Re: [RBW] H/Hilsen (Toyo) tire size

[Doug Williams]

Yes, sorry. I should have mentioned that my 56 Hilsen is 650B. The largest 
Hilsen that is 650B. Essentially a Saluki with a different paint job. But 
yes, I have run 42mm Babyshoe Pass tires  under the SKS fenders for years 
with zero issues. Of course, Mark at Rivendell installed the fenders, and 
he is a master. If I had put them on, they would probably rub everywhere.

Doug

On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 4:14:16 PM UTC-7 Doug Williams wrote:

> I have a Waterford Hilsen in 56 and I run Babyshoe Pass 42's with fenders. 
> They are close but I have been running them for several years with no 
> issues.
>
> Doug
>
>
> On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 8:29:59 AM UTC-7 gpgun...@aol.com wrote:
>
>> Gentlemen
>>
>> Much appreciate all the feedback. Confirming 42s with fenders will work 
>> answers my questions. 
>>
>> Dave...very nice looking H/H build you have there.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Gunner
>>
>> On Sunday, June 20, 2021 at 10:08:44 PM UTC-4 David Hays wrote:
>>
>>> I have a Toyo Homer 56 650B and I’m running Hetres and VO Zeppelin 
>>> fenders.
>>> Although not thinking to run anything bigger, there seems to be good 
>>> clearance.
>>>
>>> David
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>> On Jun 20, 2021, at 9:37 PM, Cyclofiend Jim  wrote:
>>>
>>> A... just before I posted this, I realized you have a 650B (which is 
>>> essentially a Saluki in 56). My comments below the line were for a 700C 
>>> Hilsen. I think you'll find any reference to Saluki clearances would be 
>>> appropriate.
>>>
>>> There is a thread here which chats a bit about Saluki v. Hilsen
>>> https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/5JKIpW9dQTA
>>>
>>> In that thread, you will find reference to a fendered Saluki with 42's. 
>>>
>>> -- 700C comments  
>>>
>>> I still run Jack Browns (bulky 33 1/3) on mine and there is gobs of 
>>> room. 
>>>
>>> On this page, you can see Pasela 37's and plenty of space to spare - 
>>> http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/hilsen/index.html
>>>
>>> Original RR article introducing the 700C Hilsen stated clearance for 40 
>>> with fenders. (you'll find a hi-rez archived scan on that page as well).
>>>
>>> - J
>>>
>>> On Sunday, June 20, 2021 at 6:20:31 PM UTC-7 gpgun...@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> Greetings
>>>> Can anyone confirm or shed light on the largest tire size one can 
>>>> safely ride on a Toyo H/Hilsen (56 650B) with fenders. I would like to 
>>>> work 
>>>> a 38-42 if possible and don't want to cut it too close for safety reasons. 
>>>> Thanks much 
>>>> Gunner  
>>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] H/Hilsen (Toyo) tire size

[Doug Williams]

I have a Waterford Hilsen in 56 and I run Babyshoe Pass 42's with fenders. 
They are close but I have been running them for several years with no 
issues.

Doug


On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 8:29:59 AM UTC-7 gpgun...@aol.com wrote:

> Gentlemen
>
> Much appreciate all the feedback. Confirming 42s with fenders will work 
> answers my questions. 
>
> Dave...very nice looking H/H build you have there.
>
> Cheers
>
> Gunner
>
> On Sunday, June 20, 2021 at 10:08:44 PM UTC-4 David Hays wrote:
>
>> I have a Toyo Homer 56 650B and I’m running Hetres and VO Zeppelin 
>> fenders.
>> Although not thinking to run anything bigger, there seems to be good 
>> clearance.
>>
>> David
>>
>>  
>>
>> On Jun 20, 2021, at 9:37 PM, Cyclofiend Jim  wrote:
>>
>> A... just before I posted this, I realized you have a 650B (which is 
>> essentially a Saluki in 56). My comments below the line were for a 700C 
>> Hilsen. I think you'll find any reference to Saluki clearances would be 
>> appropriate.
>>
>> There is a thread here which chats a bit about Saluki v. Hilsen
>> https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/5JKIpW9dQTA
>>
>> In that thread, you will find reference to a fendered Saluki with 42's. 
>>
>> -- 700C comments  
>>
>> I still run Jack Browns (bulky 33 1/3) on mine and there is gobs of room. 
>>
>> On this page, you can see Pasela 37's and plenty of space to spare - 
>> http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/hilsen/index.html
>>
>> Original RR article introducing the 700C Hilsen stated clearance for 40 
>> with fenders. (you'll find a hi-rez archived scan on that page as well).
>>
>> - J
>>
>> On Sunday, June 20, 2021 at 6:20:31 PM UTC-7 gpgun...@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>> Greetings
>>> Can anyone confirm or shed light on the largest tire size one can safely 
>>> ride on a Toyo H/Hilsen (56 650B) with fenders. I would like to work a 
>>> 38-42 if possible and don't want to cut it too close for safety reasons. 
>>> Thanks much 
>>> Gunner  
>>>
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Clothing for hot and humid riding

[Doug Williams]

Seersucker shirts. Long sleeve can be best for sunburn protection and still 
almost as cool as short sleeve. But either way, seersucker is about as cool 
as you can get.

Doug

On Thursday, May 27, 2021 at 4:41:38 AM UTC-7 Steven Sweedler wrote:

> Try the Jackson and Gibbens touring shorts, shorter than Riv’s and very 
> light and airy. 
> https://www.bicycleclothing.com/Mens-Touring-Shorts.html
> Steve
>
> On Thu, May 27, 2021 at 7:35 AM Eric Marth  wrote:
>
>> It's getting into the gross season here in Virginia where heat and 
>> humidity blend into a delightful sludge. I'm curious to hear from members 
>> about their preferred riding clothing for the heat. What's your go-to deal? 
>> I'm curious about comfort for longer rides (which for me are in the range 
>> of 40-60 miles) in non-cycling cycling clothes. Any experienced riders from 
>> the Sticky States have a special blend they'd like to share? 
>>
>> I often ride in whatever I happen to be wearing and usually that's a 
>> cotton tee and a pair of heavy canvas carpenter shorts. For longer rides I 
>> prefer a linen or chambray shirt. Linen, in particular, has been great. 
>>
>> I'm looking for some inspiration to counter my perspiration. The canvas 
>> shorts are not ideal. I have two pairs of MUSA shorts from Riv but for my 
>> tastes they are way too long and too baggy. I'm resistant to going over to 
>> traditional jerseys and shorts, though the idea of Kucharik wool shorts has 
>> caught my interest. 
>>
>> Thanks to all in advance!
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
> -- 
> Steven Sweedler
> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Need Platypus tire advice

[Doug Williams]

I am also a Babyshoe Pass fan. Been riding them on my Homer for years, both 
with tubes and tubeless. Very, very nice. The ride and handle beautifully 
and they are absolutely silent, which I enjoy (some people don't care about 
sound).

Doug

On Thursday, May 20, 2021 at 11:09:06 AM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> There's no reason you *can't *mix tire sizes. Back in the day - before 
> suspension forks - mountain bikers would add a bit of cush to the front by 
> running a bigger tire than the rear. You could do this with the knowledge 
> that your rear 38 will wear faster, then replace with a 42 you've found by 
> then. This could work! 
>
> On Thursday, May 20, 2021 at 10:02:41 AM UTC-7 JAS wrote:
>
>> Back to the drawing board on tires...I'm officially calling this "tire 
>> angst." The order for the 42 Shikoros went through, Pay Pal and all.  I was 
>> so happy!  Later, I received an apology from the merchant stating they were 
>> out of stock but hadn't updated their website.  No!  I called and spoke to 
>> James at Riv; he called their rep who has no idea when there will be more.  
>> I'd already sent an email to Soma and their eventual reply was the 
>> same...resupply date is unknown.  Someone on Amazon has one 42mm Shikoro 
>> (or at least they did yesterday). 
>>
>> So I suppose I'll have to settle for Shikoro 38mm or consider the Rene 
>> Herse options.  Does it make any sense to put a 42mm Shikoro on the rear 
>> and 38mm on the front?  Or vice versa?
>>
>> Thanks for listening to my rant.
>>
>> --Joyce 
>>
>> On Wednesday, May 19, 2021 at 12:17:33 PM UTC-7 Emily Guise wrote:
>>
>>> Joyce, so glad you were able to get those Shikoros! I have them on my 
>>> 60cm Platy and have been very pleasantly surprised by how nice they feel on 
>>> the road; they seem to really smooth out the rough spots. So far I haven't 
>>> had a flat in a month of ownership even though our streets are full of 
>>> glass and potholes. Two thumbs up from me!
>>>
>>> -Emily
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, May 19, 2021 at 11:41:11 AM UTC-7 JAS wrote:
>>>
 Garth, you're a life-saver!  I got busy right away and ordered the 
 tires.  Thanks so much for the link.

 On Wednesday, May 19, 2021 at 3:01:55 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:

> Joyce,  Enjoy the ride !!!  Shikoro 700x42 ..  
> https://takeahikeshop.com/products/soma-shikoro-700c-k-tire-black-brown
> ?
>
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 18, 2021 at 7:51:54 PM UTC-4 JAS wrote:
>
>> Jason, what casing did you select for your RH tires?  Standard, 
>> extralight or endurance?  I'm impressed with your mileage to flat ratio.
>>
>> Garth, you're right!  It's ultimately about life and enjoying the 
>> ride. I"ll bet you've read "Flow: The Psychology of Optimal Performance" 
>> by 
>> Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi.  If not, you might enjoy it.
>>
>> Joe, I also found that the Kenda Kwik tires that came on my Clem rode 
>> like bricks, though I didn't know how bad they were until I switched to 
>> Big 
>> Bens.  I have Schwalbe Marathons on my Bike Friday for touring for the 
>> flat 
>> protection.  My hands aren't as strong as they used to be so it's often 
>> a 
>> struggle to get the tire back on the rim.
>>
>> Thanks to all for continuing this conversation about tires.  I 
>> appreciate the opportunity to learn more about bikes via your 
>> experience.  
>> As far as my tire decision goes,  I'm currently leaning toward the 
>> folding 
>> Shikoro 700 x 38 due to availability.  I don't know if the 42mm would be 
>> better, but can't find them in the folding (lighter) version.
>>
>> --Joyce
>> On Tuesday, May 18, 2021 at 3:13:06 PM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>
>>> I was riding 70 to 100 miles per week back then with 3 to 5 bikes, 
>>> most on the commuter and allrounder, mostly on pavement but say 1/3 
>>> dirt.
>>>
>>> Oh: One big exception to the "flatting fast tires": Big Apples. They 
>>> rolled surprisingly well for their bulk, but got perhaps 1/3 of the 
>>> flats 
>>> per unit distance of the other tires; in order of flat-prone-ness, ie 
>>> from 
>>> more flats to less flats per unit: 26 X 1.25 Paselas, non-TG (and yet 
>>> for a 
>>> number of years these were my commuting tires and got the most miles); 
>>> Conti GPs, Michelin Pro Races, Specialised Turbos (yep, fewer flats 
>>> than 
>>> the Paselas); 26 X 1.35 and 700C X 35 Kojaks; 26 and 29" 2.35" Big 
>>> Apples).
>>>
>>> On Tue, May 18, 2021 at 5:06 PM Patrick Moore  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Each to his or her own. It depends on what you prefer. Many ride 
 stiff tires that don't flat; pre-sealant, I preferred -- no, really, 
 really 
 much preferred --  to fix over 150 flats per year (2 boxes of 100 
 Remas per 
 year, more or less) instead of riding tires 

[RBW] Re: Derailer for A. Homer Hilsen

[Doug Williams]

Thanks for the comments everybody. Garth, I agree that the compact double 
sounds good on paper and saves a few ounces, but like you, I'm still 
reluctant to give up my triple in the hills where I ride. I still wonder if 
the 26 will be as useful as the 24. I don't use my 24 with the 32 in back 
often, but when I need it...I need it. I even run a 11-34 in the back 
sometimes. Again, nice when you need it.

Nice to know that Andel makes the Silver triple. Of course I could also 
consider the Rene Herse triple, but one has to wonder if it is going to be 
that many $$$ better than the Silver triple. How much lighter and faster 
can it really be? Both the Herse double and triple are gorgeous, of course.

Doug

On Tuesday, May 11, 2021 at 5:38:13 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:

> My experience with double FD's is that they are incredibly adaptable with 
> capacities far beyond the manufacturers self-imposed specs and guidelines. 
> The apparent raves about the CX70 I take with a grain of salt as there are 
> endless other double FD's that work just as well. I'm currently using a 
> Tiagra 4400 9-speed double FD with 44/36/24 rings (9-sp chain, Andel triple 
> crank) and it shifts as well as I could ask for. That's even using a 44t 
> ring intended for small/middle use mounted backwards, as the big ring. The 
> specs of the FD say it's 2(larger) road rings, the specs say it only has so 
> much capacity between the rings. How about what the specs don't say, or 
> can't say ? What specs don't/can't mention is the infinitude of settings 
> and usefulness. What they cannot express is the unlimited/inherent 
> creativity that lies within. 
>
>
> By the way, about comparing wide/low doubles and triple cranks. 3 
> rings offers the ability to run either large ring with the cassette. Even 
> if some gears appear to overlap per ring that's okay as that offers the 
> ability to use different cogs in the back rather the same cog all the time 
> with a single ring alone. It also offers larger up/down shifts just by 
> changing rings rather than by just cog shifts. So while a wide/low crank 
> sounds okay in talking about it, I won't be riding one anytime soon with 
> the hilly terrain I live in where I use 36,44,46 rings and cogs from 14 to 
> 32 teeth daily. 
>
> Also, the 152mm Andel triple crank I run is a black powdercoat finish. 
> Andel makes it in silver also , but I've grown to like the hearty finish. 
> It's very scratch resistant and easy to clean if need be. It's also notably 
> stiffer/straighter than a Sugino XD type crank of which I've used 5 of. The 
> XD is another of those online rider "favorites" that in my experiences is 
> the least favorite of all. The hidden/backwards bolt only adds to it's 
> demerits. Andel is a fine crank manufacturer, I wish their extensive crank 
> selection was more easily accessible in the US market. The Riv Silver crank 
> is made by Andel, btw. 
>
> I've grown to like some black finished parts. At this point anything but 
> the frame I'm okay with in given circumstances. 
> On Tuesday, May 11, 2021 at 3:26:07 AM UTC-4 Ed Carolipio wrote:
>
>> Hi Doug, is your Claris triple specific? If it's not, that may account 
>> for the rough shifts. Triple FDs have an inner plate that is taller than 
>> the outer one. The CX70 is spec'ced for a double crank (46T top gear, 16T 
>> outer-to-inner difference) may have problems with the triple as well.
>>
>> I've used a Claris double with a VO 46/30 and a Sugino 42/26 in friction, 
>> and it worked well for both. Currently on my MIT Hillsen I'm running a 
>> Silver 46-34-24 with a Deore FD-M591 (the 3x9 version), a 9-speed rear, and 
>> Silver1 shifter. The M591 is matched almost perfectly with that crankset 
>> and gearing: 48T top gear, 12T outer-to-mid difference, 22T outer-to-inner 
>> difference. Front shifts are like butter with this setup.
>>
>> (BTW the crank is a Silver low-low double with a Sugino 46T chainring 
>> replacing the guard. I didn't want to wait for a Silver triple...)
>>
>> The Claris triple (FD-R2030) will work but is less ideal: 50T top gear, 
>> 11T outer-to-mid difference,  20T outer-to-inner difference. Better for 
>> something like a 48-38-28 crank but will likely be made to work with your 
>> 46-36-24.
>>
>> Good luck,
>> Ed C.
>> On Monday, May 10, 2021 at 8:44:40 PM UTC-7 Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>>> I have a Hilsen with 28.6mm seat tube and it looks like there is already 
>>> a shim on there to mount my derailer, a clamp on Shimano Claris Triple. The 
>>> shim seems to make it about 32mm. So if I replace this derailer, would a 
>>> 31.8/28.6 clamp on be correct?
>>>
>>> I found a bottom pull Sh

[RBW] Re: Derailer for A. Homer Hilsen

[Doug Williams]

Jan at Rene Herse likes the CX70 for both compact doubles and triples where 
the big ring is around 46 or 44 teeth. I have no interest in STI/Ergopower, 
however. I sticking with my Riv friction-only Silver bar end shifters. But 
here is Jan's rant:
https://www.renehersecycles.com/trouble-with-sti-triples/

Since I do only friction shifting I was hoping it would work well for me 
regardless of whether I went with a Rene Herse 42-26 or a Riv Silver 
44-34-24 triple. Because I'm still waffling there. :-)  I just know that 
I'm dumping my old Sugino triple when the current chain rings wear out. I'm 
told that the Silver Triple will be available in 6 months. The Rene Herse 
double 42-26 is available now. So either could work. Just wondering if the 
CX70 would be a good derailer for either. My Claris is a triple, judging by 
the fact that it has the stepped channel that Jan goes on about.

Doug

On Tuesday, May 11, 2021 at 12:26:07 AM UTC-7 Ed Carolipio wrote:

> Hi Doug, is your Claris triple specific? If it's not, that may account for 
> the rough shifts. Triple FDs have an inner plate that is taller than the 
> outer one. The CX70 is spec'ced for a double crank (46T top gear, 16T 
> outer-to-inner difference) may have problems with the triple as well.
>
> I've used a Claris double with a VO 46/30 and a Sugino 42/26 in friction, 
> and it worked well for both. Currently on my MIT Hillsen I'm running a 
> Silver 46-34-24 with a Deore FD-M591 (the 3x9 version), a 9-speed rear, and 
> Silver1 shifter. The M591 is matched almost perfectly with that crankset 
> and gearing: 48T top gear, 12T outer-to-mid difference, 22T outer-to-inner 
> difference. Front shifts are like butter with this setup.
>
> (BTW the crank is a Silver low-low double with a Sugino 46T chainring 
> replacing the guard. I didn't want to wait for a Silver triple...)
>
> The Claris triple (FD-R2030) will work but is less ideal: 50T top gear, 
> 11T outer-to-mid difference,  20T outer-to-inner difference. Better for 
> something like a 48-38-28 crank but will likely be made to work with your 
> 46-36-24.
>
> Good luck,
> Ed C.
> On Monday, May 10, 2021 at 8:44:40 PM UTC-7 Doug Williams wrote:
>
>> I have a Hilsen with 28.6mm seat tube and it looks like there is already 
>> a shim on there to mount my derailer, a clamp on Shimano Claris Triple. The 
>> shim seems to make it about 32mm. So if I replace this derailer, would a 
>> 31.8/28.6 clamp on be correct?
>>
>> I found a bottom pull Shimano CX70 in that size that looks nice. Everyone 
>> raves about the CX70 so I wonder if it would be better than my Claris? The 
>> Claris basically works, but it is not exactly smooth. I am currently 
>> running the Sugino Triple Crank 46-36-24 but I might switch to the Rene 
>> Herse 42-26 or wait for Riv's Silver Triple 44-34-24 to be back in stock. 
>> In any event, when this set of chain rings wears out, I am done with the 
>> Sugino hidden bolt. I just stripped the bitch and had to drill it out, so 
>> I'm done with hidden bolts.
>>
>> So...would the CX70 work with both double and triple 8 speed friction 
>> only (Silver Bar End) shifters? Or is it only going to work with a double? 
>> Would the CX70 be better than the Claris?
>>
>> Doug
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Derailer for A. Homer Hilsen

[Doug Williams]

I have a Hilsen with 28.6mm seat tube and it looks like there is already a 
shim on there to mount my derailer, a clamp on Shimano Claris Triple. The 
shim seems to make it about 32mm. So if I replace this derailer, would a 
31.8/28.6 clamp on be correct?

I found a bottom pull Shimano CX70 in that size that looks nice. Everyone 
raves about the CX70 so I wonder if it would be better than my Claris? The 
Claris basically works, but it is not exactly smooth. I am currently 
running the Sugino Triple Crank 46-36-24 but I might switch to the Rene 
Herse 42-26 or wait for Riv's Silver Triple 44-34-24 to be back in stock. 
In any event, when this set of chain rings wears out, I am done with the 
Sugino hidden bolt. I just stripped the bitch and had to drill it out, so 
I'm done with hidden bolts.

So...would the CX70 work with both double and triple 8 speed friction only 
(Silver Bar End) shifters? Or is it only going to work with a double? Would 
the CX70 be better than the Claris?

Doug















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Re: [RBW] Converting 650b Hilsen to Rene Herse 42/26 cranks

[Doug Williams]

Thanks very much, Patrick! As usual, very helpful.

Doug

On Sunday, May 2, 2021 at 4:30:06 PM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Doug: There are all sorts of reasons to buy the RH crank, foremost among 
> which is its beauty. But if you want a cheaper, more utilitarian way to get 
> the same result, consider converting the homely Sugino by removing the 46 
> and replacing it with a guard (https://bbgbashguard.com), swapping the 36 
> for a 42, and considering whether you need to swap the 24 for a 26; but if 
> you decide that you do, this is easy. 
>
> Then you can hold an interior debate about the cogs you need to change in 
> the rear.
>
> The *upshot* is that you can leave the bb spindle and even the front 
> derailleur strictly alone. 
>
> Some years ago I changed the 46-36-24 on my Fargo, long since sold, to a 
> BBBashGuard/38/24 on the same Sugino XD2. I swapped the 7 cogs on the 
> Shimano LX freehub for 9 different ones; IIRC, I simply bought 9-sp spacers 
> and built a cassette from the cogs in my Big Box.
>
> Note this carefully: I *did not* change the bb assembly, I kept the same 
> LX triple front derailleur, *and I didn't even** lower the front 
> derailleur.* I simply adjusted the fd outer throw adjustment screw. 
>
> It all worked fine. Again, I did not lower the fd; just left it hanging 
> with a huge gap over the outer, formerly middle, ring.
>
> But once again, the RH crank is indeed very pretty, and I am tempted to 
> buy one myself simply for prettiness.
>
> Oh,
>
>
>
> On Sun, May 2, 2021 at 1:53 PM Doug Williams  
> wrote:
>
>> I have a 58cm 650b A. Homer Hilsen that I purchased from Riv in 2014. I 
>> have been loving it ever since! It has the Sugino Triple Crank 46-36-24 and 
>> I run it all friction shifting with bar end silvers, 8 speed with a 11-32 
>> cassette. The front derailer is Shimano Claris Triple. The bottom bracket 
>> is  bbc110.
>>
>> So...I'm getting older and I notice I don't use the 46 ring much, at 
>> least not with the higher gears in the back. I am definitely an "UnRacer" 
>> anyway. I am thinking of getting the Rene Herse double cranks with 42-26 
>> rings. If I go with the 8 speed megarange 11-34 cassette in the back, I 
>> would give up almost nothing in the lower gears and lose just some high 
>> gears that I rarely use anyway. So two questions:
>>
>> 1. Is my bottom bracket compatible with the Rene Herse cranks? I think 
>> so, but I'm not sure. Would now be a good time to replace it anyway?
>>
>> 2. Should I just keep my Claris triple FD and crank in the limit screw or 
>> go with something like the Shimano CX70 or some other double FD that works 
>> well with compact 42-26 rings?
>>
>> Any other comments or suggestions would be welcome.
>>
>> Doug
>>
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>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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[RBW] Converting 650b Hilsen to Rene Herse 42/26 cranks

[Doug Williams]

I have a 58cm 650b A. Homer Hilsen that I purchased from Riv in 2014. I 
have been loving it ever since! It has the Sugino Triple Crank 46-36-24 and 
I run it all friction shifting with bar end silvers, 8 speed with a 11-32 
cassette. The front derailer is Shimano Claris Triple. The bottom bracket 
is  bbc110.

So...I'm getting older and I notice I don't use the 46 ring much, at least 
not with the higher gears in the back. I am definitely an "UnRacer" anyway. 
I am thinking of getting the Rene Herse double cranks with 42-26 rings. If 
I go with the 8 speed megarange 11-34 cassette in the back, I would give up 
almost nothing in the lower gears and lose just some high gears that I 
rarely use anyway. So two questions:

1. Is my bottom bracket compatible with the Rene Herse cranks? I think so, 
but I'm not sure. Would now be a good time to replace it anyway?

2. Should I just keep my Claris triple FD and crank in the limit screw or 
go with something like the Shimano CX70 or some other double FD that works 
well with compact 42-26 rings?

Any other comments or suggestions would be welcome.

Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Rene Herse rene crankset ultegra chains?

[Doug Williams]

Thanks David! Very helpful!

Doug

On Thu, Jun 20, 2019, 19:12 David Carner  wrote:

> Doug,
> I have had a 44/28 crank on this bike for about 10 years. Before the Rene
> Herse I was using a TA Pro- vis-5. One of my reasons for choosing the RH
> was because I wanted to keep the same size chain rings.  I have a 12-32
> cassette. For relaxed riding I am usually on the 18 or 16 cog; when riding
> with someone who prefers to go faster 16 or 14. I use all 9 cogs with the
> 44 chain ring and  rarely have to use the 28. We have hills where I live,
> but not long ones.  I use the 28 ring most often on steep gravel.
> I have never been a fast or strong rider. I am currently 70 years old. If
> I frequently rode long hills I might consider dropping down to a 42 so I
> could stay on the big ring most of the time.  I don't worry about running
> out of gears going down hill. If my bike is going 25 mph without me working
> hard, I am happy to rest.
> Good luck on finding what works best for you.
>
> David
>
>
> On Wednesday, June 19, 2019 at 2:34:00 PM UTC-5, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> David,
>>
>> How are you liking the Rene Herse 44/28? I'm looking at the exact same
>> thing but I'm thinking that (at my advanced age and with hills) a 42/26
>> would be a better choice. Which rear cog do you find yourself on the with
>> 44 ring most of the time...12, 16, 28? I'm hoping to be in the big
>> chainring most of the time, using the little ring only for a hilly bailout.
>> Around 90 gear inches is big enough for me, I'll just tuck and coast
>> downhill if I spin that out. I can get 90 gear inches with a 42.
>>
>> I have a 650B Homer with 42mm tires and the Sugino 46/36/24 triple now. I
>> spend most of my time in the 36, but I still go to the 46 fairly often. I
>> go to the 24 only on steep hills. So I'm thinking that if that 36 were just
>> a little bigger, I could live there 99% of the time. I think that the 26
>> will be close enough to my current 24 to get me by. Although, when one is
>> pedaling up a steep hill while bonked, no gear is too low. I suppose I
>> could go with 42/24 if I could tolerate a 18 tooth shift.
>>
>> Who is running a 42/26 and how do you like it?
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> On Sunday, June 16, 2019 at 10:51:33 AM UTC-7, David Carner wrote:
>>>
>>> Toby,
>>> I installed a Rene Herse crankset (double 44/28) on my Riv Road about a
>>> year ago. I don't think the pinned and ramped rings were available in that
>>> size at the time, so I have the standard 5-10 model. Since I was staying
>>> with 9 speed in the rear I used a new SRAM PC 971 that I already had on
>>> hand. In the process of updating the drivetrain I installed a Shimano FX-70
>>> FD from Rivbike.  I was frustrated to find that I could not adjust the FD
>>> to keep the chain from rubbing the cage on the inner rear cog.  I checked
>>> my chain line and it was within a mm. of perfect. Then I realized that the
>>> CX70 FD is marketed as a 2 x 10.  I bought an Ultegra 10 speed, CN-6701 and
>>> that solved the problem. I use indexed rear, friction front and it would
>>> seem difficult for either to shift more smoothly than they do now.
>>> David
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday, June 14, 2019 at 8:27:45 PM UTC-5, Toby Whitfield wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Jan,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for that information. One quick clarification question- do you
>>>> recall what 10 speed Ultegra chain you found worked well? There are 2: the
>>>> 6600, and the 6701. In think the 6701 is asymmetrical and has to be
>>>> installed in a certain orientation, but I've never held one in my hands.
>>>> Looking for a couple new chains to use with 10 speed on my Rene Herse
>>>> crankset.
>>>>
>>>> Toby Whitfield
>>>>
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[RBW] Re: Rene Herse rene crankset ultegra chains?

[Doug Williams]

David,

How are you liking the Rene Herse 44/28? I'm looking at the exact same 
thing but I'm thinking that (at my advanced age and with hills) a 42/26 
would be a better choice. Which rear cog do you find yourself on the with 
44 ring most of the time...12, 16, 28? I'm hoping to be in the big 
chainring most of the time, using the little ring only for a hilly bailout. 
Around 90 gear inches is big enough for me, I'll just tuck and coast 
downhill if I spin that out. I can get 90 gear inches with a 42.

I have a 650B Homer with 42mm tires and the Sugino 46/36/24 triple now. I 
spend most of my time in the 36, but I still go to the 46 fairly often. I 
go to the 24 only on steep hills. So I'm thinking that if that 36 were just 
a little bigger, I could live there 99% of the time. I think that the 26 
will be close enough to my current 24 to get me by. Although, when one is 
pedaling up a steep hill while bonked, no gear is too low. I suppose I 
could go with 42/24 if I could tolerate a 18 tooth shift.

Who is running a 42/26 and how do you like it?

Doug

On Sunday, June 16, 2019 at 10:51:33 AM UTC-7, David Carner wrote:
>
> Toby,
> I installed a Rene Herse crankset (double 44/28) on my Riv Road about a 
> year ago. I don't think the pinned and ramped rings were available in that 
> size at the time, so I have the standard 5-10 model. Since I was staying 
> with 9 speed in the rear I used a new SRAM PC 971 that I already had on 
> hand. In the process of updating the drivetrain I installed a Shimano FX-70 
> FD from Rivbike.  I was frustrated to find that I could not adjust the FD 
> to keep the chain from rubbing the cage on the inner rear cog.  I checked 
> my chain line and it was within a mm. of perfect. Then I realized that the 
> CX70 FD is marketed as a 2 x 10.  I bought an Ultegra 10 speed, CN-6701 and 
> that solved the problem. I use indexed rear, friction front and it would 
> seem difficult for either to shift more smoothly than they do now.
> David
>
>
> On Friday, June 14, 2019 at 8:27:45 PM UTC-5, Toby Whitfield wrote:
>>
>> Jan, 
>>
>> Thanks for that information. One quick clarification question- do you 
>> recall what 10 speed Ultegra chain you found worked well? There are 2: the 
>> 6600, and the 6701. In think the 6701 is asymmetrical and has to be 
>> installed in a certain orientation, but I've never held one in my hands. 
>> Looking for a couple new chains to use with 10 speed on my Rene Herse 
>> crankset.
>>
>> Toby Whitfield 
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Carrying Water on bikes w/ minimal bottle cage mounts

[Doug Williams]

My Saddlesack Large easily holds my 64oz Growler. In fact, it would 
probably hold 4 of them.  Plus lunch, tools, book, etc. :-)

Doug

On Tuesday, June 18, 2019 at 5:24:31 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> A saddlebag is one solution.
>
> Patrick Moore
>
> On Jun 18, 2019, at 5:58 AM, RDS > wrote:
>
> How do you carry multiple bottles or larger bottles (32 oz) on bikes w/ 
> minimal cage mounts?  Clem L as an example.
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Rene Herse rene crankset ultegra chains?

[Doug Williams]

Thanks Jan! That answers all of my questions in a very definitive fashion.
Good to know. Now I just have to pick my rings. I'm an old man who has
trouble getting up steep hills so I'm leaning toward 42/26.  Maybe I'll
throw caution to the wind and go 44/28.  :-)

Doug

On Fri, Jun 14, 2019 at 2:11 PM Jan Heine  wrote:

> To add some clarification to the chain recommendation for Rene Herse
> cranks:
>
> 11-speed rings (also suitable for 9- and 10-speed): Ramps and pins have to
> be designed for one specific chain, and we designed ours for the 11-speed
> Ultegra chain. So the shifting is best with this chain. Other chains should
> work, but may not shift quite as smoothly.
>
> 5-10-speed rings, 10-speed: There are some 10-speed chains that have a
> propensity for chain suck. We've done a lot of testing with Ultegra chains,
> and they work great. So that is our recommendation, but others may work
> well, too. Just avoid chains that are known for chain suck...
>
> 5-10-speed rings, 5-9-speed: Use any chain you want. I run SRAM 8-speed
> chains on my Herse (5-speed), Urban Bike (6-speed) and Mule (7-speed), with
> no problems whatsoever.
>
> Jan Heine
> Rene Herse Cycles
> Reborn in the Cascade Mountains
> www.renehersecycles.com
>
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Re: [RBW] Rene Herse rene crankset ultegra chains?

[Doug Williams]

So I would be getting the 7-8-9 speed version of the Rene Herse crank. As I 
said, I am happily friction shifting 8 speed. But I might consider trying 9 
speed with an Ultegra chain if the "special" Ultegra 9 speed chain was 
going to magically interact with the Rene Herse crank in a way that would 
not happen with a generic and mundane 8 speed chain. It sounds like there 
is no such magic, so I will probably just stick with 8 speed.

Doug

On 6/13/19 8:54 AM, Doug Williams wrote: 
> > Hi all, 
> > 
> > I'm considering a Rene Herse crankset for my Homer but I'm a little 
> > confused on when you must (should) use an Ultegra chain on Rene Herse 
> > cranksets. Clearly recommended by Jan for 11 speed, I get that. 10 
> > speed also, I think. But what about for 8 or 9 speed? Must you use an 
> > Ultegra chain on a 9 speed in order to get the advantage of the Herse 
> > ramps and pins? What about 8 speed? I don't even see an "Ultegra" 
> > chain for 8 speed, which is what I am currently (and happily) friction 
> > shifting on my Homer. Would chain brand matter at all for Rene Herse 
> > cranksets with 8 or 9 speed setups? 
> > 
>
> Jan's recommendation of the Ultegra chain is not confined solely to the 
> 11 speed rings with ramps and pins.  10 and below rings do not have 
> ramps and pins.  They're not "straight cut" but aren't ramped and 
> pinned.  I've got a Herse triple and I'm running 10.  I got an Ultegra 
> 10 chain on his recommendation, and all I can say is it shifts fine and 
> isn't too expensive even with the extra cost of a Wippermann link (no 
> stupid Shimano break-off pins for me, thanks). 
>
> 8 speed chains are pretty cheap, so how much harm could you get into if 
> you got a SRAM 8 speed chain and tried it? 
>
> -- 
> Steve Palincsar 
> Alexandria, Virginia 
> USA 
>
>

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[RBW] Rene Herse rene crankset ultegra chains?

[Doug Williams]

Hi all,

I'm considering a Rene Herse crankset for my Homer but I'm a little 
confused on when you must (should) use an Ultegra chain on Rene Herse 
cranksets. Clearly recommended by Jan for 11 speed, I get that. 10 speed 
also, I think. But what about for 8 or 9 speed? Must you use an Ultegra 
chain on a 9 speed in order to get the advantage of the Herse ramps and 
pins? What about 8 speed? I don't even see an "Ultegra" chain for 8 speed, 
which is what I am currently (and happily) friction shifting on my Homer. 
Would chain brand matter at all for Rene Herse cranksets with 8 or 9 speed 
setups?

Doug

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[RBW] Thumb Shifter Recommendations

[Doug Williams]

Hi Riv fans,

I have been happily riding my 650b Homer with Albatross Bars and Silver 
friction bar end shifters (8 gears in the rear, triple ring up front) for 
several years. But I want to try out the Bosco Bars that I have lying 
around. I'll just use the Silver Bar ends at first, but I anticipate that I 
will want to go to Thumb Shifters after I bump my knees enough times on the 
Silvers.

So...given that I'm a friction fan and using 8 in the back and 3 in the 
front, does anybody have recommendations on the best thumb shifters for my 
(soon to be Bosco) Hilsen?

Does anyone have any knowledge of the new, supposedly soon to be released 
Silver Shifters? Will they come in a thumb version? What are the supposed 
improvements over the old Silver Shifters? Should I just bang my knees on 
the bar ends until the new Silvers are available in a thumb version?

Doug

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Re: [RBW] seeking Rivendell Saluki reviews...and maybe a lead

[Doug Williams]

I have a 58cm 650b Hilsen. My kids call it "Homer" when I ride slow and 
"Saluki" when I ride fast. Because we all know that the most important factor 
in the speed of a bike is the name. 

Doug

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[RBW] Rim Tape for Pacenti SL23 tubeless

[Doug Williams]

My Homer has Rich Lesnik built 650b wheels with Pacenti SL23 rims. They 
have been running perfectly since I got them in 2014. Recently, I have been 
running them tubeless with Orange Seal and Compass Babyshoe Pass tires. 
Sweet ride and I love the fact that I get zero flats. But I wonder if I 
should replace the rim tape. I recently had them off for cleaning out the 
dried Orange Seal (which, in retrospect, was not necessary). But anyway, 
the rim tape is getting a little worn and brittle. So, I resolved that, 
next time I get new tires, I’ll get new rim tape as well.


The Pacenti SL23’s are 24.5mm outside width and 20.3mm inside width. So, 
what width tubeless rim tape should I use? Rich used something blue vinyl, 
but since it was stretched, I don’t know the original width. Can anyone 
recommend the proper width and the best brand for tubeless?

 

Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Pondering fatherhood

[Doug Williams]

I means that your life is going to change in many ways, but for the better. 
As for biking, start looking for  a trailer. I suggest a larger (100 pound 
capacity) Burley trailer. The baby won't ride in it right away, but you can 
the seat out and use it for cargo. You will be making many emergency supply 
runs for diapers, etc.

But relax, focus on your wife now...and enjoy! Everything will be good. My 
kids are both "self propelled" now, they ride their bikes to school. But 
that is a distant future for you. :-)

Doug

On Wednesday, February 10, 2016 at 11:35:23 PM UTC-8, Jim Bronson wrote:
>
> Wife gets induced on Friday.  What will it all mean?
> On Feb 10, 2016 9:40 PM, "Deacon Patrick"  
> wrote:
>
>> Awesome!
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2016 at 8:09:31 PM UTC-7, Jim Bronson wrote:
>>>
>>> Yep yep yep
>>>
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[RBW] Re: Headlight Charging Games

[Doug Williams]

Patrick,

Hmmm...my Ixon Core lights don't rattle, but then the batteries are not 
removable. The IQ has removable batteries, correct? So maybe it is the 
batteries rattling? Try putting a layer of tape or two on the batteries 
before installation to make them fit tighter.

Doug

On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 8:53:47 AM UTC-8, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> Sweet idea, Doug! I'll have to test that out for my Xion IQ. It's bright 
> enough for everything but singletrack and it does great on rides where I 
> run it for 3-5 hours, but I've never needed it for more than that. But I 
> have a battery pack for my iPhone when bikepacking, so I bet it'd work 
> great! Your daisy chain (am I using that right?) charging idea is 
> excellent. I'll set mine up and see how it goes. Thanks for the great idea!
>
> My only issue with the light is there is a rattle I can't get rid of 
> except my putting my hand on the casing as I ride. Anyone have any ideas 
> how to still the chatter?
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
> On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 9:39:38 AM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> The lights are being charged by the battery pack now. I could plug the 
>> battery pack into my wall charger and the battery pack would charge at the 
>> same time as the lights. I do so nightly, but really I don't have to do it 
>> that often. Easy and effective.
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Headlight Charging Games

[Doug Williams]

Since these USB battery banks are not that heavy, I opt to size mine so 
that I can go multiple days on it. But yes, you eventually have to charge 
the battery somehow. Dynamo hubs are tempting, but my understanding is that 
they won't really run your lights AND charge your battery and/or your 
electronic devices at the same time. A dynamo hub might run your lights and 
keep up with your phone in Airplane and Power Save mode, but it won’t 
manage lights and a cell phone navigating with GPS, etc. But if you are 
willing to give up daylight running lights and moderate the power 
consumption of your other toys, a dynamo hub is tempting.


I still prefer multiple battery lights because of the redundancy. If you go 
“dynamo only”, a failure of the wiring or the hub could leave you in the 
dark. Same goes for a single battery light, of course. But with multiple 
battery lights you have a high degree of redundancy. Dynamo with battery 
light backup is good, but not much of a weight savings (if any) and you 
can’t use multiple bikes easily.


Doug



>>

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[RBW] Re: Headlight Charging Games

[Doug Williams]

Patrick and all,

I should also say again that this "charge and light at the same time" 
doesn't work for all lights. It does work for my Ixon Core lights and all 
the Cygolites I have tested. But before you buy a battery bank, test out 
your lights by plugging them into a wall charger while they are on to see 
if they remain lit.

Doug

On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 9:12:57 AM UTC-8, Doug Williams wrote:
>
> Patrick,
>
> Hmmm...my Ixon Core lights don't rattle, but then the batteries are not 
> removable. The IQ has removable batteries, correct? So maybe it is the 
> batteries rattling? Try putting a layer of tape or two on the batteries 
> before installation to make them fit tighter.
>
> Doug
>
> On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 8:53:47 AM UTC-8, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>> Sweet idea, Doug! I'll have to test that out for my Xion IQ. It's bright 
>> enough for everything but singletrack and it does great on rides where I 
>> run it for 3-5 hours, but I've never needed it for more than that. But I 
>> have a battery pack for my iPhone when bikepacking, so I bet it'd work 
>> great! Your daisy chain (am I using that right?) charging idea is 
>> excellent. I'll set mine up and see how it goes. Thanks for the great idea!
>>
>> My only issue with the light is there is a rattle I can't get rid of 
>> except my putting my hand on the casing as I ride. Anyone have any ideas 
>> how to still the chatter?
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>> On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 9:39:38 AM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:
>>>
>>> The lights are being charged by the battery pack now. I could plug the 
>>> battery pack into my wall charger and the battery pack would charge at the 
>>> same time as the lights. I do so nightly, but really I don't have to do it 
>>> that often. Easy and effective.
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Headlight Charging Games

[Doug Williams]

I agree with Ron again. Yes, you can decide to go "All dyno" or "All 
solar". Those are both viable options if they supply all of your power 
needs.

But if you have already decided to buy and carry a battery bank (of some 
size)...then the small amount of power you get from solar (or even a dyno) 
isn't cost or weight efficient compared to just bringing a larger battery 
bank to cover ALL your power needs for the entire trip. So don't buy a too 
small battery and try to supplement it. Buy a battery that meets your needs 
and Just Ride.


Doug

On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 2:22:15 PM UTC-8, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> No Deac, I'm talking about bringing along 10, 20, or 30 Ah with you all 
> charged up.  Bringing along enough stored power that you don't need 
> electricity from anyone else.  
>
> On Sunday, February 7, 2016 at 12:44:16 PM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>> True, Ron, though this presumes a campground with electricity. If not, 
>> then solar charging is the option I use. Strap the solar panels open to the 
>> sleeping bag and it charges the battery pack as I ride. At camp, I can 
>> position the panels toward the sun for optimal charging. This system keeps 
>> up with my iPhone use, charging it every couple of days (I keep it in 
>> airplane mode to save battery, only connecting when I need to). I doubt it 
>> would keep up with light and iPhone use though.
>>
>> With abandon,
>>
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Chainstay protector

[Doug Williams]

I'm using the clear stick on one that Riv sells. But I was thinking of 
doing the Newbaums and shellac thing. Is that safe for your paint if you 
ever take it off?

Doug

On Saturday, February 6, 2016 at 3:24:32 PM UTC-8, drew wrote:
>
> Newbaums and shellac works and looks nice

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[RBW] Headlight Charging Games

[Doug Williams]

I have two Busch & Müller Ixon Core battery powered lights that I got from 
Peter White. Yes, I love them. Great beam pattern, doesn’t blind anyone, 
and running two is plenty of light. One of the reasons that I got them is 
that I read somewhere (can’t find where now) that you can charge the light 
and run the light at the same time. Indeed, this works! I have a USB 
battery bank in my front bag plugged into the lights. I can leave the light 
on and charge it at the same time. I have successfully used this on several 
long rides where the lights otherwise would have run out. I have run them 
for over 10 hours on high power and the lights stayed on the whole time. My 
Zendure battery pack was only ¼ down in power, so I suppose I could run 
them continuously on high power this way for 40 hours??? I haven’t tried 
because that seems silly, but maybe I’ll have to do it…For Science!


The Ixon Core lights are mounted on my Mark’s rack and plugged into the 
Zendure battery pack in my Sackville TrunkSack Small. I just leave them 
like that always. I even rigged rain proof booties made from a cut up inner 
tube for the Ixon’s so that the charging port can’t get wet in the rain 
(even with the USB plug inserted into the light).

I plug the battery pack into a USB wall charger when I get home. The 
Zendure has a “charge through” capability so the battery pack charges 
itself and the lights at the same time. In the morning, I’m ready for 
another day of riding. I just leave the lights on continuously during my 
rides day or night because…well…because I can and why not have daytime 
running lights? I can also use the battery pack to charge my phone and use 
it for navigation (which otherwise runs down the phone battery rather 
quickly).

The Ixon Core lights are plenty good for 95% of my riding, but I would like 
to have a more powerful light mounted on my handlebars for use as a high 
beam when I’m riding through the woods at night. The Ixon Core’s are a 
little dicey by themselves in that situation, especially on a fast descent.


Anyway, I was told that this “light up and charge at the same time trick” 
will NOT work for many other lights. Specifically, I was told that the 
Light & Motion Urban 800FC Headlight can’t do this and that it turns off as 
soon as the charger is plugged in (according to an Amazon customer who 
answered my question). Hmmm…I’m testing it now with a Cygolight Streak 350 
USB that I have. Seems to be working…at least the light didn’t turn off 
right away when I plugged it into the battery pack. I’ll have to let it run 
for a while and see what happens.


So now I’m wondering what other lights this works for and which ones it 
doesn’t work for. I guess it doesn’t really matter because I would use the 
third bright light only as a High Beam for short periods when I really need 
it. I’m not going to leave it continuously on and blind people.


So…has anybody else tried something like this…successfully or otherwise? 
Which lights work and which ones don't?


Doug


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Re: [RBW] No free electronic version of RR #44?

[Doug Williams]

I don't mind paying for them. We can't expect to get them for free when Riv 
puts so much time and work into them. I just wish they had 1-39 on USB in 
stock. I've been waiting for a while now. I have all the later issues, but 
I wish I had "the early years". 

Doug

On Friday, February 5, 2016 at 6:03:11 AM UTC-8, Skenry wrote:
>
> Not from what I've heard yet.   Gotta make the dollars I guess.
> Scott
>
> On Fri, Feb 5, 2016 at 2:32 AM, eliu01  
> wrote:
>
>> At http://www.rivbike.com/product-p/rr.htm and, I think, in older posts 
>> here Grant said that starting with RR #42 that future issues would be 
>> available for free as a PDF.  Anyone know if the same will apply to RR #44?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Eric Liu
>> SF, CA
>>
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>>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Dyno light recommendation

[Doug Williams]

Yes, Zendure is made in China but they were designed in the USA as a 
Kickstarter. They have proven to be quite reliable, definitely more than a 
few steps ahead of the pack. The Shutter Precision dynamos that everyone is 
raving about are made in Taiwan.

Zendures can be run over by a car with no damage and none have burst into 
flames as some have feared. My example was the 2nd Gen A3: 10,000mAh with 
two USB ports for only $37 and weighing 204 grams. Not exactly a car 
battery. No, I'm not in league with Zendure and I get nothing from them. 
Just saying...technology marches on. Even dyno systems benefit from a 
battery so that the lights, etc. can run when the bike is stopped.

Doug

On Saturday, January 30, 2016 at 9:12:30 AM UTC-8, Benz, Sunnyvale, CA 
wrote:
>
> I can't help but wonder what corners have been cut and/or sacrifices made 
> to be able to sell a 10Ah battery for $37. For example, I'm pretty sure 
> these are from China and I would be curious about the environmental and 
> societal impact of benefitting from paying only $37 for such a battery. 
> Yeah, 1st world problems...
>
>
> On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 9:19:03 PM UTC-8, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> Bill and Joe,
>>
>>
>> Yes, of course. I didn’t mean to demean dynohubs and certainly not the 
>> people who use them. My point is that just a few years ago dynohubs were 
>> the clear winner for anyone doing longer rides. But batteries are really 
>> getting stronger, cheaper, and lighter. Like 10,000mAh with two USB ports 
>> for only $37 and weighing 204 grams. That’s hard for a dyno to beat now and 
>> batteries are getting better all the time. In contrast, unless there is 
>> some breakthrough, dynohub technology is pretty much as good as it will 
>> ever be.
>>
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 6:05:58 PM UTC-8, joe b. wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Doug,
>>>
>>> Re: why some still use dynamo hubs
>>>
>>> Gone are the days when dynamo hubs were "
>>> ​
>>> 575 to 720 grams and cost from $257 to $426." Shutter Precision's hubs 
>>> are sub-400g and around $120. Don't forget to subtract the weight of a 
>>> front hub, too. The weight penalty for a dyno is a measly 250g or so these 
>>> days. And, the head and tail lights are superlight!
>>>
>>> How much do all those batteries weigh again? 
>>>
>>> But, more to your question, it's mostly convenience and range anxiety 
>>> for me. I already have enough gadgets to recharge. Definitely don't need 
>>> four(!) more. And, even though I rarely do it any more, I still enjoy 
>>> riding through the night without worrying that one of my batteries will 
>>> give out. 
>>>
>>> I'm glad to know about the new battery options, though. Sounds like 
>>> they've gotten better!
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> joe
>>> pdx or
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 4:52 PM, Doug Williams <sal...@minbaritm.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Warning: Heresy and Impiety follow! I know that we are all 
>>>> retro-grouches here and my AHH shifts 8-speed friction on Silver’s. 
>>>> Friction shifting will never die so long as I live. But I honestly think 
>>>> that technology has left dynohubs in the dustbin of history.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I run two Ixon Core battery powered (USB rechargeable) lights. Made by 
>>>> Busch & Müller; I got them from Peter White, see them here: 
>>>> http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The light output and beam shape are both outstanding. The batteries 
>>>> last plenty long too (3 hours on high power and 15 hours on low power). 
>>>> But 
>>>> if I’m going on a REALLY long night ride and/or I want to run the lights 
>>>> at 
>>>> high-power for the whole ride, I just plug them into my Zendure USB power 
>>>> bank battery and I can charge my lights even when they are in use. The 
>>>> Zendure’s come in several sizes from 6,700mAh to 25,600mAh and weights 
>>>> from 
>>>> 136 grams to 725 grams (for the really ridiculously powered model). The 
>>>> thing is, even the small ones are enough to run my phone for navigation 
>>>> (Ride with GPS sucks power in navigation mode) and my lights at full power 
>>>> for much longer than I need. I keep the Zendure in my Sackville TrunkSack 
>>>> Small and the lights and bag are both mounted on my front Mark’s Rack.
>>>>

[RBW] Re: Dyno light recommendation

[Doug Williams]

I agree there, and I would want that "no worries" aspect for my lights, 
just leaving them on day and night. But the other problem with dyno's is 
limited output. If you are only going to run a LED light or two, no 
problem. But if you want to also charge your phone/GPS and your GoPro...a 
dyno won't handle that. I can select a battery that will power everything 
for as long as I like and still be as light as a dyno. If a dyno could 
power all my toys at once, I would be sold. If a dyno could run my lights 
continuously AND slowly charge a small battery pack at the same time (so I 
could rotate two packs for my other toys), I would be sold.

Again, I don't mean to be contentious, if there is such a dyno with higher 
output, please point me to it. I would gladly push a little more weight and 
drag to get enough output to run continuous lights and charge my phone at 
the same time. But the last thing I want is for my phone/navigation/GPS to 
give out in the middle of the night. I'm old, senile, and I easily become 
lost. So simultaneous lights AND navigation are important to me. But yeah, 
I don't need to run the GoPro, that's just for fun.

Doug

On Saturday, January 30, 2016 at 5:32:12 AM UTC-8, Julian wrote:
>
> Doug, 
>
> I commute, and the "it's there, no worries" aspect of dynohubs cannot be 
> overstated. 
>
> I also go on multi-day tours, self-supported, and in that case in addition 
> to providing light at night the dynohub charges a battery pack during the 
> day so that phone, GPS, camera, tablet, Kindle (all wonderful 
> battery-powered gizmos) can be charged easily without having to worry about 
> plugging in. No hunting for outlets in cafes or bathrooms, no sitting with 
> your plugged-in gizmo for an hour in a bathroom waiting for a half charge 
> (or the battery pack) ... That's great! 
>
> Julian Westerhout
> Bloomington, IL 
>
> On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 6:52:51 PM UTC-6, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> Warning: Heresy and Impiety follow! I know that we are all retro-grouches 
>> here and my AHH shifts 8-speed friction on Silver’s. Friction shifting will 
>> never die so long as I live. But I honestly think that technology has left 
>> dynohubs in the dustbin of history.
>>
>>
>> I run two Ixon Core battery powered (USB rechargeable) lights. Made by 
>> Busch & Müller; I got them from Peter White, see them here: 
>> http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b
>>
>>
>> The light output and beam shape are both outstanding. The batteries last 
>> plenty long too (3 hours on high power and 15 hours on low power). But if 
>> I’m going on a REALLY long night ride and/or I want to run the lights at 
>> high-power for the whole ride, I just plug them into my Zendure USB power 
>> bank battery and I can charge my lights even when they are in use. The 
>> Zendure’s come in several sizes from 6,700mAh to 25,600mAh and weights from 
>> 136 grams to 725 grams (for the really ridiculously powered model). The 
>> thing is, even the small ones are enough to run my phone for navigation 
>> (Ride with GPS sucks power in navigation mode) and my lights at full power 
>> for much longer than I need. I keep the Zendure in my Sackville TrunkSack 
>> Small and the lights and bag are both mounted on my front Mark’s Rack.
>>
>>
>> Dyno hubs on Peter’s website weigh from 575 to 720 grams and cost from 
>> $257 to $426. USB battery banks like the Zendure weigh less and cost less 
>> than a dynohub. They also power more stuff (mostly 2 outputs but 4 on the 
>> big one) than a dynohub. They provide power for as long as a mortal can 
>> ride and don't require a special wheel.
>>
>>
>> So…why do we still ride dynohubs?
>>
>>
>> Doug
>>
>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Dyno light recommendation

[Doug Williams]

Hmmm...Since Zendure battery packs and some others have a "charge through 
capability" (they will power stuff while being charged themselves)...maybe 
what I need is a Zendure hooked up to a dynohub. The Zendure would power 
all the lights, phone, toys, etc. and the dyno would recharge the Zendure. 
I suppose that the system would run a small deficit (because the dyno 
couldn't quite keep up) and the Zendure would eventually need to be plugged 
in...but that would take a LONG time. Has anyone run something like that?

Doug

On Saturday, January 30, 2016 at 6:55:26 AM UTC-8, Doug Williams wrote:
>
> I agree there, and I would want that "no worries" aspect for my lights, 
> just leaving them on day and night. But the other problem with dyno's is 
> limited output. If you are only going to run a LED light or two, no 
> problem. But if you want to also charge your phone/GPS and your GoPro...a 
> dyno won't handle that. I can select a battery that will power everything 
> for as long as I like and still be as light as a dyno. If a dyno could 
> power all my toys at once, I would be sold. If a dyno could run my lights 
> continuously AND slowly charge a small battery pack at the same time (so I 
> could rotate two packs for my other toys), I would be sold.
>
> Again, I don't mean to be contentious, if there is such a dyno with higher 
> output, please point me to it. I would gladly push a little more weight and 
> drag to get enough output to run continuous lights and charge my phone at 
> the same time. But the last thing I want is for my phone/navigation/GPS to 
> give out in the middle of the night. I'm old, senile, and I easily become 
> lost. So simultaneous lights AND navigation are important to me. But yeah, 
> I don't need to run the GoPro, that's just for fun.
>
> Doug
>
>
>>>>

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[RBW] Re: Dyno light recommendation

[Doug Williams]

Brian,

I'm certainly with you on the "blinding issue". But there are smartly 
designed battery lights as well. I have the Ixon Core battery powered 
lights made by Busch & Müller and there are a few others. It seems that the 
Germans have cornered the market on intelligently designed beam patterns. I 
think it is due to German legislation that we should copy here.

Doug


On Saturday, January 30, 2016 at 12:24:42 PM UTC-8, stonehog wrote:
>
> I ride dyno hubs so I never have to think/worry/bother with lighting.  I 
> never have to charge anything.  I never have to carry something extra.  I 
> can go on a five-minute run to the store, or a 30-hour brevet through the 
> dark countryside.  Haven't worried about lights for going on 4 or 5 years 
> now.  It's just simple.  I also get a smug sense of satisfaction that I'm 
> providing the power.  That's technically and socially cool.  
>
> I also have a lot of options with high-quality lights that I don't yet 
> have with battery powered lights.  Lights that direct the beam where it 
> needs to go - not in other road/trail users eyes.
>
> ***warning - rant - look away***  It seems like I am constantly being 
> blinded these days on my commute on the Burke Gilman by people who now have 
> lights that should be used for cave exploration or riding 40mph through the 
> woods. Then there are the folks that somehow manage to see in front of them 
> with a B - l - I - N - k - I - n - G front light.  On a trail only used by 
> walkers and bikers.  What - are they worried that I won't see them and run 
> into them head on?  Wow.  This isn't even just selfish, or extra cautious. 
>  This is getting to the point of extremely dangerous.  Between the lights, 
> and the helmets, and the vests, and the airbag neck gaiters, is this just a 
> giant conspiracy to end "the ride"?
> *** ok - feel better now ***
>
> Perhaps I just need to find a welding goggle that electronically cancels 
> blinking lights and mutes all ridiculous blinding beams.  It may be the 
> only way to fight the continued onslaught of "*stupid-dangerous lights".
>
> Brian Hanson
> Seattle, WA
>
> * my term and my opinion
>
> On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 4:52:51 PM UTC-8, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> Warning: Heresy and Impiety follow! I know that we are all retro-grouches 
>> here and my AHH shifts 8-speed friction on Silver’s. Friction shifting will 
>> never die so long as I live. But I honestly think that technology has left 
>> dynohubs in the dustbin of history.
>>
>>
>> I run two Ixon Core battery powered (USB rechargeable) lights. Made by 
>> Busch & Müller; I got them from Peter White, see them here: 
>> http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b
>>
>>
>> The light output and beam shape are both outstanding. The batteries last 
>> plenty long too (3 hours on high power and 15 hours on low power). But if 
>> I’m going on a REALLY long night ride and/or I want to run the lights at 
>> high-power for the whole ride, I just plug them into my Zendure USB power 
>> bank battery and I can charge my lights even when they are in use. The 
>> Zendure’s come in several sizes from 6,700mAh to 25,600mAh and weights from 
>> 136 grams to 725 grams (for the really ridiculously powered model). The 
>> thing is, even the small ones are enough to run my phone for navigation 
>> (Ride with GPS sucks power in navigation mode) and my lights at full power 
>> for much longer than I need. I keep the Zendure in my Sackville TrunkSack 
>> Small and the lights and bag are both mounted on my front Mark’s Rack.
>>
>>
>> Dyno hubs on Peter’s website weigh from 575 to 720 grams and cost from 
>> $257 to $426. USB battery banks like the Zendure weigh less and cost less 
>> than a dynohub. They also power more stuff (mostly 2 outputs but 4 on the 
>> big one) than a dynohub. They provide power for as long as a mortal can 
>> ride and don't require a special wheel.
>>
>>
>> So…why do we still ride dynohubs?
>>
>>
>> Doug
>>
>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Dyno light recommendation

[Doug Williams]

Warning: Heresy and Impiety follow! I know that we are all retro-grouches 
here and my AHH shifts 8-speed friction on Silver’s. Friction shifting will 
never die so long as I live. But I honestly think that technology has left 
dynohubs in the dustbin of history.


I run two Ixon Core battery powered (USB rechargeable) lights. Made by 
Busch & Müller; I got them from Peter White, see them here: 
http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b


The light output and beam shape are both outstanding. The batteries last 
plenty long too (3 hours on high power and 15 hours on low power). But if 
I’m going on a REALLY long night ride and/or I want to run the lights at 
high-power for the whole ride, I just plug them into my Zendure USB power 
bank battery and I can charge my lights even when they are in use. The 
Zendure’s come in several sizes from 6,700mAh to 25,600mAh and weights from 
136 grams to 725 grams (for the really ridiculously powered model). The 
thing is, even the small ones are enough to run my phone for navigation 
(Ride with GPS sucks power in navigation mode) and my lights at full power 
for much longer than I need. I keep the Zendure in my Sackville TrunkSack 
Small and the lights and bag are both mounted on my front Mark’s Rack.


Dyno hubs on Peter’s website weigh from 575 to 720 grams and cost from $257 
to $426. USB battery banks like the Zendure weigh less and cost less than a 
dynohub. They also power more stuff (mostly 2 outputs but 4 on the big one) 
than a dynohub. They provide power for as long as a mortal can ride and 
don't require a special wheel.


So…why do we still ride dynohubs?


Doug


>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Dyno light recommendation

[Doug Williams]

Bill and Joe,


Yes, of course. I didn’t mean to demean dynohubs and certainly not the 
people who use them. My point is that just a few years ago dynohubs were 
the clear winner for anyone doing longer rides. But batteries are really 
getting stronger, cheaper, and lighter. Like 10,000mAh with two USB ports 
for only $37 and weighing 204 grams. That’s hard for a dyno to beat now and 
batteries are getting better all the time. In contrast, unless there is 
some breakthrough, dynohub technology is pretty much as good as it will 
ever be.


Doug

On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 6:05:58 PM UTC-8, joe b. wrote:
>
> Hi Doug,
>
> Re: why some still use dynamo hubs
>
> Gone are the days when dynamo hubs were "
> ​
> 575 to 720 grams and cost from $257 to $426." Shutter Precision's hubs are 
> sub-400g and around $120. Don't forget to subtract the weight of a front 
> hub, too. The weight penalty for a dyno is a measly 250g or so these days. 
> And, the head and tail lights are superlight!
>
> How much do all those batteries weigh again? 
>
> But, more to your question, it's mostly convenience and range anxiety for 
> me. I already have enough gadgets to recharge. Definitely don't need 
> four(!) more. And, even though I rarely do it any more, I still enjoy 
> riding through the night without worrying that one of my batteries will 
> give out. 
>
> I'm glad to know about the new battery options, though. Sounds like 
> they've gotten better!
>
> Best,
> joe
> pdx or
>
>  
>
> On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 4:52 PM, Doug Williams <sal...@minbaritm.com 
> > wrote:
>
>> Warning: Heresy and Impiety follow! I know that we are all retro-grouches 
>> here and my AHH shifts 8-speed friction on Silver’s. Friction shifting will 
>> never die so long as I live. But I honestly think that technology has left 
>> dynohubs in the dustbin of history.
>>
>>
>> I run two Ixon Core battery powered (USB rechargeable) lights. Made by 
>> Busch & Müller; I got them from Peter White, see them here: 
>> http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b
>>
>>
>> The light output and beam shape are both outstanding. The batteries last 
>> plenty long too (3 hours on high power and 15 hours on low power). But if 
>> I’m going on a REALLY long night ride and/or I want to run the lights at 
>> high-power for the whole ride, I just plug them into my Zendure USB power 
>> bank battery and I can charge my lights even when they are in use. The 
>> Zendure’s come in several sizes from 6,700mAh to 25,600mAh and weights from 
>> 136 grams to 725 grams (for the really ridiculously powered model). The 
>> thing is, even the small ones are enough to run my phone for navigation 
>> (Ride with GPS sucks power in navigation mode) and my lights at full power 
>> for much longer than I need. I keep the Zendure in my Sackville TrunkSack 
>> Small and the lights and bag are both mounted on my front Mark’s Rack.
>>
>>
>> ​​
>> Dyno hubs on Peter’s website weigh from 
>> ​​
>> 575 to 720 grams and cost from $257 to $426. USB battery banks like the 
>> Zendure weigh less and cost less than a dynohub. They also power more stuff 
>> (mostly 2 outputs but 4 on the big one) than a dynohub. They provide power 
>> for as long as a mortal can ride and don't require a special wheel.
>>
>>
>> So…why do we still ride dynohubs?
>>
>>
>> Doug
>>
>>
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>
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[RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Do you shame people who ride the wrong way against traffic? Or is that okay 
as long as they are wearing their helmet? Wearing a helmet is prudent. 
Again, I wear mine every time I ride. But it is the LEAST important safety 
measure that you can take behind (in order)  1. Bike Control,  2. Rule 
Compliance, 3. Lane Position, and 4. Hazard Avoidance. Each of these 
elements (1-4) have many details and procedures attached to them, and each 
of these details is much more important than wearing a helmet. It is MUCH 
safer to ride properly without a helmet than it is to ride with a helmet 
and violate 1-4 above. You like data? YES, the data says that 1-4 above are 
much more important to safety than wearing a helmet. MUCH more important.

So who should be shamed? Someone who rides properly without a helmet? Or 
someone who wears a helmet and rides improperly? I would take off my 
helmet, have three beers, and ride properly before I would wear a helmet 
and ride against traffic. I would be much safer riding helmet-less but 
properly after 3 beers than I would be riding against traffic sober wearing 
a full face motorcycle helmet. Yet wearing a helmet seems to be the only 
measure of bicycle safety and responsibility for the helmet zealots. We 
need to take a broader view.

Do you want to determine if an accident was the fault of a bicyclist so 
that you can properly shame him? If so, "Was he wearing a helmet?" should 
be the LAST question you ask, not the first.

Doug

On Tuesday, November 24, 2015 at 6:11:10 PM UTC-8, Will wrote:
>
> If data indicates that helmets mitigate head damage and if you choose to 
> ignore that data... whose lives have you compromised? 
>
> Yours? For sure. 
>
> Your wife's, your children... well... maybe the shame label is 
> appropriate. I'll accept that opinion. 
>
> On Tuesday, November 24, 2015 at 5:37:13 PM UTC-6, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> Yes, and you also disrespect your family when you fail to wear a helmet 
>> in your car or while walking on the street, both of which are more 
>> dangerous than bicycling. This is just the kind of "helmet shaming" that I 
>> am talking about.
>>
>> On Tuesday, November 24, 2015 at 1:40:03 PM UTC-8, Will wrote:
>>>
>>> Kelly,
>>>
>>> I think there's another perspective that has not been mentioned here...
>>>
>>> When I was sitting outside the ER waiting for the Cat-Scans on my wife, 
>>> I realized that her injuries were not simply hers. Her injuries belonged to 
>>> our children, our parents, our neighbors... 
>>>
>>> The decision to wear, or not wear, a helmet isn't singular. We have 
>>> networks of family and friends who suffer when we are injured. The assumed 
>>> risk is not singular. Families and friends pick up the pieces. Jan Heine 
>>> was very fortunate to have a good friend drop everything to shepherd him 
>>> home from Taiwan. 
>>>
>>> The decision to mitigate risk should recognize those who will bear the 
>>> burden of loss. It's not about laws. It's about common sense. It's about 
>>> respect for your loved ones.  
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Newest Rivendell poster child

[Doug Williams]

LOL, hey...I noticed the fender issue too. No fender on the front, and the 
fender line on the rear is just terrible! Bars are too low and I don't like 
straight bars or single speeds. Frame is nice, though. I guess that we are 
a hopeless bunch.

Doug

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 8:43:55 AM UTC-8, Eric Norris wrote:
>
> Oh, the bike has fenders? Hadn't noticed ...
>
> --Eric N
> www.CampyOnly.com 
> CampyOnlyGuy.blogspot.com 
> Twitter: @CampyOnlyGuy
>
> On Nov 25, 2015, at 10:20 AM, David Person  > wrote:
>
> No that anyone is looking at the bike, but that fender line could use some 
> serious work.
>
> David P.
>
> On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 5:22:47 AM UTC-8, Garth wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>>   Fashionistas "just ride" too  . . . . as does anyone who rides 
>>
>>
>>
>>
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[RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Will,

I think we are on the same page. I don't think we should be shaming 
bicyclists for anything. I was just reacting to the people who say we 
should shame people for not wearing a helmet. But if not wearing a helmet 
is a decision that results in an accident that is a "shared event" that 
effects your family...then surely riding the wrong way against traffic and 
having an accident is also such a "shared event". As a bicycle safety 
instructor, I am tired of people labeling cyclists as "good" or "bad" 
solely on the basis of helmet use. Riding the wrong way against traffic is 
just one example of bad (and quite common) behavior, but it is WAY more 
dangerous than not wearing a helmet. Yet you rarely hear the helmet zealots 
shame someone for riding the wrong way, even though that behavior endangers 
both the wrong way cyclist and all the lawful cyclists who are often forced 
into the traffic lane to go around a "bike salmon".

In the media, "Was he or she wearing a helmet?" is always the first 
question. We had a bike fatality here recently in which a truck (going over 
50 MPH) crossed the center line and hit a cyclist, killing her instantly. 
The newspaper reported that the bicyclist was not wearing a helmet. Like a 
helmet would have saved her? Ok...it turns out that the bicyclist was hit 
HEAD ON because she was riding against traffic. But the newspaper said 
nothing of that. I'm not saying that she couldn't have been hit by a truck 
while riding WITH traffic, but clearly riding correctly would have saved 
her in this instance (because the truck crossed the median). But, according 
to the newspaper, she was a bad cyclist not because she was riding the 
wrong way, but because she didn't have a helmet.

Doug

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 8:29:04 AM UTC-8, Will wrote:
>
> Geez Doug, I think this shaming business is getting a little too deep. 
>
> My suggestion, most simply put, is that one wears a helmet to protect 
> their family. It's not a personal decision, it's a communal decision. It's 
> not about shame. It's about risk evaluation. 
>
> I reached that conclusion via personal exposure to the vaguries of bike 
> riding. My wife had a serious bike wreck. I admit bias. But it's not 
> academic bias, or bias simply to argue x or y on bike groups, it's bias 
> that was informed by 7 cat-scans. 
>
> I don't rank riding habits.. so wearing a helment versis riding against 
> traffic, not having a blinky, or drinking beer is not meaningful to me. I 
> ride daily. My entire family rides daily. Our riding habits are highy 
> skewed to safe behaviors. We have lights. We all wear those big Riv 
> reflector triangles. Our pedals have reflectors. We wear helmets, etc...
>
> Whether you wear a helmet is obviously your choice. I'm not advocating 
> mandatory laws. I am simply making the case for recognizing that accidents 
> are SHARED EVENTS. If you screw up, you family bears the weight. Your 
> decision tree needs to include that contingency. 
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 9:54:47 AM UTC-6, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> Do you shame people who ride the wrong way against traffic? Or is that 
>> okay as long as they are wearing their helmet? Wearing a helmet is prudent. 
>> Again, I wear mine every time I ride. But it is the LEAST important safety 
>> measure that you can take behind (in order)  1. Bike Control,  2. Rule 
>> Compliance, 3. Lane Position, and 4. Hazard Avoidance. Each of these 
>> elements (1-4) have many details and procedures attached to them, and each 
>> of these details is much more important than wearing a helmet. It is MUCH 
>> safer to ride properly without a helmet than it is to ride with a helmet 
>> and violate 1-4 above. You like data? YES, the data says that 1-4 above are 
>> much more important to safety than wearing a helmet. MUCH more important.
>>
>> So who should be shamed? Someone who rides properly without a helmet? Or 
>> someone who wears a helmet and rides improperly? I would take off my 
>> helmet, have three beers, and ride properly before I would wear a helmet 
>> and ride against traffic. I would be much safer riding helmet-less but 
>> properly after 3 beers than I would be riding against traffic sober wearing 
>> a full face motorcycle helmet. Yet wearing a helmet seems to be the only 
>> measure of bicycle safety and responsibility for the helmet zealots. We 
>> need to take a broader view.
>>
>> Do you want to determine if an accident was the fault of a bicyclist so 
>> that you can properly shame him? If so, "Was he wearing a helmet?" should 
>> be the LAST question you ask, not the first.
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> On Tuesday, November 24, 20

[RBW] Re: Newest Rivendell poster child

[Doug Williams]

Ah! That would explain the painfully ugly fender line. Not that I'll 
forgive her for riding a fixie anyway. I guess I have to give her points 
for having both front and rear brakes on a fixie. But really, does she look 
like she changes her own flats? No saddlebag...tools must be in her 
backpack or stuffed in her fur scarf. Or is the guy on the motorcycle her 
support crew?

Doug

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 11:20:14 AM UTC-8, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> I think she done it on purpose because its a fixie to get the wheel out 
> for a flat change.
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Yes, and you also disrespect your family when you fail to wear a helmet in 
your car or while walking on the street, both of which are more dangerous 
than bicycling. This is just the kind of "helmet shaming" that I am talking 
about.

On Tuesday, November 24, 2015 at 1:40:03 PM UTC-8, Will wrote:
>
> Kelly,
>
> I think there's another perspective that has not been mentioned here...
>
> When I was sitting outside the ER waiting for the Cat-Scans on my wife, I 
> realized that her injuries were not simply hers. Her injuries belonged to 
> our children, our parents, our neighbors... 
>
> The decision to wear, or not wear, a helmet isn't singular. We have 
> networks of family and friends who suffer when we are injured. The assumed 
> risk is not singular. Families and friends pick up the pieces. Jan Heine 
> was very fortunate to have a good friend drop everything to shepherd him 
> home from Taiwan. 
>
> The decision to mitigate risk should recognize those who will bear the 
> burden of loss. It's not about laws. It's about common sense. It's about 
> respect for your loved ones.  
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

That's what I have been saying all along. I choose to wear a helmet.  I 
encourage others to wear a helmet. But I don't support mandatory helmet laws 
and I don't insult or shame those who choose not to wear a helmet. That reduces 
ridership. Reduced ridership hurts everyone.

Just Ride! 

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[RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Benz brings up a very good point, and we should listen to him because he 
has experience in these things. Yes, many such “studies” are political in 
nature and funded by special interests. So…I don’t know about this study, 
but many such studies have been funded by the automobile insurance industry 
and auto interest groups such as AAA. They don’t get insurance premium 
payments from bicyclists and their members don’t like having to steer 
around bicyclists on the road. So they have an interest in getting 
bicyclists off of the road. Hence…mandatory helmet laws! Mandatory helmet 
laws have proven to be an extremely effective way to reduce ridership. So 
any “study” that recommends mandatory helmet laws without addressing the 
reduced ridership that such laws would cause is immediately suspect.


Bottom line, anybody who recommends mandatory helmet laws without 
acknowledging that mandatory helmet laws reduce bicycle ridership is full 
of BS. I can’t put it in a nicer way. Again, I am pro-helmet. I am an LCI 
(bicycle safety instructor). I teach bicycle safety in schools all the 
time. We give them helmets, we make them wear them during class and we 
encourage them to wear them when the class is over. But many kids (and 
adults) don’t like wearing helmets and making them wear a helmet reduces 
ridership. I wish that this was not true, but my wishing does not change 
the truth. Study after study has proven that mandatory helmet laws reduce 
ridership. My own personal experience is that mandatory helmet use reduces 
ridership. Just ask any potential bicycle rider. The truth that mandatory 
helmet use reduces ridership is intuitively obvious to the casual observer! 
Does anyone honestly dispute this truth? Why don’t mandatory helmet law 
supporters ever mention this simple truth?


Ron Mc wonders if the surgeons have helmets for sale. Probably not, in my 
view; I still put my money on AAA to be the financiers for this study. But 
then the study identifies lower facial injuries as a problem, so maybe they 
want to develop full face helmets for bicyclists and make them mandatory. 
That should get those pesky bicyclists off of the road! Interesting though 
is the fact that the study says nothing about neck injuries. Most other 
studies recognize the fact that helmets INCREASE neck injuries. This is 
because the helmet catches on the ground or other objects and twists the 
neck. I have seen figures that helmets reduce head injuries by 15% but 
increase neck injuries by 11%. I would be interested in reading another 
impartial study that would scientifically measure helmet 
effectiveness…clearly, this study we are discussing here does not qualify.


Steve, I don’t think that Garth and Benz are the least bit cynical. They 
are just realistic.

 

Doug

 

On Tuesday, November 24, 2015 at 8:23:46 AM UTC-8, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> The IQ of the counter-helmet arguments continues to plummet.  
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Okay, what do you suggest? Should we pass mandatory helmet laws that will 
reduce ridership so that doctors won't be traumatized by injured bicyclists? 
Even though:

1) The few remaining bicyclists will be at greater risk.

2) Many more people will die of obesity and other fitness related diseases. 
(And motor vehicle accidents).

3) More cars will clog our roads and pollute our air. (The list goes on).

I'm just saying that those advocating mandatory helmet laws need to address ALL 
of the facts and policy concerns that accompany those laws.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Quoting from the article: "As a result of their findings, Drs. Haider and 
Joseph said that the next step is to create injury prevention programs to 
increase helmet use among bicyclists, to manufacture better helmets, and to 
develop and enforce stricter laws for helmet use."

Doug

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 6:55:31 AM UTC-8, Doug Williams wrote:
>
> Umm...Eric...read the article again. The authors of the study recommended 
> mandatory helmet laws.
>
> On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 6:16:27 AM UTC-8, Eric Norris wrote:
>>
>> Well said, Steve. Nobody is suggesting mandatory helmets--on bikes, in 
>> the shower, or elsewhere. 
>>
>> Eric N
>> www.CampyOnly.com <http://www.campyonly.com>
>> CampyOnlyGuy.blogspot.com <http://campyonlyguy.blogspot.com>
>> Twitter: @CampyOnlyGuy
>>
>> On Nov 23, 2015, at 5:10 AM, Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com> wrote:
>>
>> When did mandatory helmet laws enter this discussion?  I didn't read the 
>> article all that closely, but the gist of it as I recall it is that the 
>> wearing of helmets was in fact effective in the cases cited.  That itself 
>> has been called in question in the past, and it is worthwhile attempting to 
>> answer it.  And within that context, the introduction of mandatory helmet 
>> laws/helmet wars is an irrelevant distraction.  One can be for the wearing 
>> of helmets but against mandatory helmet laws; I am and I know many others 
>> who feel the same way.  In fact, although I know many, many helmet users I 
>> don't know anyone who favors criminalizing the not wearing of them.
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Umm...Eric...read the article again. The authors of the study recommended 
mandatory helmet laws.

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 6:16:27 AM UTC-8, Eric Norris wrote:
>
> Well said, Steve. Nobody is suggesting mandatory helmets--on bikes, in the 
> shower, or elsewhere. 
>
> Eric N
> www.CampyOnly.com <http://www.campyonly.com>
> CampyOnlyGuy.blogspot.com <http://campyonlyguy.blogspot.com>
> Twitter: @CampyOnlyGuy
>
> On Nov 23, 2015, at 5:10 AM, Steve Palincsar <pali...@his.com 
> > wrote:
>
> When did mandatory helmet laws enter this discussion?  I didn't read the 
> article all that closely, but the gist of it as I recall it is that the 
> wearing of helmets was in fact effective in the cases cited.  That itself 
> has been called in question in the past, and it is worthwhile attempting to 
> answer it.  And within that context, the introduction of mandatory helmet 
> laws/helmet wars is an irrelevant distraction.  One can be for the wearing 
> of helmets but against mandatory helmet laws; I am and I know many others 
> who feel the same way.  In fact, although I know many, many helmet users I 
> don't know anyone who favors criminalizing the not wearing of them.
>
> On 11/23/2015 12:19 AM, Doug Williams wrote:
>
> Hey, I wear my helmet all the time, but…The article fails to mention 
> several OTHER important facts. Because of this, the study simply can’t be 
> taken seriously. You simply can’t pick only the facts that support your 
> desired conclusion; you must weigh all the facts. Those advocating helmet 
> laws can't ignore other inconvenient facts that don’t support their 
> conclusion. That’s not how science works, and anyone who ignores 
> established and pertinent facts when making their conclusion shouldn’t be 
> taken seriously. Let’s start by granting their single fact that helmets may 
> reduce injuries in the event of a crash. This single fact has to be weighed 
> against the other proven facts before we can arrive at a conclusion that 
> mandatory helmet laws save lives.
>
>
> Fact 1: Mandatory Helmet Laws reduced ridership. This has been proven over 
> and over again in study after study.
>
>
> Fact 2: Bicycling in general is safer with more bicycles on the road. 
> Drivers get used to seeing bicycles and become accustomed to them. The 
> drivers then act more safely around bicycles. This is also well documented.
>
>
> Fact 3: Bicycling is much safer than they represent when the risk of 
> bicycle injury is weighed against other known risks. Many, many, more 
> people would be saved by mandatory helmet laws for pedestrians and 
> motorists. Around 4,500 pedestrians and 45,000 motorists are killed in 
> accidents each year in the U.S. The percentage of these people who would 
> have reduced injuries with a helmet is similar to that for bicyclists. Why 
> not save these people as well? I’ll take these people seriously when they 
> propose a UNIVERSAL helmet law for everyone instead of just for bicyclists.
>
>
> Fact 4: Around 600 bicyclists die each year in the U.S. but well over 
> 300,000 die of obesity and lack of exercise related diseases. The reduced 
> ridership caused by mandatory helmet laws would cause more deaths from 
> reduced health status than would be saved by helmets. 
>
> All “studies” that argue for mandatory helmet laws ignore the above facts. 
> Find me a study that doesn’t and then we can reopen the helmet wars. In the 
> meantime…yawn.
>
> On Sunday, November 22, 2015 at 7:02:05 PM UTC-8, Eric Norris wrote: 
>>
>> Not that this is going to change a single mind on the subject, but it is 
>> perhaps of interest to some: 
>>
>> https://www.facs.org/media/press-releases/2015/haider 
>>
>> And yes, I realize that the helmet and non-helmet camps have firmly 
>> established their entrenched positions, which have been expressed many 
>> times on this forum.
>>
>> --Eric Norris
>> campyo...@me.com
>> <http://www.campyonly.com>www.campyonly.com
>> campyonlyguy.blogspot.com 
>>
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[RBW] Re: Smart Guys: Bicycle Helmets Reduce Injuries

[Doug Williams]

Hey, I wear my helmet all the time, but…The article fails to mention 
several OTHER important facts. Because of this, the study simply can’t be 
taken seriously. You simply can’t pick only the facts that support your 
desired conclusion; you must weigh all the facts. Those advocating helmet 
laws can't ignore other inconvenient facts that don’t support their 
conclusion. That’s not how science works, and anyone who ignores 
established and pertinent facts when making their conclusion shouldn’t be 
taken seriously. Let’s start by granting their single fact that helmets may 
reduce injuries in the event of a crash. This single fact has to be weighed 
against the other proven facts before we can arrive at a conclusion that 
mandatory helmet laws save lives.


Fact 1: Mandatory Helmet Laws reduced ridership. This has been proven over 
and over again in study after study.


Fact 2: Bicycling in general is safer with more bicycles on the road. 
Drivers get used to seeing bicycles and become accustomed to them. The 
drivers then act more safely around bicycles. This is also well documented.


Fact 3: Bicycling is much safer than they represent when the risk of 
bicycle injury is weighed against other known risks. Many, many, more 
people would be saved by mandatory helmet laws for pedestrians and 
motorists. Around 4,500 pedestrians and 45,000 motorists are killed in 
accidents each year in the U.S. The percentage of these people who would 
have reduced injuries with a helmet is similar to that for bicyclists. Why 
not save these people as well? I’ll take these people seriously when they 
propose a UNIVERSAL helmet law for everyone instead of just for bicyclists.


Fact 4: Around 600 bicyclists die each year in the U.S. but well over 
300,000 die of obesity and lack of exercise related diseases. The reduced 
ridership caused by mandatory helmet laws would cause more deaths from 
reduced health status than would be saved by helmets. 

All “studies” that argue for mandatory helmet laws ignore the above facts. 
Find me a study that doesn’t and then we can reopen the helmet wars. In the 
meantime…yawn.

On Sunday, November 22, 2015 at 7:02:05 PM UTC-8, Eric Norris wrote:
>
> Not that this is going to change a single mind on the subject, but it is 
> perhaps of interest to some:
>
> https://www.facs.org/media/press-releases/2015/haider 
>
> And yes, I realize that the helmet and non-helmet camps have firmly 
> established their entrenched positions, which have been expressed many 
> times on this forum.
>
> --Eric Norris
> campyo...@me.com 
> www.campyonly.com
> campyonlyguy.blogspot.com 
>
>

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[RBW] Tektro Brake RL720 Interrupter Levers on Bosco Bars?

[Doug Williams]

I was thinking of putting Tektro Brake RL720 Interrupter Levers on my Bosco 
Bars. Riv says that they don't fit Bosco's because the clamp diameter of 
the bars is 22.2mm and the Interrupter levers are designed for a 24.0 clamp 
diameter bars. But...really? Can't I just add a wrap or two of friction 
tape to the bars before I put on the Tektro Brake RL720 Interrupter Levers? 
What about just putting them on over the bar wrap? (I use shellacked 
Newbaums)

Has anyone had success with the Tektro Brake RL720 Interrupter Levers on 
Bosco's? Are there other good interrupter levers that work with Bosco's?

Doug

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[RBW] Re: Keven

[Doug Williams]

>
> I would like to add my voice to the chorus of praise for Keven! Thanks for 
> all your patience and time when I was working out all the details of my 
> Homer. You made the experience a truly happy one that I will treasure!
>

Best of luck!

Doug 

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Re: [RBW] Waiting for newly tubeless tires before riding?

[Doug Williams]

I was going to say that I rode mine right away with no issues. But then you 
beat me to it. :-) Good for you! Remember this is the Rivendell list, so...
JUST RIDE

Doug

On Friday, October 9, 2015 at 4:31:54 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:
>
> Thanks, Joe. Jumped the gun and road them downtown this afternoon; all 
> well.
>
> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 3:17 PM, Joe Bartoe  > wrote:
>
>> Patrick,
>>
>> Keep spinning them to distribute the sealant for the rest of the day. If 
>> they hold pressure overnight then you should be able to ride them at that 
>> point.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Joe
>>
>> --
>> From: bert...@gmail.com 
>> Date: Fri, 9 Oct 2015 13:15:07 -0600
>> Subject: [RBW] Waiting for newly tubeless tires before riding?
>> To: rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
>>
>>
>> I had the Kojaks made tubeless today; they look as if they'll work fine. 
>> No apparent air leaks. 3-4 oz of Orange Seal.
>>
>> But how long ought I to leave them, for bead seating and sealing, before 
>> riding? Can I ride them right away?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
>> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
>> Other professional writing services.
>> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
>> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
>>
>> *
>> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
>> circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
>> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>>
>> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* Carthusian motto
>>  
>>
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
> Other professional writing services.
> http://www.resumespecialties.com/
> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
>
> *
> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
> circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>
> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* Carthusian motto
>  
>

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[RBW] Re: Compass Switchback on 58 Homer

[Doug Williams]

Thanks Dave! I was planning on the EL Switchbacks since I am loving the 
Babyshoe Pass EL's. I guess 49+mm would be really pushing my clearance. I 
might get away with it without my fenders, but then I think I'll wait until 
the rainy season passes before I try that. I wish that Compass would put 
the tubeless ready bead on the Babyshoe Pass. I suppose that isn't likely 
since they would have to make a new mold.

Doug

On Sunday, October 4, 2015 at 7:54:01 AM UTC-7, Dave Johnston wrote:
>
> I haven't even ridden them yet but I've been letting them sit at 55psi and 
> now at 26psi they measure 48.5mm on a PL23 rim. I expect them to grow to 
> 49+mm after riding awhile. (these are the EL version)
>
> -Dave J
>
> On Saturday, October 3, 2015 at 11:13:25 PM UTC-4, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> Will,
>>
>> True enough. I only weigh 165, so the 42's are wide enough in that 
>> regard. The Switchbacks are "tubeless ready" and that interested me. If 
>> Compass would give the Babyshoe Pass the new tubeless bead, I would be 
>> satisified.
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> On Saturday, October 3, 2015 at 7:09:31 PM UTC-7, Will wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm running 45s on my Atlantis with P65s. I don't think I'd notice the 
>>> difference if I was running 42s or 48s. The question is what do you weigh? 
>>> If your weight works with 42s, don't fret. I weigh 160, so my guess is I 
>>> could go to 35s and not feel any pain or feel compromised. I think we're 
>>> getting too fixated on tire width and extra leger sidewall buzz. 
>>>
>>> This is no different than the last era's fixation on frame weight and 
>>> indexed shifting. Just saying... :-) 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Saturday, October 3, 2015 at 5:36:39 PM UTC-5, Doug Williams wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I have a 58cm Homer. Recent build; I got it in May this year. So it is 
>>>> the largest of the 650b Homers, if that makes any difference. I am 
>>>> currently running the Compass Babyshoe Pass tires.  The Babyshoes measure 
>>>> darn close to the advertised 42mm. I have Paul Racer brakes and P55 SKS 
>>>> Longboards. Clearance is pretty darn good. In fact, I can take my 6mm 
>>>> Allen 
>>>> wrench and pass it through all the areas that require clearance. So my 
>>>> clearance is at least 6mm all around. Which leads up to my question:
>>>>
>>>> If I have 6mm all around and I only need 3mm for safety...that means 
>>>> that I have 3mm "surplus" clearance. So...will I get away with running the 
>>>> new 48mm Switchback Hill tires? I only need an extra 3mm per side, and I 
>>>> have it. Right? Or am I dreaming here?
>>>>
>>>> Doug
>>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Compass Switchback on 58 Homer

[Doug Williams]

Will,

True enough. I only weigh 165, so the 42's are wide enough in that regard. 
The Switchbacks are "tubeless ready" and that interested me. If Compass 
would give the Babyshoe Pass the new tubeless bead, I would be satisified.

Doug

On Saturday, October 3, 2015 at 7:09:31 PM UTC-7, Will wrote:
>
> I'm running 45s on my Atlantis with P65s. I don't think I'd notice the 
> difference if I was running 42s or 48s. The question is what do you weigh? 
> If your weight works with 42s, don't fret. I weigh 160, so my guess is I 
> could go to 35s and not feel any pain or feel compromised. I think we're 
> getting too fixated on tire width and extra leger sidewall buzz. 
>
> This is no different than the last era's fixation on frame weight and 
> indexed shifting. Just saying... :-) 
>
>
>
> On Saturday, October 3, 2015 at 5:36:39 PM UTC-5, Doug Williams wrote:
>>
>> I have a 58cm Homer. Recent build; I got it in May this year. So it is 
>> the largest of the 650b Homers, if that makes any difference. I am 
>> currently running the Compass Babyshoe Pass tires.  The Babyshoes measure 
>> darn close to the advertised 42mm. I have Paul Racer brakes and P55 SKS 
>> Longboards. Clearance is pretty darn good. In fact, I can take my 6mm Allen 
>> wrench and pass it through all the areas that require clearance. So my 
>> clearance is at least 6mm all around. Which leads up to my question:
>>
>> If I have 6mm all around and I only need 3mm for safety...that means that 
>> I have 3mm "surplus" clearance. So...will I get away with running the new 
>> 48mm Switchback Hill tires? I only need an extra 3mm per side, and I have 
>> it. Right? Or am I dreaming here?
>>
>> Doug
>>
>

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[RBW] Compass Knickers

[Doug Williams]

I was thinking of getting a pair of the Compass Knickers. Anybody have any 
experience with them?
https://www.compasscycle.com/shop/components/compass-knickers/

Doug

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[RBW] Compass Switchback on 58 Homer

[Doug Williams]

I have a 58cm Homer. Recent build; I got it in May this year. So it is the 
largest of the 650b Homers, if that makes any difference. I am currently 
running the Compass Babyshoe Pass tires.  The Babyshoes measure darn close 
to the advertised 42mm. I have Paul Racer brakes and P55 SKS Longboards. 
Clearance is pretty darn good. In fact, I can take my 6mm Allen wrench and 
pass it through all the areas that require clearance. So my clearance is at 
least 6mm all around. Which leads up to my question:

If I have 6mm all around and I only need 3mm for safety...that means that I 
have 3mm "surplus" clearance. So...will I get away with running the new 
48mm Switchback Hill tires? I only need an extra 3mm per side, and I have 
it. Right? Or am I dreaming here?

Doug

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Re: [RBW] Valve Stem eating Synergy Wheels

[Doug Williams]

I have been very happy with my tubeless Babyshoe Pass tires. See my post on 
this list. If you stick with tubes, try duct tape. You could reinforce the 
rim hole or the valve stem. Remember...if you can't fix it, duck it!

Doug

On Wednesday, September 23, 2015 at 8:11:21 PM UTC-7, cyclot...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> They're on my list!
>
> On Wed, Sep 23, 2015 at 7:45 PM, Edwin W  > wrote:
>
>> Argj! Just got another valve base tear on THAT rim. Kenda tube. I got 
>> some schwalbes and was explaining the fix to my 9 year old son.
>> Me: I think the fix is these expensive tubes. See, they have 
>> reinforcement in that area.
>> Him: how much are they?
>> Me: expensive. 8 bucks.
>> Him: that doesn't sound like much. How much are the cheap ones?
>> Me: 5.
>> Him: sounds worth it.
>> Wisdom doesn't always come with age. We will see if they work!!
>>
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Cheers,
> David
>
> Member, Supreme Council of Cyberspace
>
> "it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Riv-PayPal marketing mashup

[Doug Williams]

That looks EXACTLY like the back of my Homer, except I switch between the 
SaddleSack Small and the SaddleSack Large. That is an XS. But bike, rack, 
saddle, and fenders are an exact match.

So Christian, it is either an amazing coincidence that a Rivendell fan 
would receive such a flyer...or Google is stalking us.

Doug

On Sunday, September 20, 2015 at 7:40:59 AM UTC-7, Christian wrote:

> The other day I got my new PayPal credit card in the mail. The marketing 
> material the card was glued to had what seems unmistakably to be a 
> Rivendell complete with Sackville sack and Nitto rack.  Thought some might 
> get a kick out of this pic. 
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell Riders use for helmet/head rain covers?

[Doug Williams]

I don't like hoods that block my vision when I'm trying to scan behind me. 
I haven't tried it, but I think the Grundens rain hat would not block your 
vision.

If you wear a helmet (and maybe you want to if you are mixing it up with 
SUV's in the rain) I like this one:

https://www.taigaworks.ca/cart.php?m=product_detail=66

It fits over you helmet, doesn't block you vision, and even has a loop to 
attach your red light. I attach my take-a-look mirror to my helmet and the 
taiga doesn't interfere with it. I don't always bike with a helmet, mirror, 
and red light on my head. But if it is dark and rainy in heavy traffic...it 
is time to pull out all the stops.


Doug



On Saturday, September 12, 2015 at 5:29:02 PM UTC-7, Matthew J wrote:

> Rivendell fans would do well to take Grant's advise and wear a Grundens 
>  in a hard rain.  Keeps your 
> gourd dry.  Bright yellow colors enhance visibility in the gloom.
>
> On Saturday, September 12, 2015 at 1:18:19 PM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>>
>> Next in the series.
>> What works for you in downpours on long rides?
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: The Impossible School Commute

[Doug Williams]

Way to go, Leah! I'm a bicycle safety instructor and I teach Safe Routes to 
School classes. Biking to school is great for kids for SO many reasons. 
Adults have different priorities, but for the kids it is the freedom to go 
where they want when they want; rather than have to wait for some adult to 
give them a ride. My kids are both "self-propelled".

Doug

On Tuesday, September 8, 2015 at 9:03:09 PM UTC-7, LeahFoy wrote:

> This year we enrolled the boys in a new charter school. It is over 2 miles 
> from home and a VERY challenging commute - all downhill to school, all 
> uphill home. It's the kind of hill that cyclists in Lycra who ride carbon 
> bikes flock to for the challenge. No one thought this was a viable bike 
> commute, at least not with children. It's too hot, they said. That hill is 
> too steep, they said. Your younger child is only six, they said. My kids 
> would never do that, they said. 
>
> We've made it most days and it sure has been freeing! Further bolstering 
> my decision was a giant neighborhood squabble on the Nextdoor app.  There 
> was outrage over parents parking all over the neighborhood, blocking 
> driveways and driving erratically. It got all sorts of nasty, so I finally 
> chimed in. Since there are just too many cars and no place to park them,  I 
> encouraged those parents who head home after dropping off/picking up kids 
> to bike with their kids. (I totally kept it from being preachy. I was going 
> for a you-want-what-I-got approach.) I told them I meet lovely people, get 
> exercise, and best of all, I'm not angry. I nudged then into getting a 
> commuter with a shiny new bell and a basket. And then I said they must come 
> to dinner at my house so we can chat all about it. The next day people were 
> honking and waving and yelling, "Go, Leah!" on the way to school. Since I 
> was practically the only biking mom out there, I was recognized easily. 
> Pedestrians stopped me and said, "You must be Leah!" I made a plethora of 
> friends overnight. Now I ring my bell and wave and yell "Good morning!" and 
> people love it. Best of all, I now see several parents on bikes dropping 
> off and picking up with kids at school. What a welcome sight! 
>
> I put one photo here, but check out the other recent ones in the album. 
> Pictures proved you can change your collective attitude, one bike at a 
> time. Also, please notice my bicycle necklace because it's DARLING. 
>
> https://flic.kr/p/y7fnUF

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[RBW] Re: The Impossible School Commute

[Doug Williams]

Yes, you were wrong...You should not have gently defended your case. You 
should have vigorously defended your case.

I usually wear a helmet, but I have zero tolerance for non-cyclists who 
insist that all bike riders should wear a helmet. For kids, helmet use is 
required under California law. For adults, it is not...nor should it be. 
Tell your uncle that you are an adult and you don't have to wear a helmet 
on your bike.

Tell him that bike helmets are MUCH less effective than he has been told. 
Ask him why he doesn't wear a helmet in his car, since many more lives 
would be saved if motorists all wore helmets than will ever be saved by 
bicycle helmets. Ask him why he doesn't wear a helmet while walking, 
because being a pedestrian is more dangerous than being a cyclist (and MUCH 
more so if you compare pedestrian deaths per mile and cyclist deaths per 
mile). Annual cyclist deaths: 600, pedestrians: 4,500, motorists: 30,000. 
Annual deaths from obesity and lack of exercise: 300,000. Given the fact 
that helmet laws have been proven to reduce ridership...they actually kill 
people by increasing the number of obesity related deaths.

Also annoying are people who blame the bicyclist killed by an SUV by 
saying, "If only he was wearing a helmet!" As if the magic invisible safety 
runes on the helmet would have prevented the death somehow. Helmets are 
fine, but they are definitely dead last on the Five Layers of Safety. 
People commenting about bicycle accidents should address Layers 1-4 before 
that talk about how the "magic helmet" could have helped.

Doug

The Five Layers of Safety:

*Layer 1: Control Your Bicycle* (Don’t fall or collide with others)

If you can skillfully control your bike by starting, stopping, and turning 
properly, you will not fall down all by yourself or run into others. Do 
this and you cut out about half of your injury risk. To ride in groups, a 
cyclist must have good bike handling skills.

*Layer 2: Follow the Rules* (Don’t cause traffic accidents)

Follow traffic laws, obey signs and signals, use headlights and taillights 
at night, and use the correct lanes for turns and through movements and you 
won’t cause a collision with a motorist. About half of cyclist/motorist 
crashes are caused by cyclists who violate the basic rules of the road. But 
you don’t do that, right? Combine Layers 1 and 2 and you cut about 75% of 
your injury risk.

*Layer 3: Lane Positioning* (Discourage other driver’s mistakes)

Knowing when to use the full lane or to share a lane is something few 
cyclists fully understand. Your position in a lane is the best way to make 
yourself conspicuous, to tell drivers what you are doing, and to discourage 
them from making unsafe movements. Many of these effective lane positioning 
principles have been forgotten by the modern cycling community, so they may 
be contrary to what you’ve been taught! Combine Layers 1, 2 and 3 and you 
cut out about 99% of all potential crashes.

*Layer 4: Hazard Avoidance* (Avoid the other driver’s mistakes)

There are evasive maneuvers you should know that can help you avoid major 
motorist mistakes or dodge obstacles. Knowing how to stop and turn quickly 
helps you avoid motorist mistakes that aren’t discouraged by lane 
positioning. These skills are not instinctive and must be taught.

*Layer 5: Passive Safety* (Protection when all else fails)

This is actually the least effective layer. Helmets and gloves protect your 
most vulnerable body parts as a last resort in case of the very rare 
failure of Layers 1 through 4, but they do nothing to help you avoid 
crashes.




On Wednesday, September 9, 2015 at 10:58:54 AM UTC-7, LeahFoy wrote:

> Thanks, All, for your kind words. I have also posted this to my Facebook 
> account, where  it also drew an overwhelmingly positive response. That was, 
> until an uncle of mine noticed I was not wearing a helmet.  I was stupid 
> enough to gently defend my case. When will I ever learn to just be quiet? 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fender front flap: how close to the ground I is still safe?

[Doug Williams]

My 58cm 650B Homer has SKS P50 LongBoards. Even with the extra long (6 
inch) mud flap, the front wheel flap is 4.5 inches above the ground. So if 
someone makes a 8-10 inch long flap that would fit the P50 LongBoards, 
please let me know. Otherwise, I guess I'll have to DYI an extension of my 
own. Any ideas on that?

I want to go as low as practical because I want to keep myself and my 
drivetrain clean. That said, I do a lot of rocky trail riding, so I don't 
know how low I'll be able to get away with. Here in Carmichael (near 
Sacramento) the rainy season is not imminent, but the horse apples, grit, 
dust, and gravel are present year round.

Doug

On Tuesday, September 1, 2015 at 5:48:23 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:

> I've had mudflaps easily within 1" of the ground. Mine were flexible, so 
> no harm done if they grounded. That said, as long as the fender/flap keeps 
> spray from the bb area, it's long enough; and I've found that ~3" above the 
> ground works on my bikes.
>
> On Tue, Sep 1, 2015 at 3:38 PM, Paul G  
> wrote:
>
>> In Jan Heine's blog, he states that the front mud flap should be within 
>> 2" to the ground for maximum protection of spray to the drivetrain and 
>> feet. I don't know how safe it would be or otherwise but it apparently 
>> works well for him.
>>
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
> By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
> Other professional writing services.
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> www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten
>
> *
> *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
> circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
> individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu
>
> *Stat crux dum volvitur orbis.* Carthusian motto
>  
>

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[RBW] Re: Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

 

UPDATE: Ride with GPS reports that it has been 611.8 miles since I 
converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on my tubeless ready Pacenti SL23 rims to 
tubeless. So I suppose I should give a midterm performance update.

 Short version: ZERO flats! Wonderful! Great! Should have done it sooner! 
If you have tubeless ready rims and run tires 42mm or wider, I recommend 
you go tubeless. If you have narrower tires or rims that are not tubeless 
ready…I don’t know. I just know that what I did works great!

 Long Version: I used to get MANY flats from goat heads, star thistle, and 
other thorns. Before, with inner tubes, I was averaging a flat every 42.75 
miles. With my tubeless setup, I still get many thorns, but they don’t 
result in flats. If anything, I get more thorns than ever because I do more 
dirt trails now that I don’t have to worry about flats. In the beginning, I 
used to carefully go over my tires after each ride and pick all the thorns 
out of the tires. Now I am much more casual about it. I pick out the really 
obvious thorns but I often just leave most of them in until my weekend 
maintenance. When I pull a thorn, I get a brief leak of Orange Seal, and 
then it seals up. No worries; and I have never had a significant pressure 
loss. I just got back from a bike free 5 day vacation and the tires lost 
less than 5 PSI. In normal use, I just top off the tires every few days. 
The only real issue I have had is that the Orange Seal is so good at 
plugging leaks that it eventually clogs up the valves. I have removed, 
cleaned, and replaced each valve stem once during this 611.8 mile test…not 
a big deal.

 Doug


On Saturday, July 18, 2015 at 10:40:47 AM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

 I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless 
 yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so 
 far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some 
 preliminary observations:

 From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires was 
 actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used no 
 soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange Seal 
 sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the 
 tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

 First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then I 
 broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire 
 stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead outward 
 on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of course, 
 but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't 
 even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because 
 my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite 
 easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high 
 volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump 
 would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the 
 other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on 
 and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

 So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having to 
 use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the Babyshoe 
 Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If there 
 is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe 
 SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't 
 flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat 
 heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with tubes. 
 I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll 
 probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so 
 again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. I 
 use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I 
 get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 minute 
 or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at 
 dawn before work. Been there, done that!

 So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

 Doug


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Re: [RBW] Racer loves Rivendell

[Doug Williams]

Good point, but we really need bike education here in the US. The Dutch 
have extensive bike education starting in early school and going all the 
way up. I am an LCI, and I have taught How to Choose a Bike classes. I 
assure you, the level of ignorance among the general public is breath 
taking. People really think that MCRB's will make them 10 MPH faster than a 
normal bike. When I do the One MPH faster for every 12 pounds math and 
show them that the difference in their commute time is more like 30 
seconds, their eyes open up. Then I tell them that they spent more time 
than that putting on their special shoes and jersey. The Dutch know 
that...Americans do not.

Doug

On Thursday, July 30, 2015 at 2:51:09 AM UTC-7, George Millwood wrote:


 The Dutch love bike racing but the country is awash with normal bikes.  I 
 have friends who live in Hilversum, a village outside of Amsterdam, and it 
 is a real education to sit at a cafe in the shopping centre there and watch 
 the horde of people turn up on normal bicycles to shop at the supermarket, 
 go to the chemist, get a snack all on bicycles.


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[RBW] Re: Racer loves Rivendell

[Doug Williams]

I just think that racing has a negative impact on bike design for the 
general public. Keep BORAF and races like that if you want, but I would 
like to see many more real world races on real world bikes which would 
influence bicycle purchases in a POSITIVE rather than a negative manner. 
Current races glamorize super lightweight, super fragile bikes. Have 
equipment endurance racing events (or whatever you want to call them) and 
make the racers start and finish on the SAME bike, carry all their tools 
and spare parts, and make all their own in race repairs.This would 
glamorize USEFUL bikes and encourage bike makers to make useful bikes 
available to the public, instead of the ridiculously impractical bikes 
glamorized in most races. Who goes on their daily ride with a van with 3 
spare bikes, spare parts, and a mechanic following? Why would you want to 
buy and ride a bike that requires that logistics trail?

True, we all know about RBW and other such bikes on this list. But I bet 
that the average bike purchaser does NOT. Equipment Endurance type races on 
durable and repairable bikes would help educate the buying public and steer 
them onto a bike that would be much better for them than the typical MCRB. 
Again, the only race rules would be:
(1) Start and finish on the same bike.
(2) Carry all your own repair parts and tools.
(3) Make all your own in race repairs.

No other design rules would be necessary. Bike manufacturers would be 
encouraged to manufacture and advertise bikes that would be useful to the 
public. 

Doug

On Tuesday, July 28, 2015 at 6:17:29 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:

 There's a definite negative attitude on this list toward racers. Me, I 
 like watching racers in a well-coordinated paceline or climbing efficiently 
 or descending skillfully; never raced worth mentioning myself. Our local 
 roadies are friendly, and I think 40 year old racing bikes have much to 
 recommend them as road-biased all rounders.

 That said, I rode my (modestly racer-like, albeit fixed gear) gofast to 
 Fat Tire Bicycles this afternoon to pick up a new (black, clamp on, 1 1/8) 
 stem for the Fargo (new, longer reach bar) and a tandem rd cable (running 
 the housing along the bar to exit with brake housing near stem). The young 
 man at the register saw the '99 Joe and praised it and described the 
 Legolas he races local cross on. He installed a straight bar because his 
 background is downhill mtb racing, but he finds it much more comfortable 
 than his CF cross bike, and says that it doesn't slow him down (he loses 
 ground to roadies on the flats/straights, but gets ahead on twisties thanks 
 to his mtb handling skills.

 So, there. 

 -- 
 Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
 Other professional writing services.
 http://www.resumespecialties.com/
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 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten

 *
 *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
 circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
 individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

 *Kinei hos eromenon. It moves as the being-loved. *Aristotle

 *The Love that moves the Sun and all the other stars. *Dante  
  

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Re: [RBW] Racer loves Rivendell

[Doug Williams]

Nobody ever said that only MCRB's are available. I just said that only 
MCRB's are raced and glamorized, and that real world bike design could 
benefit from the same testing and glamour that MCRB's receive. I'm 
advocating race testing of practical, durable, and reliable bikes. 
Reliability would be race tested. That would provide useful information 
to the public. Wouldn't you be interested to know which fast bike could 
complete a long race with the fewest repairs and the most reliability? I 
might buy that bike.

Doug

On Wednesday, July 29, 2015 at 4:51:40 PM UTC-7, Eric Daume wrote:

 What useful bikes are being kept from buyers? Hybrids, city bikes, 
 cyclocross bikes, fat tire gravel bikes... All are easily available. 

 I think it's time to stop the narrative that people only buy MCFR bikes 
 because that's all that's available, or they're somehow forced to. People 
 have more options than ever, and can buy what they want. 

 Eric but no MCFR bike for me Daume

 On Wednesday, July 29, 2015, Doug Williams sal...@minbaritm.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 I just think that racing has a negative impact on bike design for the 
 general public. Keep BORAF and races like that if you want, but I would 
 like to see many more real world races on real world bikes which would 
 influence bicycle purchases in a POSITIVE rather than a negative manner. 
 Current races glamorize super lightweight, super fragile bikes. Have 
 equipment endurance racing events (or whatever you want to call them) and 
 make the racers start and finish on the SAME bike, carry all their tools 
 and spare parts, and make all their own in race repairs.This would 
 glamorize USEFUL bikes and encourage bike makers to make useful bikes 
 available to the public, instead of the ridiculously impractical bikes 
 glamorized in most races. Who goes on their daily ride with a van with 3 
 spare bikes, spare parts, and a mechanic following? Why would you want to 
 buy and ride a bike that requires that logistics trail?

 True, we all know about RBW and other such bikes on this list. But I bet 
 that the average bike purchaser does NOT. Equipment Endurance type races on 
 durable and repairable bikes would help educate the buying public and steer 
 them onto a bike that would be much better for them than the typical MCRB. 
 Again, the only race rules would be:
 (1) Start and finish on the same bike.
 (2) Carry all your own repair parts and tools.
 (3) Make all your own in race repairs.

 No other design rules would be necessary. Bike manufacturers would be 
 encouraged to manufacture and advertise bikes that would be useful to the 
 public. 

 Doug

 On Tuesday, July 28, 2015 at 6:17:29 PM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:

 There's a definite negative attitude on this list toward racers. Me, I 
 like watching racers in a well-coordinated paceline or climbing efficiently 
 or descending skillfully; never raced worth mentioning myself. Our local 
 roadies are friendly, and I think 40 year old racing bikes have much to 
 recommend them as road-biased all rounders.

 That said, I rode my (modestly racer-like, albeit fixed gear) gofast to 
 Fat Tire Bicycles this afternoon to pick up a new (black, clamp on, 1 1/8) 
 stem for the Fargo (new, longer reach bar) and a tandem rd cable (running 
 the housing along the bar to exit with brake housing near stem). The young 
 man at the register saw the '99 Joe and praised it and described the 
 Legolas he races local cross on. He installed a straight bar because his 
 background is downhill mtb racing, but he finds it much more comfortable 
 than his CF cross bike, and says that it doesn't slow him down (he loses 
 ground to roadies on the flats/straights, but gets ahead on twisties thanks 
 to his mtb handling skills.

 So, there. 

 -- 
 Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
 Other professional writing services.
 http://www.resumespecialties.com/
 www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten

 *
 *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
 circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
 individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

 *Kinei hos eromenon. It moves as the being-loved. *Aristotle

 *The Love that moves the Sun and all the other stars. *Dante  
  
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Re: [RBW] Re: Fenders in Summer

[Doug Williams]

Yes but...does anyone commute in a car like that? How many people drive a 
car like that on the road? How many people train in a car like that 
outside of a race? Everyone recognizes that a car like that is fragile and 
maintenance intensive; completely impractical for normal use. Given that, 
why is it so many people think that they should ride the equivalent bike on 
the street and/or bike trail when they are not even in a race?

Grant is right on this: bike racing has ruined cycling for normal people.

Doug

On Wednesday, July 29, 2015 at 2:54:33 AM UTC-7, Patrick Moore wrote:

 No fenders on this baby.

 [image: Inline image 1]

 On Tue, Jul 28, 2015 at 10:59 PM, Jan Heine hei...@earthlink.net 
 javascript: wrote:

 https://janheine.wordpress.com/2012/03/31/taking-off-fenders/

 How many cyclists run fenders year-round on their cars? It still amazes 
 me that nobody thinks a Porsche or a Ferrari is less sporty for having 
 fenders and lights, but on a bike, it's still uncool in certain circles. ;-)

 Jan Heine
 Editor
 Bicycle Quarterly
 www.bikequarterly.com

 Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/

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 -- 
 Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.
 By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.
 Other professional writing services.
 http://www.resumespecialties.com/
 www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten

 *
 *The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
 circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
 individualities revolve. *Chuang Tzu

 *Kinei hos eromenon. It moves as the being-loved. *Aristotle

 *The Love that moves the Sun and all the other stars. *Dante  
  

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[RBW] Fenders in Summer

[Doug Williams]

I was out on my early morning ride today from 5:15-7:00. I take the extra 
long route to work by looping around Lake Natoma. My work commute would 
otherwise be only 5 miles. But anyway...

I take many side dirt paths to lose the MCRB racers zipping around the 
American River Bike Trail on their skinny tires. I'm pretty much all alone 
on the dirt. Occasionally I see a runner but bikes are very rare. Horses 
use these trails often but nobody has their horse out on the trails that 
early in the morning. Still...the horses leave evidence of their passing. 
Which brings me back to my Subject Line.

Yes, it is nice to have fenders in summer.

Doug

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Re: [RBW] Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

I seated both beads using a n inner tube. Then I broke one bead to remove 
the inner tube and install the tubeless valve.


On Monday, July 20, 2015 at 11:22:22 AM UTC-7, Jim Bronson wrote:

 It wasn't clear to me at which step you put the sealant in.  After the 
 tubeless tire stem, or before?

 On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 12:40 PM, Doug Williams sal...@minbaritm.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless 
 yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so 
 far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some 
 preliminary observations:

 From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires was 
 actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used no 
 soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange Seal 
 sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the 
 tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

 First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then I 
 broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire 
 stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead outward 
 on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of course, 
 but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't 
 even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because 
 my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite 
 easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high 
 volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump 
 would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the 
 other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on 
 and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

 So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having to 
 use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the Babyshoe 
 Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If there 
 is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe 
 SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't 
 flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat 
 heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with tubes. 
 I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll 
 probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so 
 again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. I 
 use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I 
 get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 minute 
 or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at 
 dawn before work. Been there, done that!

 So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

 Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

True Joe,

My SL-23 rims are tubeless ready. They have a tighter fit than other rims.
So I don't recommend going tubeless unless your rims are made for tubeless.
On Jul 20, 2015 11:26 AM, Joe Broach joebro...@gmail.com wrote:

 Proceed with caution, Shoji. I don't think synergies are tubeless ready
 (i.e. not designed to keep a tire on without a tube). Some people have had
 success just putting the sealant in the tube, though.

 Best,
 joe broach
 pdx or

 Caveat lector. Sent from a phone.
 On Jul 20, 2015 9:39 AM, Shoji Takahashi shoji.takaha...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Hi Doug,
 I'm considering tubeless set up for my Loup Loup Pass EL (650B x 38) on
 Velocity Synergies. I've had a number of rear-tire flats the past two weeks
 from glass bits. Puts a damper on the nice ride.

 For the conversion: did you use the tubeless valves and stan's tape? And
 then add the Orange Seal via injector? Is that really all there is to it?

 Thanks for your help/advice,
 Shoji



 On Saturday, July 18, 2015 at 1:40:47 PM UTC-4, Doug Williams wrote:

 I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless
 yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so
 far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some
 preliminary observations:

 From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires
 was actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used no
 soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange Seal
 sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the
 tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

 First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then
 I broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire
 stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead outward
 on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of course,
 but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't
 even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because
 my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite
 easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high
 volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump
 would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the
 other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on
 and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

 So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having to
 use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the Babyshoe
 Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If there
 is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe
 SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't
 flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat
 heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with tubes.
 I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll
 probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so
 again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. I
 use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I
 get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 minute
 or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at
 dawn before work. Been there, done that!

 So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

 Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

Where I have been riding...yes, that is a record.  But I will reserve final
judgment until I get more more tubeless miles.

Doug

On Mon, Jul 20, 2015, 09:56 Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:



 On 07/20/2015 12:46 PM, Doug Williams wrote:
 
  The answers are yes, yes,  and yes.  That's all there is to it. Over
  50 flat free miles and counting.
 
 

 Is that like some kind of longevity record?



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Re: [RBW] Re: Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

The answers are yes, yes,  and yes.  That's all there is to it. Over 50
flat free miles and counting.

Doug

On Mon, Jul 20, 2015, 09:39 Shoji Takahashi shoji.takaha...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Hi Doug,
 I'm considering tubeless set up for my Loup Loup Pass EL (650B x 38) on
 Velocity Synergies. I've had a number of rear-tire flats the past two weeks
 from glass bits. Puts a damper on the nice ride.

 For the conversion: did you use the tubeless valves and stan's tape? And
 then add the Orange Seal via injector? Is that really all there is to it?

 Thanks for your help/advice,
 Shoji



 On Saturday, July 18, 2015 at 1:40:47 PM UTC-4, Doug Williams wrote:

 I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless
 yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so
 far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some
 preliminary observations:

 From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires was
 actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used no
 soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange Seal
 sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the
 tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

 First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then I
 broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire
 stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead outward
 on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of course,
 but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't
 even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because
 my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite
 easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high
 volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump
 would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the
 other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on
 and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

 So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having to
 use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the Babyshoe
 Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If there
 is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe
 SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't
 flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat
 heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with tubes.
 I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll
 probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so
 again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. I
 use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I
 get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 minute
 or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at
 dawn before work. Been there, done that!

 So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

 Doug

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Re: [RBW] Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

Jim,

I put the sealant into the tire after installing the tubeless valve stem 
and seating both beads of the tire on the rim. I used an injector to put 
the sealant in through the valve stem.

Doug

On Monday, July 20, 2015 at 11:59:48 AM UTC-7, Jim Bronson wrote:

 It is still not clear to me at what point you put the sealant (Stan's, 
 Orange Seal, or similar) in the tire.  You mention installing the tubeless 
 valve stem, but you don't mention adding sealant.

 Or are you saying you didn't use any sealant?

 On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 1:42 PM, Doug Williams sal...@minbaritm.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 I seated both beads using a n inner tube. Then I broke one bead to remove 
 the inner tube and install the tubeless valve.


 On Monday, July 20, 2015 at 11:22:22 AM UTC-7, Jim Bronson wrote:

 It wasn't clear to me at which step you put the sealant in.  After the 
 tubeless tire stem, or before?

 On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 12:40 PM, Doug Williams sal...@minbaritm.com 
 wrote:

 I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless 
 yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so 
 far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some 
 preliminary observations:

 From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires 
 was actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used 
 no 
 soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange 
 Seal 
 sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the 
 tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

 First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then 
 I broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire 
 stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead 
 outward 
 on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of 
 course, 
 but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't 
 even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because 
 my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite 
 easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high 
 volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump 
 would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the 
 other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on 
 and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

 So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having 
 to use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the 
 Babyshoe 
 Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If 
 there 
 is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe 
 SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't 
 flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat 
 heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with 
 tubes. 
 I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll 
 probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so 
 again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. 
 I 
 use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I 
 get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 
 minute 
 or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at 
 dawn before work. Been there, done that!

 So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

 Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

I log my miles with Ride With GPS and I use the same program to log 
maintenance, including flats. Checking my records, I was averaging a flat 
every 42.75 miles. I have now gone 65.6 miles without a flat and I am 
riding the same thorn prone routes. If anything, I'm riding over more 
thorns because I used to shy away from areas that I knew were full of 
thorns, but now I'm riding right through them. So...nice; but too early to 
give a meaningful and statistically significant review of my tubeless 
setup. Stay tuned as I bike more miles.  :-)

Doug

On Monday, July 20, 2015 at 9:59:57 AM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

 Where I have been riding...yes, that is a record.  But I will reserve 
 final judgment until I get more more tubeless miles. 

 Doug 

 On Mon, Jul 20, 2015, 09:56 Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:



 On 07/20/2015 12:46 PM, Doug Williams wrote:
 
  The answers are yes, yes,  and yes.  That's all there is to it. Over
  50 flat free miles and counting.
 
 

 Is that like some kind of longevity record?



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Re: [RBW] Re: Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

Shoji,

From what I have read, putting the sealant in the tube is somewhat 
effective in reducing flats, but it is not anywhere as good as going 
tubeless because the thin inner tube just won't seal as well as a thicker 
tire. Still worth trying, but don't expect a flat-free miracle.

Doug

On Monday, July 20, 2015 at 11:49:34 AM UTC-7, Shoji Takahashi wrote:

 Thanks, Joe. I'm thinking of putting Stans or Orange into the tube. I've 
 got Schwalbe tubes, and I think they have a removable core. Shouldn't be 
 too hard to put in some sealant. Downsides of that? Some added weight? :)

 shoji



 On Monday, July 20, 2015 at 2:26:07 PM UTC-4, joe b. wrote:

 Proceed with caution, Shoji. I don't think synergies are tubeless ready 
 (i.e. not designed to keep a tire on without a tube). Some people have had 
 success just putting the sealant in the tube, though.

 Best,
 joe broach
 pdx or

 Caveat lector. Sent from a phone.
 On Jul 20, 2015 9:39 AM, Shoji Takahashi shoji.t...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi Doug,
 I'm considering tubeless set up for my Loup Loup Pass EL (650B x 38) on 
 Velocity Synergies. I've had a number of rear-tire flats the past two weeks 
 from glass bits. Puts a damper on the nice ride.

 For the conversion: did you use the tubeless valves and stan's tape? And 
 then add the Orange Seal via injector? Is that really all there is to it? 

 Thanks for your help/advice,
 Shoji



 On Saturday, July 18, 2015 at 1:40:47 PM UTC-4, Doug Williams wrote:

 I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless 
 yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so 
 far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some 
 preliminary observations:

 From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires 
 was actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used 
 no 
 soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange 
 Seal 
 sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the 
 tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

 First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then 
 I broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire 
 stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead 
 outward 
 on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of 
 course, 
 but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't 
 even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because 
 my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite 
 easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high 
 volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump 
 would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the 
 other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on 
 and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

 So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having 
 to use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the 
 Babyshoe 
 Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If 
 there 
 is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe 
 SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't 
 flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat 
 heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with 
 tubes. 
 I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll 
 probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so 
 again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. 
 I 
 use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I 
 get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 
 minute 
 or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at 
 dawn before work. Been there, done that!

 So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

 Doug

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[RBW] Re: Bosco shifter placement

[Doug Williams]

My Riv has Albas and Silver bar ends. My Bosco bars are on my non-Riv bike. 
I use (gasp) twist shifters. They have been trouble free and ergonomically 
sweet.

Doug

On Sunday, July 19, 2015 at 6:37:49 PM UTC-7, DS wrote:

 For those of you riding bosco bars, where do you place the shifters? 
 Thinking about a cockpit swap on my Sam, and wondering if bar ends or 
 thumbies are the way to go, and if thumbies where to put them?

 Consequently, if anyone has a bosco cockpit (all or whole) they're 
 interested in selling, let me know ;) I need the bars (looking at the 52), 
 stem (don't know length, I run 8cm on my albastaches), brake levers.


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[RBW] Babyshoe Pass EL's Tubeless on Pacenti SL23's

[Doug Williams]

I converted my Babyshoe Pass EL's on Pacenti SL23 rims to tubeless 
yesterday. So my 58cm 650B Homer is running SMOOTH. Everything is great so 
far, I'll followup with a long term report after some more miles. Some 
preliminary observations:

From what I had read, I was expecting a battle; but seating the tires was 
actually quite easy. I didn't want water inside the tires, so I used no 
soapy water or lubricant of any kind. I had an injector for the Orange Seal 
sealant, so I added the sealant AFTER the tires were seated. In short, the 
tires were seated while completely dry. Here is how I did it.

First, I seated the tires in the normal manner with an inner tube. Then I 
broke ONE bead and removed the inner tube. I installed the tubeless tire 
stem. Then I worked my way around the rim and pulled the loose bead outward 
on the rim to seat it as best as I could. It wasn't fully seated of course, 
but somewhat close. Then I just pumped the tire up and seated it, didn't 
even remove the valve core (as some recommend for faster air flow) because 
my pump fit the valve stem better with the core in. It was actually quite 
easy to seat the tire with my floor pump! Full disclosure, I have the high 
volume Lezyne Dirt Floor Drive Pump, but really I think any floor pump 
would have worked. My daughter seated one of the tires and I seated the 
other. Easy both times. I think the key is to have one bead completely on 
and the second bead pulled in close like I did.

So far I'm quite satisfied with tubeless. My goal was to avoid having to 
use a heavy commuter tire because I really love the ride of the Babyshoe 
Pass EL's. I see no weight savings with tubeless and I don't care. If there 
is a difference in performance I can't tell. I was already using Schwalbe 
SV14 light (130 gram) inner tubes and the ride was sweet (when I didn't 
flat). I'm interested only in flat protection because with all the goat 
heads and other thorns around here flats were annoyingly common with tubes. 
I probably used more Orange Seal than necessary, but we will see. I'll 
probably carry two inner tubes and a patch kit as emergency backup, so 
again...no weight savings. But if I don't get flats, it will be worth it. I 
use my bike to commute to work. It is only 5 miles each direction, but I 
get up early and extend my morning commute somewhere fun to get a 90 minute 
or so morning ride. I don't want to be fixing a flat out in the boonies at 
dawn before work. Been there, done that!

So hopefully tubeless will be the answer for me...time will tell.

Doug

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RE: [RBW] Re: Post Surgery Therapy

[Doug Williams]

Thanks!

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Person
Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2015 7:31 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Post Surgery Therapy

 

It is a fork crown mount used with a Busch  Muller IXON IQ headlight, 
purchased from Peter White Cycles.

 

The mount is sold separately.  Scroll down a little from the top of the page 
and you will find the description for it:  http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/b 
http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/bm.asp m.asp

On Wednesday, July 8, 2015 at 5:40:42 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

To take a shot at answering my own question...is it an Edelux Light Mount like 
on the Riv site? If so, then my next question...is that a Cygolite mount on it? 
That's what I want to do; mount a Cygolite on my Mark's rack like that. What 
did you have to do to make that work?

 

Doug

On Wednesday, July 8, 2015 at 3:30:39 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

What is the light holder attached to your front rack and where did you get it?

Thanks,

 

Doug

On Wednesday, July 8, 2015 at 1:22:17 PM UTC-7, David Person wrote:

Changed the cockpit over to Albatrosses this past week.  I'm enjoying the more 
upright position and the location of the bar-end shifters.  An added benefit is 
the shifters are now higher than the top tube, so no more banging of the 
bar-ends on the it.  The Linus is a new addition for my wife.

 



On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 7:14:18 AM UTC-7, David Person wrote:

I've had a pair of Nitto B115 drop bars hang around (literally) for a couple of 
years begging to be put to use.  I was inspired by an old Kohler faucet 
commercial (the one where a couple wants a house designed around a faucet).  So 
I've designed a bike build around these bars.  Had back surgery at the end of 
December and recently was released to do PT, so it was time to put this bike 
together.  I have to give a shout out to Pondero, Stonehog and a few others 
who's blogs kept me sane and inspired during the first few months after 
surgery, when I seriously doubted I'd ever ride again.  I rode six miles 
yesterday, which is the most so far, but to far to go to get back to the riding 
shape I was in a couple years ago.

 

Additional photos can be found in my Flickr album:  
https://www.flickr.com/photos/98035479@N08/sets/72157653847408849/with/18432114739/

 

Going to experiment with some Nitto Albatross bars too.  Got to keep a promise 
I made to Keven at Rivendell when I ordered the frame.

 

David

So. Cal 

 

 

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RE: [RBW] Re: Post Surgery Therapy

[Doug Williams]

David,

 

Rats! But thanks anyway. Might have to upgrade to the BM.  J

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Person
Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2015 7:46 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Post Surgery Therapy

 

Looking at the Cygolite website, it looks like the style of the mount is 
opposite of that of the BM.  With the BM the rails on the light slide over 
the groves on the mount.  With the Cygolite it looks like the rails on the 
mount slide over the groves in the light.

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[RBW] Re: Post Surgery Therapy

[Doug Williams]

To take a shot at answering my own question...is it an Edelux Light Mount 
like on the Riv site? If so, then my next question...is that a Cygolite 
mount on it? That's what I want to do; mount a Cygolite on my Mark's rack 
like that. What did you have to do to make that work?

Doug

On Wednesday, July 8, 2015 at 3:30:39 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

 What is the light holder attached to your front rack and where did you get 
 it?
 Thanks,

 Doug

 On Wednesday, July 8, 2015 at 1:22:17 PM UTC-7, David Person wrote:

 Changed the cockpit over to Albatrosses this past week.  I'm enjoying the 
 more upright position and the location of the bar-end shifters.  An added 
 benefit is the shifters are now higher than the top tube, so no more 
 banging of the bar-ends on the it.  The Linus is a new addition for my wife.



 On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 7:14:18 AM UTC-7, David Person wrote:

 I've had a pair of Nitto B115 drop bars hang around (literally) for a 
 couple of years begging to be put to use.  I was inspired by an old Kohler 
 faucet commercial (the one where a couple wants a house designed around a 
 faucet).  So I've designed a bike build around these bars.  Had back 
 surgery at the end of December and recently was released to do PT, so it 
 was time to put this bike together.  I have to give a shout out to Pondero, 
 Stonehog and a few others who's blogs kept me sane and inspired during the 
 first few months after surgery, when I seriously doubted I'd ever ride 
 again.  I rode six miles yesterday, which is the most so far, but to far to 
 go to get back to the riding shape I was in a couple years ago.

 Additional photos can be found in my Flickr album:  
 https://www.flickr.com/photos/98035479@N08/sets/72157653847408849/with/18432114739/

 Going to experiment with some Nitto Albatross bars too.  Got to keep a 
 promise I made to Keven at Rivendell when I ordered the frame.

 David
 So. Cal 




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[RBW] Re: Post Surgery Therapy

[Doug Williams]

What is the light holder attached to your front rack and where did you get 
it?
Thanks,

Doug

On Wednesday, July 8, 2015 at 1:22:17 PM UTC-7, David Person wrote:

 Changed the cockpit over to Albatrosses this past week.  I'm enjoying the 
 more upright position and the location of the bar-end shifters.  An added 
 benefit is the shifters are now higher than the top tube, so no more 
 banging of the bar-ends on the it.  The Linus is a new addition for my wife.



 On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 7:14:18 AM UTC-7, David Person wrote:

 I've had a pair of Nitto B115 drop bars hang around (literally) for a 
 couple of years begging to be put to use.  I was inspired by an old Kohler 
 faucet commercial (the one where a couple wants a house designed around a 
 faucet).  So I've designed a bike build around these bars.  Had back 
 surgery at the end of December and recently was released to do PT, so it 
 was time to put this bike together.  I have to give a shout out to Pondero, 
 Stonehog and a few others who's blogs kept me sane and inspired during the 
 first few months after surgery, when I seriously doubted I'd ever ride 
 again.  I rode six miles yesterday, which is the most so far, but to far to 
 go to get back to the riding shape I was in a couple years ago.

 Additional photos can be found in my Flickr album:  
 https://www.flickr.com/photos/98035479@N08/sets/72157653847408849/with/18432114739/

 Going to experiment with some Nitto Albatross bars too.  Got to keep a 
 promise I made to Keven at Rivendell when I ordered the frame.

 David
 So. Cal 




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[RBW] Re: loaded handling question

[Doug Williams]

I just got a new Homer and love it. I did get a small amount of shimmy when 
I had my SaddleSack Large fully loaded on an R14 rack with no other weight 
anywhere else. But really...I have a Mark's front rack so there is no 
excuse for that. I added a basket on the front so I'll put some weight 
there if the shimmy returns. But now I wish I had popped for the 
NeedleBlasteur headset. Maybe I'll get a NeedleBlasteur now anyway. But I 
don't want to ding up my Hilsen trying to install it. How tough is it for 
someone of only basic mechanical expertise to swap out a headset?

Doug

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RE: [RBW] Re: Help Riv: Let people ride your bike

[Doug Williams]

Toss all your valuables into a small stuff sack or something and take them with 
you. The SaddleSack Large has a detachable outer pocket to do just that.

 

That said…I avoid locking my bike if at all possible. If you want to keep your 
love…keep your love in your arms or between your legs. I take my bike into the 
grocery store and use it as a shopping cart. Never had anyone complain.

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] 
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2015 11:04 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Help Riv: Let people ride your bike

 

Drew,

But what about the valuable inside?

On Saturday, May 23, 2015 at 9:34:45 PM UTC-7, drew wrote:

My solution has been to buy a used bag, thread a cable thru one of the leather 
lashes/rack/saddle/seat stay, but small lock and attach. Someone may cut the 
cable, but likely they won't go for a beausaged/patched/locked up bag.

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[RBW] Help Riv: Let people ride your bike

[Doug Williams]

Boost sales at Rivendell by letting your friends test ride your bike! Riv 
should see a few Bosco Bar orders and an order for Albatross Bars simply 
because I have let people ride my old mountain bike with Bosco's and my new 
Homer with Albas. Once people ride them, they are instantly sold on getting 
them. Everybody likes my bell and my SaddleSacks (Large and Small) as well. 
:-)

Doug

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RE: [RBW] Re: At last! My new Homer!

[Doug Williams]

Well, my new Homer is running the Soma Grand Randonneur GREEN (lightweight, 
only 300 grams) tire 650b x 42mm on Pacenti SL23 rims and Shimano LX hubs. 32 
spokes on both wheels. My other bike (Novara Safari) has 38mm (measured) 
Schwalbe Marathon Supremes on Alexrims DP17’s with 36 spokes.

 

So yes, the wheels account for a significant portion of the speed gain. And the 
Homer is lighter as well. But even given all that, I can’t scientifically 
account for the HUGE gain in speed. But again…who cares?

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of hsmitham
Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2015 11:28 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: At last! My new Homer!

 

Doug,

 

Nah it's a fast bike! I run the Hetre's and every time I get on it I'm just 
wow! Congrats on your new wheels and enjoy in good health.

 

~Hugh

On Wednesday, May 20, 2015 at 7:39:59 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

At last! My new A. Homer Hilsen! Here is the obligatory picture in front of Riv 
HQ. I just threw on my bag and a water bottle and off I went! Amazing bike, I 
absolutely love it! Thanks to all the many people at Riv who helped me in this 
process!

 

The wheels that Rich made are just perfect. I'm so glad I got the Paul brakes, 
they stop as well as my disc brakes.

 

The bike is MUCH faster than my old bike...to much so to be real. So I know 
some of this is just new bike placebo effect. But who cares? I'm loving it!

 

Doug

 

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RE: [RBW] Re: 160 pound bike lock for A. Homer Hilsen

[Doug Williams]

Been tried…doesn’t work. Yes, he likes steak, but Tibetan Mastiffs won’t accept 
food from strangers. Really…no BS. They just won’t accept treats from people 
they don’t know and trust. I have had several “new friends” test this. Breed 
instinct. They were selectively breed to be guardians and any dog not passing 
this obvious test (come on now, very old trick) was not selected for breeding.

 

So no, you can’t get a Rivendell for the price of a steak or other form of dog 
bribery.  J

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Eric Norris
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 5:36 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: 160 pound bike lock for A. Homer Hilsen

 

Does your dog like steak?

 

--Eric Norris
campyonly...@me.com
www.campyonly.com
campyonlyguy.blogspot.com 

 

On May 21, 2015, at 5:26 PM, Deacon Patrick lamontg...@mac.com wrote:

 

With the welcome mat, there is a wee bit of a mixed message! Grin.

 

With abandon,

Patrick

On Thursday, May 21, 2015 at 6:04:26 PM UTC-6, Doug Williams wrote:

All new Rivendell owners worry about bike theft. Here is my solution: the 160 
pound bike lock. A biological lock, the would be thief must pass simultaneous 
visual, auditory, and olfactory tests in order to gain access to my new A. 
Homer Hilsen. Failure to pass a test would result in...well, it won't be pretty.

 

Doug

 

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[RBW] Re: 160 pound bike lock for A. Homer Hilsen

[Doug Williams]

If you met him on the street, sure. But at his door...forget it. Again, 
that instinct thing. Tibetan Mastiffs were breed to be threshold guardians.

On Thursday, May 21, 2015 at 5:46:47 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 That sweetheart would just lick my face.  Who are you trying to kid?

 On Thursday, May 21, 2015 at 5:04:26 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

 All new Rivendell owners worry about bike theft. Here is my solution: the 
 160 pound bike lock. A biological lock, the would be thief must pass 
 simultaneous visual, auditory, and olfactory tests in order to gain access 
 to my new A. Homer Hilsen. Failure to pass a test would result in...well, 
 it won't be pretty.

 Doug



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[RBW] Re: Soma San Marcos or Sam Hillborne with Surly LHT parts

[Doug Williams]

I notice that the San Marcos is no longer on the Riv website. I wonder if 
this is intentional or just a web glitch? Still available from Soma, of 
course.

Doug

On Thursday, May 21, 2015 at 9:16:22 AM UTC-7, Surlyprof wrote:

 If the LHT's wheelset and parts doesn't get you to the club ride feel you 
 are looking for, have you thought of building up a lightweight San Marcos 
 and just keeping the LHT beefy for your touring desires?  N+1 is always 
 nice if you have the space!

 John

 On Tuesday, May 19, 2015 at 4:40:58 PM UTC-7, Mike Troxell wrote:

 I have a Surly LHT that I am very happy with. The problem is that I want 
 something that I can do light tours and club/group rides (not racing) with 
 but that is a bit livelier than the LHT. How do you think a San Marcos or 
 Sam Hillborne would ride if I bought the frame and swapped the LHT's 
 components to one of them?



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[RBW] Re: Semi-annual shoutout to Riv's box packing

[Doug Williams]

Jenny Klug is Riv's shipper, I believe. AKA Jenny the Shipper! Amazing 
Lass! I remember placing an order and getting a tracking number back in 
less than an hour. Riv is always fast on shipping, and the packing is 
artfully done. Now...if only my Homer frame would come in.  :-)


*Doug*
On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 9:53:59 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:

 I just got my new shorts, t-shirt and coffee mug, and, seriously..have you 
 ever seen another company which puts so much effort into putting stuff into 
 boxes in such a perfectly efficient manner? I picture Dave or Will or 
 Meisha - I don't actually know who does it - laying the order on the table 
 like a puzzle, then standing back and saying, Time for genius! They're 
 very good :)

 Joe Bernard
 Vallejo, CA.


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RE: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

[Doug Williams]

Anne,

 

I do the same. A SaddleSack Large and a double kickstand makes it really easy. 
My bike is slimmer and easier to maneuver than a shopping cart.

 

Yes, not having to carry and futz with a lock is a big bonus.

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Anne Paulson
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 9:35 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

 

I often stop by the grocery store on the way home from a ride. If I don't have 
a lock with me, I use the two wheeled grocery cart.

Sent from my iPad


On Feb 26, 2015, at 6:57 PM, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:

On 02/26/2015 09:40 PM, Patrick Moore wrote:

You must have walked in SPDs? And my Ram and '03 custom carry groceries just 
fine, while being fun to ride unladen. As for theft, I usually wheel the bike 
through the aisles in place of a shopping cart.


I didn't say it couldn't be done, obviously it can be, but that's pretty much 
the interior dialog.  I have a bike I can ride in regular street clothes and 
shoes that I use for errands.  Lots of people bring bikes to the grocery store, 
but I have never yet even once in my entire life seen anyone bring one into the 
store.





 

at least 3/4 of my riding is turning shopping and errand trips into cycling 
detours on such bikes. At 12 to 20 miles each, rt, it's worth my while to 
change into cycling kit -- such as it is. Certainly SPDs.

 

On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:36 PM, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:

 

It's a right pain walking around in a store shopping wearing cycling shoes.  
Also, odds are good a bike you'd use on a regular ride couldn't carry 
groceries anyway.  On top of that, what are the chances the bike would be 
stolen?  Hardly worth taking the risk.  It's a lot more than just too much 
trouble to get into the uniform.

 

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RE: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

[Doug Williams]

I use my bike as a shopping cart all the time. Never had any business say 
anything negative at all.

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jim Bronson
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 6:46 AM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

 

You use your bike as the shopping cart???  Hmm never thought of that.  I guess 
the floors are concrete, at least at my grocer they are.  

Wald baskets?

On Feb 26, 2015 8:41 PM, Patrick Moore bertin...@gmail.com wrote:

You must have walked in SPDs? And my Ram and '03 custom carry groceries just 
fine, while being fun to ride unladen. As for theft, I usually wheel the bike 
through the aisles in place of a shopping cart.

 

at least 3/4 of my riding is turning shopping and errand trips into cycling 
detours on such bikes. At 12 to 20 miles each, rt, it's worth my while to 
change into cycling kit -- such as it is. Certainly SPDs.

 

On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:36 PM, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:

 

It's a right pain walking around in a store shopping wearing cycling shoes.  
Also, odds are good a bike you'd use on a regular ride couldn't carry 
groceries anyway.  On top of that, what are the chances the bike would be 
stolen?  Hardly worth taking the risk.  It's a lot more than just too much 
trouble to get into the uniform.



 

-- 

Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.

By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.

Other professional writing services.

http://www.resumespecialties.com/

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Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten

 

*

The point which is the pivot of the norm is the motionless center of a 
circumference on the rim of which all conditions, distinctions, and 
individualities revolve. Chuang Tzu

Kinei hos eromenon. It moves as the being-loved. Aristotle

The Love that moves the Sun and all the other stars. Dante  

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RE: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

[Doug Williams]

Perfect Geir!

 

Just wear whatever works for the ride you will be doing. Exercise clothes or 
racing kit are fine if that is what you are doing. Nothing wrong with bike 
clothes for a long and/or hard ride. But bike shoes and jerseys in the grocery 
store are just…well…whatever. Again, I maintain that MANY bicyclists simply 
can’t imagine going on a “regular ride” in “regular clothes”. They miss out on 
many good rides because they simply can’t ride without their racing kit. In the 
time spent getting dressed, I could have already been at the grocery store. The 
result is that the “racing kit crowd” never ride on short errand rides, because 
it is just too much trouble to get into their uniform.

 

 

Doug

 

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Geir Bentzen
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 2:24 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

 

I believe I have read/skimmed all the comments by now and as a European who has 
emigrated to the U.S. what strikes me as odd is the feeling I get that riding a 
bike is something special. Something you need a club for, extra things to buy, 
something a bit exotic. I believe the core of what Grant says is that it is not 
something special. It as normal as driving or walking down the street or taking 
the bus, and in fact those things can often be combined. My impression is that 
he promotes using the bike as your get around daily tool as much as you can, 
and that may mean to wear whatever suits the combination of your tasks, not 
only your bike riding. This is how I experienced life in Europe. But, if you go 
out for a ride that has no other tasks to it than just riding then I believe 
you should feel free to dress for the physical exercise involved. In my own 
case that means bike shorts made of lycra and other more or less bike specific 
attire as needed for the weather. I just don't see the conflict here. I have 
several bikes, but I notice that the one I grab all the time is my Hunqapillar, 
even though I own an excellent German city bike for going to the grocery store. 
So the Hunq does it all, but I may not wear the same clothes all the time. When 
younger I would often wear running shoes while walking around town in jeans, 
but I would never go for a long run wearing those jeans even though I still 
wore the same shoes. Why not adopt the same practical and non-ideological 
attitude?

On Tuesday, February 24, 2015 at 3:08:44 PM UTC-6, Jon in the foothills of 
Central Colorado wrote:

In the new Adventure Cyclist Mag

PETERSEN RESPONDS TO READER

LETTER ‘UNRACING? UNCOOL’

Racing attitudes, bikes, clothing,

and diets have become the norm and

normal, and are so pervasive that many

adult cyclists, maybe even some you

know, accept the racing standards as

the only legitimate way to be a serious

adult cyclist. What I tried to do in the

book Just Ride — and what we do here

at Rivendell Bicycle Works — is offer

an alternative, a model to other adult

cyclists that there is another way. This

letter is not an ad for either. I’m simply

saying where I come from and what I

do.

We are the mice trying to squeak

above the roar at the base of the

waterfall. It is no time to be wishywashy,

but I try hard to not offend.

Inevitably, a declarative position on

any matter is bound to raise a few

hackles with those who have a different

position, but it still hurts to be judged

by a stranger who would probably like

me, and whom I’d surely like, in person.

A good number of our customers are

middle-aged and older folks trying to

fit in some activity as they age. They

often have the means, and they’re

influenced by what they read and see

that promotes racers as a good model —

and that’s something I don’t agree with.

They shop as innocents and come

out of it dressed like racers and riding

bikes that are not only inappropriate

for the kind of riding they do, but are,

on top of that and more egregiously, not

comfortable. We undo that. You may

see ego or evil behind it, but I don’t

feel either of those. I see racing and

racers as fringe and am simply trying

to legitimize an alternative point of

view, one that I feel strongly about. I’m

trying — certainly not singlehandedly —

to make people feel good about riding

without dressing in pro-team gear and

copying so many other affectations of

the racer, and that is what Unracing and

Just Ride and Rivendell Bicycle Works is

all about. We’re nobody’s enemy. Some

of my best friends pedal cliplessly and

in spandex. It’s cool.

Grant Petersen

Walnut Creek, California

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Re: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

[Doug Williams]

There are many riders who can NOT conceive of going for a bike ride without 
their clipless shoes, jersey, the whole kit. How sad! I mean...there isn't 
anything wrong with wearing your kit to go on a serious bike ride. But for 
a short ride, you wind up spending more time dressing and undressing than 
you do riding. Plus, the kit is just stupid for many rides.

Example: I'm a bike safety instructor and I teach bike traffic safety, 
typically to 5-7 grades. We ask for parent volunteers to tag along at the 
end of a line of 8-12 students. We make it very clear that we will be 
riding slowly, stopping often for instruction, etc. You would be amazed at 
how many volunteers show up in full kit and clipped in. They just can't 
envision an easy ride in regular clothes, no matter how appropriate for the 
situation.


Doug

On Wednesday, February 25, 2015 at 4:20:09 PM UTC-8, Peter M wrote:

 One way to know your message has really gotten out there is when some 
 people you don't know start to genuinely hate you, hahaha!

 On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 7:16 PM, Patrick Moore bert...@gmail.com 
 javascript: wrote:



 Brewster Fong bfd...@gmail.com javascript: wrote:


 Btw, for all you paleo lovers, you'll hate this guy! While dropping 
 30lbs, he still eats like a pig and that includes massive amounts of 
 noodles, rice and bread (hey, a guy's got to carbo load!)...


 Kudos to him! I wish I had a 24 oz beer right now with which to drink his 
 health.

  


 You do see the what I call Rivendell guys out there too. But they 
 actually kind of stand out dress like bums in their baggy shorts, 
 seersucker shirts, etc. 


 One of them, or a near relation,  passed me today at about a 50% speed 
 differential, up a hill. Scruffy lout! I was wearing cycling kit, too!
  
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Re: [RBW] Re: Grant sets them straight with letter to editor

[Doug Williams]

pb,

Hmmm...I'm glad that you found a few good LBS's, but have you read a 
mainstream bicycle magazine recently? I see all sorts of articles and 
advertisements glorifying racing and bikes so lightweight that they are 
completely impractical for normal use. I see VERY few articles and 
advertisements featuring practical and reliable bikes or articles that 
espouse using a bike for transportation rather than for only racing or 
exercise. Transportation? What's that? A fun ride that isn't a race? What's 
that?

I don't think that Grant just invented this issue. The phenomena is quite 
real. Grant's message resonates with many because the racing phenomena IS 
real. 

And yes, I do (quite often) encounter smug racers in their spandex uniforms 
who disparage practical cyclists. They are mostly wannabe's and not real 
racers, of course. But they are numerous and annoying just the same.


Doug

On Tuesday, February 24, 2015 at 7:16:52 PM UTC-8, pb wrote:

 On Tuesday, February 24, 2015 at 4:57:32 PM UTC-8, Jim Bronson wrote:

 Why?  Why, over and over again?  Because the racing philosophy has the 
 mainstream and the LBS.  And it's not what serves most causal riders best, 
 and I applaud Grant for calling them out for it.  
 We all have seen at the LBS the times when some racerish young LBS 
 employee is trying to fit an older person onto a racerish bike, that will 
 not be well served by said bike.  Why is this what's in the mainstream?


 I just got off the phone with three representative LBS's.  I asked them 
 all the same thing:  I'm going to send my 58-year-old neighbor in to see 
 you.  He has average fitness, not bad, hikes on the weekend, hasn't ridden 
 a bike since college.  He wants to start riding on weekends, maybe work up 
 riding more regularly.  What kind of bike do you think he should look at 
 first?  The shops were Black Mountain Bicycles, a large Specialized 
 dealer, the Performance near my house, and the Trek Super Store nearest to 
 my house.

 All three gave me the same answer: a flat bar road hybrid.  None said, 
 well, duh, a racing bicycle, of course, with drop bars three inches below 
 the saddle!  Then I asked about what tires would come with the bikes.  Both 
 the Trek and Specialized stores said, somewhere between 32 and 38.  The guy 
 at Performance said, 28 at the narrowest, but more likely 32 or 35.  Two of 
 the three asked if I knew whether my friend had back or neck pain, and both 
 suggested my friend should start off with something pretty upright.  The 
 guy at Performance said, well, I'd really have to talk to him to find out 
 what he wants to do with the bike.

 So, are those answers OK with you, Jim?  How big a sample do I need to 
 persuade you that stereotyping the industry, LBS's, and a group of 
 cyclists, has the same value as other stereotypes?  By the way, do you know 
 what bike shops make the most money on, the largest margins?  Rubber and 
 softgoods.  If LBS's are as stupid and singleminded as you and, apparently, 
 Grant think they are, and if they are pushing bikes that will make people 
 uncomfortable, tell me, do you think their customers will come back and buy 
 rubber and softgoods?  Will their customers be excited about riding, and 
 bring their friends in to buy bikes?  

 Do I think the racerish sale has ever happened?  Of course I know that it 
 has.  There are poor salespeople, making inappropriate sales, in every 
 industry.  However, tarring the bicycle industry, and a significant group 
 of its members, all with the same brush, is not productive, and does not 
 reflect well on the speaker.  The whole nonsense of making an entire group 
 of people wrong so that you can feel superior just needs to stop.  And I 
 gotta tell you, I've never heard any of the racer-y people I know say, 
 those people on lugged steel bikes with alba bars sure are stupid and 
 brainwashed.

 I refer again to Norma's last paragraph.  Clearly, she has gotten an 
 impression about Grant and about his positions, and it's not a positive 
 impression.  I'm betting that she is in fact a nice person, and not a 
 stupid one.  And, she's a cyclist!  However she arrived at her impression 
 of Grant ... well, you draw your own conclusions. 


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[RBW] Re: Mithril?

[Doug Williams]

I just want a Mithril sticker for the Homer I have on order. GUARANTEED 
BUILT WITH MITHRIL and Manufactured Under the Mountain. How cool is 
that?  :-)

I was disappointed when I first visited RBW and learned that they don't 
make their frames on site. I was hoping to find Grant and Elrond forging 
steel in the basement with Gimli at the bellows.

Doug

On Wednesday, February 4, 2015 at 10:13:50 AM UTC-8, A. L Young wrote:

 Interesting overview of a new alloy that might be made into bicycles 
 someday. Or become vapor ware. 


 http://www.economist.com/news/science-and-technology/21642107-alloy-iron-and-aluminium-good-titanium-tenth?fsrc=scn/tw/te/pe/ed/wingsofsteel

 And here's the Riv-specific content: 

 http://flic.kr/p/obzSPw 
 http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fflic.kr%2Fp%2FobzSPwsa=Dsntz=1usg=AFQjCNGSb7R_W2Yl03UEr61C-8BvmVgmSw

 Hope Grant P. won't mind if I share a pic of his Homer from Entmoot. 

 Aaron nerd fest Young
 The Dalles, OR



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[RBW] Re: Towards a new category: high performance upright

[Doug Williams]

Yes, the word Sport might be a good starting point. We have had Sport 
Touring bikes. I don't think I like Sport Upright...is Upright Sport 
any better? I don't like Sport Townie or Sport Dutch. I don't want to 
use racer in the name and I don't know what a Sport Racer would be 
anyway.

That leaves Sport Cruiser?

Keep thinking and maybe we can come up with a good name.

Doug

On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 12:00:32 PM UTC-8, Trenker wrote:



 Sounds similar to the Sport Minivan. 


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[RBW] Re: Towards a new category: high performance upright

[Doug Williams]

Sportster bike...It would probably get shortened to Sportster. 
Hmmm...that might work. Especially for the Waterford frames made in 
Wisconsin (birthplace of the Harley Davidson Sportster).

I have a 650b Homer (with Albas) on order and we all know that the 650b 
Homer is just a Saluki with a stealth paint job. I'll make my own 
headbadge...Saluki Sportster.  :-)

Doug

On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 2:05:51 PM UTC-8, iamkeith wrote:

 You're on to something.   Gosh, why not just call them sportster 
 bikes.   As in: vehicles that combine capable handling with all-day 
 comfort and good looks, as opposed to singularly focused, 
 race-oriented, muscle-machines.  Examples of actual sportsters from other 
 disciplines:




 https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-9wCjkkjSdX8/VMquD4f_0iI/AEc/hNr3B1aUfiM/s1600/porsche-sportster.jpg


 https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-m6_pz3yFYa4/VMquJNSKwsI/AEk/K5jeHT41Fzg/s1600/Harley-sportster_1957.jpg


 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-7B9a86BMdfE/VMquP-iB2WI/AEs/Kfj1-7655Tc/s1600/marlin-sportster-03.jpg



 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-XhWXHRjfrFg/VMqt3FWcgMI/AEU/AofaJKGLzLg/s1600/maverick-sportster_car_1952.jpg




 On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 1:43:05 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

 Yes, the word Sport might be a good starting point. We have had Sport 
 Touring bikes. I don't think I like Sport Upright...is Upright Sport 
 any better? I don't like Sport Townie or Sport Dutch. I don't want to 
 use racer in the name and I don't know what a Sport Racer would be 
 anyway.

 That leaves Sport Cruiser?

 Keep thinking and maybe we can come up with a good name.

 Doug

 On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 12:00:32 PM UTC-8, Trenker wrote:



 Sounds similar to the Sport Minivan. 



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[RBW] Re: Towards a new category: high performance upright

[Doug Williams]

Ok, now that I did some checking, I found such a bike on the REI website. 
Called the 

Scott Sportster 50 Bike – 2015.

 

The easy-riding Scott Sportster 50 bike offers a comfortable upright riding 
position and speedy, smooth-rolling wheels for mellow commutes, riding 
around town or cruising along your local bike path.

 

http://www.rei.com/product/879474/scott-sportster-50-bike-2015

I don’t like the bike pictured, but put a quill stem on it, raise the 
handlebars, ditch the disc brakes and shocks... and it wouldn't be too bad. 
At least the Scott concept of a Sportster fits our concept to some degree.

 

Doug

On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 2:29:34 PM UTC-8, Doug Williams wrote:

 Sportster bike...It would probably get shortened to Sportster. 
 Hmmm...that might work. Especially for the Waterford frames made in 
 Wisconsin (birthplace of the Harley Davidson Sportster).

 I have a 650b Homer (with Albas) on order and we all know that the 650b 
 Homer is just a Saluki with a stealth paint job. I'll make my own 
 headbadge...Saluki Sportster.  :-)

 Doug

 On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 2:05:51 PM UTC-8, iamkeith wrote:

 You're on to something.   Gosh, why not just call them sportster 
 bikes.   As in: vehicles that combine capable handling with all-day 
 comfort and good looks, as opposed to singularly focused, 
 race-oriented, muscle-machines.  Examples of actual sportsters from other 
 disciplines:




 https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-9wCjkkjSdX8/VMquD4f_0iI/AEc/hNr3B1aUfiM/s1600/porsche-sportster.jpg


 https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-m6_pz3yFYa4/VMquJNSKwsI/AEk/K5jeHT41Fzg/s1600/Harley-sportster_1957.jpg


 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-7B9a86BMdfE/VMquP-iB2WI/AEs/Kfj1-7655Tc/s1600/marlin-sportster-03.jpg



 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-XhWXHRjfrFg/VMqt3FWcgMI/AEU/AofaJKGLzLg/s1600/maverick-sportster_car_1952.jpg




 On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 1:43:05 PM UTC-7, Doug Williams wrote:

 Yes, the word Sport might be a good starting point. We have had Sport 
 Touring bikes. I don't think I like Sport Upright...is Upright Sport 
 any better? I don't like Sport Townie or Sport Dutch. I don't want to 
 use racer in the name and I don't know what a Sport Racer would be 
 anyway.

 That leaves Sport Cruiser?

 Keep thinking and maybe we can come up with a good name.

 Doug

 On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 12:00:32 PM UTC-8, Trenker wrote:



 Sounds similar to the Sport Minivan. 



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Re: [RBW] Re: Kids' Riv-esque Bike

[Doug Williams]

I have kids myself. I second the mixte...my son has a Trek MountainTrack. 
It allowed him to ride a bigger bike that he could otherwise ride (better 
investment as he is now about to outgrow it). Also, his bike actually has a 
quill stem! Hard; but not impossible to come by. Allows you to raise the 
handlebars as the kid grows (and get them up high enough to start with). 
Lastly, my sons bike has a cool feature where the peddles can screw into 
the cranks in two different positions, effectively changing the crank 
length (again, adjust as they grow).

I suggest that you look for something like that. Ask for those features 
when you call the various bike shops or look online.

Doug

On Thursday, January 29, 2015 at 5:29:06 PM UTC-8, cyclot...@gmail.com 
wrote:

 If you don't need gears, a vintage Schwinn Bantam is a great bike: 
 https://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/4338741715
 Could even build it up w/ a 3 speed if so inclined. 



 On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 5:27 PM, Eric Daume eric...@gmail.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 I wouldn't worry much about bar height if you're moving to a 20 bike. My 
 90th% son, at just over 7, has a lot of room to grow before his saddle is 
 above the bars when I got him this 20 Specialized (picture a ways down on 
 this post):

 http://www.bikingtoplay.blogspot.com/2014/01/bike-and-hatchet-update.html

 (and please excuse my horrible mixing of past and present tense in the 
 above sentence).

 Eric
 Dublin, OH

 On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 8:20 PM, LeahFoy jonasa...@gmail.com 
 javascript: wrote:

 Ok, this sounds doable, all, but is there a Trek mtn bike that is made 
 small enough for a 6 year old? Aren't they adult bikes?

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 Cheers,
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 Member, Supreme Council of Cyberspace

 it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal



  

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[RBW] Re: new steel bike: Rivendells are cheap!

[Doug Williams]

And it still has a carbon infused plastic fork!

Many are catching on to the benefits of carbon. On Monday, January 26th, 
The Bike Snob wrote:
My belated New Year's Resolution is to make my bicycle cycle fleet 
completely crabon-free by the end of 2015.

For me...Done and Done!

Doug

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 4:53:53 AM UTC-8, Leslie wrote:

 Eddy Merckx announced a new steel bike

 http://pelotonmagazine.com/goods/eddy-merckx-custom-bike-eddy-70/

 ( http://eddy70.com/ )

 $17,500!!!

 Rivendells are a bargain!








 -L



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RE: [RBW] Re: Tire Pressure Revolution

[Doug Williams]

Yes, even the folding Supremes are not THAT supple. But let me say that they 
are more supple than many tires out there, they run very nicely. But they 
aren't as supple as the Compass tires or their ilk. The strength of the 
Schwalbe Marathon Supreme is that it is very flat resistant and tough due to 
the Vectran belt. Other tires have flat resistant belts, but they are stiffer, 
heavier, and (IMHO) not as tough. In order to get the same flat resistance, you 
would have to run a much heavier tire.

So, to sum up...run the Marathon Supreme if you want a flat resistant tire that 
doesn't weigh over 600 grams and that is more supple and runs better than most 
other tires in the high 300 to low 400 gram range. The Marathon Supreme is my 
favorite urban warrior and commuter tire because it is NOT a tank like most 
other commuter tires. Don't over inflate it and it will ride comfortably 
enough. Quite nicely...really! Just don't expect it to run like a Compass tire, 
or Jack Brown Green, (or another thin sidewall, thin tread tire) of the same 
width. If you go with the Supreme, my advice is to get the widest you can run 
and keep it inflated to as low a pressure as works for your riding. Do that, 
and you will be happy.

Doug

-Original Message-
From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Surlyprof
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2015 10:19 AM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Tire Pressure Revolution

Even the folding Supremes?  Just wondered if that would make a difference from 
the wire bead.

Thanks,
John

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[RBW] Re: Tire Pressure Revolution

[Doug Williams]

John,

I have Marathon Supreme's and they are great tires...very tough and flat 
resistant and much lighter than most other tires with the equivalent 
toughness and flat resistance. Call it a medium weight tire with heavy 
weight toughness. But, no...they are not considered supple. Not the 
stiffest tire out there, but not supple.

Doug

On Monday, January 26, 2015 at 8:18:14 AM UTC-8, Surlyprof wrote:


 Are there any resources that list tires that fall into the supple 
 category (or those that do not)?  I've been debating going to a 32 or 35c 
 Marathon Supreme for a road tire.  Is that considered supple?  Also, based 
 on your findings, it sounds like 35 might be preferable since the larger 
 size would not affect the performance.  Is that true?

 Thanks,
 John

 On Monday, January 26, 2015 at 6:20:47 AM UTC-8, Jan Heine wrote:

 Most here already know this, of course, but I summarized what we now know 
 about tire pressure and performance in a new blog post today...

 https://janheine.wordpress.com/2015/01/26/the-tire-pressure-revolution/

 Jan Heine
 Editor
 Bicycle Quarterly
 www.bikequarterly.com

 Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/



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[RBW] Re: One drawback to flippin' your bike for roadside repair.

[Doug Williams]

Every Douglas Adams fan knows that:“A towel, [The Hitchhiker's Guide to the 
Galaxy] says, is about the most massively useful thing an interstellar 
hitchhiker can have. Partly it has great practical value. You can wrap it 
around you for warmth as you bound across the cold moons of Jaglan Beta; 
you can lie on it on the brilliant marble-sanded beaches of Santraginus V, 
inhaling the heady sea vapors; you can sleep under it beneath the stars 
which shine so redly on the desert world of Kakrafoon; use it to sail a 
miniraft down the slow heavy River Moth; wet it for use in 
hand-to-hand-combat; wrap it round your head to ward off noxious fumes or 
avoid the gaze of the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal (such a 
mind-boggingly stupid animal, it assumes that if you can't see it, it can't 
see you); you can wave your towel in emergencies as a distress signal, and 
of course dry yourself off with it if it still seems to be clean enough.”
I always carry a small micro-fiber backpacking towel for all emergencies. 
In addition to the above, it cleans greasy hands after touching the chain, 
saves Brooks saddle during tire changes, and works as a bandage for any 
wounds incurred.

Doug Williams
Don't Panic, and keep your towel handy.

On Monday, January 26, 2015 at 3:54:10 PM UTC-8, John Phillips wrote:

 You're not scratching your saddle, you're creating beausage, the patina of 
 love and use!

 Or you can strip and spread your shirt down on the ground to spare your 
 loved one any discomfort.

 Bonus points for each 10 degree drop in wind chill below 32F/0C, extra 
 bonus points if you use your pants!

 Demerits if you drag your bike across the ground seat side down, or if you 
 change the tire in the mud, or a mess of cow patties.

 I'd say, Ready, set go!, but that would be racing.

 John  



 On Monday, January 26, 2015 at 2:49:03 PM UTC-8, lungimsam wrote:

 Scratches your leather saddle to turn the bike upside down.

 In light of the Blog post about this, I figured I would ask you leather 
 users how you prevent the scratching from happening. Any convenient ideas?




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[RBW] Re: One drawback to flippin' your bike for roadside repair.

[Doug Williams]

Of course, if your bike has a double kickstand (one of mine does), none of 
this is necessary because you can just leave the bike on the kickstand and 
change either wheel. If the rear wheel is flat and the rear of the bike is 
heavily loaded, you might have to toss some stuff on the handlebars to 
weigh them down. For most everyday loads, just removing a wheel is enough 
to change the balance to the other wheel. Nothing could be easier.

Doug

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[RBW] Re: Rapid Rise rear derailers?

[Doug Williams]

Hmmm...I have a Homer on order and I am getting bar end shifters. But I am 
new to bar end shifters and I like the idea of up is up-shift and down 
is down-shift. Maybe I should consider one of those wierdo backward 
derailers. Any suggestions?

Doug Williams

On Thursday, January 22, 2015 at 5:37:48 PM UTC-8, Bill wrote:

 Got one on my Saluki and love it. With bar ends you pull up to upshift and 
 push down to downshift. I have four other bikes that are normal and one 
 Campy Shimergo and have no problem switching among them.

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Re: [RBW] Homer brake improvements?

[Doug Williams]

Peter,

Thanks for making this clear for me! I had visited Paul's website, but due 
to insufficient brain power, I didn't have a clear understanding of the 
difference between the braze-on version and the center-mount version 
(except for the obvious part about the braze-on version requiring specially 
positioned braze-on's). I missed the center mount conversion kit link that 
you posted below. Now everything is clear to me.

I'm getting Paul Racers for my new 58cm 650b Homer. I want to run 42mm 
tires and P50 LongBoard fenders. Hopefully the Paul Racers will help with 
clearance issues as well as stopping the bike. Actually, I'm quite certain 
that they will...because Mark said so when I called Riv.  :-)  Obviously, 
I'm going with the center mount version because I'm not eager to take a 
torch to my new frame! My frame was ordered December 30th, so now I am just 
waiting...waiting...waiting.  :-(

Miles and years down the road when I need a repaint, I might consider 
adding the braze-on's...if I was convinced that there was going to be a big 
difference in performance and/or ease of adjustment. Is there really a 
convincing case for that?

Doug Williams

On Saturday, January 17, 2015 at 1:57:46 AM UTC-8, Peter Adler wrote:

 Correction: The center-mount Racers are identical to the braze-on Racers - 
 they just have the additional bolt-on bridge and pivots installed, which 
 keeps the bearings spaced correctly and attaches to the frame/fork brake 
 holes. That's the reason the braze-ons are $14 cheaper than the bolt-ons: 
 Fewer parts. Paul sells an aftermarket conversion kit for braze-ons for $50:

 http://www.paulcomp.com/spareparts/racercentermountkit.html?relatedid=355 
 http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.paulcomp.com%2Fspareparts%2Fracercentermountkit.html%3Frelatedid%3D355sa=Dsntz=1usg=AFQjCNETcl21hbq1PdjKgnsLP7WnB2OZLg

 Considering that the bolt-on conversion kit costs $35 more than getting 
 the bolt-on bridge preinstalled, I think the shrewd purchase is to buy the 
 bolt-on version and then pull off the bridge when you've finally gotten the 
 canti posts brazed on in the correct position. Not only does it give you 
 the option of using the brakes before you've gotten your act together for 
 torch surgery, but you have more resale options down the road.

 Peter Adler
 Berkeley, CA/USA

 On Thursday, January 15, 2015 at 1:46:17 PM UTC-8, Tim Gavin wrote:

 Paul Racers are available as braze-on only (to be mounted on a fork with 
 dedicated braze-ons), or the bolt-on version (which I have) which has a 
 bridge between the arms to mount to the standard brake hole. 



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