cost, just isn’t 
>>> justified.  I
>>> 
>>> My opinion would be just say no…
>>> 
>>> Of course, it’s your money and you should spend it however you damn well 
>>> want to.
>>> 
>>> John
> 
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Bow Thrusters

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Now if you could add to the existing diverter in that system and also use the 
high pressure pump as a water maker….

Oh never mind, ran out of batteries.

John

> On Sep 28, 2015, at 12:16 PM, S Thomas via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> That system is a great idea, but I think that many of us would prefer to 
> build our own if choosing that sort of system. 
> They charge over 4k Euros (6k C$) for the cheapest kit. 
> Pretty sure I could source what I would need to construct something 
> functional for less money than what they charge. 
> With that said, and if you had to pay for a tunnel installation, it is price 
> competitive with some of the other systems available. 
> I just think that it should sell for less. 
>  
> Steve Thomas
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>
>> To: 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com' <mailto:'cnc-list@cnc-list.com'>
>> Cc: Della Barba, Joe <mailto:joe.della.ba...@ssa.gov>
>> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2015 10:19
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Bow Thrusters
>> 
>> Sure – if someone wants one, or even two, go for it. I just find every C I 
>> have had to dock or undock so far to be about the easiest single engine 
>> boats to handle. I get and out of my slip single-handed with little effort.
>> If you do have to have one, this looks nice: 
>> http://www.hollandmarineparts.nl/jetthruster 
>> <http://www.hollandmarineparts.nl/jetthruster> You could make it double as 
>> an emergency bilge pump and have fun squirting bystanders.
>>  
>> Joe 
>> Coquina
>>  
>>  
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick 
>> G Street via CnC-List
>> Sent: Monday, September 28, 2015 8:37 AM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Cc: Frederick G Street
>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Bow Thrusters
>>  
>> Edd just wants to be able to call out, “Helmsman: maneuvering thrusters to 
>> leave Spacedock”…   :^)
>> 
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>>  
>>> On Sep 28, 2015, at 7:14 AM, Bill Bina - gmail via CnC-List 
>>> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
>>>  
>>> Some people retire from sailing, or buy a trawler prematurely, because they 
>>> eschewed equipping their boat with whatever was needed to make it less 
>>> physically demanding to sail. Luddites be damned! There are plenty of 
>>> sailors who will tell you that a GPS and RADAR are wastes of money, too. 
>>> 
>>> Bill Bina
>>> 
>>> On 9/27/2015 2:56 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List wrote:
>>>> Ed:
>>>>  
>>>> I sailed/lived aboard a 51 for many years.  Everyone thought we were crazy 
>>>> when we removed the bow thruster (it didn’t work anyway).  I can say I 
>>>> never missed it.  They do add some drag - probably not as much as you 
>>>> would expect.  I would think a pod hanging down would be worse.  
>>>> Nevertheless,I just don’t see the need and I sail in the same area as you. 
>>>>  It sounds strange, but my experience has been the tighter the slip the 
>>>> easier it is to get into. There just isn’t as much room to screw up!  Yes, 
>>>> there has been the rare occasion where it would have been helpful coming 
>>>> in.  Leaving a dock it serves no purpose as god invented spring lines.  To 
>>>> me, the complexity of the systems, to say nothing of the cost, just isn’t 
>>>> justified.  I
>>>>  
>>>> My opinion would be just say no…
>>>>  
>>>> Of course, it’s your money and you should spend it however you damn well 
>>>> want to.
>>>>  
>>>> John
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
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