Re: Active Directory lookup

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

I have found the answer. I record it here in case it helps someone in the
future.

While avoiding AD, if you simply want to check if an account exists either
locally or in the default domain do this:

uint sidSize = 0;
uint domainSize = 0;
int accountType = 0;
bool b1 = LookupAccountName
<https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/winbase/nf-winbase-lookupaccountnamew>(null,
user, null, ref sidSize, null, ref domainSize, ref accountType);
int err2 = Marshal.GetLastWin32Error();
if (err2 == 0x007a) { *the account exists (insufficient buffer)* }
else if (err2 == 0x0534) { *account not found (no mapping)* }
else { *some bad error code* }

If you want to authenicate an account credentials then call LoginUser
<https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/winbase/nf-winbase-logonuserw>,
there are lots of examples.

*Greg*

On Fri, 24 May 2024 at 09:06, Greg Keogh  wrote:

> TGIF!
>
> I just spiced-up an ASP.NET app so that it uses DirectorySearch.FindOne
> <https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/api/system.directoryservices.directorysearcher.findone?view=netframework-4.8>
> to either verify a login user account exists or to authenticate. It runs
> perfectly on my work PC, but when I installed the app in IIS on my test
> server it died with *The specified domain either does not exist or could
> not be contacted*. I discovered that because my app was running as
> NETWORK SERVICE, which isn't a domain user, it can't see the Active
> Directory.
>
> A trap...only domain user accounts can *see* AD. Asking the customer (a
> hospital) to create a special account, assign it to the pool and set ACLs
> is impractical. My lovely new login feature has hit a roadblock and I'm not
> sure of a workaround or alternative. It's a specialist topic, but I thought
> I'd ask in here just in case some boffin has suggestions.
>
> *Greg Keogh*
>
> P.S. I just remembered that about 15 years ago I used a Win32 Interop to
> call LoginUser
> <https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/winbase/nf-winbase-logonusera>
> for a similar purpose, but it was for local accounts and I'll need to
> research if it works for domain accounts.
>
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Active Directory lookup

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

TGIF!

I just spiced-up an ASP.NET app so that it uses DirectorySearch.FindOne
<https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/api/system.directoryservices.directorysearcher.findone?view=netframework-4.8>
to either verify a login user account exists or to authenticate. It runs
perfectly on my work PC, but when I installed the app in IIS on my test
server it died with *The specified domain either does not exist or could
not be contacted*. I discovered that because my app was running as NETWORK
SERVICE, which isn't a domain user, it can't see the Active Directory.

A trap...only domain user accounts can *see* AD. Asking the customer (a
hospital) to create a special account, assign it to the pool and set ACLs
is impractical. My lovely new login feature has hit a roadblock and I'm not
sure of a workaround or alternative. It's a specialist topic, but I thought
I'd ask in here just in case some boffin has suggestions.

*Greg Keogh*

P.S. I just remembered that about 15 years ago I used a Win32 Interop to
call LoginUser
<https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/winbase/nf-winbase-logonusera>
for a similar purpose, but it was for local accounts and I'll need to
research if it works for domain accounts.
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Re: [OT] Windows Server install problems

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> Just put the server in a vm on win11. All your problems will go away.
>

Okay, a consensus from such distinguished persons. I'm reconsidering my way
forward -- *Greg K*


> David Connors
> da...@connors.com // +61 417 189 363
>
>
> On Sun, 17 Mar 2024 at 10:17 am, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> They took a lot of device support out of server along the way and that is
>>> when I stopped running it in my laptop. I'd install windows 11 and turn on
>>> hyper v and run server in a vm
>>>
>>
>> I guess this means I must shop around for a hardware combination (or a
>> whole box) that specifically runs the latest Windows servers. The price of
>> that is worrying, and I need do the research. I've been lucky for the last
>> 20 years because old work PCs could be rebranded as home servers without
>> any hiccups at all -- *Greg*
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
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RE: [OT] Windows Server install problems

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

+1 vote for just running the Win servers in VMs on Windows 11.

Works well.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
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From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Sunday, March 17, 2024 11:15 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Re: [OT] Windows Server install problems

They took a lot of device support out of server along the way and that is when 
I stopped running it in my laptop. I'd install windows 11 and turn on hyper v 
and run server in a vm

I guess this means I must shop around for a hardware combination (or a whole 
box) that specifically runs the latest Windows servers. The price of that is 
worrying, and I need do the research. I've been lucky for the last 20 years 
because old work PCs could be rebranded as home servers without any hiccups at 
all -- Greg
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Re: [OT] Windows Server install problems

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> They took a lot of device support out of server along the way and that is
> when I stopped running it in my laptop. I'd install windows 11 and turn on
> hyper v and run server in a vm
>

I guess this means I must shop around for a hardware combination (or a
whole box) that specifically runs the latest Windows servers. The price of
that is worrying, and I need do the research. I've been lucky for the last
20 years because old work PCs could be rebranded as home servers without
any hiccups at all -- *Greg*
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[OT] Windows Server install problems

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, it's been a non-TGIF day. My old server under the desk running
Server 2019 (or 2016 I forget) died this morning and I'm trying to create a
replacement

I have a brand new *one of these*
<https://www.ple.com.au/Products/665032/ple-midnight-gtx-1650-prebuilt-ready-to-go-gaming-pc>,
so I installed Server 2019 and it all went smoothly until it booted and all
chipset devices are dead, including the network adapter and the screen is
stuck at SGA. The only drivers I can find are for Windows 7 to 11 and
nothing else.

I tried installing 2016 as an experiment but it produces the same results.

Am I wasting my time? Is that box incapable of running recent Windows
Server editions?

*Thanks, Greg*
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RE: AI

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Worse, in the baseball umpiring exam I mentioned, someone said to me “isn’t 
that what you’d get if you just asked a whole lot of fans about the rules 
rather than asking umpires?”

There’s probably something important about that. How does it know which of the 
material it was trained on is valid?

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
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From: mike smith via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 12:19 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: mike smith 
Subject: Re: AI

"old system views"

That makes me wonder if it has any way of differentiating between something it 
found from a decade ago to more recent data.

Mike
On Fri, 23 Feb 2024, 11:43 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Hi Tom,

For me, it depends what you want it to do. It certainly can appear to help 
someone who’s new to an area.

For most code writing, I’ve been pretty underwhelmed. As an example, if I ask 
it to write SQL, I get a very poor outcome. It will use old deprecated views 
instead of the current system views (that have been around for a decade), and 
often does things in a convoluted way.

What I have been impressed with, is how it can help you understand acronyms, 
etc. Quite amazing. I’ve also been pretty impressed with using it go generate 
some test data, including in multiple languages. And the test data is fairly 
believable. If I ask it for family names, and I also ask for Chinese, it does 
pick common Chinese family names in the test output. That’s pretty impressive.

It can do a reasonable job of things like “here’s some DAX code, can you 
simplify it?” It often can. Or “here’s a regular expression, can you explain 
what it does?” and it does that just fine. I’ve seen people happily using it to 
explain code that they don’t understand, or to (sort of) document some code.

But it also is so confident on things, yet so wrong. I gave it a 25 question 
baseball umpire test the other day. It was 100% confident sounding, but 40% 
correct. The weird thing is that some of the questions that it got right, are 
things that new human umpires often get wrong. Yet for simpler questions, it 
would say that something legal is illegal.

It’s certainly interesting, but it’s very much a work in progress. It will be 
part of our futures.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
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From: Tom Gao via ozdotnet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:58 AM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Tom Gao mailto:t...@tomgao.com>>
Subject: AI

Hi guys, I haven't posted in a few years and haven't been on the tools for a 
long time now as well. I'm on a panel on a digital conference coming up in 
march. We had a pre meeting today and the topic of AI came up. Two of the 
panelist said cited CBA and Westpac using AI and were able to save 30% on 
development effort.

Personally I just finished an AI course my view is quite the opposite. My 
personal opinion of the generative AI space and AI in general having spent time 
with the academics is that the benefits are significantly over inflated.

I want to get some other opinions if you are seeing any significant benefit and 
that I may be just out of touch or not aware.

Thanks,
Tom
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RE: AI

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

There were other things I should have mentioned.

The new PowerPoint co-pilot where you just say “Prepare me a presentation about 
what’s in xyz.docx” is pretty amazing.

I’ve used ChatGPT to rewrite marketing blurb for various things. It does that 
very well. However, I’ve asked it to improve a paragraph of writing, and find 
that something like the Hemmingway editor does a far superior job.

In Teams, having the AI tool write a summary of what just happened in a meeting 
is pretty stunning.

We are going to just be using these tools all day long.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
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From: Dr Greg Low
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 12:11 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom Gao 
Subject: RE: AI

Hi Tom,

For me, it depends what you want it to do. It certainly can appear to help 
someone who’s new to an area.

For most code writing, I’ve been pretty underwhelmed. As an example, if I ask 
it to write SQL, I get a very poor outcome. It will use old deprecated views 
instead of the current system views (that have been around for a decade), and 
often does things in a convoluted way.

What I have been impressed with, is how it can help you understand acronyms, 
etc. Quite amazing. I’ve also been pretty impressed with using it go generate 
some test data, including in multiple languages. And the test data is fairly 
believable. If I ask it for family names, and I also ask for Chinese, it does 
pick common Chinese family names in the test output. That’s pretty impressive.

It can do a reasonable job of things like “here’s some DAX code, can you 
simplify it?” It often can. Or “here’s a regular expression, can you explain 
what it does?” and it does that just fine. I’ve seen people happily using it to 
explain code that they don’t understand, or to (sort of) document some code.

But it also is so confident on things, yet so wrong. I gave it a 25 question 
baseball umpire test the other day. It was 100% confident sounding, but 40% 
correct. The weird thing is that some of the questions that it got right, are 
things that new human umpires often get wrong. Yet for simpler questions, it 
would say that something legal is illegal.

It’s certainly interesting, but it’s very much a work in progress. It will be 
part of our futures.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
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From: Tom Gao via ozdotnet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:58 AM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Tom Gao mailto:t...@tomgao.com>>
Subject: AI

Hi guys, I haven't posted in a few years and haven't been on the tools for a 
long time now as well. I'm on a panel on a digital conference coming up in 
march. We had a pre meeting today and the topic of AI came up. Two of the 
panelist said cited CBA and Westpac using AI and were able to save 30% on 
development effort.

Personally I just finished an AI course my view is quite the opposite. My 
personal opinion of the generative AI space and AI in general having spent time 
with the academics is that the benefits are significantly over inflated.

I want to get some other opinions if you are seeing any significant benefit and 
that I may be just out of touch or not aware.

Thanks,
Tom
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RE: AI

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Hi Tom,

For me, it depends what you want it to do. It certainly can appear to help 
someone who’s new to an area.

For most code writing, I’ve been pretty underwhelmed. As an example, if I ask 
it to write SQL, I get a very poor outcome. It will use old deprecated views 
instead of the current system views (that have been around for a decade), and 
often does things in a convoluted way.

What I have been impressed with, is how it can help you understand acronyms, 
etc. Quite amazing. I’ve also been pretty impressed with using it go generate 
some test data, including in multiple languages. And the test data is fairly 
believable. If I ask it for family names, and I also ask for Chinese, it does 
pick common Chinese family names in the test output. That’s pretty impressive.

It can do a reasonable job of things like “here’s some DAX code, can you 
simplify it?” It often can. Or “here’s a regular expression, can you explain 
what it does?” and it does that just fine. I’ve seen people happily using it to 
explain code that they don’t understand, or to (sort of) document some code.

But it also is so confident on things, yet so wrong. I gave it a 25 question 
baseball umpire test the other day. It was 100% confident sounding, but 40% 
correct. The weird thing is that some of the questions that it got right, are 
things that new human umpires often get wrong. Yet for simpler questions, it 
would say that something legal is illegal.

It’s certainly interesting, but it’s very much a work in progress. It will be 
part of our futures.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
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From: Tom Gao via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 11:58 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom Gao 
Subject: AI

Hi guys, I haven't posted in a few years and haven't been on the tools for a 
long time now as well. I'm on a panel on a digital conference coming up in 
march. We had a pre meeting today and the topic of AI came up. Two of the 
panelist said cited CBA and Westpac using AI and were able to save 30% on 
development effort.

Personally I just finished an AI course my view is quite the opposite. My 
personal opinion of the generative AI space and AI in general having spent time 
with the academics is that the benefits are significantly over inflated.

I want to get some other opinions if you are seeing any significant benefit and 
that I may be just out of touch or not aware.

Thanks,
Tom
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Re: CPU profiling an MS unit test

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Nah. When you click start, it starts whichever project is set to Start,
which in my case was some WinForms old test project of no use. You can't
set a library to start.

I created a mini test project which did some CPU and IO work. If I start
the profiler it starts and waits, and when I run a unit test method it
reports nothing useful, just a [System Code] execution. In release mode the
profile just starts and stops while I've done nothing. All I can get is:

[image: image.png]

I'll wager that Chat GPT is smarter than me, so there's probably a way of
profiling a unit test, but my feeble biased human brain can't find it yet.
If it is possible and I can't find it, then the VS team needs to have a
chat to Chat GPT and ask it how to improve discoverability.

*Greg K*


> In the Performance Profiler, several profiling options are available, such
> as CPU Usage, Memory Usage, etc. For CPU performance, ensure CPU Usage is
> checked.
> Click Start.
> Run the Specific Test:
>
> The profiler will start, and Visual Studio will switch to a profiling
> mode. Now, navigate to the Test Explorer.
> Find the [TestMethod] you want to profile.
> Right-click on the test method and select Run. If your test project
> contains multiple tests and you only want to profile a specific one, make
> sure only that test is set to run.
>
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Re: CPU profiling an MS unit test

[Greg Harris via ozdotnet]

I asked Chat GPT...

Far too late at night for me to read / understand the response

How do I run a CPU performance profiler over a [TestMethod] in my c# unit
test project.
ChatGPT
Running a CPU performance profiler over a [TestMethod] in your C# unit test
project involves several steps and can be accomplished using various tools.
The most straightforward way to profile a specific test method is to use
Visual Studio's built-in performance profiling tools, assuming you are
using Visual Studio. Here's how to do it:

Using Visual Studio Performance Profiler
Prepare Your Test Project:
Ensure that your unit test project is correctly set up and that the
[TestMethod] you wish to profile can be executed successfully.

Open Performance Profiler:

In Visual Studio, go to the Debug menu.
Select Performance Profiler This option might be found under Other
Windows or Profile in different versions of Visual Studio.
Choose the Profiling Method:

In the Performance Profiler, several profiling options are available, such
as CPU Usage, Memory Usage, etc. For CPU performance, ensure CPU Usage is
checked.
Click Start.
Run the Specific Test:

The profiler will start, and Visual Studio will switch to a profiling mode.
Now, navigate to the Test Explorer.
Find the [TestMethod] you want to profile.
Right-click on the test method and select Run. If your test project
contains multiple tests and you only want to profile a specific one, make
sure only that test is set to run.
Analyze the Results:

Once the test completes, the Performance Profiler will gather the CPU usage
data and present it to you.
You can analyze the report to see where most of the CPU time is spent. The
report will show you the call tree, hot paths, and other details that help
identify performance bottlenecks.
Tips for Effective Profiling:
Isolate the Test: If possible, isolate the test you are profiling to
minimize noise from other tests or operations.

Use Release Mode: Run your tests in Release mode rather than Debug mode to
get a more accurate representation of performance, as the compiler
optimizations are different.

Repeat Tests: To ensure consistency, consider running the profiler multiple
times and averaging the results, as performance can vary from run to run.

Alternative Tools:
If you're not using Visual Studio or if you're looking for more advanced
profiling options, there are several third-party tools available that can
profile .NET applications, such as:

JetBrains dotTrace: A performance profiler for .NET applications that can
integrate with unit testing frameworks to profile specific tests.
Redgate ANTS Performance Profiler: Another profiler that can attach to .NET
processes, including test runners, to gather performance data.
Visual Studio Code with Extensions: If you're using Visual Studio Code,
extensions like .NET Core Test Explorer can be used in conjunction with
external profiling tools.
When using third-party tools, the general approach involves running your
unit test suite with the profiler attached, similar to how you would
profile any .NET application. However, the specifics will vary based on the
tool, so consult the documentation for detailed instructions.

Remember, performance profiling can sometimes introduce its own overhead,
so interpret the results with an understanding of what might be profiling
artifacts versus genuine performance issues in your code.

Greg Harris




On Thu, Feb 15, 2024 at 2:10 PM Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> It's not Friday, but I can't find any way of running the CPU performance
> profiler over a [TestMethod] in my unit test project.
>
> Web searches produce no useful results, some hint that I can right-click a
> test in the test explorer and pick Profile..., but I have no such menu.
>
> Is this possible or not? If so, what's the trick?
>
> P.S. I often use the profiler for commands or GUI apps, but in that case
> you set breakpoint #1 and start the profiler, then at breakpoint #2 you
> stop it and collect the results. That doesn't work for a unit test method
> (so far...).
>
> *Greg*
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
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CPU profiling an MS unit test

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

It's not Friday, but I can't find any way of running the CPU performance
profiler over a [TestMethod] in my unit test project.

Web searches produce no useful results, some hint that I can right-click a
test in the test explorer and pick Profile..., but I have no such menu.

Is this possible or not? If so, what's the trick?

P.S. I often use the profiler for commands or GUI apps, but in that case
you set breakpoint #1 and start the profiler, then at breakpoint #2 you
stop it and collect the results. That doesn't work for a unit test method
(so far...).

*Greg*
-- 
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Re: Private Apple App distribution

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> Perhaps not ideal but maybe the app can go into the app store but nobody
> can actually use it without an account which you would only allow your
> users to create. Just an idea.
>

Each phone running the app needs its app-generated ID registered in a
master XML file, so the public can't run it, which makes forcing it into
the store somewhat stupid -- *Greg*


>
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 14:48, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Folks,
>>
>> We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
>> phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
>> (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
>> for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
>> convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
>> doing this?
>>
>> A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and
>> was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> *Greg Keogh*
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
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RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

And even more changes from Apple:

https://www.macrumors.com/2024/01/16/us-app-store-alternative-purchase-option/?utm_source=tldrwebdev

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
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From: Dr Greg Low
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 5:21 PM
To: 'ozDotNet' 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: RE: Private Apple App distribution

Are you in the Apple Developer program? I’m guessing there might be a test 
option there.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
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From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 4:46 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Greg Keogh mailto:gfke...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: Private Apple App distribution

So you're all telling me that there is no "side load" feature for iPhone apps?! 
This is a dreadful obstacle to getting the app onto company staff phones. 
Luckily I have an Apple account that was recently renewed (for 150 goddamn $), 
but I'll have to fill-in all the store compliance documentation and make keys 
and fumble through their cryptic alien processes, and so on and on. Goddammit 
again.

GK
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RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Are you in the Apple Developer program? I’m guessing there might be a test 
option there.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__about.me_greg.low=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=NsAibgiqfCxsyc8m2DBKogKQcs3OqE3mkyCjmpoYxTk=>

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 4:46 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Re: Private Apple App distribution

So you're all telling me that there is no "side load" feature for iPhone apps?! 
This is a dreadful obstacle to getting the app onto company staff phones. 
Luckily I have an Apple account that was recently renewed (for 150 goddamn $), 
but I'll have to fill-in all the store compliance documentation and make keys 
and fumble through their cryptic alien processes, and so on and on. Goddammit 
again.

GK
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

So you're all telling me that there is no "side load" feature for iPhone
apps?! This is a dreadful obstacle to getting the app onto company staff
phones. Luckily I have an Apple account that was recently renewed (for 150
goddamn $), but I'll have to fill-in all the store compliance documentation
and make keys and fumble through their cryptic alien processes, and so on
and on. Goddammit again.

*GK*
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]



I like the lateral thinking.

I wonder if it will be based on the user’s home location, or where the phone is.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__about.me_greg.low=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=NsAibgiqfCxsyc8m2DBKogKQcs3OqE3mkyCjmpoYxTk=>

From: mike smith via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 3:11 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: mike smith 
Subject: Re: Private Apple App distribution

So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in Europe?

I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.

Mike
On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about this. 
They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In response, Apple 
has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with one for EU, and one 
for the rest of the world.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__about.me_greg.low=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=NsAibgiqfCxsyc8m2DBKogKQcs3OqE3mkyCjmpoYxTk=>

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Greg Keogh mailto:gfke...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Private Apple App distribution

Folks,

We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple phones. 
For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it (after the 
security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same for iPhones. We 
don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a convention for 
"side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone doing this?

A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and was 
published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.

Thanks,
Greg Keogh
--
ozdotnet mailing list
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RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about this. 
They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In response, Apple 
has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with one for EU, and one 
for the rest of the world.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
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From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Private Apple App distribution

Folks,

We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple phones. 
For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it (after the 
security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same for iPhones. We 
don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a convention for 
"side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone doing this?

A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and was 
published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.

Thanks,
Greg Keogh
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Private Apple App distribution

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks,

We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
(after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
doing this?

A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and
was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.

Thanks,
*Greg Keogh*
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Web app large uploads and downloads

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

I think it's been using azcopy for a fair while now. Azcopy has improved
dramatically over the last few years to have more switches and options. I
recently used it to bulk copy a container in one storage account to
another, then bulk upload all files with certain extensions (which wasn't
originally possible). In each case it was harder than refining fissionable
uranium, so I pasted the skeletons of the working commands into my "bag of
tricks" text file. The Blazor bulk upload is mercifully on hold while they
reconsider who should have the facility -- *Greg K*

On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 at 16:27, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
wrote:

> I notice that the Azure Storage Explorer desktop app nowadays defaults to
> using azcopy under the covers to copy files. That’s a much better option
> for files of any size. Probably need a component that does that but azcopy
> has a few dependencies.
>
>
>
> It’s on GitHub as open source so you could probably check out how it does
> what it does. It’s sure fast and filesize isn’t an issue. I’ve used azcopy
> on multi-terabyte files without issue. (Apart from the hosting provider for
> the site calling to find out what was going on, given the way it worked in
> parallel and flooded their network)
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
>  |
> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__about.me_greg.low=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=NsAibgiqfCxsyc8m2DBKogKQcs3OqE3mkyCjmpoYxTk=>
>
>
>
> *From:* DotNet Dude via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:17 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* DotNet Dude 
> *Subject:* Re: Web app large uploads and downloads
>
>
>
> Yep we usually do this sort of thing with a batch process, particularly if
> there are large files. I don’t see any web app being used just to upload a
> bunch of files.
>
>
>
> For fun try asking ChatGPT or one of the others to see where they go.
>
>
>
> On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 at 11:13, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
> Folks (welcome to the distant future of 2024)
>
>
>
> I'm pretty sure that there is no sensible way to provide a bulk Azure Blob
> upload facility in a web hosted app (Wasm, JS or whatever). There could be
> thousands of files with a total size up to hundreds of MB. Managers are
> currently using a WPF program I created for uploads and it feels like a
> perfectly natural process on the desktop, and it's pretty fast using
> streams on multi cores (I also optionally check for new or changed so only
> *diffs* are uploaded which often saves a lot of time).
>
>
>
> None of the components or controls I've seen are designed for huge
> uploads, and in any case, I've reported that it's technically and usability
> questionable to have "normal" users of the browser app doing this sort of
> thing. The boss of the app suite is now considering the bigger picture and
> the bulk upload feature may be delayed or moved to somewhere else in the
> flow, or the desktop program will suffice. So I'm happy the issue is
> on-hold for now.
>
>
>
> I think this is a good example of how the web browser should never have
> evolved into a host for business apps. I think the web browser, HTML, HTTP,
> REST, css and JS have diseased 21st century IT.
>
>
>
> *Greg K*
>
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>
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RE: Web app large uploads and downloads

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

I notice that the Azure Storage Explorer desktop app nowadays defaults to using 
azcopy under the covers to copy files. That’s a much better option for files of 
any size. Probably need a component that does that but azcopy has a few 
dependencies.

It’s on GitHub as open source so you could probably check out how it does what 
it does. It’s sure fast and filesize isn’t an issue. I’ve used azcopy on 
multi-terabyte files without issue. (Apart from the hosting provider for the 
site calling to find out what was going on, given the way it worked in parallel 
and flooded their network)

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
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 | About Greg:  
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From: DotNet Dude via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 3, 2024 4:17 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: DotNet Dude 
Subject: Re: Web app large uploads and downloads

Yep we usually do this sort of thing with a batch process, particularly if 
there are large files. I don’t see any web app being used just to upload a 
bunch of files.

For fun try asking ChatGPT or one of the others to see where they go.

On Wed, 3 Jan 2024 at 11:13, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Folks (welcome to the distant future of 2024)

I'm pretty sure that there is no sensible way to provide a bulk Azure Blob 
upload facility in a web hosted app (Wasm, JS or whatever). There could be 
thousands of files with a total size up to hundreds of MB. Managers are 
currently using a WPF program I created for uploads and it feels like a 
perfectly natural process on the desktop, and it's pretty fast using streams on 
multi cores (I also optionally check for new or changed so only diffs are 
uploaded which often saves a lot of time).

None of the components or controls I've seen are designed for huge uploads, and 
in any case, I've reported that it's technically and usability questionable to 
have "normal" users of the browser app doing this sort of thing. The boss of 
the app suite is now considering the bigger picture and the bulk upload feature 
may be delayed or moved to somewhere else in the flow, or the desktop program 
will suffice. So I'm happy the issue is on-hold for now.

I think this is a good example of how the web browser should never have evolved 
into a host for business apps. I think the web browser, HTML, HTTP, REST, css 
and JS have diseased 21st century IT.

Greg K
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Re: Web app large uploads and downloads

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks (welcome to the distant future of 2024)

I'm pretty sure that there is no sensible way to provide a bulk Azure Blob
upload facility in a web hosted app (Wasm, JS or whatever). There could be
thousands of files with a total size up to hundreds of MB. Managers are
currently using a WPF program I created for uploads and it feels like a
perfectly natural process on the desktop, and it's pretty fast using
streams on multi cores (I also optionally check for new or changed so only
*diffs* are uploaded which often saves a lot of time).

None of the components or controls I've seen are designed for huge uploads,
and in any case, I've reported that it's technically and usability
questionable to have "normal" users of the browser app doing this sort of
thing. The boss of the app suite is now considering the bigger picture and
the bulk upload feature may be delayed or moved to somewhere else in the
flow, or the desktop program will suffice. So I'm happy the issue is
on-hold for now.

I think this is a good example of how the web browser should never have
evolved into a host for business apps. I think the web browser, HTML, HTTP,
REST, css and JS have diseased 21st century IT.


*Greg K*

>
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RE: Web app large uploads and downloads

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Hi Greg,

Are you using any Blazor frameworks? Several of them seem to have pretty good 
file upload components. That might give the best experience.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__sqldownunder.com_=DwMFAg=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM=2rgtwrXggQFZiZbisdwDooYFalucb-vLhjG0McaanBZKn0UVuognuHqfHnjp2AVc=I23jyX4AKIv9q2x7A3CQAer9PGCjq8R6DwW7BE1IAhZ1JbigKMrMPRCjs6AqW7h3=o3oFliHztOF8D9Nbqaa7KQdqC-zkQNXWl4IqnEG58Wc=>
 | About Greg:  
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From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2023 8:58 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Web app large uploads and downloads

Folks (anyone working?)

I've been asked to add a feature to a Blazor Webassembly app to allow uploads 
and downloads of possibly large numbers of files between the local file system 
and Blob storage. I'm not sure how to implement this feature in a browser 
hosted app.

I wrote a WPF tool for "managers" which does high-performance bulk uploads and 
downloads with nice progress (the code is trivial on the desktop), but now they 
want the same feature for "normal" users in the Blazor app. Given how dumb and 
restricted browser hosted apps are, I don't know how to code this, or if it's 
even feasible.

Are there some tools, techniques or tricks I can apply? Any ideas or 
suggestions anyone?

Thanks,
Greg Keogh
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Web app large uploads and downloads

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks (anyone working?)

I've been asked to add a feature to a Blazor Webassembly app to allow
uploads and downloads of possibly large numbers of files between the local
file system and Blob storage. I'm not sure how to implement this feature in
a browser hosted app.

I wrote a WPF tool for "managers" which does high-performance bulk uploads
and downloads with nice progress (the code is trivial on the desktop), but
now they want the same feature for "normal" users in the Blazor app. Given
how dumb and restricted browser hosted apps are, I don't know how to code
this, or if it's even feasible.

Are there some tools, techniques or tricks I can apply? Any ideas or
suggestions anyone?

Thanks,
*Greg Keogh*
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Re: Conditional builds of arbitrary files

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> Look at VS Text Templates, or we sometimes make use the C-preprocessor.
>

Bingo! I'm a big fan of T4 templates and have used them in anger in many
projects ... but I didn't think of using them in this case. I just did a
sanity check and it works. Thankfully someone published an example of how
to get the active configuration value inside the tt file (in brief).

<#@ template debug="false" hostspecific="true" language="C#" #>
<#@ assembly name="System.Core" #>
<#@ assembly name="EnvDTE" #>
<#@ import namespace="System" #>
<#@ import namespace="EnvDTE" #>
<#@ output extension=".html" #>
<#
var serviceProvider = Host as IServiceProvider;
var dte = serviceProvider.GetService(typeof(DTE)) as DTE;
var configName = dte.Solution.SolutionBuild.ActiveConfiguration.Name;
#>
 ... (etc)

With the config value I can now <# if #> control the contents of the html
file. It looks a bit strange in the VS solution tree, but so what, it works.

There is one quirk ... the T4 generator does not run automatically when the
configuration changes or when you build or publish, so I must remember to
Alt+B+4 as needed.

Thanks,
*Greg*

P.S. If I see you at DDD I'll shout you a drink as thanks.


>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Tuesday, December 5, 2023 11:59 AM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* Conditional builds of arbitrary files
>
>
>
> Folks, the MSBuild process provides Condition= and #if to provide lots of
> control over which files and code fragments are compiled and published for
> a given Configuration.
>
>
>
> My projects contain increasing numbers of non-cs files like html, css, js,
> txt, etc which often need conditional processing, especially the equivalent
> of a #if to select fragments of those sorts of files for different
> configurations. There's no way to select fragments of arbitrary files with
> a #if, so I've been wondering for years about the best way to simulate the
> feature.
>
>
>
> I can't find any tools to do this, so I *think* that a custom MSBuild
> Task might be the way to go. The task could be given some parameters and it
> would edit the files and add and remove sections based upon the
> configuration before the build starts.
>
>
>
> Does anyone think that's a good idea? Or maybe there's a better way.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> *Greg Keogh*
>
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Conditional builds of arbitrary files

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, the MSBuild process provides Condition= and #if to provide lots of
control over which files and code fragments are compiled and published for
a given Configuration.

My projects contain increasing numbers of non-cs files like html, css, js,
txt, etc which often need conditional processing, especially the equivalent
of a #if to select fragments of those sorts of files for different
configurations. There's no way to select fragments of arbitrary files with
a #if, so I've been wondering for years about the best way to simulate the
feature.

I can't find any tools to do this, so I *think* that a custom MSBuild Task
might be the way to go. The task could be given some parameters and it
would edit the files and add and remove sections based upon the
configuration before the build starts.

Does anyone think that's a good idea? Or maybe there's a better way.

Cheers,
*Greg Keogh*
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Re: Blazor css overrides

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> I recall doing something similar in the past but I believe I gave each
> client their own entire css. So app.css by default OR use the client’s css
> if the config value is passed (via querystring or whatever).
>

I was thinking of that as the best choice. If t=company is specified then
I'll insert a link to a complete css file in their storage, falling back to
a local app.css. They have complete control of the styling that way.
EXCEPT... if we invent new styles, which is quite possible, foreign copies
will need to be synchronised, which is fragile. Maybe not the best choice
after all.

I don’t see a problem with using !important if it guarantees it and they do
> it always. If they don’t want to then the alternative above may suit.
>

Articles tell you to never use !important in public shared css files, but
since the customer's overrides are the top of the food chain, then maybe
it's acceptable.


> I’ve never bothered going down the rabbit hole of css to be honest.
>

That's putting it politely. If I bothered to learn all about css then it
would certainly displace other knowledge from my brain that is more
valuable.

*Greg*


>
>
> On Fri, 1 Dec 2023 at 15:53, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Folks, TGIF
>>
>> Our Blazor app has a simple classic shape with a local wwwroot/app.css
>> file containing all the styles for the app. I had to allow people to
>> customise the appearance, and my way of doing that works, but not as
>> smoothly as I hoped and I think someone might be able to suggest a better
>> more elegant technique.
>>
>> If someone starts the app with query parameter ?t=contoso then the
>> startup code appends a line like this into the 
>>
>> https://*somecompany*.
>> blob.core.windows.net/*myapp*/*contoso.css*">
>>
>> They can edit this external css file and override selectors without
>> touching the original app's files. Firstly ... is this sensible? It works,
>> but there is a problem.
>>
>> To override a certain colour they have to code something like this:
>>
>> .HeadLinkSel { background-color: BlueViolet !important; }
>>
>> Note how the !important is needed, sometimes. I can't figure out why
>> yet, but !important needs to be added to the overrides most of the time. I
>> thought that the last selector override all previous identical ones, and
>> it's really irritating and confuses people settings the overrides. Can
>> anyone explain this?
>>
>> Maybe my whole technique is flawed and naïve. I'm keen for suggestions or
>> links to recommended techniques for doing this sort of thing.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> *Greg Keogh*
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Blazor css overrides

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, TGIF

Our Blazor app has a simple classic shape with a local wwwroot/app.css file
containing all the styles for the app. I had to allow people to customise
the appearance, and my way of doing that works, but not as smoothly as I
hoped and I think someone might be able to suggest a better more elegant
technique.

If someone starts the app with query parameter ?t=contoso then the startup
code appends a line like this into the 

https://*somecompany*.
blob.core.windows.net/*myapp*/*contoso.css*">

They can edit this external css file and override selectors without
touching the original app's files. Firstly ... is this sensible? It works,
but there is a problem.

To override a certain colour they have to code something like this:

.HeadLinkSel { background-color: BlueViolet !important; }

Note how the !important is needed, sometimes. I can't figure out why yet,
but !important needs to be added to the overrides most of the time. I
thought that the last selector override all previous identical ones, and
it's really irritating and confuses people settings the overrides. Can
anyone explain this?

Maybe my whole technique is flawed and naïve. I'm keen for suggestions or
links to recommended techniques for doing this sort of thing.

Cheers,
*Greg Keogh*
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[OT] Identifying domain details

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, I'm preparing the paperwork to take some fraudulent plumbers to the
Magistrate's Court for "recovery of civil debt". Background information is
on my web page SCAM - KM Heating & Cooling
<http://www.orthogonal.com.au/specproj/km-heating-cooling.htm>.

As part of the case I'm going to ask if an order can be made to shut down
the matching fraudulent website at kmheatingandcoolingplumbers.com.au and
(hopefully) have the domain registration cancelled.

Can any network boffins in here tell me what identifying whois and similar
domain information can be extracted for me to add to the case?

*Consider replying to my personal email because this is not of further
interest to the group.*

Cheers,
*Greg Keogh*
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Re: Minimal Web API code helper package

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> I think the package you are looking for is Carter
>
>
>
> https://www.nuget.org/packages/Carter
>
> https://github.com/CarterCommunity/Carter
>

Folks, some quick feedback. Carter wasn't quite as attractive as I guessed.
It adds too much of what I call "magic plumbing" and lots of fluent methods
for validation and authorisation that weren't of much use for me. I didn't
want to get married to another framework without a good reason, so I
skipped it and moved all my endpoint methods into a partial class:

static partial class Program
{
  public static void MapEndpoints(IEndpointRouteBuilder app,
WebApplicationBuilder builder)
  {
app.MapPost(...) { etc }
// etc
  }
}

I call  MapEndpoints(...) during program startup and it separates all that
code into a separate file, and for a good reason ... I use a T4 template to
generate about 1000 lines of repetitive app.mapxxx(...) calls into that
partial file.

*Greg K*
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Re: Minimal Web API code helper package

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> I think the package you are looking for is Carter
>
> https://www.nuget.org/packages/Carter
>
> https://github.com/CarterCommunity/Carter
>

Yes thanks, that looks familiar.

It doesn't look quite as *clever* as I recall, but I'll look into it
anyway. I tried something vaguely similar myself last year, but it's time
to revisit the issue and see how someone else tackled the matter.

*Greg*
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Minimal Web API code helper package

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, a couple of weeks ago I was watching a video where someone used a
NuGet package in a minimal Web API project to change the plumbing slightly
so that it was easier to code the endpoint methods. By default, the
endpoint methods must be strictly coded and it's tricky to break them apart
or make partial methods. The package I saw added some magic to make coding
the endpoints easier, but I can't remember exactly how. I just remember
thinking "that looks handy" and now I can't find it. Any idea what it might
have been?

*Greg Keogh*
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Re: AEC form

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

:-)

Dr Greg Low
Director
SQL Down Under Pty Ltd
Office: 1300SQLSQL (1300775775)
Mobile: +61419201410
About me: https://greglow.me


From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2023 8:51:52 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors 
Subject: Re: AEC form

I didn't think the government was handing IBM any more contracts ...

On Fri, 15 Sept 2023 at 19:39, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
It almost makes sense but there was no visible control on the form saying that. 
And after fixing the captcha error and resubmitting, it just worked. So the 
other one wasn't an error anyway.

Bizarre.

Regards

Greg

Dr Greg Low
Director
SQL Down Under Pty Ltd
Office: 1300SQLSQL (1300775775)
Mobile: +61419201410
About me: https://greglow.me


From: Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2023 7:32:04 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Dr Greg Low mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>>
Subject: AEC form

Whoever develops code for the AEC really needs to take a long hard look at 
themselves. Second error is the Captcha failing even though it didn't ask for 
it in the first place. It wasn't visible on the form.

And I'm not sure what attempt at English the other error is meant to be.

Does anyone review this?

Regards

Greg

Dr Greg Low
Director
SQL Down Under Pty Ltd
Office: 1300SQLSQL (1300775775)
Mobile: +61419201410
About me: https://greglow.me

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Re: AEC form

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

It almost makes sense but there was no visible control on the form saying that. 
And after fixing the captcha error and resubmitting, it just worked. So the 
other one wasn't an error anyway.

Bizarre.

Regards

Greg

Dr Greg Low
Director
SQL Down Under Pty Ltd
Office: 1300SQLSQL (1300775775)
Mobile: +61419201410
About me: https://greglow.me


From: Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2023 7:32:04 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Dr Greg Low 
Subject: AEC form

Whoever develops code for the AEC really needs to take a long hard look at 
themselves. Second error is the Captcha failing even though it didn't ask for 
it in the first place. It wasn't visible on the form.

And I'm not sure what attempt at English the other error is meant to be.

Does anyone review this?

Regards

Greg

Dr Greg Low
Director
SQL Down Under Pty Ltd
Office: 1300SQLSQL (1300775775)
Mobile: +61419201410
About me: https://greglow.me

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RE: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Thanks David. I’ve got a meeting today with a guy who’s the Principal Software 
Engineering Manager for Learn.

I’ll see how that goes and report back.

I suspect a key issue is that you still can’t have an M365 email address for 
your certification profile and that only MSAs work. If so, that would continue 
to be crazy stuff, and should have been resolved long ago.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Kean 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 11:02 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors ; Dr Greg Low 
Subject: RE: Blazor popularity and use

Greg can you forward me some context? Can’t promise anything, but I probably 
have a better chance of landing on the right person’s desk.

From: Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 2:24 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: David Connors mailto:da...@connors.com>>; Greg Low 
mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>>
Subject: RE: Blazor popularity and use

Agreed, but being one of the people who periodically need to consume many 
Microsoft internal apps and web sites, I will just have to differ on how 
effective I find them I’ve been so frustrated by some of the ones I need to 
use, that I’ve volunteered to help fix them. It would be quicker for me to fix 
the app for them, than to need to interact with it.

But it’s Friday so:

My biggest issues are still around identity. I’m having yet another week 
struggling to work out how to sort out issues with Microsoft identities. I do 
not understand why this needs to be so hard.

I’ve dealt with Amazon for a very long time. To this day, I still use the same 
identity I created when I first used them, and it works for all services that I 
purchase from them.
Same with Google. Same with Apple, etc.

But with Microsoft, I’ve been pushed into needing a string of identities over 
the years, with incompatible identity systems, incompatible Microsoft service 
requirements for identity, etc.

Why does this have to continue?

And the support for this in many areas has moved to forum-based support that is 
extremely poor. Here’s a fine example of “support” that I received yesterday:


[cid:image001.png@01D9E30B.B6BC9D20]

I’ve been trying to work out if that’s the worst “support” response I’ve ever 
received.

So, I then guessed that I needed to contact MCP support, instead of MCT support 
(as clearly they don’t have a clue, even though they are closely associated), 
and today I woke up to:

A moderator has deleted a thread you were following, How do I change my email 
address on my certification profile?. It's possible that the thread was off 
topic, violated the Code of Conduct, or was just a duplicate thread.


I have no idea what the issue was as they’d already deleted the thread. It 
might be because I’m asking how to change the email address, and they assume 
that’s a duplicate. But I can’t find any previous discussion now, apart from 
changing it via the Learn profile, which clearly doesn’t work.

I don’t get why there isn’t some Microsoft VP screaming at people to fix it. I 
know I want to, and I’m a calm person.

It’s gone on way too long.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:55 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: David Connors mailto:da...@connors.com>>
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:44, Dr Greg Low 
mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>> wrote:
Yep, we talk about browsers like there’s consistency there. There still isn’t. 
And it’s a huge hit on productivity. I see so much lost effort trying to align 
pixels across different browsers, different versions of browsers, etc. It’s 
just silly.

I remember being on a web app project. I was doing the data bits, and there 
were 10 devs doing the web parts.

After 6 months, I looked at what the other 10 had produced and knew I could 
have built that myself in a winform app in a fortnight, by myself.

This is probably more down to approach. If they were building from scratch by 
themselves, then I agree, productivity will be terrible; however on the flip 
side, you have to remember that 80+% of the cost of software is after the code 
is written and in the support phase. For our internal apps, we use a commercial 
off the shelf theme and a couple of other components and stick with those. The 
consistency of UI layout, responsiveness across form factors etc is all done 
very cost effectively by using something like: 
https://angular-material.fusetheme.com/dashboards/project - best $700 you'll 
ever spe

RE: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Yep, but the request that I raised was closed overnight.
A moderator has deleted a thread you were following, How do I change my email 
address on my certification profile?. It's possible that the thread was off 
topic, violated the Code of Conduct, or was just a duplicate thread.
Now they might think that’s a duplicate question, and it would be, if there was 
any way to see the outcome from other people who asked the same question. But 
every time, they take it off to a private discussion, and don’t report back on 
what was required.

So duplicate or not, any previous thread isn’t helpful. Apart from that, I 
really don’t understand why they would have deleted it. I did have one that I 
asked the MCT support people, instead of the MCP support people, but they made 
it clear, they have no clue on how to help. So that can’t be a duplicate either.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tony Wright 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 2:38 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors ; Dr Greg Low 
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

Hi Greg, you need to raise a generic request for a fix to your mcid on the 
certifications forum. I am dealing with it right now, and they are switching 
email addresses for me. After I raised the issue, they opened up a private 
message to get private info about my accounts. It's pretty much a 3 day process.
On Fri, 8 Sep 2023, 2:30 pm Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Agreed, but being one of the people who periodically need to consume many 
Microsoft internal apps and web sites, I will just have to differ on how 
effective I find them I’ve been so frustrated by some of the ones I need to 
use, that I’ve volunteered to help fix them. It would be quicker for me to fix 
the app for them, than to need to interact with it.

But it’s Friday so:

My biggest issues are still around identity. I’m having yet another week 
struggling to work out how to sort out issues with Microsoft identities. I do 
not understand why this needs to be so hard.

I’ve dealt with Amazon for a very long time. To this day, I still use the same 
identity I created when I first used them, and it works for all services that I 
purchase from them.
Same with Google. Same with Apple, etc.

But with Microsoft, I’ve been pushed into needing a string of identities over 
the years, with incompatible identity systems, incompatible Microsoft service 
requirements for identity, etc.

Why does this have to continue?

And the support for this in many areas has moved to forum-based support that is 
extremely poor. Here’s a fine example of “support” that I received yesterday:


[cid:image001.png@01D9E25F.6ED9FA90]

I’ve been trying to work out if that’s the worst “support” response I’ve ever 
received.

So, I then guessed that I needed to contact MCP support, instead of MCT support 
(as clearly they don’t have a clue, even though they are closely associated), 
and today I woke up to:

A moderator has deleted a thread you were following, How do I change my email 
address on my certification profile?. It's possible that the thread was off 
topic, violated the Code of Conduct, or was just a duplicate thread.


I have no idea what the issue was as they’d already deleted the thread. It 
might be because I’m asking how to change the email address, and they assume 
that’s a duplicate. But I can’t find any previous discussion now, apart from 
changing it via the Learn profile, which clearly doesn’t work.

I don’t get why there isn’t some Microsoft VP screaming at people to fix it. I 
know I want to, and I’m a calm person.

It’s gone on way too long.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:55 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: David Connors mailto:da...@connors.com>>
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:44, Dr Greg Low 
mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>> wrote:
Yep, we talk about browsers like there’s consistency there. There still isn’t. 
And it’s a huge hit on productivity. I see so much lost effort trying to align 
pixels across different browsers, different versions of browsers, etc. It’s 
just silly.

I remember being on a web app project. I was doing the data bits, and there 
were 10 devs doing the web parts.

After 6 months, I looked at what the other 10 had produced and knew I could 
have built that myself in a winform app in a fortnight, by myself.

This is probably more down to approach. If they were building from scratch by 
themselves, then I agree, productivity will be terrible; however on th

RE: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Agreed, but being one of the people who periodically need to consume many 
Microsoft internal apps and web sites, I will just have to differ on how 
effective I find them I’ve been so frustrated by some of the ones I need to 
use, that I’ve volunteered to help fix them. It would be quicker for me to fix 
the app for them, than to need to interact with it.

But it’s Friday so:

My biggest issues are still around identity. I’m having yet another week 
struggling to work out how to sort out issues with Microsoft identities. I do 
not understand why this needs to be so hard.

I’ve dealt with Amazon for a very long time. To this day, I still use the same 
identity I created when I first used them, and it works for all services that I 
purchase from them.
Same with Google. Same with Apple, etc.

But with Microsoft, I’ve been pushed into needing a string of identities over 
the years, with incompatible identity systems, incompatible Microsoft service 
requirements for identity, etc.

Why does this have to continue?

And the support for this in many areas has moved to forum-based support that is 
extremely poor. Here’s a fine example of “support” that I received yesterday:


[cid:image001.png@01D9E25F.6ED9FA90]

I’ve been trying to work out if that’s the worst “support” response I’ve ever 
received.

So, I then guessed that I needed to contact MCP support, instead of MCT support 
(as clearly they don’t have a clue, even though they are closely associated), 
and today I woke up to:

A moderator has deleted a thread you were following, How do I change my email 
address on my certification profile?. It's possible that the thread was off 
topic, violated the Code of Conduct, or was just a duplicate thread.


I have no idea what the issue was as they’d already deleted the thread. It 
might be because I’m asking how to change the email address, and they assume 
that’s a duplicate. But I can’t find any previous discussion now, apart from 
changing it via the Learn profile, which clearly doesn’t work.

I don’t get why there isn’t some Microsoft VP screaming at people to fix it. I 
know I want to, and I’m a calm person.

It’s gone on way too long.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:55 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors 
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:44, Dr Greg Low 
mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>> wrote:
Yep, we talk about browsers like there’s consistency there. There still isn’t. 
And it’s a huge hit on productivity. I see so much lost effort trying to align 
pixels across different browsers, different versions of browsers, etc. It’s 
just silly.

I remember being on a web app project. I was doing the data bits, and there 
were 10 devs doing the web parts.

After 6 months, I looked at what the other 10 had produced and knew I could 
have built that myself in a winform app in a fortnight, by myself.

This is probably more down to approach. If they were building from scratch by 
themselves, then I agree, productivity will be terrible; however on the flip 
side, you have to remember that 80+% of the cost of software is after the code 
is written and in the support phase. For our internal apps, we use a commercial 
off the shelf theme and a couple of other components and stick with those. The 
consistency of UI layout, responsiveness across form factors etc is all done 
very cost effectively by using something like: 
https://angular-material.fusetheme.com/dashboards/project - best $700 you'll 
ever spend.

If ease of development was our primary concern we would all be building 
Microsoft Access apps.

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RE: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]



Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:54 PM
To: Dr Greg Low 
Cc: ozDotNet ; David Connors 
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

I'm glad I'm not the only grumpy old fart in here! -- GK

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:44, Dr Greg Low 
mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>> wrote:
Yep, we talk about browsers like there’s consistency there. There still isn’t. 
And it’s a huge hit on productivity. I see so much lost effort trying to align 
pixels across different browsers, different versions of browsers, etc. It’s 
just silly.

I remember being on a web app project. I was doing the data bits, and there 
were 10 devs doing the web parts.

After 6 months, I looked at what the other 10 had produced and knew I could 
have built that myself in a winform app in a fortnight, by myself.

But, no, they didn’t have to deal with “DLL-hell” from the thick clients.

Yet now, every time I open a VS project that I haven’t touched for a few 
months, I totally cringe. Instead of DLL-hell on deployment, I now usually have 
“dependency-hell” with multiple inconsistent updates to dependent frameworks. 
Sometimes I can’t even work out how to resolve it and must reimplement part of 
the code.

What we as an industry have done to productivity is tragic.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:30 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: David Connors mailto:da...@connors.com>>; Greg Keogh 
mailto:gfke...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

Sure, deploying a web app to a server is easier than distributing thick client 
updates to many recipients, but that's a lucky side-effect. I stand by my claim 
that the web browser is a woefully inadequate host for business applications. I 
even have an example from today ...

A Blazor app version update was published, with some small fixes and UI tweaks 
which required css changes. I get a report that some clients are seeing parts 
of the page squashed or the text is ugly mixed sizes. After some back-and-forth 
with suggested quick fixes, the only fix was to clear the browser cache and 
restart the browser, which is really irritating for non-technical clients. I'm 
sure there are ways around this problem, with special meta tags or similar 
tricks, but it's more hoops to jump through and a good example of just how 
crappy the web browser is for business use.

 -- Greg

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:08, David Connors via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:


On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 12:06, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote
I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET<http://ASP.NET>, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all 
finish-up rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web 
browser is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to present 
serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web browser was 
invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of cats and porn, 
it's barely evolved since then and it's completely inadequate for rendering 
business applications. Sure it can, but look at the flaming hoops and all the 
weird quirks you have to jump through. Web development is in a lamentable state.

You have a short memory of what it was like deploying apps back when thick 
clients were the only option. Modern web has done more to streamline ops than 
anything else and reduced application deployment to pushing code to an app 
service and end-user deployment to pasting a link in an e-mail or IM.


--
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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
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Re: Blazor popularity and use

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

I'm glad I'm not the only grumpy old fart in here! -- *GK*

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:44, Dr Greg Low  wrote:

> Yep, we talk about browsers like there’s consistency there. There still
> isn’t. And it’s a huge hit on productivity. I see so much lost effort
> trying to align pixels across different browsers, different versions of
> browsers, etc. It’s just silly.
>
>
>
> I remember being on a web app project. I was doing the data bits, and
> there were 10 devs doing the web parts.
>
>
>
> After 6 months, I looked at what the other 10 had produced and knew I
> could have built that myself in a winform app in a fortnight, by myself.
>
>
>
> But, no, they didn’t have to deal with “DLL-hell” from the thick clients.
>
>
>
> Yet now, every time I open a VS project that I haven’t touched for a few
> months, I totally cringe. Instead of DLL-hell on deployment, I now usually
> have “dependency-hell” with multiple inconsistent updates to dependent
> frameworks. Sometimes I can’t even work out how to resolve it and must
> reimplement part of the code.
>
>
>
> What we as an industry have done to productivity is tragic.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com | About Greg:
> https://about.me/greg.low
>
>
>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Friday, September 8, 2023 1:30 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* David Connors ; Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* Re: Blazor popularity and use
>
>
>
> Sure, deploying a web app to a server is easier than distributing thick
> client updates to many recipients, but that's a lucky side-effect. I stand
> by my claim that the web browser is a woefully inadequate host for business
> applications. I even have an example from today ...
>
>
>
> A Blazor app version update was published, with some small fixes and UI
> tweaks which required css changes. I get a report that some clients are
> seeing parts of the page squashed or the text is ugly mixed sizes. After
> some back-and-forth with suggested quick fixes, the only fix was to clear
> the browser cache and restart the browser, which is really irritating for
> non-technical clients. I'm sure there are ways around this problem, with
> special meta tags or similar tricks, but it's more hoops to jump through
> and a good example of just how crappy the web browser is for business use.
>
>
>
>  -- *Greg*
>
>
>
> On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:08, David Connors via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 12:06, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote
>
> I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all finish-up
> rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web browser
> is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to present
> serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web browser was
> invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of cats and porn,
> it's barely evolved since then and it's completely inadequate for rendering
> business applications. Sure it can, but look at the flaming hoops and all
> the weird quirks you have to jump through. Web development is in a
> lamentable state.
>
>
>
> You have a short memory of what it was like deploying apps back when thick
> clients were the only option. Modern web has done more to streamline ops
> than anything else and reduced application deployment to pushing code to an
> app service and end-user deployment to pasting a link in an e-mail or IM.
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
>
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

RE: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Yep, we talk about browsers like there’s consistency there. There still isn’t. 
And it’s a huge hit on productivity. I see so much lost effort trying to align 
pixels across different browsers, different versions of browsers, etc. It’s 
just silly.

I remember being on a web app project. I was doing the data bits, and there 
were 10 devs doing the web parts.

After 6 months, I looked at what the other 10 had produced and knew I could 
have built that myself in a winform app in a fortnight, by myself.

But, no, they didn’t have to deal with “DLL-hell” from the thick clients.

Yet now, every time I open a VS project that I haven’t touched for a few 
months, I totally cringe. Instead of DLL-hell on deployment, I now usually have 
“dependency-hell” with multiple inconsistent updates to dependent frameworks. 
Sometimes I can’t even work out how to resolve it and must reimplement part of 
the code.

What we as an industry have done to productivity is tragic.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:30 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors ; Greg Keogh 
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use

Sure, deploying a web app to a server is easier than distributing thick client 
updates to many recipients, but that's a lucky side-effect. I stand by my claim 
that the web browser is a woefully inadequate host for business applications. I 
even have an example from today ...

A Blazor app version update was published, with some small fixes and UI tweaks 
which required css changes. I get a report that some clients are seeing parts 
of the page squashed or the text is ugly mixed sizes. After some back-and-forth 
with suggested quick fixes, the only fix was to clear the browser cache and 
restart the browser, which is really irritating for non-technical clients. I'm 
sure there are ways around this problem, with special meta tags or similar 
tricks, but it's more hoops to jump through and a good example of just how 
crappy the web browser is for business use.

 -- Greg

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:08, David Connors via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:


On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 12:06, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote
I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET<http://ASP.NET>, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all 
finish-up rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web 
browser is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to present 
serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web browser was 
invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of cats and porn, 
it's barely evolved since then and it's completely inadequate for rendering 
business applications. Sure it can, but look at the flaming hoops and all the 
weird quirks you have to jump through. Web development is in a lamentable state.

You have a short memory of what it was like deploying apps back when thick 
clients were the only option. Modern web has done more to streamline ops than 
anything else and reduced application deployment to pushing code to an app 
service and end-user deployment to pasting a link in an e-mail or IM.


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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
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RE: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

It was always about the IT people though, not the users.

Outlook as a web app is a good example. It has had enormous funds spent on 
producing it, likely far more than pretty much any other web app.

But shown the web app and the desktop app, users pick the desktop one pretty 
much every time.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 1:00 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors 
Subject: Re: Blazor popularity and use



On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 12:06, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote
I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET<http://ASP.NET>, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all 
finish-up rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web 
browser is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to present 
serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web browser was 
invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of cats and porn, 
it's barely evolved since then and it's completely inadequate for rendering 
business applications. Sure it can, but look at the flaming hoops and all the 
weird quirks you have to jump through. Web development is in a lamentable state.

You have a short memory of what it was like deploying apps back when thick 
clients were the only option. Modern web has done more to streamline ops than 
anything else and reduced application deployment to pushing code to an app 
service and end-user deployment to pasting a link in an e-mail or IM.


-- 
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Re: Blazor popularity and use

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Sure, deploying a web app to a server is easier than distributing thick
client updates to many recipients, but that's a lucky side-effect. I stand
by my claim that the web browser is a woefully inadequate host for business
applications. I even have an example from today ...

A Blazor app version update was published, with some small fixes and UI
tweaks which required css changes. I get a report that some clients are
seeing parts of the page squashed or the text is ugly mixed sizes. After
some back-and-forth with suggested quick fixes, the only fix was to clear
the browser cache and restart the browser, which is really irritating for
non-technical clients. I'm sure there are ways around this problem, with
special meta tags or similar tricks, but it's more hoops to jump through
and a good example of just how crappy the web browser is for business use.

 -- *Greg*

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 13:08, David Connors via ozdotnet <
ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 12:06, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote
>
>> I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all
>> finish-up rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web
>> browser is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to
>> present serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web
>> browser was invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of
>> cats and porn, it's barely evolved since then and it's completely
>> inadequate for rendering business applications. Sure it can, but look at
>> the flaming hoops and all the weird quirks you have to jump through. Web
>> development is in a lamentable state.
>>
>
> You have a short memory of what it was like deploying apps back when thick
> clients were the only option. Modern web has done more to streamline ops
> than anything else and reduced application deployment to pushing code to an
> app service and end-user deployment to pasting a link in an e-mail or IM.
>
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
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Re: Blazor popularity and use

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

If demand *for SSW* to use Blazor is overtaking JS, then I'd believe it. I
saw the statement made.

I've never met a living person who uses Flutter, or the Dart language for
that matter. It would be a brave decision to choose that as a development
platform for the future.

Does MAUI generate browser hosted web apps? I didn't think it was made for
that purpose, but maybe it does. I haven't looked yet.

If you don't want to use a JavaScript framework, then Webassembly is the
future. I see there is a proposal to take JavaScript out of the stack so
that Wasm can talk directly to the browser DOM, which I think would be a
great leap forward because the JS layer is an utterly useless link in the
chain. Then we can finally consign JavaScript to the rubbish bin of history
where it belongs.

*GK*

On Fri, 8 Sept 2023 at 12:47, Tony Wright via ozdotnet <
ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> I agree. React demand is far higher than any other front end framework as
> far as I can see. Angular ticks all the corporate governance boxes but it
> is so unwieldy and requires so much boilerplate before getting to the
> business logic it has really lost the war. Most of it comes down to
> popularity. If something it discovered that it fast superior to everything
> else, you usually see it rocket up the list. Blazor doesn't seem to be
> doing that unfortunately. Vue should be more popular. NodeJs if you want a
> pure JavaScript approach. But if you don't want a JavaScript framework what
> choices do you have? .Net Maui? Flutter?
>
> On Fri, 8 Sep 2023, 12:31 pm DotNet Dude via ozdotnet, <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> I find it very hard to believe Blazor demand has overtaken JS. That’s an
>> insane comment from Adam
>>
>> On Fri, 8 Sep 2023 at 12:05, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Is anyone here actively using Blazor on a decent sized project? I used
>>>> it for a while on my last contract but am unable to find new work anywhere
>>>> that uses Blazor, not a single one!
>>>
>>>
>>> Compared to server-side ASP.NET and JS Frameworks, Blazor is a gift
>>> from heaven .. well ... sort-of. Here's a Friday story.
>>>
>>> With the death of Silverlight, we had to replace an app with a quite
>>> rich UI with something else, what?! Like many people, I was spitting chips
>>> angry at the suggestion we must replace our Silverlight apps with HTML5
>>> apps. The idea that HTML+CSS+JS could replace a WPF-like rich web UI made
>>> me laugh and cry at the same time.
>>>
>>> Angular was really popular around 2018 so we got an offer to write a JS
>>> replacement for $200/hr. I then decided to learn Angular and watched 5
>>> hours of a 10 hour Angular course, at which point I gave up and said f**k
>>> that s**t. Now what?
>>>
>>> Luckily, Blazor 0.9 was in preview around this time. I spent a whole
>>> Sunday afternoon experimenting with Blazor. By the end of the day I had
>>> quite a sophisticated hobby app working with only a few hundred lines of
>>> coding, thanks to the familiarity of using VS, C# and Razor markup (with a
>>> bit of JS). The same app in ASP.NET would have taken 5 times as long
>>> and 5 times the code. The same app in Angular would have required
>>> unfamiliar tooling and millions of lines of script.
>>>
>>> To answer your question, I have one quite complex Blazor app being used
>>> by some huge US companies to analyse marketing data (using Telerik and
>>> SpreadJS components to attempt to make charts and grids as fancy as was
>>> possible in Silverlight). I have a couple of smaller apps in live use, and
>>> few little ones for utility use.
>>>
>>> I know the guys at Melbourne App Development
>>> <https://melbourneappdevelopment.com/> are really keen on Blazor and
>>> were using it for some serious apps just as it reached version 1.0. About
>>> 18 months ago, Adam Cogan at SSW said during the preamble to one of their
>>> monthly presentations, that Blazor demand had overtaken JS.
>>>
>>> I hope other people in here have similar stories.
>>>
>>> I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all
>>> finish-up rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web
>>> browser is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to
>>> present serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web
>>> browser was invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of
>>> cats and porn, it's barely evolved since then and it's

Re: Blazor popularity and use

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> Is anyone here actively using Blazor on a decent sized project? I used it
> for a while on my last contract but am unable to find new work anywhere
> that uses Blazor, not a single one!


Compared to server-side ASP.NET and JS Frameworks, Blazor is a gift from
heaven .. well ... sort-of. Here's a Friday story.

With the death of Silverlight, we had to replace an app with a quite rich
UI with something else, what?! Like many people, I was spitting chips angry
at the suggestion we must replace our Silverlight apps with HTML5 apps. The
idea that HTML+CSS+JS could replace a WPF-like rich web UI made me laugh
and cry at the same time.

Angular was really popular around 2018 so we got an offer to write a JS
replacement for $200/hr. I then decided to learn Angular and watched 5
hours of a 10 hour Angular course, at which point I gave up and said f**k
that s**t. Now what?

Luckily, Blazor 0.9 was in preview around this time. I spent a whole Sunday
afternoon experimenting with Blazor. By the end of the day I had quite a
sophisticated hobby app working with only a few hundred lines of coding,
thanks to the familiarity of using VS, C# and Razor markup (with a bit of
JS). The same app in ASP.NET would have taken 5 times as long and 5 times
the code. The same app in Angular would have required unfamiliar tooling
and millions of lines of script.

To answer your question, I have one quite complex Blazor app being used by
some huge US companies to analyse marketing data (using Telerik and
SpreadJS components to attempt to make charts and grids as fancy as was
possible in Silverlight). I have a couple of smaller apps in live use, and
few little ones for utility use.

I know the guys at Melbourne App Development
<https://melbourneappdevelopment.com/> are really keen on Blazor and were
using it for some serious apps just as it reached version 1.0. About 18
months ago, Adam Cogan at SSW said during the preamble to one of their
monthly presentations, that Blazor demand had overtaken JS.

I hope other people in here have similar stories.

I must end on a sad note. ASP.NET, Blazor, JS, or whatever, all finish-up
rendering in a web browser. It's tragic that the ancient dumb web browser
is now the only host for web apps, and that we must attempt to present
serious business applications using HTML, CSS and JS. The web browser was
invented so we could have flame wars and look at pictures of cats and porn,
it's barely evolved since then and it's completely inadequate for rendering
business applications. Sure it can, but look at the flaming hoops and all
the weird quirks you have to jump through. Web development is in a
lamentable state.

*Greg Keogh*
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Re: Blazor popularity and use

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Yes several clients doing so. Will report back if they need anyone.

Get Outlook for iOS

From: Tom Rutter via ozdotnet 
Sent: Friday, September 8, 2023 11:13:58 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom Rutter 
Subject: Blazor popularity and use

Is anyone here actively using Blazor on a decent sized project? I used it for a 
while on my last contract but am unable to find new work anywhere that uses 
Blazor, not a single one!

Thoughts?

Tom
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Re: A real C++ vs C# story

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> I have never understood the fixation with C++ unless you're in the
> business of writing kernels, device drivers, embedded systems, etc.
>

The library we're phasing out was started around 1997, so you can throw the
authors a bone because the world was very different back then. Your main
choices were C/C++, VB and Java.

I stand by my opinion that C++ is the most absurdly complex and idiotic
language in contemporary use. Ooops! I made a judgement.

*GK*


>
> On Fri, 1 Sept 2023 at 08:44, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Folks, it's Friday and I have an anecdote to share before I return to
>> today's coding fiasco. I'll just tell you what happened and try to avoid
>> making judgements, I'll leave that to you.
>>
>> For about 4 years we've had an Azure hosted Web API/service driving a
>> moderately complex Blazor app and some other smaller clients. The service
>> hosted a C++ library that did the heavy lifting of generating
>> cross-tabulation reports. The trouble was, that the service would randomly
>> crash deep inside the C++ dll and it would leave no useful diagnostic
>> evidence, usually just a hint about some kind of memory access violation.
>> It would never crash in testing, only in Azure. I presume here is a way to
>> diagnose this sort of crash in Azure hosting, but you probably need the
>> minidump and symbol files out of the C++ compile, I'm not exactly sure, as
>> I just couldn't face the toil, and by great luck it was due for replacement
>> anyway. Some very large US companies were suffering from the crash
>> interruptions and there was a serious risk that we could lose their
>> business.
>>
>> The lucky part is that the huge C++ codebase was already being rewritten
>> in C#, so we went into a frenzy of continued conversion and testing, and
>> the C# replacement is now about 90% rolled-out. and guess what?! ... The
>> random crashes are gone and one customer even sent us a message of thanks
>> for the new reliability.
>>
>> We did have a few small unhandled exceptions, but I simply went to the
>> Azure portal logs and the stack trace pointed us straight to the problem
>> point. We could usually publish a fix within half an hour.
>>
>> So years of random C++ crashes were completely cured by a C# rewrite.
>>
>> *Greg K*
>> --
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>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
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A real C++ vs C# story

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, it's Friday and I have an anecdote to share before I return to
today's coding fiasco. I'll just tell you what happened and try to avoid
making judgements, I'll leave that to you.

For about 4 years we've had an Azure hosted Web API/service driving a
moderately complex Blazor app and some other smaller clients. The service
hosted a C++ library that did the heavy lifting of generating
cross-tabulation reports. The trouble was, that the service would randomly
crash deep inside the C++ dll and it would leave no useful diagnostic
evidence, usually just a hint about some kind of memory access violation.
It would never crash in testing, only in Azure. I presume here is a way to
diagnose this sort of crash in Azure hosting, but you probably need the
minidump and symbol files out of the C++ compile, I'm not exactly sure, as
I just couldn't face the toil, and by great luck it was due for replacement
anyway. Some very large US companies were suffering from the crash
interruptions and there was a serious risk that we could lose their
business.

The lucky part is that the huge C++ codebase was already being rewritten in
C#, so we went into a frenzy of continued conversion and testing, and the
C# replacement is now about 90% rolled-out. and guess what?! ... The random
crashes are gone and one customer even sent us a message of thanks for the
new reliability.

We did have a few small unhandled exceptions, but I simply went to the
Azure portal logs and the stack trace pointed us straight to the problem
point. We could usually publish a fix within half an hour.

So years of random C++ crashes were completely cured by a C# rewrite.

*Greg K*
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RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

My favourite was Brisbane’s Go Card. Had a friend driving busses in Brisbane, 
and when it was first released, they had the sensitivity wrong. He’d drive past 
a bus stop, and it would charge everyone standing there, even if they weren’t 
getting on.

It fascinates me that we continue to feel the need to develop these things, 
pretty much from scratch.

As for the "I'll get some mates together and do it for half the price, I fondly 
remember the guy that quoted to paint the Sydney Harbour Bridge with his son. 
Their quote was a fraction of the prevailing cost. Yes, “how hard can it be” 

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2023 11:15 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Maybe we should set up OzDotNet Consultants specializing in government 
contracts? We could be swimming in cash!

Yeah, when I see news about a planned $4bn IT project going ahead, I think 
"I'll get some mates together and do it for half the price".

A replacement MYKI system, no problems. As Homer Simpsons often says, "How hard 
can it be?"

 -- Greg K
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Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> Maybe we should set up OzDotNet Consultants specializing in government
> contracts? We could be swimming in cash!
>

Yeah, when I see news about a planned $4bn IT project going ahead, I think
"I'll get some mates together and do it for half the price".

A replacement MYKI system, no problems. As Homer Simpsons often says, "How
hard can it be?"

 --
*Greg K*
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RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

The ones swimming in cash seem to be the ones doing the current projects, and 
having them stretch out forever.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Burstin via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2023 10:45 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom Rutter ; David Burstin 
Subject: Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Maybe we should set up OzDotNet Consultants specializing in government 
contracts? We could be swimming in cash!

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 at 10:31, Tom Rutter via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
If you want a project to fail the best thing to do is to allow the govt to run 
it

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 at 19:30, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Another one though where the project has many parts, almost all of which were 
to be delivered at the end. The only delivered item is the now orphaned 
Director ID.

Have we learned nothing about delivering projects in the last half century?

Regards

Greg

Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>

From: DotNet Dude via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 7:19:34 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: DotNet Dude mailto:adotnetd...@gmail.com>>

Subject: Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Am hesitant to share much but apparently the sh!t show was due to earlier 
decisions, 2 or so years old. Technically a lot of the work was being delivered 
successfully.

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 at 17:36, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Worse, they were probably drowning in XML schema definitions.
Only one mention of XML in the redacted report, but three mentions of SBR1, so 
that still counts. 

Aha!  That leads to a bit of IT tech talk I can sort-of understand:

The MBR’s starting point for the technology architecture was Foster Moore’s 124 
registry software, Catalyst. Catalyst was selected as the 
commercial-off-the-shelf product for the MBR implementation, following a formal 
approach to market and design validation with Foster Moore. 125 During the 
course of the program, the implementation changed to a later version of 
Catalyst called Verne.

Verne is a cloud-hosted registry product that uses Linux/Unix OS and a document 
database that is suitable for registries. It uses a lesser-known Java-based 
programming language called Groovy. 126 Verne provides out-of-the-box 
functionalities for registration management, client management, content 
management, access management, configuration management, analytics and 
reporting, data provision, account management, communication management, 
document management, API management, and fee and revenue management. The user 
interface framework provides a flexible way to generate XML based APIs.

I've heard of Groovy<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Groovy>, but now I 
see it's a Java-like static or dynamic language. Foster Moore's 
Verne<https://www.fostermoore.com/verne> software is some gigantic 
off-the-shelf corporate registry software product that claims to be highly 
configurable. There's no mention of what back-end database it uses.

Greg K
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Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Another one though where the project has many parts, almost all of which were 
to be delivered at the end. The only delivered item is the now orphaned 
Director ID.

Have we learned nothing about delivering projects in the last half century?

Regards

Greg

Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>

From: DotNet Dude via ozdotnet 
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 7:19:34 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: DotNet Dude 
Subject: Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Am hesitant to share much but apparently the sh!t show was due to earlier 
decisions, 2 or so years old. Technically a lot of the work was being delivered 
successfully.

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 at 17:36, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Worse, they were probably drowning in XML schema definitions.
Only one mention of XML in the redacted report, but three mentions of SBR1, so 
that still counts. 

Aha!  That leads to a bit of IT tech talk I can sort-of understand:

The MBR’s starting point for the technology architecture was Foster Moore’s 124 
registry software, Catalyst. Catalyst was selected as the 
commercial-off-the-shelf product for the MBR implementation, following a formal 
approach to market and design validation with Foster Moore. 125 During the 
course of the program, the implementation changed to a later version of 
Catalyst called Verne.

Verne is a cloud-hosted registry product that uses Linux/Unix OS and a document 
database that is suitable for registries. It uses a lesser-known Java-based 
programming language called Groovy. 126 Verne provides out-of-the-box 
functionalities for registration management, client management, content 
management, access management, configuration management, analytics and 
reporting, data provision, account management, communication management, 
document management, API management, and fee and revenue management. The user 
interface framework provides a flexible way to generate XML based APIs.

I've heard of Groovy<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Groovy>, but now I 
see it's a Java-like static or dynamic language. Foster Moore's 
Verne<https://www.fostermoore.com/verne> software is some gigantic 
off-the-shelf corporate registry software product that claims to be highly 
configurable. There's no mention of what back-end database it uses.

Greg K
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Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> Worse, they were probably drowning in XML schema definitions.
> Only one mention of XML in the redacted report, but three mentions of
> SBR1, so that still counts. 
>

Aha!  That leads to a bit of IT tech talk I can sort-of understand:

The MBR’s starting point for the technology architecture was Foster Moore’s
124 registry software, Catalyst. Catalyst was selected as the
commercial-off-the-shelf product for the MBR implementation, following a
formal approach to market and design validation with Foster Moore. 125
During the course of the program, the implementation changed to a later
version of Catalyst called Verne.

Verne is a cloud-hosted registry product that uses Linux/Unix OS and a
document database that is suitable for registries. It uses a lesser-known
Java-based programming language called Groovy. 126 Verne provides
out-of-the-box functionalities for registration management, client
management, content management, access management, configuration
management, analytics and reporting, data provision, account management,
communication management, document management, API management, and fee and
revenue management. The user interface framework provides a flexible way to
generate XML based APIs.


I've heard of Groovy <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_Groovy>, but now
I see it's a Java-like static or dynamic language. Foster Moore's Verne
<https://www.fostermoore.com/verne> software is some gigantic off-the-shelf
corporate registry software product that claims to be highly configurable.
There's no mention of what back-end database it uses.

*Greg K*
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Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

>
> You can also read the review. It’s available online. Riveting stuff, and
> of course, with lots redacted because we wouldn’t want to name names.
>
>
> https://treasury.gov.au/sites/default/files/2023-08/review-modernising-business-registers-program-report-redacted_0.pdf
>

I can't read 340 pages this afternoon, I have some coding to do!! I did
notice there are 48 impacts in the document, like:

program impacts
adversely impacted
material impact
do not impact
impacted agencies
change impact
severely impacted
market impacts
negative impact
no cash impact
intended impacts
directly impact
clearly impact
economic impact
financial impact

*Greg K*
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Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Couldn't they recruit enough COBOL programmers?

*Greg K*

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 at 16:30, mike smith via ozdotnet 
wrote:

> Here's a non paywalled one
>
>
> https://www.innovationaus.com/burning-12m-a-month-govt-scraps-business-register-overhaul/
>
>
>
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RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

You can also read the review. It’s available online. Riveting stuff, and of 
course, with lots redacted because we wouldn’t want to name names.

https://treasury.gov.au/sites/default/files/2023-08/review-modernising-business-registers-program-report-redacted_0.pdf

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: mike smith via ozdotnet 
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 4:23 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: mike smith 
Subject: Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Here's a non paywalled one

https://www.innovationaus.com/burning-12m-a-month-govt-scraps-business-register-overhaul/



On Tue, 29 Aug 2023, 14:34 Tom Rutter via ozdotnet, 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Another one bites the dust…

https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/bleeding-money-labor-scraps-morrison-business-register-overhaul-20230827-p5dzpa

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RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Sadly true

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 4:08 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors 
Subject: Re: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 at 16:01, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:

[...]

 We just can’t keep doing this.

Oh, yes we can.

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RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

I’ll bet it ends up reminiscent of the local hotel quarantine project. 
Unbelievable amounts spent on it but who authorised it? Apparently, no-one. Yet 
large sums were going out the door, and the “real” details need to remain 
secret.

The Commonwealth Games? A fortune paid to consultants to do the costing, and 
when the price is $6B not $2B, no-one is apparently responsible, and worse, yet 
again, secrecy surrounds most of it.

In Victoria, apparently we spent more on MyKi than NASA spent putting Curiosity 
on Mars, and NASA invented the Sky Crane as part of that project. We got a card 
system that’s already being replaced.

The census debacle looks like a choice of the wrong technology, and wrong 
specifications for testing. But again, no heads roll when it happens.

And so on, and so on.

Apparently for this business register stuff, a primary issue is that the chosen 
platform didn’t go even close to meeting requirements or costs to modify. Yet,  
again, I’ll bet no-one is responsible and wears the cost except the public.

We just can’t keep doing this.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Dr Greg Low
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 3:51 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom Rutter 
Subject: RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

It’s only public money, right?

In the end, who is getting sacked? Who is being sued? Who is bearing direct 
consequences of this, apart from the public?

My guess? No-one.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom Rutter via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 3:02 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Tom Rutter mailto:therut...@gmail.com>>
Subject: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Another one bites the dust…

https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/bleeding-money-labor-scraps-morrison-business-register-overhaul-20230827-p5dzpa

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RE: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

It’s only public money, right?

In the end, who is getting sacked? Who is being sued? Who is bearing direct 
consequences of this, apart from the public?

My guess? No-one.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom Rutter via ozdotnet 
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2023 3:02 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom Rutter 
Subject: [OT] Junked business registry overhaul blew out by $2.3b

Another one bites the dust…

https://www.afr.com/politics/federal/bleeding-money-labor-scraps-morrison-business-register-overhaul-20230827-p5dzpa

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Web app deploy without Visual Studio

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, I have a Blazor app and a Web API that I need to "give" to someone
to install in their own Azure subscription. I have only ever published to
Azure from Visual Studio via right-click and make some publish profiles. In
other cases I would create a Web Setup project and give someone an MSI
file, but I doubt if that's useful for deploying to Azure.

I've been searching and searching, but most results talk about Visual
Studio publish, and a few talk about using DevOps pipelines, but none of
those are suitable because the customer has a personal Azure subscription
that I can't access.

Is there some dotnet command switch to generate some kind of "package"?
Maybe there are other options I haven't stumbled on.

Thanks,
*Greg Keogh*
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Re: SQL Server Performance monitoring [Update]

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks, TGIF and FYI -- some more detailed logging and feedback from office
staff has opened this performance problem can of worms further.

Last Monday my main suspect was SQL Server, but it might be innocent and is
actually a victim. Dozens of SQL timeout exceptions are logged, but they're
all over the place, even in trivial selects of a single row which would
happen in a blink. Office staff report unpredictable "slow-downs" in
different apps. Web app users are suffering random pauses as well, as we
can see them clicking buttons multiple times in frustration (thereby
causing other problems).

So this problem is system wide in an in-house computer centre. A meeting
with the hardware/network support guy revealed many links in the chain.
There are a dozen workstations, several servers, VMs, multiple networks and
routers, two high-speed external internet connections, NAS boxes, terminal
services, Sophos and Anitmalware running, etc. There are so many places to
investigate that we're all a bit befuddled at the moment and are looking
for angles to investigate. I'm only involved in the office apps, who are
probably innocent victims, but I'm in the loop to help if I can.

This reminds of the 80s again on mainframes, but finding performance
problems back then was reasonably straightforward because there weren't so
many parts of the clockwork to examine. These days it's like trying to
debug an atomic clock.


*Greg K*

>
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Re: SQL Server Performance monitoring

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

My finger of suspicion is pointing at SQL because the links are: An ASP.NET
Web Forms at the top -> which calls a Windows Service in the middle ->
which runs the SQL queries at the bottom. Both the app and service are
rather "thin" and have a good track record for the last 15 years, which
leaves the suspect. I did see some SQL timeout exceptions in the service
log.

However, spying on the GC is a good idea anyway. I'll do a practice run to
remember how it works, so when they next report a slow-down I can hop in
and have a look.

*Greg*

On Mon, 31 Jul 2023 at 10:34, David Kean  wrote:

> How confident are you that it’s a SQL query? Unpredictable “stalls” smells
> like garbage collection, likely a Gen2 blocking. A dump during the stall or
> better ETL trace using PerfView will quickly rule that out.
>
>
>
> *From:* Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Monday, July 31, 2023 10:27 AM
> *To:* 'ozDotNet' 
> *Cc:* 'Greg Keogh' ; Greg Low 
> *Subject:* RE: SQL Server Performance monitoring
>
>
>
> Hi Greg,
>
>
>
> The performance trace procedures in SDU Tools have duration as one of the
> summaries provided.
>
>
>
> Duration is a curious one though. In so many cases, it's meaningless, yet
> it's the one that the Microsoft tooling often worries about most.
>
>
>
> For example, if you have a query that executes, and then the client takes
> forever to retrieve the rowset that was produced (e.g. by reading it a row
> at a time and doing other things in between each row), the duration shows
> the entire time. But it could be a very light query.
>
>
>
> In your case though, that might well help, particularly if you find
> queries with long durations, but few pages read. That means that the query
> can't get its work done for some reason. Whenever you have that, it's
> blocked waiting on something else.
>
>
>
> If you can catch it while it's blocked, even Activity Monitor in SSMS can
> show you what's at the head of a blocking chain. sp_whoisactive (from Adam
> Machanic) will do a better job of that again. But that only helps if you
> can catch it while it's happening. That's why tracing usually helps.
>
>
>
> The other thing I've done in the past, if it becomes very hard to find, is
> to just leave a proc running in the background that every 5, 10, or 20
> seconds, finds any process that's at the head of a blocking chain, and
> writes details of it out to a table. That's more work, but it shows clearly
> what the regular culprits are. The "Show Current Blocking" code in SDU
> Tools should provide an example to help get something like that going.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com | About Greg:
> https://about.me/greg.low
>
>
>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Monday, July 31, 2023 10:15 AM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* SQL Server Performance monitoring
>
>
>
> Folks,
>
>
>
> We have a problem on a live server where web users experience occasional
> unpredictable "stalls". There are a few links in the chain where the
> problem could be, but based on some clues in logs, I suspect that it's the
> last link at the bottom of the chain ... SQL Server that's the source of
> the problem.
>
>
>
> But I need evidence. Is there some feature of SQL Server or perhaps some
> tool that can detect queries that are suspiciously long running? This is
> SQL Server full standard edition. I haven't had to poke deeply into SQL
> Server's machinery before, so I'm in unfamiliar territory.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> *Greg Keogh*
>
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

RE: SQL Server Performance monitoring

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Hi Greg,

The performance trace procedures in SDU Tools have duration as one of the 
summaries provided.

Duration is a curious one though. In so many cases, it's meaningless, yet it's 
the one that the Microsoft tooling often worries about most.

For example, if you have a query that executes, and then the client takes 
forever to retrieve the rowset that was produced (e.g. by reading it a row at a 
time and doing other things in between each row), the duration shows the entire 
time. But it could be a very light query.

In your case though, that might well help, particularly if you find queries 
with long durations, but few pages read. That means that the query can't get 
its work done for some reason. Whenever you have that, it's blocked waiting on 
something else.

If you can catch it while it's blocked, even Activity Monitor in SSMS can show 
you what's at the head of a blocking chain. sp_whoisactive (from Adam Machanic) 
will do a better job of that again. But that only helps if you can catch it 
while it's happening. That's why tracing usually helps.

The other thing I've done in the past, if it becomes very hard to find, is to 
just leave a proc running in the background that every 5, 10, or 20 seconds, 
finds any process that's at the head of a blocking chain, and writes details of 
it out to a table. That's more work, but it shows clearly what the regular 
culprits are. The "Show Current Blocking" code in SDU Tools should provide an 
example to help get something like that going.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2023 10:15 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: SQL Server Performance monitoring

Folks,

We have a problem on a live server where web users experience occasional 
unpredictable "stalls". There are a few links in the chain where the problem 
could be, but based on some clues in logs, I suspect that it's the last link at 
the bottom of the chain ... SQL Server that's the source of the problem.

But I need evidence. Is there some feature of SQL Server or perhaps some tool 
that can detect queries that are suspiciously long running? This is SQL Server 
full standard edition. I haven't had to poke deeply into SQL Server's machinery 
before, so I'm in unfamiliar territory.

Cheers,
Greg Keogh
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

SQL Server Performance monitoring

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks,

We have a problem on a live server where web users experience occasional
unpredictable "stalls". There are a few links in the chain where the
problem could be, but based on some clues in logs, I suspect that it's the
last link at the bottom of the chain ... SQL Server that's the source of
the problem.

But I need evidence. Is there some feature of SQL Server or perhaps some
tool that can detect queries that are suspiciously long running? This is
SQL Server full standard edition. I haven't had to poke deeply into SQL
Server's machinery before, so I'm in unfamiliar territory.

Cheers,
*Greg Keogh*
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: [OT] Assign app role in subscription

[Greg Keogh]

>
> In the Select Members panel on the right, it'll show users and groups in
> the list by default, but doesn't show applications. You may just need to
> search for the application service principal by name.
>

This morning I sit down with a freshly booted brain, and I've fixed it.
You're right! ... The list on the right does not list apps, so I started
typing "S u b..." into the search box and my app with that name prefix
appears, and I can give the role okay. Now I'm confused ... did I not
previously start typing into the search box? I can't believe I wouldn't
have tried that in recent days, but maybe during all the fumbling around I
didn't ... I dunno.

I assigned the role Reader to my app, but it died with permission failure
trying to ListKeys (list the storage account keys). It's not obvious which
Role I should use, so I gave-up and made it an Owner role and now it works
(with overkill).

*Greg*

[image: image.png]

[OT] Assign app role in subscription

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, my Azure Portal pages have changed subtly sometime over recent
months and I can no longer find a way of assigning a role to an app. It
tooks hours to figure out how to do this a year ago and I wrote down
instructions for myself, but they don't apply any more due to UI changes.

I have created an App in the AD blade and I have its name, Id and secret. I
want this app to have read access to my subscription so it can enumerate
accounts, containers, etc.

I go to the Subscriptions > IAM > Role Assignments. + Add Role Assignment >
select *Reader* > at this point I expect Select members to offer me my app
for the role, but it never appears in the list on the right.

That's where I've been stuck for days now. I can't give my app the Reader
role to my subscription. Are there any Azure portal boffins who know how to
do this?

Thanks,
*Greg K*

Re: VS2022 format all files

[Greg Keogh]

Bingo! Thanks David, I'll admit that I have neglected the Code Cleanup
feature and it went out of my mind. I have fiddled with it occasionally
over the years but I couldn't get it to work the way I wanted. But this
time I concentrated and:

• Set all the Tools Options C# preferences I want (takes time).
• Saved the .editorconfig file in the solution folder.
• Configure Code Cleanup -- *It's hard to know which Available fixers to
include, because you don't know which specific preferences are inside each
fixer. I noticed that using statements weren't being moved to the outside
and I wasn't getting file-scoped namespaces, so I had to scroll down the
Available list and guess which ones to include. I noticed I needed an
experimental one to remove excess blank lines.*
• Run the cleanup. *I accidentally clicked the main window while the
cleanup was running and it went grey and asked if I wanted to wait for the
app to respond, which it eventually did, but the progress dialog was hidden
and only visible by holding Alt+Tab.*

So overall, after you take time to get everything just right, it works like
a dream. It's hard to know how the .editorconfig file and the VS options
are affecting the process or if they are fighting each other. Maybe the
file takes preference outside VS when using the dotnet format command
(which I haven't tried yet).

I'd love an option to remove blank lines immediately inside method opening
and closing braces so you don't get this:

void Something()
{

WriteLine("I hate the blank lines around this");

}

*Greg K*

On Wed, 12 Apr 2023 at 11:18, David Kean  wrote:

> Both of these options can do this on a per solution, project, document
> basis.
>
>
>
>
> If you want to this via command-line, look at *dotnet format*. These all
> work better if you’ve got a good .editorconfig that calls the style
> <https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/dotnet/fundamentals/code-analysis/code-style-rule-options>.
> You can have IntelliCode automatically generate one based on the project
> via Add -> New Item -> Editor Config (IntelliCode).
>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com
> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 12, 2023 11:03 AM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* VS2022 format all files
>
>
>
> Folks, is there a way to apply commands like *Format Document* and *Remove
> and Sort Usings* to multiple C# files, perhaps all open files or all
> files in the project?
>
>
>
> Web searches suggest it's not possible at the moment. I see an Extension
> for this which looks a bit flakey and I won't try it yet.
>
>
>
> Taking this even further, I occasionally need to "beautify" C# code in
> hundreds of files in projects to fix things like indentation, tabs, usings
> and more fiddly things like removing excess blank lines, putting gaps
> between methods, etc. That is, I want to bring code that is sometimes
> haphazardly formatted back to a vanilla format acceptable to typical
> developers.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> *Greg Keogh*
>

Re: VS2022 format all files

[Greg Keogh]

>
> Resharper?
>

I accidentally used it for one day back in about 2010 and it was a constant
battle of keystrokes and interruptions that drove me bonkers and I'm glad
I've never seen it again. I thought Reshaper was basically redundant now
that recent VS releases have incorporated most of its original features
(vague gossip I've heard). In any case, even if it does have the global
formatting that I desire, I don't want to buy it or install it --
*Greg K*

VS2022 format all files

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, is there a way to apply commands like *Format Document* and *Remove
and Sort Usings* to multiple C# files, perhaps all open files or all files
in the project?

Web searches suggest it's not possible at the moment. I see an Extension
for this which looks a bit flakey and I won't try it yet.

Taking this even further, I occasionally need to "beautify" C# code in
hundreds of files in projects to fix things like indentation, tabs, usings
and more fiddly things like removing excess blank lines, putting gaps
between methods, etc. That is, I want to bring code that is sometimes
haphazardly formatted back to a vanilla format acceptable to typical
developers.

Cheers,
*Greg Keogh*

Postman help please

[Dr Greg Low]

Hi folks,

Anyone a gun on Postman?

I'm trying to debug a file upload.


  *   I create a request that looks like the typical request, including a body 
saying form-data and with a key of file and a value set to File with an 
uploaded file.
  *   I save a 200 response for it.
  *   I choose to mock the collection and create a server.
  *   I start a new request pointing to the mock server, and set the body the 
same way as before.
  *   I send the request.

In the server logs, I see this:

[cid:image001.png@01D95E43.FC7535E0]

The content-length looks about right. The content-type does say 
multipart/form-data, and has a boundary, etc.

But the body is empty.

Is there some trick to getting it to log the body? That's what I'm trying to 
see.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

RE: Replacement for old PictureBox

[Dr Greg Low]

To summarise, I did get the new standard picturebox, etc. working as I needed. 
Thanks to all who tried to help.

Hats off to anyone who finds that current doco useful though. Seems a complete 
mess.

As an example from today, I was super-impressed with the quality of the 
TreeView documentation.

[cid:image001.png@01D95921.AE4412F0]

That’s pretty but pretty much completely useless.

I did click on the ContextMenuStrip link in the middle of the text, and it has 
a bit more but again, it has an auto-generated description, one example that’s 
not great (under a heading of “Examples” – that’s funny), then auto-generated 
lists of properties, methods, and events.

I mean, how could anyone not find that useful? There continues to be a basic 
misconception about the purpose of this documentation. Somewhere it really 
needs to actually be helpful.

What’s concerning is that it’s still at the level that it was in the early 
2000’s.

It’s lucky we have Google and YouTube and helpful souls who describe what 
they’ve learned the hard way.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tony McGee via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 16 March 2023 12:32 PM
To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com
Cc: Tony McGee 
Subject: Re: Replacement for old PictureBox

Hi Greg,

The WinForms PictureBox control is pretty basic, it's mostly designed for 
displaying images, not really for drawing.
In the distant past I've used Leadtools Imaging Pro for a WinForms document 
management project that required annotation, but that can get expensive if your 
needs are basic and looking towards the future I can't quite tell what their 
.NET 7+ story is anymore.
These days it might be worth looking into SkiaSharp canvas drawing, and there 
are also some PDF export samples in the github repository.

cheers,
Tony


On 16/03/2023 09:45, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet wrote:
Hi Everyone,

I’m migrating an old VB6 app to .NET. It used a PictureBox control and of 
course that had all sorts of options for drawing all over it.

In the end, it was used to generate JPG images that were printed.

I’d really prefer to use PDF as output anyway.

Does anyone have a favourite control that presents a drawable surface that you 
can output as a PDF? (Or ideally as a JPG as well?)

I get the impression that the .NET version of the PictureBox is way different, 
although it does seem to expose a Graphics object that you can then draw on. Is 
it better to stick with the standard .NET control and work out how to migrate 
the code?

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

RE: Replacement for old PictureBox

[Dr Greg Low]

Thanks Greg.

I do wonder how I’ll push it into a PDF later but I’m trying the drawing part 
first.

Not sure what I did in a past life to end up doing this at present 

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 16 March 2023 1:17 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Re: Replacement for old PictureBox

Dr L,

About 15 years ago I recall drawing to Windows Forms Bitmap then drawing 
(blt-ing) it into a PictureBox. A timer would draw many times per second to 
create a primitive but acceptable animation. I can't find the code now.

I'd construct a Bitmap, then g = bmp.CreateGraphics() and use the various 
Graphics methods to set pixels, draw rectangles, etc. Then g.DrawImageUnscaled 
into the PictureBox.

The C# classes are clearly thin wrappers over GDI+ and the C# code looks a bit 
like C++ code from the 1990s. If you have VB6 code that "draws", then maybe a 
translation to GDI calls would be easy (?!).

I haven't used Skia, but some friends like it in Xamarin apps.

Greg K

Re: Replacement for old PictureBox

[Greg Keogh]

Dr L,

About 15 years ago I recall drawing to Windows Forms Bitmap then
drawing (blt-ing) it into a PictureBox. A timer would draw many times per
second to create a primitive but acceptable animation. I can't find the
code now.

I'd construct a Bitmap, then g = bmp.CreateGraphics() and use the various
Graphics methods to set pixels, draw rectangles, etc. Then
g.DrawImageUnscaled into the PictureBox.

The C# classes are clearly thin wrappers over GDI+ and the C# code looks a
bit like C++ code from the 1990s. If you have VB6 code that "draws", then
maybe a translation to GDI calls would be easy (?!).

I haven't used Skia, but some friends like it in Xamarin apps.

*Greg K*

RE: Replacement for old PictureBox

[Dr Greg Low]

Hi Tony,

Thanks so much for the pointer to SkiaSharp. That certainly looks interesting.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tony McGee via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 16 March 2023 12:32 PM
To: ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com
Cc: Tony McGee 
Subject: Re: Replacement for old PictureBox

Hi Greg,

The WinForms PictureBox control is pretty basic, it's mostly designed for 
displaying images, not really for drawing.
In the distant past I've used Leadtools Imaging Pro for a WinForms document 
management project that required annotation, but that can get expensive if your 
needs are basic and looking towards the future I can't quite tell what their 
.NET 7+ story is anymore.
These days it might be worth looking into SkiaSharp canvas drawing, and there 
are also some PDF export samples in the github repository.

cheers,
Tony


On 16/03/2023 09:45, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet wrote:
Hi Everyone,

I’m migrating an old VB6 app to .NET. It used a PictureBox control and of 
course that had all sorts of options for drawing all over it.

In the end, it was used to generate JPG images that were printed.

I’d really prefer to use PDF as output anyway.

Does anyone have a favourite control that presents a drawable surface that you 
can output as a PDF? (Or ideally as a JPG as well?)

I get the impression that the .NET version of the PictureBox is way different, 
although it does seem to expose a Graphics object that you can then draw on. Is 
it better to stick with the standard .NET control and work out how to migrate 
the code?

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

Replacement for old PictureBox

[Dr Greg Low]

Hi Everyone,

I'm migrating an old VB6 app to .NET. It used a PictureBox control and of 
course that had all sorts of options for drawing all over it.

In the end, it was used to generate JPG images that were printed.

I'd really prefer to use PDF as output anyway.

Does anyone have a favourite control that presents a drawable surface that you 
can output as a PDF? (Or ideally as a JPG as well?)

I get the impression that the .NET version of the PictureBox is way different, 
although it does seem to expose a Graphics object that you can then draw on. Is 
it better to stick with the standard .NET control and work out how to migrate 
the code?

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

Re: [OT] "Shrinking" IDs in SQL Server

[Greg Keogh]

>
> Possibly both.  Use the hash for your original table, and setup a
> secondary table with hash as the key, and a zipped file as data.  But you'd
> need to have some provision for the inevitable collisions.
>

A 16 byte (128 bit) hash should be practically safe from collisions. See
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthday_attack (table about half way down)
-- 
*GK*

Re: [OT] "Shrinking" IDs in SQL Server

[Greg Keogh]

Hi Tom, I think this is a maths problem more than a SQL one. Good fun!

At first I thought "just MD5 hash the original string to 16 bytes and store
the 32 hex chars".

Then you said you'd like to convert back, which sank my idea. The only
option left is compression, but I'll bet it would be a miracle if all of
your original strings could be roundtripped via 32 compressed characters.

*Greg K*

RE: [OT] "Shrinking" IDs in SQL Server

[Dr Greg Low]

Hi Tom,

So many questions about what you’re trying to do (sounds really odd), but I 
think the safest for you right now would be to just select the current key and 
the truncated value out into another table while you take a look at them.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom P via ozdotnet 
Sent: Tuesday, 14 March 2023 9:52 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom P 
Subject: [OT] "Shrinking" IDs in SQL Server

Hello

I was hoping some of the SQL experts here could help with a problem I am 
facing. Currently have covid too so perhaps I'm not thinking clearly...

Long story short, is there a way in SQL Server to convert strings (varchars) of 
any length to exactly 32, keeping uniqueness? It would also be nice if I could 
convert them back to ensure I haven't lost information.

Briefly, the reason I want to do this is my target is varchar(32) but the IDs I 
am dealing with are made up of composite business keys of larger length. I need 
to be able to use the current business keys and generate unique 32 character 
equivalents in a deterministic way.

Appreciate any advice.

Thanks
Tom

Blazor update publish problems

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, we have an intermittent serious problem with publishing updates to
our Blazor app. I'm hoping someone knows of tricks or techniques to fix it.

When publishing a new version I delete all files from the vdir beforehand,
then I stop+start the Azure app service in an attempt to force the new
version to be visible. However, on the client-side just about anything can
go wrong. We see stalls, absurd JavaScript errors, 3rd party control
licencing errors, 403 file errors, etc. Any stupid thing that can go wrong
probably will. I know the app release is perfectly valid and passes all
tests, but when deployed it goes randomly up sh*t creek for the end user in
the web browser.

I assume the behaviour of web browsers is to blame and we have limited
control over that. Is there some server or client side configuration or
meta that can help avoid this problem? Or some other technique?

We have some large companies using our app and they're getting very
irritated, so any advice would be most welcome.

Thanks,
*Greg Keogh*

Re: [OT] APNIC charges for historical resources

[Greg Keogh]

Your replies have confirmed the situation. I didn't realise a IPv4
hunt-and-reclaim was going on, and now they've found me, and I can't get
off their radar, and they call the shots, and I'll have to roll over and
give-up the range I used to own. If I don't join and pay then the range
apparently becomes "disabled" from any use. So you have no choice but to
surrender (or just hang on to the dead C block out of spite). If it cost
$15 a year to keep the range then I'd pay (it's not even worth that), but
*$500* !

In any other case I would call this theft and extortion.

*Greg K*

On Wed, 1 Mar 2023 at 13:35, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet 
wrote:

> Yep, the major ISPs ran out of IPv4 space ages ago. I note that I can no
> longer get an v4 IP when using any mobile service that has Telstra
> underneath it. And of course that’s a world of entertainment for systems
> that I need to connect to that have IP v4 allow lists.
>
>
>
> I’m sure they’re mopping up all the class Cs as they can. I’ll bet they
> did the class B and class A ones ages ago.
>
>
>
> In the end, whoever owns the routing at the upper levels gets to call the
> shots.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com | About Greg:
> https://about.me/greg.low
>
>
>
> *From:* David Connors via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 1 March 2023 1:29 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* David Connors 
> *Subject:* Re: [OT] APNIC charges for historical resources
>
>
>
> Greg,
>
>
>
> Historical objects were always free but they made you bring them into a
> paid basis whenever you needed additional IP space or a new AS number or
> something. That happened to us years ago. Once you're on that train you
> can't get off.
>
>
>
> They must be rounding up the stragglers like you. :)
>
>
>
> David.
>
>
>
> On Wed, 1 Mar 2023 at 07:41, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
> Folks, It's almost Friday...
>
>
>
> I just received an email from APNIC to tell me that a class C IP block
> I've owned for 27 years is now under their control and I will be charged
> $500/year to keep this *historical* resource that was created before
> APNIC existed. See Maintenance Fee Change
> <https://help.apnic.net/s/article/historical-fee-change>. Has anyone else
> received a similar notification?
>
>
>
> My thoughts were: this is either kidnapping, extortion or a "protection
> racket", or all three.
>
>
>
> I'm reminded of the 1990s when Melbourne IT were effectively selling the
> dictionary for a minimum ~$135 per domain name, and special words like
> "realestate" or "sales" etc were up for the highest bidder at eye-watering
> prices. Ah, the days of the Internet boom...!
>
>
>
> I'd like to write an official complaint about APNIC's money-grubbing scam
> to someone, but who? The ACCC is a toothless tiger. There is a federal
> ombudsman, but would APNIC be on their radar?
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> *Greg K*
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
>

RE: [OT] APNIC charges for historical resources

[Dr Greg Low]

Yep, the major ISPs ran out of IPv4 space ages ago. I note that I can no longer 
get an v4 IP when using any mobile service that has Telstra underneath it. And 
of course that’s a world of entertainment for systems that I need to connect to 
that have IP v4 allow lists.

I’m sure they’re mopping up all the class Cs as they can. I’ll bet they did the 
class B and class A ones ages ago.

In the end, whoever owns the routing at the upper levels gets to call the shots.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Connors via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, 1 March 2023 1:29 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: David Connors 
Subject: Re: [OT] APNIC charges for historical resources

Greg,

Historical objects were always free but they made you bring them into a paid 
basis whenever you needed additional IP space or a new AS number or something. 
That happened to us years ago. Once you're on that train you can't get off.

They must be rounding up the stragglers like you. :)

David.

On Wed, 1 Mar 2023 at 07:41, Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Folks, It's almost Friday...

I just received an email from APNIC to tell me that a class C IP block I've 
owned for 27 years is now under their control and I will be charged $500/year 
to keep this historical resource that was created before APNIC existed. See 
Maintenance Fee Change<https://help.apnic.net/s/article/historical-fee-change>. 
Has anyone else received a similar notification?

My thoughts were: this is either kidnapping, extortion or a "protection 
racket", or all three.

I'm reminded of the 1990s when Melbourne IT were effectively selling the 
dictionary for a minimum ~$135 per domain name, and special words like 
"realestate" or "sales" etc were up for the highest bidder at eye-watering 
prices. Ah, the days of the Internet boom...!

I'd like to write an official complaint about APNIC's money-grubbing scam to 
someone, but who? The ACCC is a toothless tiger. There is a federal ombudsman, 
but would APNIC be on their radar?

Cheers,
Greg K
--
ozdotnet mailing list
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/

[OT] APNIC charges for historical resources

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, It's almost Friday...

I just received an email from APNIC to tell me that a class C IP block I've
owned for 27 years is now under their control and I will be charged
$500/year to keep this *historical* resource that was created before APNIC
existed. See Maintenance Fee Change
<https://help.apnic.net/s/article/historical-fee-change>. Has anyone else
received a similar notification?

My thoughts were: this is either kidnapping, extortion or a "protection
racket", or all three.

I'm reminded of the 1990s when Melbourne IT were effectively selling the
dictionary for a minimum ~$135 per domain name, and special words like
"realestate" or "sales" etc were up for the highest bidder at eye-watering
prices. Ah, the days of the Internet boom...!

I'd like to write an official complaint about APNIC's money-grubbing scam
to someone, but who? The ACCC is a toothless tiger. There is a federal
ombudsman, but would APNIC be on their radar?

Cheers,
*Greg K*

Reduced Azure console log noise

[Greg Keogh]

Do other people use the Azure portal Log Stream console to watch logging
output from their apps? If so, you might have seen that there's a lot of
"noisy" [Information] messages from Microsoft.AspNetCore.* which I can't
figure out how to disable. It's a terrible burden trying to see my messages
in the clutter.

My appsettings.json is deployed with this:

  "Logging": {
"LogLevel": {
  "Default": "Information",
  "Microsoft.AspNetCore": "Warning"
}
  },

But it makes no difference at all. I've tried various combinations without
success. Maybe I'm using the wrong technique.

Thanks,
*Greg*

Xamarin support policy - Hiding the keyboard

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, while looking for a way to prevent the soft keyboard appearing when
certain edit fields got the focus, I stumbled upon this
<https://dotnet.microsoft.com/en-us/platform/support/policy/xamarin>. It
definitively closes the Xamarin vs MAUI debates.

Xamarin support will end on May 1, 2024 for all Xamarin SDKs. Android 13
and Xcode 14 SDKs (iOS and iPadOS 16, macOS 13) will be the final versions
Xamarin will target.

In the meantime, I'm still stuck finding a simple way of hiding the
keyboard when a page opens and a specific edit field is given focus. The
text will be entered with a barcode scanner, so the soft keyboard is a
useless distraction that covers important information. However, if you tap
the edit field then the keyboard must appear.

Web searches produce no trustworthy answers to try yet, just arguments and
complaints.

*Greg*

Re: [OT] Google font globally

[Greg Keogh]

Experiments reveal (for me) that you only need the @import statement, so in
my site global css file I have this to make 3 Google fonts available:

@import url('
https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Sans=Roboto=Source+Code+Pro=swap'
);

The preconnect statements are optional for a performance boost and I'm not
sure why the link to googleapis is optional as well (it looks important).

*Greg*

On Thu, 29 Dec 2022 at 14:18, Greg Keogh  wrote:

> Folks (anyone working?!)
>
> I've finally decided there are some nice Google web fonts I'd like to use
> (there are far too many nearly identical ones to choose from). The docs
> recommend the following (blue) lines in the html of each page:
>
> 
>   https://fonts.googleapis.com;>
>   https://fonts.gstatic.com; crossorigin>
>   https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Serif=swap;
> rel="stylesheet">
>   
> @import url('
> <a  rel="nofollow" href="https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Serif&display=swap">https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Serif&display=swap</a>');
>   
> 
>
> This is okay for one page, but how can I use a font in the hundreds of
> pages in a site? The problem is factoring out the common statements. The
> preconnect lines are optional and I think they can be ignored. The @import
> can be placed in a global link'd css file. But I don't think the link href
> to the font can be factored out and it would have to be inserted into
> hundreds of pages.
>
> Are there HTML5 boffins here who know of a trick or technique to simply
> apply a Google font globally with minimal editing?
>
> Cheers,
> *Greg K*
>

[OT] Google font globally

[Greg Keogh]

Folks (anyone working?!)

I've finally decided there are some nice Google web fonts I'd like to use
(there are far too many nearly identical ones to choose from). The docs
recommend the following (blue) lines in the html of each page:


  https://fonts.googleapis.com;>
  https://fonts.gstatic.com; crossorigin>
  https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Serif=swap;
rel="stylesheet">
  
@import url('
<a  rel="nofollow" href="https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Serif&display=swap">https://fonts.googleapis.com/css2?family=PT+Serif&display=swap</a>');
  


This is okay for one page, but how can I use a font in the hundreds of
pages in a site? The problem is factoring out the common statements. The
preconnect lines are optional and I think they can be ignored. The @import
can be placed in a global link'd css file. But I don't think the link href
to the font can be factored out and it would have to be inserted into
hundreds of pages.

Are there HTML5 boffins here who know of a trick or technique to simply
apply a Google font globally with minimal editing?

Cheers,
*Greg K*

DataDude.com.au domain name available

[Greg Harris]

Some years ago, I purchased the domain name DataDude.com.au

I was thinking that I would pivot to being more of a data dude

I am never going to use it, I am open to suggestions.


Greg Harris
Harris Consulting Group Pty Ltd
g...@harrisconsultinggroup.com
www.HarrisConsultingGroup.com <http://harrisconsultinggroup.com/home.htm>
phone: (international) +61 407 942 982
phone: (within Australia) 0407 942 982
Sydney
Australia

RE: [OT] Creating logins/users/roles/permissions in Visual Studio sqlproj projects

[Dr Greg Low]

That’s a pity. But you can, as you mention, have post deploy steps that put 
them in place. Ideally though, they’d still come from something like Key Vault 
instead of being in the scripts or in files somewhere.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom P 
Sent: Thursday, 8 December 2022 10:53 AM
To: Dr Greg Low 
Cc: ozDotNet 
Subject: Re: [OT] Creating logins/users/roles/permissions in Visual Studio 
sqlproj projects

Thanks for the advice, Greg.

Unfortunately, the setup is "legacy" using SQL logins and AD auth is not an 
option here. Deployment strategies are currently being investigated but it 
looks like they may be going with the old TFS pipelines. I guess the actual 
logins and assignment to roles would need to be managed separately to the DB 
projects it sounds like.

Regards
Tom

On Thu, 8 Dec 2022 at 10:11, Dr Greg Low 
mailto:g...@sqldownunder.com>> wrote:
Hi Tom,

For roles and permissions, they should just go directly in the DB projects. 
Nothing special about them.

Users/logins are different.

Ideally, you’d have AD or AAD based groups that are added to the roles, and 
again they can go right in the project. If you’re looking after the DB or 
deploying it, you really shouldn’t be getting involved in who is in those 
groups, and there’s nothing more for you to do.

If you have to use SQL logins/users (and you really should now be trying to 
avoid those), you can put them in the projects but you don’t want passwords 
there. It then depends how you are deploying the projects. If it’s something 
like Azure Pipelines or GitHub Actions, then you should put the credentials 
that must be there into Azure Key Vault or similar, and retrieve them from 
there during deployment.

If you are in an environment like Azure, then you should be reassessing why you 
need the SQL logins. If it’s an app connecting to a DB, in many cases, a 
user-assigned managed identity would be a better option.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom P via ozdotnet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Thursday, 8 December 2022 9:58 AM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Tom P mailto:tompbi...@gmail.com>>
Subject: [OT] Creating logins/users/roles/permissions in Visual Studio sqlproj 
projects

Hello

I'm fairly new to Visual Studio sqlproj projects and was wondering what the 
normal practice is for managing database security scripts (user logins, users, 
roles, permissions).

I have seen some other projects here where the previous developers had the 
create login SQL code for example in post-deployment scripts, however, I see 
this being a problem since different environments (different publish profiles 
in the project) would require different logins and different security 
altogether. On top of that I'm not even sure how the passwords would be managed 
in this case as they would need to be hardcoded in the scripts.

In the past I'm sure I've only ever seen the security purely managed by the 
DBAs in external scripts (or manually) and not in the Visual Studio project 
itself.

Any thoughts or recommendations would be much appreciated.

Regards
Tom

RE: [OT] Creating logins/users/roles/permissions in Visual Studio sqlproj projects

[Dr Greg Low]

Hi Tom,

For roles and permissions, they should just go directly in the DB projects. 
Nothing special about them.

Users/logins are different.

Ideally, you’d have AD or AAD based groups that are added to the roles, and 
again they can go right in the project. If you’re looking after the DB or 
deploying it, you really shouldn’t be getting involved in who is in those 
groups, and there’s nothing more for you to do.

If you have to use SQL logins/users (and you really should now be trying to 
avoid those), you can put them in the projects but you don’t want passwords 
there. It then depends how you are deploying the projects. If it’s something 
like Azure Pipelines or GitHub Actions, then you should put the credentials 
that must be there into Azure Key Vault or similar, and retrieve them from 
there during deployment.

If you are in an environment like Azure, then you should be reassessing why you 
need the SQL logins. If it’s an app connecting to a DB, in many cases, a 
user-assigned managed identity would be a better option.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom P via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 8 December 2022 9:58 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom P 
Subject: [OT] Creating logins/users/roles/permissions in Visual Studio sqlproj 
projects

Hello

I'm fairly new to Visual Studio sqlproj projects and was wondering what the 
normal practice is for managing database security scripts (user logins, users, 
roles, permissions).

I have seen some other projects here where the previous developers had the 
create login SQL code for example in post-deployment scripts, however, I see 
this being a problem since different environments (different publish profiles 
in the project) would require different logins and different security 
altogether. On top of that I'm not even sure how the passwords would be managed 
in this case as they would need to be hardcoded in the scripts.

In the past I'm sure I've only ever seen the security purely managed by the 
DBAs in external scripts (or manually) and not in the Visual Studio project 
itself.

Any thoughts or recommendations would be much appreciated.

Regards
Tom

Friday complaint about configuration

[Greg Keogh]

In the .NET Core world most configuration has gone "fluent". The idea is
elegant enough, in that you write an extension method for some basic class
of config options and it joins the other ones that are available (if you
have the right usings). There's a terrible side effect of the lovely fluent
elegance ... I can't find any friggin' option without a Google search. It
just took me 20 minutes fumbling with intellisense and searching to find
this single statement. The option I wanted was obsolete and didn't appear
in intellisense, so I had to F12 into the source and discover it had been
renamed.

builder.Services.Configure(jopts =>
jopts.JsonSerializerOptions.DefaultIgnoreCondition =
JsonIgnoreCondition.WhenWritingNull);

And this is just a simple case. Sometimes the fluency is nested so A => B
=> C.Foo deep that you've got more chance of finding a gold nugget than
finding the option you want.

Here endeth the rant, but I could go all day if you want.

*Greg K*

Re: Visual Studio 2022 cannot add existing project

[Greg Keogh]

>
> I'm even running a repair now, which is pretty desperate (and slow). I
> know it won't work, but I do it anyway, which is a standard 21st century
> software development procedure.
>

The repair actually fixed the problem. I don't know what was wrong and I
don't know what fixed it. With this luck I think I'll buy a lottery ticket.

*Greg*

Visual Studio 2022 cannot add existing project

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, I've had an intermittent problem in previous weeks where adding an
existing csproj to a solution produces the message box:

*The operation could not be completed.*

It was occasional, but today I'm getting the error everywhere. I've made
empty solutions, added A to B and B to A, deleted all the .vs .user and
binary outputs (some searches suggest that), but absolutely nothing works.
Web searches produce no modern useful results.

I'm basically dead in the water. Has anyone else had this and solved it?

I'm even running a repair now, which is pretty desperate (and slow). I know
it won't work, but I do it anyway, which is a standard 21st century
software development procedure.

*Greg Keogh*

RE: [OT] Finding duplicate rows in Sql Server

[Dr Greg Low]

Hi Tom,

Possible example:

DROP TABLE IF EXISTS #TestData;
GO

CREATE TABLE #TestData
(
ID int NOT NULL,
[Name] varchar(20) NOT NULL,
[Description] varchar(30) NOT NULL,
SomeDate date NOT NULL,
Etc varchar(20) NOT NULL
);
GO

INSERT #TestData
(
ID, [Name], [Description], SomeDate, Etc
)
SELECT ID, [Name], [Description], SomeDate, Etc
FROM (VALUES
  (1,'abc','abc abc','20221117','a'),
  (2,'abc','abc abc','20221117','a'),
  (5,'def','def def','20221117','a'),
  (4,'abc','abc abc','20221117','a'),
  (3,'def','def def','20221117','a'),
  (6,'xyz','def def','20221117','a')
 ) AS v(ID, [Name], [Description], SomeDate, Etc);
GO

SELECT * FROM #TestData;

WITH OrderedRows
AS
(
SELECT ID, [Name], [Description], SomeDate, Etc,
   ROW_NUMBER() OVER(PARTITION BY [Name], [Description], SomeDate, Etc 
ORDER BY ID DESC) AS CopyNumber
FROM #TestData
)
SELECT ID, [Name], [Description], SomeDate, Etc
FROM OrderedRows
WHERE CopyNumber > 1
ORDER BY ID;

DROP TABLE IF EXISTS #TestData;

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Tom P via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 17 November 2022 5:01 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Tom P 
Subject: [OT] Finding duplicate rows in Sql Server

Apologies if this is basic for probably most of you but I just can't get my 
head around it.

I have a flat table in sql server which contains lots of duplicates, differing 
only by one column.

Id,Name,Desc,Date,Etc
1,abc,abc abc,2022-11-17,a
2,abc,abc abc,2022-11-17,a
5,def,def def,2022-11-17,a
4,abc,abc abc,2022-11-17,a
3,def,def def,2022-11-17,a
6,xyz,def def,2022-11-17,a

I'm trying to write a query that finds all duplicates excluding the ones with 
the highest Id. So for the above example it would return the following:

Id,Name,Desc,Date,Etc
1,abc,abc abc,2022-11-17,a
2,abc,abc abc,2022-11-17,a
3,def,def def,2022-11-17,a

There are many millions of rows to process so looking for something efficient. 
Any advice would be appreciated.

Regards
Tom

Re: Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

[Greg Keogh]

>
> The SDK itself is fully backwards compatible. Regardless of whether the
> runtime itself is LTS, barring workarounds for bugs there should be no need
> to pin SDKs.
>

I have only pinned once ever, and it was for a known problem in 603(?)
which caused VS web service publish to fail and I had to force the publish
to use 602. Publishing for many years has produced random bizarre failures,
but it looks like 17.4 has fixed that.


>- dotnet command and it said that SDK 6 was needed
>
> Can you remember what you executed?
>

I think it was a web api publish. The output window luckily gave me a clear
message (which I didn't record).

*Greg*

Re: Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

[Greg Keogh]

>
> @Greg Keogh  How did the uninstall of the 6.0 SDK
> break your project? Are you pinning versions via global.json?
>

I just accepted the update and let it run to completion smoothly. A short
time later I ran a dotnet command and it said that SDK 6 was needed. I saw
in Control Panel that only SDK 7 was installed, so I reinstalled 6 and I
was back to normal. Strangely, a colleague did the same thing and didn't
see that happen.

No pinning anywhere. I'll revisit the pros and cons.

*Greg*

Re: Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

[Greg Keogh]

Blazor fix

Update these two packages to 6.0.11, the last of the v6 series.

Include="Microsoft.AspNetCore.Components.WebAssembly" Version="6.0.11" />
Include="Microsoft.AspNetCore.Components.WebAssembly.DevServer" Version="
6.0.11"

You are offered 7.0.0 as the latest, but they will not install in a net60
project. One old project had 6.0.3 and another 6.0.10 which both stalled.


*GK*

>

Re: Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

[Greg Keogh]

>
> One of my dreams is to be able to open a VS project that I haven’t touched
> for 6 months, and have it still just work. Far too frequently, I spend an
> eternity in dependency hell.
>

Yes indeed, you mentioned that a few months ago, and it happened to me a
few days ago. I opened a project archived about last Xmas to compare some
code with its replacement and I received shedloads of errors trying to
compile and run it, I could have spent a solid hour resurrecting it with
tfm or package updates, but I gave up and just browsed the raw files.
Sometimes projects I compiled last Friday won't work this week.

The person who should be taken to the Hague and prosecuted for crimes
against software is Mr Newtonsoft. I wonder if other people here have
burned major parts of their lives away trying to solve Newtonsoft conflicts
and crashes. He's not totally to blame though, because major players have
become dependent on it, which combined with its dodgy versioning system has
created a tangle worse than string theory. I'm glad to see Microsoft is
gradually removing it from their libraries, the worst being Cosmos DB which
keeps dragging it in (but I think it's gone in the latest libraries I'm not
using yet). End of rant.

P.S. I just found that one of my vanilla hobby Blazor apps is also stalling
like the big apps. Now I suspect there is some new global compatibility or
config mismatch issue. The only players are VS2022 and Chrome, so what they
hell has happened to their friendship?!

*GK*

RE: Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

[Dr Greg Low]

One of my dreams is to be able to open a VS project that I haven’t touched for 
6 months, and have it still just work. Far too frequently, I spend an eternity 
in dependency hell.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 10 November 2022 10:34 AM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

Folks, I accepted the major update yesterday, and this morning some odd things 
are happening.

I noticed that .NET SDK 6 was gone and 7 was installed. I had to manually 
reinstall SDK 6 to get going again (this didn't happen to a colleague).

A WebApi project produced a huge slab of NU1106 compile errors. I removed every 
reference of every type and it made no difference. After 2 hours I discovered 
that if I removed one of my own rather innocuous project references then it all 
came good. That reference has been there for the last 6 months.

Now all of my existing Blazor projects stall and produce something like this:

Failed to launch debug adapter.  Additional information may be available in the 
output window.
Unable to launch browser: "Could not open 
ws://localhost:56709/_framework/debug/ws-proxy?browser=wsAFF127.0.0.1A59317FdevtoolsFbrowserF4fe90d5b-f3d4-4f84-950c-2cc9af15b95c"
The program '' has exited with code 4294967295 (0x).

I've now spent 2 hours on this, and it's not looking helpful. A brand new app 
runs okay. I've run out of ideas. I started work at 06:30 but I haven't done 
any real work yet.

Greg Keogh

Visual Studio 17.4.0 side effects

[Greg Keogh]

Folks, I accepted the major update yesterday, and this morning some odd
things are happening.

I noticed that .NET SDK 6 was gone and 7 was installed. I had to manually
reinstall SDK 6 to get going again (this didn't happen to a colleague).

A WebApi project produced a huge slab of NU1106 compile errors. I removed
every reference of every type and it made no difference. After 2 hours I
discovered that if I removed one of my own rather innocuous project
references then it all came good. That reference has been there for the
last 6 months.

Now all of my existing Blazor projects stall and produce something like
this:

Failed to launch debug adapter.  Additional information may be available in
the output window.
Unable to launch browser: "Could not open
ws://localhost:56709/_framework/debug/ws-proxy?browser=wsAFF127.0.0.1A59317FdevtoolsFbrowserF4fe90d5b-f3d4-4f84-950c-2cc9af15b95c"
The program '' has exited with code 4294967295 (0x).

I've now spent 2 hours on this, and it's not looking helpful. A brand new
app runs okay. I've run out of ideas. I started work at 06:30 but I haven't
done any real work yet.

*Greg Keogh*

Fwd: Platform x64 argument

[Greg Keogh]

>
> Do you actually support/ship your app to run on x86-only or ARM
> environments? If not, it probably doesn’t matter and I would probably give
> this one and save the battles for other things.
>

All machines involved everywhere are x64. I will not concede defeat in this
battle!! -- *Greg*

RE: Platform x64 argument

[Dr Greg Low]

Yes, I was wondering the same thing David. I can’t recall the last time I 
worked on a 32 bit machine.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com<https://sqldownunder.com/> | 
About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low

From: David Kean via ozdotnet 
Sent: Thursday, 13 October 2022 3:13 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh ; David Kean 
Subject: RE: Platform x64 argument

Do you actually support/ship your app to run on x86-only or ARM environments? 
If not, it probably doesn’t matter and I would probably give this one and save 
the battles for other things.

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2022 9:46 AM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Greg Keogh mailto:gfke...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Platform x64 argument

Folks, one of my colleagues insists on compiling everything as platform x64 
mainly because he thinks "it's an x64 world and it creates a better 
impression". For a year I've tried to convince him that for managed code that 
it's a complete waste of time. I've told him that ildasm.exe shows that for x64 
and AnyCPU the generated IL and the manifests are identical, I even told him 
that dumpbin.exe shows the only non trivial difference in the PE headers is a 
couple of flags that show x86/x64 and PE32/PE32+, but they don't affect the 
loading and running of a PE containing IL and metadata.

Does anyone have paradigm-shattering evidence I can give my colleague to break 
his habit? (I'm hoping I'm right of course!!)

Greg