from:"Drake"

Re: [RE-wrenches] replacement needed for 12 vdc, 20w El-Sid circulator

2024-05-27 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches




I have a box of new, 24VDC El Sid pumps that I decided not to use. I 
would be willing to sell the lot for what i have in it.


Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2024-05-26 12:35, Kirk Herander via RE-wrenches wrote:


Hello,

Any recommendations for replacement? A customer's El Sid on an old Sdhw 
system just failed after 20 years of service. It is powered directly 
from a PV module. Thanks in advance.

--

Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC

_Celebrating our 33st Anniversary 1991-2024!!_

dba Vermont Solar Engineering

802.559.1225
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback Tech Support

2024-05-27 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches




Okay I did. Below is my posting.

Is Outback tech support coming back under the new management? I would 
recommend reviving it and hiring back the people who really know the 
equipment, especially Lones Tuss.


Will Outback honor the warranties of equipment now in the field? I 
recommend that it does, and improves the services rendered by the 
sellers. Since many people depend on  their solar equipment for their 
electricity, it is crucial that replacements be delivered in a timely 
manner.


Thank you,

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2024-05-24 18:40, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches wrote:

Marshall Neipert [3]Forum MemberPosts: 11 [4]Joined: Mon May 20, 2024 
10:07 amMy RE system: President of Outback Power

https://www.linkedin.com/in/neipertContact:
Contact Marshall Neipert [5]

You should ask him Drake! He is on the forum and responding to some 
emails. Here is in a link that he is taking suggestions on

https://forum.outbackpower.com/viewtopic.php?t=18726

Kind of weird that the president is using a linkedin address but it is 
their company now. That is the main reason I responded on the Solar 
edge stock.
You have to stay in business to be in business. With that price hit and 
an address in Isreal right now, beware!


I know very little about roof mounted electronics because I do not go 
on roofs. I totally get it that most here do. I still have my rights I 
think!


FRIDAY ! Stay Safe !

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
[1]https://offgridsolar1.com/ [2]  [1]
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2024-05-24 3:20 pm, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches wrote:


Hello All,

With the sale of Outback, their tech support seems to have 
disappeared. Around the time of the sale, tech support had agreed to 
send me a new control stack for a Radian. After a long delay, they did 
send it, but were quick to remind me to return the core.


When the new control stack was installed, the inverter would not work. 
The error message was AC Out Voltage Low. I put the old one back in 
and returned the one they sent. There is no one to talk to, and no one 
answers email.


Do you know if the new owners are planning to honor product warranty? 
Is tech support coming back?


This is a pretty rough transition. It will likely leave a number of 
people in the dark.


Fun Times Indeed!

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

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Links:
--
[1] http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
[2] https://offgridsolar1.com/
[3] 
https://forum.outbackpower.com/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofileu=20772
[4] 
https://forum.outbackpower.com/search.php?author_id=20772sr=posts

[5] https://forum.outbackpower.com/viewtopic.php?t=18726#___
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[RE-wrenches] Outback Tech Support

2024-05-24 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches



Hello All,

With the sale of Outback, their tech support seems to have disappeared. 
Around the time of the sale, tech support had agreed to send me a new 
control stack for a Radian. After a long delay, they did send it, but 
were quick to remind me to return the core.


When the new control stack was installed, the inverter would not work. 
The error message was AC Out Voltage Low. I put the old one back in and 
returned the one they sent. There is no one to talk to, and no one 
answers email.


Do you know if the new owners are planning to honor product warranty? Is 
tech support coming back?


This is a pretty rough transition. It will likely leave a number of 
people in the dark.


Fun Times Indeed!

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

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[RE-wrenches] Fwd: Re: $300 + transmission fee!

2024-02-25 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches



Peter,

Right, that is about it. The fee is a monthly fee. It will take a year 
of keeping the spike below that before the fee will be dropped from the 
bill.


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


---


On 2024-02-23 11:12, pgir...@mindspring.com wrote:

Drake

  AEP should be able to provide your client ( if they are the one
asking ) with a real time readout showing the "spike / load increase "
and what actual equipment they had to install. Sounds a bit dodgy.
What's next, special fees for homeowners who kick on the well pump
flushing a toilet while using a hairdryer at the same time?

Peter Giroux
ASAE

-Original Message-
From: RE-wrenches  On
Behalf Of Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2024 10:57 AM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] $300 + transmission fee!

Hello All,

A system we installed several years ago is on an old school building
that has been repurposed to office space and small shops. The loads
are very small. The electric bill, during the short days of the year
with lots of clouds (very little solar), was around $30.

Suddenly the electric bill came with a $300+ fee for transmission. AEP
claimed that the load, at some point, went over a certain amount of
power, so that the company had to charge for equipment that would
handle that load year around. No equipment changes have been made. The
service is 200 A.

Has anyone else encountered this? I wonder if there is any other type
of rate schedule the building could be put on to eliminate this
problem.
AEP is not forthcoming about rate schedules or this issue.

Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810 NABCEP Certified PV
Installation Professional




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[RE-wrenches] $300 + transmission fee!

2024-02-23 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello All,

A system we installed several years ago is on an old school building 
that has been repurposed to office space and small shops. The loads are 
very small. The electric bill, during the short days of the year with 
lots of clouds (very little solar), was around $30.


Suddenly the electric bill came with a $300+ fee for transmission. AEP 
claimed that the load, at some point, went over a certain amount of 
power, so that the company had to charge for equipment that would handle 
that load year around. No equipment changes have been made. The service 
is 200 A.


Has anyone else encountered this? I wonder if there is any other type of 
rate schedule the building could be put on to eliminate this problem. 
AEP is not forthcoming about rate schedules or this issue.


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional




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Re: [RE-wrenches] EG4 Equipment

2024-02-17 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

I fully agree that off grid solar has taken a major downturn. Once the
equipment became software based, the reliability dropped. Sure, there
are nice features available with these cyber enhanced systems, but the
cost in reliability makes being energy independent off the grid hard to
accomplish.

There are good reports on Samlex products. Has anyone tried their new
120/240 split phase units? Are they stack-able yet?

As far as batteries go, I'm pretty much in the Lead Head club,
especially for off grid. That being said, lead acid batteries,
especially AGMs have gotten really expensive and it seems the quality
isn't what it used to be.

What is the best AGM battery these days?

Thanks,

Drake

---

On 2024-02-16 17:02, Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches wrote:

We gave EG4 and Signature another chance after promises from their dealer
oriented support department that we could expect better service from them. We
had an EG4 BMS crap out a couple months ago after only a few months. Lots and
lots of communications with Signature and we still don't have a BMS or
replacement battery. It's been a shit show with them. I think we are going to
remove them and install 3rd party BMS's and find some use for them. Maybe
donate them. We've only had luck with Schneider/Discover pairings in closed
loop. A large system we did with Sol-Arks never really worked in Closed loop,
despite Discover coming to the site. Most likely it's a Sol-Ark issue, but
we've reached Sol-Arks technical expertise limits. Even with Schneider/AES,
there have been some issues that are causing me to re-consider Li for offgrid.
I just had a conversation this morning with a long time off-grid pro and he
said the same thing. It used to be, we'd install a wet lead acid bank and then
ten
years would pass before hearing from the client when it was time for another bank. Sometimes fifteen years. Our call backs with systems over the last ten years, first with a decline in equipment quality and then the switch to Li are costing us too much money and causing a lot of heartburn for our clients. Rant Over

On Fri, Feb 16, 2024 at 12:57 PM Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi All,

I've searched the archives for info pertaining to EG4 inverters and batteries. The comments have been mostly positive. I have stayed away from EG4 until now in part, for the reason the Michael Morningstar suggested last June - that is, they seemed very oriented to the DIY market and not real serious contenders in the lasting marketplace. However, I was at RE+ Boston this week and was quite surprised to see that the EG4 18k inverter is, for all I could tell, identical to the Fortress Envy 12k, in both physical layout as well as menu structure. I have very limited experience with the Envy (having just installed my 1st one last week, in order to compare it to the Sol-Ark 15). I don't have any thoughts about it yet, except that the font on the screen is quite small and the opening screen is not as intuitive as the Sol-Ark, but that might just take familiarizing myself more to the Envy (and/or the EG4).

My question is, for folks who have had either the Envy or the EG4 inverters installed for a decent period of time, what is your current take on their functionality, durability, and for the EG4, the quality of support? Also, what experience have folks had similarly with the EG4 LLI batteries? I'm not unhappy with the Sol-Ark or in general the Fortress eVault Max battery, but there are some attractive things about the Envy and potentially the EG4 18k, and the price point and seemingly smart configuration of the EG4 LLI batteries are certainly eye-catching.

I'm also currently starting to lean toward using Lithium batteries and inverters from the same manufacturer, as I'm growing weary of the mismatching firmware updates that are causing somewhat frequent issues between the 2 components. Although the inverter/battery integrated units (i.e. Sonen, Tesla, etc.) don't seem ideal, since the market is so volatile at the moment. If one component fails, I'd like the option to replace it with a different brand without having to replace the other component as well. Using the same manu doesn't necessarily cut down the problems, but it certainly will help in the troubleshooting process by hopefully having less of the "not my problem" or "we haven't seen that problem" responses from tech support.

I really don't like making forays into bleeding-edge technologies, so I'm hoping to gain some experienced insight.

Thanks,

Howie Michaelson

Sun Catcher ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Fwd: Re: Cantilevered array

2024-02-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


If the array covers the rain gutters, doesn't that prevent the gutters
from catching rain? Doesn't the edge of the extended modules form a drip
edge, where water will not be diverted by the gutters, but hit the
ground directly?  

Will the gutters be accessible for future maintenance? 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 


_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2024-02-12 11:02, Christopher Warfel wrote:


Hi, in what way?  The loading is obviously less, and the clamps are rated for 
the load.

On 2/12/2024 10:56 AM, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org wrote: 

How do you deal with the rain gutters? 

Drake Chamberlin 

Media & Communication Action Project 


https://m-cap.org/

---

On 2024-02-08 16:46, Sky Sims via RE-wrenches wrote: 

I've designed and installed several thousand cantilevered arrays over the last three decades and never had a single issue. Unfortunately, code changes have taken a turn for the worse in most jurisdictions and oftentimes disallow cantilevering.  

Sky Sims 
Https://EcologicalSystems.org 
732-462-3858 


On Jan 19, 2024, at 3:09 PM, Christopher Warfel via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:

I've done a fair amount of roof mounted solar structural compliance, and I would say that the cantilevered design looks like a disaster waiting to happen. You could not use conventional solar racking products.  Chris 

On 1/13/2024 12:42 PM, William Miller via RE-wrenches wrote: 

Drake 

My earlier reply may have been a bit facetious.  What I meant by it was that big-box solar contractors can be lazy when it comes to solar design.  They will rely totally on satellite imagery and not check the design on the ground.  This is how you get solar proposed for shaded areas, where skylights and roof vents are located, or overhanging thin air.  This may be what is happening in the image you shared.  

What is unique here is someone actually specified overhanging panels.  Looking more closely at the image, a roof outline is shown but it is not clear that the outline is actually situated over a building.  It almost looks like there is landscaped area inside the outline. 

The solution of course is to get on out there, measure the roof and any obstructions and analyze the shading.  I use the Sun Seeker [1] app for IOS for the shading analysis. 

William 

Miller Solar 

17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422 

805-438-5600 

www.millersolar.com [2] 

CA Lic. 773985 


From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf 
Of Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2024 8:47 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Cc: drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Fwd: Re: Cantilevered array 

Here is a larger snip of the situation. 

 

Label says overhang from upper roof. 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


---

On 2024-01-12 07:29, Jason Szumlanski wrote: 

Are you sure that's what you're looking at? To me, that looks like there was an addition made to the house, and maybe it's a multi-pitch roof. That lower part might be a covered wrap-around porch. 

Jason Szumlanski 


Principal Solar Designer | Florida Solar Design Group
NABCEP Certified Solar Professional (PVIP)
Florida State Certified Solar Contractor CVC56956 

On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 5:59 PM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches  wrote: 

I was given a drawing, produced by a very large solar company, showing the array cantilevered over the edge of the roof by several feet. 

 

Notice how the array hangs out over the lawn for several feet. Is there anyway that this is a legitimate way to mount modules? 

Thanks, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


--

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Fwd: Re: Cantilevered array

2024-02-12 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

How do you deal with the rain gutters? 

Drake Chamberlin 

Media & Communication Action Project 


https://m-cap.org/

---

On 2024-02-08 16:46, Sky Sims via RE-wrenches wrote:

I've designed and installed several thousand cantilevered arrays over the last three decades and never had a single issue. Unfortunately, code changes have taken a turn for the worse in most jurisdictions and oftentimes disallow cantilevering.  

Sky Sims 
Https://EcologicalSystems.org 
732-462-3858 


On Jan 19, 2024, at 3:09 PM, Christopher Warfel via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


I've done a fair amount of roof mounted solar structural compliance, and I would say that the cantilevered design looks like a disaster waiting to happen. You could not use conventional solar racking products.  Chris 

On 1/13/2024 12:42 PM, William Miller via RE-wrenches wrote: 

Drake 

My earlier reply may have been a bit facetious.  What I meant by it was that big-box solar contractors can be lazy when it comes to solar design.  They will rely totally on satellite imagery and not check the design on the ground.  This is how you get solar proposed for shaded areas, where skylights and roof vents are located, or overhanging thin air.  This may be what is happening in the image you shared.  

What is unique here is someone actually specified overhanging panels.  Looking more closely at the image, a roof outline is shown but it is not clear that the outline is actually situated over a building.  It almost looks like there is landscaped area inside the outline. 

The solution of course is to get on out there, measure the roof and any obstructions and analyze the shading.  I use the Sun Seeker [1] app for IOS for the shading analysis. 

William 

Miller Solar 

17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422 

805-438-5600 

www.millersolar.com [2] 

CA Lic. 773985 


From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf 
Of Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2024 8:47 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Cc: drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Fwd: Re: Cantilevered array 

Here is a larger snip of the situation. 

 

Label says overhang from upper roof. 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


---

On 2024-01-12 07:29, Jason Szumlanski wrote: 

Are you sure that's what you're looking at? To me, that looks like there was an addition made to the house, and maybe it's a multi-pitch roof. That lower part might be a covered wrap-around porch. 

Jason Szumlanski 


Principal Solar Designer | Florida Solar Design Group
NABCEP Certified Solar Professional (PVIP)
Florida State Certified Solar Contractor CVC56956 

On Thu, Jan 11, 2024 at 5:59 PM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches  wrote: 

I was given a drawing, produced by a very large solar company, showing the array cantilevered over the edge of the roof by several feet. 

 

Notice how the array hangs out over the lawn for several feet. Is there anyway that this is a legitimate way to mount modules? 

Thanks, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


--

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Re: [RE-wrenches] State of Charge Meter for Sol-Ark

2024-02-09 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


How does the lack of accuracy in SOC detection affect the usefulness of
closed loop systems? 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


On 2024-02-05 11:36, William Miller via RE-wrenches wrote:

Jason: 

I am careful about getting my clients too dependent on SOC readings.  SOC is a calculated value based on changing variables and is notoriously inaccurate. 

Below is a screenshot of the Optics reporting for a client.  The graph line that begins as the lower of the two is the SOC, the other is voltage.  The SOC is out of calibration until about noon when it jumps from about 20% to about 80%.  This does not mean the SOC changed by that amount, it means that it was just very wrong.  Who knows when it is correct? 

In spite of repeated entreaties this client still reads the SOC and becomes concerned when it gets low-- even if the voltage level indicates the batteries are well charged.  I have to deal with his misplaced anxiety. 

This problem appears to occur across all battery/inverter technology.  For example, SMA touts their "coulomb counting" as more accurate than others but I have witnessed otherwise.  You'd think that BMS units built by lithium manufacturers for their own products would be consistently accurate but even those BMS units need to recalibrate frequently, this according to the battery manufacturer's engineers. 

It would be nice to offer clients a simple, accurate method of ascertaining battery charge levels.  SOC is not that method.  I train my clients to watch voltage levels and to understand these values are elastic.  If you can see trends in the battery voltage, so much the better. This is why I like the Outback Optics interface.  This is also why a good AGS system examines battery voltage over time. 

I no longer install Outback FNDC units.  Without them there is no SOC reading.  I don't install Sunny Island systems--they are SOC centered and suffer for it. 

William 

Miller Solar 

17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422 

805-438-5600 

www.millersolar.com [1] 

CA Lic. 773985 


From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On Behalf 
Of Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches
Sent: Sunday, February 4, 2024 7:30 AM
To: RE-wrenches
Cc: Jason Szumlanski
Subject: [RE-wrenches] State of Charge Meter for Sol-Ark 

Are there any off the shelf solutions to view battery SOC via a wired meter mounted remotely on a property? I have a client with a simple voltage based meter for lead acid batteries that they are accustomed to using as a quick and approximate gauge of SOC. They want something similar for their new Sol-Ark with EG4 LL batteries. 


They will have smartphone app visibility, but they want something they can see 
inside the house without picking up a phone or going out to the inverter. 
Ideally the SOC will come from the inverter or the battery itself, not an 
external source (to avoid discrepancies).

Jason Szumlanski 

Florida Solar Design Group  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Schneider Insight Home and Insight Cloud

2024-02-07 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

My experience with using Insight and Xanbus is that the projects never
end. It is too bad, since Schneider equipment seems really good. The
software issues don't seem to ever get completely solved. Possibly with
a very simple system, the Xanbus might work OK.

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2024-02-05 12:27, Lou Russo via RE-wrenches wrote:

Aloha All,

I recently installed 2 new off-grid systems using all Scneider products, Discover 7.4 batteries and the Insight Home all setup in Insight Cloud. Both systems are experiencing communications issues with Insight Cloud and a bit on the Xanbus. Though each in a different way.

Before I go into specifics, has anyone else been having issues with Insight Cloud or the Xanbus recently?
Just wondering if it is a me problem or a they problem.

I have gone through all the standard tech support phone call instructions. All firmware updated, comms cables checked, internet speeds confirmed to be good, system set back to system defaults and reprogrammed, etc...

Thanks for your time.

Aloha,

Lou Russo
Owner
l...@spreesolarsystems.com
808 345 6762
Spree Solar Systems LLC
CT-34322

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Automatic load control

2023-12-16 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

I use a Morningstar relay driver and 48 VDC relays to drop loads as the
battery voltage drops. It works fine, and avoids the necessity of
complex electronics.

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-12-14 21:36, Howie Michaelson via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi all,

I am trying to figure out best options to control loads in a Sol-Ark15k battery backup residential system. It's been quite a few years since I've set up an automatic load control, and never with a Sol-Ark. The Sol-Ark will output to the main breaker panel, so no separate "backed up" panel - all house loads will likely be on the Sol-Ark's load side.

What do folks like to use in this type of circumstance to automatically shed loads when the grid is down, either sequentially as the battery bank drops down or more simply triggered by loss of grid? Are they pieces of equipment that work specifically with the Sol-Ark?
I'd also be open to considering Fortress's Envy, if there is an option that would work well specifically with it.
I'm interested in the range of options from simple to complicated, as long as it is automated. All automated ideas/options appreciated.
Thanks!
Howie Michaelson
Sun Catcher
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Re: [RE-wrenches] 48 V DC temp sensing relay

2023-12-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

William, 


I'm planning to use a 48 V battery vent fan, turned around backwards, to
blow air into the box. 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 


_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-12-13 11:25, William Miller via RE-wrenches wrote:

Drake: 

I tried running 48 VDC muffin fans on battery voltage. They failed. I switched to a Dc-Dc converter (12 or 24, can't remember) from digi-key and problem solved.  

Point being battery voltage ranges may be too extreme for some components. 


William Miller
Miller Solar.com
805-438-5600
www.millersolar.com [1] 

On Wed, Dec 13, 2023 at 8:08 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches  wrote: 

Hello, 

Does anyone know of a 48 VDC temperature sensing relay? I need to use one to control a fan in a 48 V battery bank, to bring in cold air when the bank gets too hot from the wood heating system in the house. 

The relay needs to operate with the 48 VDC power supply and disconnect a small current with 48 VDC contacts. 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


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[RE-wrenches] 48 V DC temp sensing relay

2023-12-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Hello, 


Does anyone know of a 48 VDC temperature sensing relay? I need to use
one to control a fan in a 48 V battery bank, to bring in cold air when
the bank gets too hot from the wood heating system in the house. 


The relay needs to operate with the 48 VDC power supply and disconnect a
small current with 48 VDC contacts. 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA TL-22 insulation resistance error

2023-12-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

It could be the inverter. The TL-22 series had a lot of problems with
false arc fault errors.

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-12-13 10:52, Dave Tedeyan via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi All,

I am curious to hear if anyone else has run into this:

This is the system I posted about a little while ago that had the SolarWorld modules and all the module to module connectors were swollen and melted. One of the inverters was giving an insulation resistance error, and so after seeing the module connectors, I was sure that was the issue. We replaced every single module connector with new MC4's, and then the error came back!

My next step was to swap in the junction box which strings go to which inverter to identify whether the issue was on the roof or somewhere between the roof jbox and the inverter. (the issue was isolated to only 1 of 4 strings previously). Turns out the same inverter is faulting, which leads me to believe that there may be an issue with the wires in the DC conduit. Maybe they got damaged by a rough wire pull at the initial installation 7 years ago, and its finally degraded enough to cause a problem. The fault is intermittent, only showing up once every couple weeks or so, so it is difficult to catch it while the fault is active.

But my question is, could there also be something wrong with the inverter itself? After spending a lot of time on this one, ideally, I would know that replacing the DC wires will fix it. So I am curious if people have done this, to still find that the issue was something internal to the inverter.

Thanks!
-Dave

[1]

Dave Tedeyan, P.E.
Owner | Sungineer Solar

p: he | him | his
a: 1653 Slaterville Rd. | Ithaca, NY 14850
w: www.sungineersolar.com [2]
c: (607) 270-0370

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Question

2023-11-01 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Follow up:

The charger on the Radian connected to the grid at 252 VAC today. It
appears that it is random when the inverter will connect. The AC grid
voltage does not appear to be the issue.

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-31 11:34, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches wrote:

Jay,

It was a problem that surfaced before. Outback tech support was unable to figure it out. Then, the problem went away. Recently it showed up again.

For the last couple of days it has been connecting normally. The voltage has been 250 VAC or lower.

I know that most direct grid tie inverters can go to 264 V. I wondered if the Radian might be limiting voltage to protect loads. Just a theory based on the reading of 251 and higher when the inverter would not connect.

Thanks,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-30 20:37, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Drake I forgot to ask, but I'm thinking this is a new problem on an older system that was working normally?

Jay

On Oct 30, 2023, at 11:15 AM, david quattro via RE-wrenches
wrote:

I'm not familiar with Outback defaults but most inverters I've dealt with have a grid tolerance of 10% +/- so 216 to 264VAC.

On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 6:57 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi Jay,

The inverter won't even connect to the grid. It stays in the state where it is sampling the grid, AC in light blinking.

Is the default high voltage for the nominal 240 V 280? (IE 140 V X 2).

Thanks for your help.

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-29 15:45, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi drake

The early mate 3 has a glitch which I think they changed in the 3s.

You e got to set the rebulk volts above what you want it to charge at.

IE if the battery volts don't get below the rebulk volts it won't charge.

So if your shallow cycling the batteries it's common it won't get below the rebulk volts. If you're deep cycling it usually will with default settings

The default high voltage window for ac input is default at 140v.

Hope this helps

Jay

On Oct 29, 2023, at 11:14 AM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
wrote:

My Radian GS 8048 intermittently will connect to the grid to charge batteries. The grid voltage seems to run high around here. Yesterday, it wouldn't connect. The grid voltage was at 251 V. Later it did connect. At that point the grid was at 246 V.

I am suspecting that the Radian has a voltage acceptance limit of 250 V. Is that true? Is it possible to open up the window?

If that isn't it, what could be the problem?

Thank you,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Question

2023-11-01 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

It isn't in sell mode. The system is 2 or 3 years old, and has had this
issue before. Outback couldn't figure it out, and then is started
working normally.

---

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

On 2023-10-31 12:14, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Is the radian connected to grid sell?

If so then I'd say yes the higher grid voltage is preventing connection.

Jay

On Oct 31, 2023, at 9:35 AM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
wrote:

Jay,

It was a problem that surfaced before. Outback tech support was unable to figure it out. Then, the problem went away. Recently it showed up again.

For the last couple of days it has been connecting normally. The voltage has been 250 VAC or lower.

Thanks,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-30 20:37, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Drake I forgot to ask, but I'm thinking this is a new problem on an older system that was working normally?

Jay

On Oct 30, 2023, at 11:15 AM, david quattro via RE-wrenches
wrote:

I'm not familiar with Outback defaults but most inverters I've dealt with have a grid tolerance of 10% +/- so 216 to 264VAC.

On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 6:57 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi Jay,

The inverter won't even connect to the grid. It stays in the state where it is sampling the grid, AC in light blinking.

Is the default high voltage for the nominal 240 V 280? (IE 140 V X 2).

Thanks for your help.

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-29 15:45, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi drake

The early mate 3 has a glitch which I think they changed in the 3s.

You e got to set the rebulk volts above what you want it to charge at.

IE if the battery volts don't get below the rebulk volts it won't charge.

So if your shallow cycling the batteries it's common it won't get below the rebulk volts. If you're deep cycling it usually will with default settings

The default high voltage window for ac input is default at 140v.

Hope this helps

Jay

On Oct 29, 2023, at 11:14 AM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
wrote:

I am suspecting that the Radian has a voltage acceptance limit of 250 V. Is that true? Is it possible to open up the window?

If that isn't it, what could be the problem?

Thank you,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Question

2023-10-31 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Jay,

It was a problem that surfaced before. Outback tech support was unable
to figure it out. Then, the problem went away. Recently it showed up
again.

For the last couple of days it has been connecting normally. The voltage
has been 250 VAC or lower.

I know that most direct grid tie inverters can go to 264 V. I wondered
if the Radian might be limiting voltage to protect loads. Just a theory
based on the reading of 251 and higher when the inverter would not
connect.

Thanks,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-30 20:37, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Drake I forgot to ask, but I'm thinking this is a new problem on an older system that was working normally?

Jay

On Oct 30, 2023, at 11:15 AM, david quattro via RE-wrenches
wrote:

I'm not familiar with Outback defaults but most inverters I've dealt with have a grid tolerance of 10% +/- so 216 to 264VAC.

On Mon, Oct 30, 2023 at 6:57 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi Jay,

The inverter won't even connect to the grid. It stays in the state where it is sampling the grid, AC in light blinking.

Is the default high voltage for the nominal 240 V 280? (IE 140 V X 2).

Thanks for your help.

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-29 15:45, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi drake

The early mate 3 has a glitch which I think they changed in the 3s.

You e got to set the rebulk volts above what you want it to charge at.

IE if the battery volts don't get below the rebulk volts it won't charge.

So if your shallow cycling the batteries it's common it won't get below the rebulk volts. If you're deep cycling it usually will with default settings

The default high voltage window for ac input is default at 140v.

Hope this helps

Jay

On Oct 29, 2023, at 11:14 AM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
wrote:

I am suspecting that the Radian has a voltage acceptance limit of 250 V. Is that true? Is it possible to open up the window?

If that isn't it, what could be the problem?

Thank you,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Question

2023-10-30 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Hi Jay,

The inverter won't even connect to the grid. It stays in the state where
it is sampling the grid, AC in light blinking.

Is the default high voltage for the nominal 240 V 280? (IE 140 V X 2).

Thanks for your help.

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-10-29 15:45, Jay via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi drake

The early mate 3 has a glitch which I think they changed in the 3s.

You e got to set the rebulk volts above what you want it to charge at.

IE if the battery volts don't get below the rebulk volts it won't charge.

So if your shallow cycling the batteries it's common it won't get below the rebulk volts. If you're deep cycling it usually will with default settings

The default high voltage window for ac input is default at 140v.

Hope this helps

Jay

On Oct 29, 2023, at 11:14 AM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches
wrote:

I am suspecting that the Radian has a voltage acceptance limit of 250 V. Is that true? Is it possible to open up the window?

If that isn't it, what could be the problem?

Thank you,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

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[RE-wrenches] Radian Question

2023-10-29 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


My Radian GS 8048 intermittently will connect to the grid to charge
batteries. The grid voltage seems to run high around here. Yesterday, it
wouldn't connect. The grid voltage was at 251 V. Later it did connect.
At that point the grid was at 246 V. 


I am suspecting that the Radian has a voltage acceptance limit of 250 V.
Is that true? Is it possible to open up the window? 

If that isn't it, what could be the problem? 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


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[RE-wrenches] Line Side Tap

2023-10-12 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


We have a design where the conductors will come out of a 400 A meter
base to a junction box. Splices in the box will allow for the PV to feed
the meter. 

A maximum of 312 Amps can come from the inverters to feed the grid. 


The loads on the existing main service are significantly less than 200A.
The service is rated at 200 A, 3 phase delta. 


The conductors from the meter would be rated at 400 A to the splice, as
would the conductors to the photovoltaic system. The conductors to the
existing service would be downsized to 200 A. 


We were told that the bus bar rating of the service must also be 400 A,
even though the output of the PV does not feed through that box. Is
there a rule that says this? What would be the logic? 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 


_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Fronius USA available 2023 & 2024 ?

2023-09-01 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

My suppliers don't have any Fronius now. I try to buy entire systems, if
possible. What is now available for a string inverter is the Grow Watt.
Can anyone either recommend them, or warn us not to use them.

Thanks,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-08-25 12:44, Eric Smiley via RE-wrenches wrote:

Interesting. Fronius has a strong presence in Canada with good tech support. We
also have a very low failure rate - can't remember the last time we replaced
one. There were some supply issues earlier this year but we are receiving
inverters and parts. They also have a good rep for low failure and good service
in Australia and Europe. Not sure why the US gets short shrift.

Eric Smiley, Design Manager
e...@vecoop.ca
T: 250.703.6004 [2]
T: 888.386.0116 [3]
VIRIDIANENERGY.CA [4]

[4]

On Fri, 25 Aug 2023 at 08:27, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches wrote:

I think Fronius has left the building. The reason I know is they stopped sending me AFCI repairs about 2 years ago. There was not any support from their installers in remote places like the Sierra range.

I would second Tump on picking a good company with real money and products. Below is a new one this fall.

https://shop.se.com/us/en/schneiderhome

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
https://offgridsolar1.com/ [1]
e-mail offgridso...@sti.net

text 209 813 0060

On 2023-08-25 3:55 am, Tump via RE-wrenches wrote:

Mick, I would avoid trying to use a manufacture that has little NO support OR product availability.
IF your using the Schnieder Pros, I would suggest you consider the 600/100 CC. This product is more then capable of handling 7kW of input. They are available, compatible w/ their (Schnieder's) battery monitoring AND offer a system that is able to "talk" to itself.
Off grid should be uniform in design so clients/caretakers and you, have little adding to confusion IF/when their is an issue.
Lord knows Im not saying there won't be an issue w/ Schnieder's product, but we DO have a product, tech support & other persons w/in the company we are able to call on.
AC coupling, for off grid while we have Hi V CCs available is for me a thing of the past. My$0.02 worth TUMP

On Aug 24, 2023, at 4:23 PM, Mick Abraham via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi, Mechanix~ I asked a Greentech location about quantity four Fronius string inverter PRIMO 6.0-1. (6kW AC output, single phase 240 volt 60 hz) This p/n is in the Greentech portal but my particular branch hasn't done much with Fronius. Today the branch manager told me "Fronius no longer exists."

Can any of you confirm or correct this report? I have an off-grid opportunity for which I wish to AC couple some of the PV. If Fronius USA has indeed "left the building", are there other string inverters that can be selected for country code "off grid 60 hz"? I'd like for the PV inverters to only curtail their output wattage if there's a frequency shift from the grid forming inverter (frequency/watt). Schneider XW Pro units would be forming the grid. Schneider has a white paper # 990-6421 on AC coupling but this document is almost three years old & no help at all in finding compatible PV inverters. Rapid shutdown is not mandated for this gig & each array would be evenly illuminated. IIRC, the List hasn't been highly enamored with SolarEdge in recent years; is that still the consensus?

Thanks as always; the Wrench List is the Bomb!

Mick Abraham, Proprietor
www.abrahamsolar.com [5]

Landline: 970-731-4675
Cell phone or for text messaging: 970-946-6584
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Tump [6]3...@gmail.com www.SWNL.net [6]

Solarwinds Northernlights __
_ Serving Mid Coast Maine & Northern California_
_ 207-832-7574 Cl. 610-517-8401 _
_ __Blair "TUMP" May_

MAINE'S CHARTER
_ __ NABCEP"Certified PV Installer"_

MAINE'S CHARTER
_Trace Xantrex "Certified" Dealer / Installer"_

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[RE-wrenches] Record Low

2023-08-22 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Hello Wrenches, 


Is there a good source for finding record low temperatures in various
areas? We are designing a project that has very different temperature
characteristics than we are used to. 


Ashrae.org was recommended as a source. Does anyone know where on the
site to look? 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Inverter On/Off Switch use Outback FX

2023-07-30 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Do you have a source for voltage sensing coils? I only know about using
the Morningstar relay driver.

Thank you,

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-07-21 07:10, Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches wrote:

To avoid power relay, how about adding a voltage sensing coil on the AC input and have an NC contactor that opens on voltage in series with the inverter shutdown circuit. This should interrupt the inverter shutdown any time the generator is on.

On Thu, Jul 20, 2023 at 6:00 PM Ray Walters via RE-wrenches wrote:

I've done the AC relay idea as well, on Schneider that didn't have the easy off
switching like the Outbacks. The problems are:
1) Much bigger relay, much higher current on the control side as well. It
required a relay for the relay.
2) If there's a malfunction, you are messing with the main feeders for the home.
3) The inverters are still on with their no load draw, a pair of VFX inverters, would be 45 to 50 watts, so you could still shut the batteries down.

I think in your case without AGS, the trick might be to add a bypass control switch parallel to the relay, so they can manually turn the inverters back on.

Ray

On 7/20/2023 5:15 PM, Jay wrote:
Hi Ray

This house won't have an AGS, manual start only.

And your comments exactly, having to wait until the next day when hopefully there is enough sun to charge the battery is iffy.

Or they could do the inverter bypass switch.

Again I'm back to why is it a worse idea to install a relay on the AC?

Thx

Jay

As to the sol ark which I never thought about it being in a sense an AC coupled system. IE if the inverter is off it won't charge.
I guess you'll have to install an external battery charger?

On Jul 20, 2023, at 5:08 PM, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches
wrote:

The aux off is only if the generator doesn't start. You need to set the gen start voltage higher. Aux off is last ditch shut down, set for 44v for lead acid, or 47 to 49v, depending on the battery and inverter. Hopefully DC coupled PV will raise the voltage enough to turn the inverters back on the next day.

This is my concern on Solark installs, I just noticed that the inverter won't pass through PV, if it hits its LVD set point.

On 7/20/2023 3:04 PM, jay via RE-wrenches wrote: HI All,

I wanted to revisit this thread for one reason.

If you turn off the inverter at the remote on/off with the AUX relay, then starting the generator won't have any impact as the inverter is off.
So someone will have to go and reset the AUX relay.

If you do a relay on the AC output, when you start the generator, it will start charging, raising the battery volts, causing the AUX relay to close AC output relay and you'll have power in the house.

Am I missing something?

thanks

jay

Here is the last email I think:

Mac,

I think you've got an elegant solution to the problem. All you need is an inexpensive relay and to program the Aux output for loadshed. I believe shutting down the inverter with the remote on/off contacts is actually less stressful on the inverter than opening a relay or contactor on the load side.

Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar

On 7/11/2023 5:19 PM, Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hello Wrenches,

I'm trying to solve an issue with an older Outback FX system. It's a quad stack of Outback 3648 FX inverters and he has a couple of Fortress eVault and an unreliable generator. The LBCO setting can't go high enough to cut out before the eVaults cut out so he occasionally will have to direct charge the eVault to get things running again.I'd like to use a 12V Aux relay logic to trip the primary inverter on/off contacts before we go into battery shutdown so the solar has a chance to recover the system. Pretty simple overall but I wanted to see if there are any known ill effects of doing this with substantial load on the system. Of course, I can use a power relay but this may be better.

Thanks for your input!

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[RE-wrenches] Snapnrack end caps

2023-07-05 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Hello All, 


We have had a lot of end caps fall off Snapnrack Ultra Rail. Kevin at
S was wondering if this is a common occurrence. Is it something we are
doing, is it freezing and thawing or is it the design of the caps. 

Thank you, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Open Delta to 208Y/120 Volt

2023-06-06 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

William, 


Sol-Ark says they can only connect to a Wye, and that they need a
neutral. 

Thanks, 


Drake

---

On 2023-06-06 11:34, William Miller via RE-wrenches wrote:

Drake: 

You should be able to connect to a 120/240 split phase feeder. Avoid the stinger. I have done it with FXRs , works just fine.  

Wm 

On Tue, Jun 6, 2023 at 8:11 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches  wrote: 


Hello All,

We are looking for a transformer to connect Sol-Ark inverters to an open 
delta service. The Sol-Ark can only connect to a Wye configuration.


We found one which the supplier says will do the job. It is an MGM, 240 
Delta to 208Y/120 Volt, 3-Phase.


The supplier says this will derive a neutral which can be grounded for a 
solid neutral connection.


My concerns with what we have found so far are:
1) How much efficiency will be lost due to connecting to an open delta?
2) Will the derived neutral really be sufficient?
3) The cost of the unit we found is high. Does anyone know of a source 
for economically priced transformers.


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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www.millersolar.com [1] 
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[RE-wrenches] Open Delta to 208Y/120 Volt

2023-06-06 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello All,

We are looking for a transformer to connect Sol-Ark inverters to an open 
delta service. The Sol-Ark can only connect to a Wye configuration.


We found one which the supplier says will do the job. It is an MGM, 240 
Delta to 208Y/120 Volt, 3-Phase.


The supplier says this will derive a neutral which can be grounded for a 
solid neutral connection.


My concerns with what we have found so far are:
1) How much efficiency will be lost due to connecting to an open delta?
2) Will the derived neutral really be sufficient?
3) The cost of the unit we found is high. Does anyone know of a source 
for economically priced transformers.


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional




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Re: [RE-wrenches] Web based system monitoring via 4GLTE uplink?

2023-06-06 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

We use a Verizon Jet Pack for our internet. It wants to have its battery
charged and then be unplugged, like any cell phone. Is there a variety
that can be left plugged in? Charging could be set up to be intermittent
with a timer switch.

Drake

_Drake Chamberlin_

_Athens Electric LLC_

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-06-05 10:16, Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches wrote:

Mick,

I'll vouch that the Victron solution works great. You need a GSM carrier, TMobile works as well as others, AT for one. The GSM piece is important, Verizon won't work with this.

Another approach is to do a Mifi box with Verizon, then just use it as a wireless hotspot like any WiFi network.

No problems with the single Victron that we have out there.

Good luck!

On Mon, Jun 5, 2023, 7:30 AM Mick Abraham via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi, Mechanix~ Web portals such as Optics-RE make for easy well-baby visits for off gridders. The prospective customers that I met yesterday aren't here full time so they may not want to commit $1200/year on satellite internet service, but the Verizon 4G signal is strong at the homesite.

Which web-enabled battery based inverter platforms have a dongle for 4G LTE? I know we'd need a data type SIM card & I'd need to live with a slow refresh rate so the SIM wouldn't need data replenishment too often. This wouldn't be as good as if the site had real broadband, but maybe still better than nothing.

So far, I've only found this type of accy with the Victron platform: their model GX LTE. Among the other platforms & hybrid inverters I've found next to nothing, but "the Wrench List is the Bomb" at knowing things that I don't. Any suggestions would be welcomed. Thanks in advance,

Mick Abraham, Proprietor
www.abrahamsolar.com [1]

Landline: 970-731-4675
Cell phone or for text messaging: 970-946-6584
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Tech Support Issues with Sensata

2023-06-02 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

We had one Magnum PAE 4048 have the frequency go high. It would not AC
couple. When checking the frequency, it was out of range for the on grid
inverters.

So far, my tech support experience with Sensata has been good. The
equipment I've installed has been problematic. I like the PAE system,
but the inverters keep coming back off the wall.

Drake

Athens Electric

---

On 2023-05-31 13:50, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches wrote:

What were the issues? I've not seen a Magnum have power quality troubles, but they are not the "grid" either. My experience is that they are similar or a bit better than Outback, but certainly have measurable THD in the 4 to 5% range. Its almost always finicky loads, and the inverter has always been within its tolerances, so I doubt you have an actual warranty issue. However, I have seen inverter output get strange after lightning damage, which is not covered under warranty either.

You need a decent meter that can measure THD, and can capture the peak voltage of the waveform. A good oscilloscope is even better, so you can see the waveform.

Stuff like clocks not keeping time, or certain digital controls on certain appliances not functioning, is not a warranty claim. Lights dimming, or LEDs flickering is not a warranty claim. These are normal living off grid, and the only thing better than a Magnum for power quality is Exeltech in my experience.

Ray Walters
Remote Solar

On 5/31/2023 11:37 AM, Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi all,

I have a client with a Magnum MS 4024- PAE inverter. There are some serious issues with power output quality and according to the client, another installer had started the RMA process while the inverter was still under warranty, however Sensata has not been responsive and has lost track of the case. They are asking for a new case to be initiated, but the inverter is now out of warranty. Has anyone out there had similar lack luster support issues with Sensata?

Best,

Chris --

Chris Sparadeo

C_802-369-4458
H_802-728-3059

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Re: [RE-wrenches] IQ Gateway outside straw bale house

2023-04-27 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


There is chicken wire under the stucco. The Gateway will be near a
window, which is not too far from the router. William's experience is
encouraging. If it doesn't work, we will run a CAT 5. 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_ 

_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_ 


---

On 2023-04-26 11:56, Dan Fink via RE-wrenches wrote:

Drake; How much chicken wire or other metal mesh is in the strawbale walls and stucco? Can you measure wifi signal strength ahead of time with a smartphone? Is it possible to hardwire Cat5 from the homeowner's router/extender/etc to the WAN port of the IQ Gateway? That is always preferable to wifi. 

Dan Fink 

Owner, Buckville Energy Consulting LLC 
IREC Certified Instructor for PV and Small Wind Installation 
NABCEP Certified PV System Inspector 
NABCEP PV Associate 
danbo...@gmail.com 
970-672-4342 

On Wed, Apr 26, 2023 at 9:40 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches  wrote: 

We are planning to combine Enphase circuits in an IQ combiner box, with 
enclosed Gateway, on the outside of a straw bale house.


Will the WiFi signal penetrate a straw bale and the two layers of stucco 
the wall is made of?


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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[RE-wrenches] IQ Gateway outside straw bale house

2023-04-26 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

We are planning to combine Enphase circuits in an IQ combiner box, with 
enclosed Gateway, on the outside of a straw bale house.


Will the WiFi signal penetrate a straw bale and the two layers of stucco 
the wall is made of?


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Underground fault finder

2023-04-20 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


The thumper sounds like the one to use, but what does it destroy? Does
it induce a much higher voltage on the line than regular line voltage?
We are dealing with open circuit problems. 


We can return to our original plan of digging up areas and checking for
voltage on the lines with a voltage sensor. 

Thanks, 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_ 


_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-04-18 12:04, Brian Mehalic via RE-wrenches wrote:

Not sure about rental sources in your area, but there are two options: 

1) An underground cable fault locator, aka a "thumper," which only works on direct buried cables. It is a destructive test (at the fault location), and should only be performed when there is a known fault in order to locate it. It requires "walking" the cable run with a sensing device to hear the "thump" generated by the high current/high voltage induced on the line. 


2) A time domain reflectometer (TDR), which is sort of like radar in that low energy signals 
are reflected by changes in cable impedance; it is non-destructive, but also not as accurate 
in terms of the location (providing a cable length to the fault, rather than a 
"thump" at the actual fault location) and typically cannot see higher resistance 
(≈>200 MΩ) faults that the thumper can.

Brian Mehalic 
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installation Professional(tm) R031508-59 
National Electrical Code(R) CMP-4 Member 
(520) 204-6639


Solar Energy International
http://www.solarenergy.org 

On Tue, Apr 18, 2023 at 8:27 AM Matt Sherald via RE-wrenches  wrote: 

Hi Drake, 

I've rented a set-up from my electrical supply house.  I'd check to see if Scott Electric/Advantage Rental serves your part of Ohio. 

If memory serves, it is two pieces of equipment that you need.  One to trace the line and a second to find the fault. 

-Matt 

On Tue, Apr 18, 2023 at 11:20 AM Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches  wrote: I understand that there is a tool that locates underground faults in 
buried cables. No one in our area has one. There are high tech cable 
tracers now, but they don't advertise that they can find underground 
breaks in wires.


One company online had one that advertised that function. The entire kit 
came to $5 or $6K.


Does anyone know where one can be rented.

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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[RE-wrenches] Underground fault finder

2023-04-18 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

I understand that there is a tool that locates underground faults in 
buried cables. No one in our area has one. There are high tech cable 
tracers now, but they don't advertise that they can find underground 
breaks in wires.


One company online had one that advertised that function. The entire kit 
came to $5 or $6K.


Does anyone know where one can be rented.

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional



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Re: [RE-wrenches] PV and EMP

2023-03-09 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Backwoods Solar sells kits to harden against EMP. I am wondering how
effective they would be. 

Drake 

_Drake Chamberlin_ 

_Athens Electric LLC_ 

_Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810_ 

_CO Master Electrician's License 4526_ 


_NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional_

---

On 2023-03-08 11:49, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches wrote:

I would review Sol Arks website as they say they are immune. Probably have something to back that up published there. 

-Glenn 
Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors. 

-- Original message-- 
From: Marco Mangelsdorf via RE-wrenches 
Date: Wed, Mar 8, 2023 11:37 AM 
To: RE-wrenches; 
Cc: Marco Mangelsdorf; 
Subject:[RE-wrenches] PV and EMP 
Aloha all,  

Have any of you come across any articles or white papers on how PV systems (including energy storage) fare under conditions of electromagnetic pulses and solar flares? 

Mahalo,  
marco 
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[RE-wrenches] Trimetric on LiFe Blue

2023-03-07 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello Lithium Battery Wrenches,

A 48 V bank of 8, 12 V LiFe Blue batteries, 2 series sets of four in 
parallel, for a 400 AH bank, is being monitored by a Trimetric 2020.


What should the "charged setpoint amps" be set to?

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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[RE-wrenches] Magnum 4024PAE Won't Charge

2023-01-18 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello Wrenches,

A Magnum 4024 won't charge batteries or transfer loads. The owner of the 
system, now well out of warranty, has spent hours on the phone with tech 
support and even took the unit into a Magnum authorized repair shop. The 
technician declared that it was working perfectly.


On connection to the utility grid, the ME-ARC shows no sign of seeing 
the power. Once in a great while, it will connect and start charging 
batteries. Then it will quit.


This seems to me like a matter of a relay not operating. The technician, 
who checked it out, believes that the problem is with the AC coming in. 
One tech support agent thought the same.


The inverter is 1000' plus from the transformer. The incoming voltage, 
with light loads, is 248 VAC. Shouldn't the ME-ARC at least show that it 
sees the grid, even if the voltage dropped upon connection to the point 
it couldn't hold it?


Isn't the Magnum charger pretty forgiving about voltage input? I've 
heard they can have issues with inverter-generators, but this is 60 Hz 
grid power.


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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Re: [RE-wrenches] 3524 VFX delay

2023-01-12 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Would that mean that the control board needs to be replaced in the
master? 


---

On 2023-01-12 10:33, toddc...@finestplanet.com wrote:

stuck relay? 


On Thursday, January 12, 2023 6:39am, "Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches" 
 said:


Hello Wrenches,

A pair of off grid Outback VFX 3524 inverters are being used as an AC
coupled backup system. They have worked flawlessly for many years.

During a recent power outage it was reported that the house was dark for
20 minutes before the backup kicked on. Does anyone know what could have
caused the delay?

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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[RE-wrenches] 3524 VFX delay

2023-01-12 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello Wrenches,

A pair of off grid Outback VFX 3524 inverters are being used as an AC 
coupled backup system. They have worked flawlessly for many years.


During a recent power outage it was reported that the house was dark for 
20 minutes before the backup kicked on. Does anyone know what could have 
caused the delay?


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Utility transformer limitations

2022-12-26 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

William,

I ran into this once on an old transformer, which fortunately they
changed at no cost. It was a 10 kW transformer on a 200 A (48 kW)
service. They had some dimming of lights on heavy loads, and the
transformer was changed out on that basis, at no charge.

My questions for the utility would be?

* Are there any other PV systems feeding the transformer?

* If so, what is their maximum production.

* What size is the transformer?
* What percentage of transformer capacity is allowed to be back-fed.

If the math comes out in your favor, you will have a good case to
escalate to the next level.

Good Luck,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2022-12-25 13:58, William Miller via RE-wrenches wrote:

Wrenched:

Merry Christmas to those of you that observe such traditions, or substitute the winter festivity of your choice.

I helped a previous employee install an Enphase IQ8 system on his home. He applied for the utility approval concurrently with his building permit The day he got his final inspection the utility contacted him and claimed "The aggregate generation exceeds the identified transformer rating" and refused him a Permission to Operate letter.

Adding up the service ratings of the homes on his secondary we get about 336 kW of potential consumption. Adding the grid-tied systems on his secondary we get about 16.5 kW. How is it that the back-feed exceeds the transformer rating?

I would appreciate any insight on how to consider this situation and how to fight it.

Sincerely,

William Miller

Miller Solar

17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422

805-438-5600

www.millersolar.com [1]

CA Lic. 773985

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Magnum MS4024 grief

2022-12-18 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


If all else fails, cut the equipment ground prong from the attachment
plug to the generator. The generator is internally grounded. You appear
to have an internal ground in your system somewhere.  


---

On 2022-12-16 13:35, Kirk Herander via RE-wrenches wrote:

You may have neutral and ground connected at more than 1 location, meaning at the genset and in house panel, which means the ground is carrying current back to the generator in parallel with the neutral. 

I remember with some Honda portables we had to float the neutral at the genset or the inverter would trip the generator's GFI when trying to charge the batteries. 

On Fri, Dec 16, 2022 at 1:16 PM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches  wrote: 


The easy answer is try another genset !  You have to be more specific, did it 
ever work? Is it new? etc.  Good Luck !

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2022-12-16 10:04 am, Chris Daum via RE-wrenches wrote: 
Hi folks:


We have a new Magnum MS4024 mounted on an E-Panel using a MidNite Classic 150 
and Whiz-Bang JR with power coming from an array of Trina TSM365-De06X-05(II) 
(three strings of three) with the ME-RC50 and a HUP SolarOne 6-85-14/24 battery.
When we attempt to use the PFC (Power Factored Charger), the Gen Set's GFCI 
outlets trip.  Thus far we have verified the connections are secure, assured 
that the gen set is grounded, disconnected the jumper within the E-Panel 
between the ground buss and neutral, checked AC voltages, removed the MNSPD's 
from the buss(s)...  Stumped now on what an appropriate next step should be.  
How do we get the PFC to function properly?  What are we missing?

Best,

Chris Daum
Oasis Montana Inc.
406-777-4309 or 4321
406-777-4309 fax
www.oasismontana.com [1] 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Xantrex AC Fault 186.6v

2022-12-09 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

What modules does it have? If they are susceptible to PID (Potential 
Induced Degradation), you may need to find an inverter with a solid 
negative ground. I avoided the Xantrex grid tie inverters, but am 
assuming the are grounded.


Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional



---


On 2022-12-08 16:13, Sam Haraldson via RE-wrenches wrote:


Howdy Wrenches,

Any "old timers" here care to chime in with some basic info on what I 
might be heading out to see at a 10+ year old ground mount?  It's a 
Xantrex displaying the message AC Fault 186.6v.  I'm prepared to head 
out there and troubleshoot blind if no one has anything to offer up but 
figured why not post a quick message here in case anyone has insight 
they wish to share with me prior to my visit next week.


Subsequently since this is a ground mount it doesn't need rapid 
shutdown so if the inverter has failed I probably have some decent 
options to replace it.  If you've had good luck with a particular brand 
to use for swaps please share that intel as well.  I don't know how big 
the array is so all I'm looking for is brands and not models.


Most appreciated,
Sam

Sam Haraldson

Installation & Service Manager

http://www.onsiteenergyinc.com/

|

o. (406) 551-6135

https://www.facebook.com/onsiteenergysolar/

https://www.instagram.com/onsiteenergyinc/

https://twitter.com/onsiteenergyinc

https://www.linkedin.com/company/onsite-energy-inc/

https://onsiteenergyinc.com/bcorp

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian / Flexmax issue

2022-11-10 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Suzanne finally did get the system working. The problem was in the 
programming of the Mate. This was discovered by Outback Tech support 
with Optics. So far, no word on the exact settings involved. The 
batteries were not damaged.


Thank you for your help.

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


---


On 2022-10-28 07:53, Tump via RE-wrenches wrote:

ISOLATE ISOLATE ISOLATE. The first thing I would do id disable the Flex 
net DC, next isolate each 12 v battery, ck voltages, load test,  use  
any automotive battery tester find 4 decent batteries and try again. 
Have you replaced all the com cables? Cheap and w/ the possibility of 
Lightning strike, its a no brainer. I have seen the FNDC cause all 
sorts of issues due to battery issues. We at one time installed quite a 
few only to have issues w/ batteries that were undercharged, customers 
restarting the system w/ batteries that were not fully charged. When 
rebooted the FNDC is assuming that the batteries ARE FULLY CHARGED and 
have the rated capacity, which usually NOT the case.

Firmwares versions are easily found in the "system info" in the M3s

On Oct 26, 2022, at 8:04 PM, Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Hello All,

Suzanne Csejtey of Design Energy contacted me with an Outback Radian / 
Flexmax 80 system problem. I don't know what is going on with this 
system. Below is her description of the problem. Any help would be 
appreciated.

--
System installed 2014.

6.6kW PV, Outback Radian 8048 inverter, (2) x Midnite Classic 200 
charge controllers, 600Ah
Battery bank (12 x 12V 200Ah Outback Energycell ) for backup of 100A 
aux panel


It worked great, but the customer was always disappointed that she 
couldn't show her system
online on one screen, because the Midnite charge controllers didn't 
talk to the Outback Mate 3.
In 2017 the charge controllers were changed to (2) x Outback Flexmax 
80's, and problems
started a couple years after that. The system would shut down at least 
once a month, start up
the next day, and the electrician couldn't find the problem but 
suspected grid instability. Outback tech support couldn't help until 
the system was on OpticsRE, late 2021. Tech support resolved the 
shutdown issue this year with 2 nd firmware upgrade and a few settings 
adjusted on Mate3.


Radian GS8048 updated 2021, verified 8/2022 from tech support but I am 
not finding the
firmware number. August 2022 tech support walked through our settings 
and verified all ok with batteries, CCs. Adjusted Mate3 to establish 
OpticsRE connection, verified not selling from

battery/backup only.

Worked very well until this September when a lightning storm 
apparently took out the internet
modem and inverter comms with it. Solar and battery still working. 
Outback told us to replace
the Mate3 and Hub, and then the FlexNet DC monitor. Latest firmware 
update attempted on
new Mate3s when received, 001.004.007 but it was already installed and 
ready to go.


Instead of setting everything up again from scratch after replacing 
Mate3 with Mate3S we
decided to see if the charge controllers would repopulate the old 
information, as recommended
in the Outback forum. Then tried to get help to verify settings from 
Outback support. Support
had been very helpful in the past but this time we weren't so lucky 
and the person just let us
know that wasn't their job and sent a link to the manual. But the 
batteries appeared to be at
100%, set not to sell, backup only, max PV self-consumption. The plan 
was to find more help to

verify settings and keep an eye on the system.

Seemed to be working very well until it went
crazy last week, when the Mate showed alarm, batteries discharged down 
to 6%, then up to

100%, then everything shut down completely.

Programming may be a big part of the issue. Also hearing that the age 
of the AGM batteries may have been a factor, 8 years. That sometimes 
dying batteries cause odd behavior?


Thanks in advance.

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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C

[RE-wrenches] Radian / Flexmax issue

2022-10-26 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello All,

Suzanne Csejtey of Design Energy contacted me with an Outback Radian / 
Flexmax 80 system problem. I don't know what is going on with this 
system. Below is her description of the problem. Any help would be 
appreciated.

--
System installed 2014.

6.6kW PV, Outback Radian 8048 inverter, (2) x Midnite Classic 200 charge 
controllers, 600Ah
Battery bank (12 x 12V 200Ah Outback Energycell ) for backup of 100A aux 
panel


It worked great, but the customer was always disappointed that she 
couldn’t show her system
online on one screen, because the Midnite charge controllers didn’t talk 
to the Outback Mate 3.
In 2017 the charge controllers were changed to (2) x Outback Flexmax 
80’s, and problems
started a couple years after that. The system would shut down at least 
once a month, start up
the next day, and the electrician couldn’t find the problem but 
suspected grid instability. Outback tech support couldn’t help until the 
system was on OpticsRE, late 2021. Tech support resolved the shutdown 
issue this year with 2 nd firmware upgrade and a few settings adjusted 
on Mate3.


Radian GS8048 updated 2021, verified 8/2022 from tech support but I am 
not finding the
firmware number. August 2022 tech support walked through our settings 
and verified all ok with batteries, CCs. Adjusted Mate3 to establish 
OpticsRE connection, verified not selling from

battery/backup only.

Worked very well until this September when a lightning storm apparently 
took out the internet
modem and inverter comms with it. Solar and battery still working. 
Outback told us to replace
the Mate3 and Hub, and then the FlexNet DC monitor. Latest firmware 
update attempted on
new Mate3s when received, 001.004.007 but it was already installed and 
ready to go.


Instead of setting everything up again from scratch after replacing 
Mate3 with Mate3S we
decided to see if the charge controllers would repopulate the old 
information, as recommended
in the Outback forum. Then tried to get help to verify settings from 
Outback support. Support
had been very helpful in the past but this time we weren’t so lucky and 
the person just let us
know that wasn’t their job and sent a link to the manual. But the 
batteries appeared to be at
100%, set not to sell, backup only, max PV self-consumption. The plan 
was to find more help to

verify settings and keep an eye on the system.

Seemed to be working very well until it went
crazy last week, when the Mate showed alarm, batteries discharged down 
to 6%, then up to

100%, then everything shut down completely.

Programming may be a big part of the issue. Also hearing that the age of 
the AGM batteries may have been a factor, 8 years. That sometimes dying 
batteries cause odd behavior?


Thanks in advance.

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Looking for remote controlled contactors

2022-10-12 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

I haven't had problems with contactors failing. I suspect that a lot of
the problems on battery systems happen when contactors are controlled at
battery voltage.

The nominal voltage of the system is not what the coil will see. A 48
VDC coil might experience 63 VDC. A resistor needs to be put in series
with the coil to prevent over voltage. It's value needs to be calculated
so that it will function, within tolerance, at both the maximum high and
minimum low voltages.

A 240 V AC contactor coil, on the output of the generator, is quite
reliable. The voltage it sees is within tolerance and the coil is
generally not activated for extended periods (days or weeks or even
years at a time).

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2022-10-12 07:42, Kirk Herander via RE-wrenches wrote:

You are correct on this.

The failure of any control hardware, IO's / relays / contactor logic along the way from generator sense to PV contactor should result in the coupled grid-tie PV inverter disconnected. Which means the contactor at the PV inverter should be energized "closed" (so PV AC connected normally open) under normal operation (genny off, PV on).

Wired as such, It can be done with off the shelf components, and remotely by adding some controlbyweb.com [1] controllers.

On Tue, Oct 11, 2022 at 7:49 PM Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches wrote:
I'm not a fan of this strategy because it is not failsafe. Contactors fail. When the coil fails to open the contactor, you will have the PV AC coupled with the generator If he normally closed contactor is used in this manner.

I think the question needs to be the converse: How do you turn the PV on remotely only when the generator is not running.

Jason Szumlanski
Florida Solar Design Group

On Tue, Oct 11, 2022, 2:45 PM Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches wrote:
I'll usually use a 60 amp contactor with 240Vac coil.

The generator powers the coil and opens the Normally Closed contacts disconnecting the grid tie inverter.

Maverick Brown
Off-Grid Solar Commander since 2006
Maverick Solar Enterprises, Inc.
* Solar Commander Remote Power
* SunFlow Systems Cathodic Protection
maver...@mavericksolar.com
512-460-9825

On Oct 11, 2022, at 11:26 AM, Kirk Herander via RE-wrenches
wrote:

Hi,
I'm looking for suggestions on a remote control 60 amp contactor. It can either be true wireless or send a signal down an AC power line to open / close contact at the other end.

I'm trying to figure out a non-wired way to turn an AC coupled inverter off when the generator is running, as advised by outback and others.

All suggestions welcome thank you. --

Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC

_Celebrating our 31st Anniversary 1991-2022!!_

www.vermont.solar [2]

dba Vermont Solar Engineering

802.863.1202 ___

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Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC

_Celebrating our 31st Anniversary 1991-2022!!_

www.vermont.solar [2]

dba Vermont Solar Engineering

802.863.1202
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Re: [RE-wrenches] AC coupled grid tie only inverter

2022-10-07 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


The grid tie inverter can sell through the Magnum relay. When the grid
goes down, it will feed the batteries. 

Drake Chamberlin 

Athens Electric LLC 

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810 

CO Master Electrician's License 4526 


NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2022-10-07 11:42, Dave Tedeyan via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hi All,  

I've got someone who wants to tie their off-grid system with a Magnum inverter (which I think is a 4024 PAE inverter) to the grid. Since the Magnum inverter cannot be grid tied, I was wondering if there is some kind of simple grid tie inverter that can be the grid interface, while keeping the existing system in tact.  

Otherwise, I see two paths here. The less expensive path would be to ditch the batteries and connect the panels to a grid tie inverter. Otherwise it seems that we will need to get another battery based inverter that is meant to be grid connected to replace the Magnum. 

Cheers, 
Dave

--

[1]

Dave Tedeyan, P.E.
Owner | Sungineer Solar

p: he | him | his
a: 1653 Slaterville Rd. | Ithaca, NY 14850
w: www.sungineersolar.com [2]
c: (607) 288-2898 


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[RE-wrenches] Butt End Connector Warning

2022-10-06 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Our electrical supplier seamlessly transitioned from crimp on butt end 
connectors, that were listed for CU and AL, to unmarked ones that were 
approved for copper only.


I became concerned since there was no marking. Calling two electrical 
suppliers, the guys at the counter had to look up the device to learn 
that they were listed for copper only. Talking to one of the counter 
guys, he agreed that electricians were probably using these for 
aluminum.


Since the barrels will be insulated, it is not likely that inspectors 
will see them. The connectors are made of coated copper. I wonder how 
much of a problem this will be.


Drake





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[RE-wrenches] Enphase

2022-09-26 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello All,

Looking into the Enphase Ensemble system, I'm not sure that is a 
direction I want to take. It seems that they are extremely complicated 
and require a 30 hour training course to commission.


Once installed, are they reliable? Do they require on going tweaks and 
firmware upgrades?


Will the IQ8 micro inverters taper charge with phase shift? I am 
considering the possibility of AC coupling some to a pair of Radians.


What is the most reliable and economically feasible way to provide 
backup power today?


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Media & Communication Action Project
https://m-cap.org/




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[RE-wrenches] White Roof Temperature

2022-08-25 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello Wrenches,

A client installed a beautiful white standing seam roof. Suddenly their 
air conditioning loads dropped way down.


We were planning to put an array on the roof, but she is concerned that 
the roof would become much hotter with dark colored solar modules over 
it.


Is there any data on this issue?

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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[RE-wrenches] Bifacial Modules

2022-08-08 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Are bifacial modules good products? Do they really perform as 
advertised?


We have a potential project where they would be used on a white roof. 
Would that be an ideal situation?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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Re: [RE-wrenches] off-grid AC coupling feasibility

2022-07-31 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Yes, we have a system with AC and DC coupled arrays on an off-grid
system. Having DC coupled capacity is important for reasons given in
other posts.

We used AC coupling due to shade issues, so we could use Enphase
inverters.

In your case, if the house really is going to go on grid, I would think
AC coupling makes sense. If not, I'd use high voltage DC charge
controllers (like the Schneider 600 V units) and keep it DC.

The main complaint I have with AC coupling off grid is that some lights
tent to strobe in certain charging conditions. Another complaint is the
5 minute delay period after the micro-inverters shut down. The micros
are phased, based on battery voltage, so they don't all shut down at
once.

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2022-07-30 12:30, Kirk Herander via RE-wrenches wrote:

All,
Anyone out there successfully AC-coupled inverters in an off-grid system? Advantages vs. pitfalls?

In my case I'm thinking of its practicality with a Solaredge inverter AC-coupled to an OB Radian inverter. OB firmware makes this pretty easy now. So effectively the Radian is always operating in a grid-backup mode.

I already upgraded the system to the Radian, and soon to add 5kw of pole-mounted PV(currently only 1.8kw of 22-year old PV on the roof). This system also just got 16kwh of Blue Ion LFP batteries.

This is a last-minute thought I have instead of investing in additional DC charge controllers for the new array.
Cost-wise there's not much of a difference between several high-quality charge controllers and a smaller SE inverter w/optimisers. Thanks.

Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC

_Celebrating our 31st Anniversary 1991-2022!!_

www.vermont.solar [1]

dba Vermont Solar Engineering

802.863.1202
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[RE-wrenches] Growatt systems

2022-07-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Does anyone have experience with Growatt systems? What do you think of 
them?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional



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Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase IQ7 versus IQ8

2022-07-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

Are the IQ-7 inverters going to remain available? The additional cost of 
the IQ-8 micros killed one project where I couldn't find a good source 
for IQ-7s.



Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


---


On 2022-07-12 19:03, Nick Soleil via RE-wrenches wrote:

That is correct, Jay.  You only need the rapid shutdown switch if you 
have IQ 8s and an IQ System Controller.


One of the big advantages of the IQ 8 over IQ 7 when paired with 
storage is that the 1.5 PV to storage ratio does not apply, so you can 
install larger PV systems with smaller battery systems.


Cordially,

Nick Soleil

Enphase Energy Senior Product Manager

(707) 763-4784 x7267  // office

(707) 321-2937  // cell

Powering What's Next(tm)_ | _The Enphase Energy Management System

NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer #03262011-300

California C10 Licensed Electrician #986315

-

From: RE-wrenches  on behalf 
of Jay via RE-wrenches 

Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2022 3:54 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Jay 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase IQ7 versus IQ8

EXTERNAL EMAIL - Use caution when responding, clicking, and/or 
downloading attachments.


Hi Jason

And if you don't have the smart controller/battery system then you do 
not need this proprietary rapid shut down switch correct?


Jay

On Jul 12, 2022, at 3:25 PM, Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Yes, they require a proprietary rapid shutdown switch that connects to 
the smart controller. This would be in addition to a visible load break 
disconnect if the utility requires it. You cannot fulfill both 
requirements with one switch, and it requires a line voltage circuit be 
run from the smart controller to the rapid shutdown switch.


On Tue, Jul 12, 2022, 5:15 PM Mark Frye via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Do you need the additional switch if you use the Enphase battery?

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf 
Of Jason Szumlanski via RE-wrenches

Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2022 11:38 AM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Jason Szumlanski 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] Enphase IQ7 versus IQ8

I am trying to figure out why it is a good idea we use the IQ8 in 
anything other than a solar only backup scenario. If there are Enphase 
batteries involved, wouldn't the IQ7 do the same job on the roof? In a 
straight grid tied scenario, again the IQ7 would do the exact same 
thing. You would not have an upgrade path to solar only backup, of 
course.


I'm just having a hard time understanding the value proposition of the 
IQ8 in most of the situations I encounter. They cost significantly 
more, and you need an additional rapid shutdown switch when using 
batteries that can be quite a pain in some scenarios.


Am I missing something about the switching speed, energy harvest 
capability, or the way they interact with batteries that makes them 
better?


P.S. I am aware of the very small power output differences by model 
number and I am referring exclusively to 240 volt applications. I 
understand the 208 volt advantages of the IQ8.


Jason Szumlanski

Florida Solar Design Group  
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Re: [RE-wrenches] WATER COOLED - 1800 RPM - 13KW GENERATORS INQUIRY

2022-07-11 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


There is no regular pattern to our need for generators, but we could
likely sell some. 


---

On 2022-07-10 16:02, Chris Daum via RE-wrenches wrote:

I think we could sell a couple a year. 

--Chris @ the Oasis Montana 


From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of Tump 
via RE-wrenches
Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2022 10:54 AM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Tump 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] WATER COOLED - 1800 RPM - 13KW GENERATORS INQUIRY 


How many folks require UL listing to install, this may expedite delivery?

On Jul 8, 2022, at 3:09 PM, Dana Orzel via RE-wrenches  wrote: 

The question was - When might these units be available? 

The first request from the manu. was to get a survey of how many units might get sold per year & responses are still trickling in slowly.  

Next Tump & I will be in a zoom meeting with the company powers that be & at that point they need to source & design.  

I would bet it is out aways still depending on equipment choices/availability, testing & UL certification etc. 

I would not even dare to guess but when we ca report back with a date we will do so. 

Dana Orzel -  E - d...@solarwork.com -  C - 208.721.7003  


From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of 
Kevin Pegg via RE-wrenches
Sent: Friday, July 8, 2022 12:59 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Kevin Pegg 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] WATER COOLED - 1800 RPM - 13KW GENERATORS INQUIRY 

Thanks for this - there is certainly demand. I could see my company buying a 3-5 per year.  

Is there any estimate of timeline when these might be available?  

Kevin 


From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of Dana 
Orzel via RE-wrenches
Sent: June-30-22 11:02 AM
To: 'RE-wrenches' 
Cc: Dana Orzel 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] WATER COOLED - 1800 RPM - 13KW GENERATORS INQUIRY 

Hey now all you off grid designer/installers, 

I just had a conversation with generator manufacturer (name withheld for the moment), about 8-13KW water cooled gensets with UL & LP gas powered. I explained that there is a long time hole in the market since Onan & Kohler dropped their gensets for prime power in this size range. 

If they made the investment to produce & UL certify a 13KW - 1800 RPM - water cooled - 2 wire start, prime power rated - 120/240vac genset, how many off grid systems are being installed with oversized gensets? 

_If this was available how many units would each of you be interested in per year? _I am not asking for a commitment just a market survey for this sized unit. 

If there was 20-30 companies selling 4-5+ each per year this might be a possibility. 

Let me know either off list or on list (if this is OK ? Michael let us know) & I hope there is a possibility here for more appropriately sized & available gensets for our off grid client systems. 

I will be passing along this research to the OE manufacturer. If you do not want your name passed along let me know for now. 

Dana Orzel  Great Solar Works, Inc.  

C - 208.721.7003   d...@solarwork.com 

Idaho Contractor - # 028765 Idaho PV # 028374 

NABCEP # 051112-136   www.greatsolarworks.com [1] 

"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"   

P Please consider the environment before printing this email. 


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Tump [8]3...@gmail.com   www.SWNL.net [9]

Solarwinds Northernlights   __ 


_   Serving Mid Coast Maine & Northern California_
_ 207-832-7574   Cl. 610-517-8401  _ 

_  __Blair "TUMP" May_ 


  MAINE'S CHARTER 
_ NABCEP"Certified PV Installer"_ 


  MAINE'S CHARTER 
_Trace Xantrex "Certified" Dealer / Installer"_


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[RE-wrenches] Schneider Inverter Unbalance

2022-06-02 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches


Hello Wrenches,

A pair of Schneider XW Pro inverters will not share the load. We had 
used a configuration tool, with the help of Jose at tech support, and 
temporarily got the pair to balance. We adjusted the output voltages so 
that the inverters would share the load.


Later the inverters started drifting. At present, one will take all the 
load until it reaches a point around its maximum production limit. Then 
that inverter will stop production and the other will take over.


Is there a defective inverter? Any ideas at all about what might be 
going on?


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional




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[RE-wrenches] Module - microinverter compatibility question

2022-04-13 Thread Drake Chamberlin via RE-wrenches

I'm concerned that a microinverter - module pair that has been specified 
by a supplier may not work. The maximum power voltage is very close to 
the minimum starting voltage. The Voc is adequately high.


An Aptos DNA-120-MF26-365W is paired with an Enphase IQ 7A

•   Minimum start voltage of the inverter is 33 V
•   Vmmp of the module is 33.96 V
•   Voc of the module is 40.7 V

Is the 33 V starting voltage going to be a problem with a module STC Max 
power voltage of 33.96 V? Is it the Voc that determines the starting of 
the inverter or the Vmmp?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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[RE-wrenches] Fwd: Re: Schneider Bootloader mode

2022-02-18 Thread drake . chamberlin



Hi Dave,

Thanks for your help. All options seem to be exhausted with Schneider 
tech support.


I haven't tried the SCP advanced menu to restore defaults. After I enter 
that setting should I shut down all DC inputs for 5 minutes, or is that 
automatic?


Daniel, at tech support, knows of the situation. His is only comment was 
"interesting."


Is there any chance the problem is in the Gateway itself? Do you think 
it is possible that power-cycling it again would clear any problems with 
it.


The Gateway will not reset to its factory defaults. I tried that several 
times with tech support, and all agreed that it didn't work.


It is good to hear that the config tool should fix it.

Drake


Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---


On 2022-02-17 11:51, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar wrote:

Did you try SCP mppt-80 advance settings, enter, scroll all the way 
down to restore defaults?  Assume you did a complete power down of mppt 
for

5 minutes with no dc in/out.

weird to me that it shows on SCP and not in gateway. The config tool 
should fix this. Please let me know off list. I am not on the wrench 
list much anymore.

You might try tech support again. Do they know the cc works?
Good Luck

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2022-02-17 8:17 am, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org wrote:
Unfortunately no options are provided to do anything, including no 
option to update the firmware. The Charge controller is completely 
locked out, cannot be affected in anyway by the Gateway.


The config tool will be the next attempt.

Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

On 2022-02-16 22:31, Maverick Brown wrote:

Doesn't the boot loader start after no code runs? Therefore couldn't 
you attempt to upgrade the CC firmware again? That has worked for me in 
the past.  Sometimes I think Xanbus can be delicate and I'll use the 
Combox direct to the device being upgraded or use the Setup tool 
(config tool) direct to the device being updated.


Maverick Brown
Off-Grid Solar Commander since 2006
Maverick Solar Enterprises, Inc.
* Solar Commander Remote Power
* SunFlow Systems Cathodic Protection
maver...@mavericksolar.com
512-460-9825

On Feb 16, 2022, at 8:09 PM, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org 
wrote:
While trying to update the firmware on a Schneider 600-80 charge 
controller, it went into bootloader mode and became totally 
unresponsive. This problem was read from the Gateway on Insight Local. 
Tech support claimed the CC was bad.


However, the CC is working fine. It shows up on the SCP with no error 
codes. The only remedy that Schneider is offering is to replace the CC 
if it is under warranty. It likely is not.


How can a Schneider device be taken out of bootloader mode (if it 
really is in that mode)? Could it be an error in the Gateway?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Flickering lights on off grid AC coupled radian system

2022-02-04 Thread drake . chamberlin

Some LEDs will flicker at times with off grid AC coupled systems. I've 
seen this with Outback and Magnum. Some brands of LED seem stable.


Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


---


On 2022-02-02 14:59, Lars Ortegren wrote:


Wrenches,
I'm hoping to solve an issue we've had with a couple of our off grid AC 
coupled systems. We have had multiple reports of different LED and 
traditional ballasted fluorescent systems "flickering" during the day 
when the AC systems are producing power. We havent had issues with 
other off grid AC coupling using Sunny Islands, or even old VFX 
inverters, but this does seem to be an issue directly related to the 
Radians.I'm wondering if any of you have had experience with this, and 
if you found any hacks to "clean up" the power?

--

Lars Örtegren

General Manager

Co-Founder

Worker-Owner

He/Him

https://www.cal-solar.coop/

530 274 3671 | ext 307

l...@cal-solar.com

www.Cal-Solar.coop

149 E. Main St, Grass Valley, CA 95945

NABCEP: #PVI-091110-89
CSLB #779624

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https://californiasolarco.com/quote/
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[RE-wrenches] X-240 Buzz

2022-01-31 Thread drake . chamberlin



An Outback X-240 auto transformer on a VFX3648 buzzes loudly with a load 
of 400 W. The sound diminishes and finally stops with higher loads.


The load was an electric, oil filled space heater.

Has anyone seen this before?

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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Re: [RE-wrenches] neutral sizing for sense

2022-01-25 Thread drake . chamberlin


"the maximum load connected between the neutral and any one ungrounded
[10] conductor plus the inverter [9] output rating shall not exceed the
ampacity [5] of the neutral conductor [6]." 


So the neutral conductor is supposed to be sized for the connected load
plus the entire maximum output of the inverter?

---

On 2022-01-24 12:10, Kirk Herander wrote:


705.95 AMPACITY OF NEUTRAL CONDUCTOR

National Electrical Code 2017 of New York State [1] > 7 Special Conditions [2] > 705 Interconnected Electric Power Production Sources [3] > 705.95 Ampacity of Neutral Conductor [4] 
JUMP TO FULL CODE CHAPTER 

The ampacity [5] of the neutral conductors [6] shall comply with either (A) or (B). 


(A) NEUTRAL CONDUCTOR FOR SINGLE PHASE, 2-WIRE INVERTER OUTPUT [7]

If a single-phase, 2-wire [8] inverter [9] output is connected to the neutral and one ungrounded [10] conductor (only) of a 3-wire [8] system or of a 3-phase, 4-wire [8], wye-connected system, the maximum load connected between the neutral and any one ungrounded [10] conductor plus the inverter [9] output rating shall not exceed the ampacity [5] of the neutral conductor [6]. 


(B) NEUTRAL CONDUCTOR FOR INSTRUMENTATION, VOLTAGE, DETECTION OR PHASE 
DETECTION [7]

A conductor used solely for instrumentation, voltage [11] detection, or phase detection and connected to a single-phase or 3-phase interactive inverter [12], shall be permitted to be sized at less than the ampacity [5] of the other current-carrying conductors and shall be sized equal to or larger than the equipment grounding conductor [13]. 

On Mon, Jan 24, 2022 at 11:58 AM Foxfire Energy  wrote: 


I'd start with the manufacturers recommendations

Sent from my iPhone


On Jan 24, 2022, at 11:52 AM, jay  wrote:

HI All,

Where do I find in the code how to size a sense only neutral wire for GT 
inverter.

thanks

jay

peltz power


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--

Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar 

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC 

_Celebrating our 31st Anniversary 1991-2022!!_ 

www.vermont.solar [14] 

dba Vermont Solar Engineering 

802.863.1202 
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Links:
--
[1] https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017
[2]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/7/special-conditions#7
[3]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/7/special-conditions#705
[4]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/7/special-conditions#705.95
[5]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ampacity
[6]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#neutral_conductor
[7] http://webmail.redwoodalliance.org/./#NOP
[8]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/8/communications-systems#wire
[9]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/6/special-equipment#inverter
[10]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#ungrounded
[11]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#voltage_of_a_circuit
[12]
https://up.codes/viewer/new_york/nfpa-70-2017/chapter/1/general#interactive_inverter

Re: [RE-wrenches] Lithium Ion tool batteries

2022-01-20 Thread drake . chamberlin

What lithium battery powered tool brand that has the best performance in 
freezing weather? My 10 year old+ Makita tool set isn't nearly as 
powerful as some newer tools. Even with new batteries, the tools have 
sufficient power in cold weather.


What is the best brand for cold weather operation?

Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---


On 2022-01-19 11:58, Alex MeVay wrote:

Generally, storage or use at cold temperatures shouldn't be an issue,
as long as the battery can still deliver enough power to operate the
tool effectively.

Charging though...at cold temperatures, ion mobility goes down.  If
the battery is charged too fast, the lithium ions can't make it into
the graphite anode fast enough and they start to plate out as metallic
lithium.  At best, this results in a permanent reduction in capacity.
Next worst from there, the lithium metal can create an internal soft
short, immediately or at a later point in time, resulting in high
self-discharge or a dead cell.  Worst case, it turns into a hard short
and a fire.

In theory, the BMS or charger should prevent charging too fast or too
cold, but who knows if an edge-case like this is actually implemented
correctly on any particular battery system.Be careful charging!

Alex MeVay

Genasun * Blue Sky Energy * http://sunforgellc.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Smell from Radian

2021-12-30 Thread drake . chamberlin

The room is not overly dusty, but a little. The intake screens look 
clean. The charge was at around 30 ADC and had been going for around an 
hour.


The smell seems to have dissipated, and the unit is still working fine. 
It must have been due to some particles that had gotten in. Blowing out 
the interior with compressed air seems like a good suggestion.


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


---


On 2021-12-29 11:08, Dana Orzel wrote:






Another thought -

Open up the Radian & do a really thorough compressed air blow out of 
the cabinet interior?


Dana Orzel  Great Solar Works, Inc.

C - 208.721.7003   d...@solarwork.com

Idaho Contractor - # 028765 Idaho PV # 028374

NABCEP # 051112-136   www.greatsolarworks.com

"Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988"

P Please consider the environment before printing this email.

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf 
Of Jerry Shafer

Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 2021 9:05 AM
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Smell from Radian

Drake

These inverters are indoor rated so dust cans still get inside and if 
the humidity is high and there is dirt on the boards they omit an odor 
now I can not say I have ever smelled corn chips but anything is 
possible, now to get the important info, how hard was the charge, how 
long was the charge, what was the ambient temperature,  the environment 
the inverter is residing, condition of the inlet screens, is the room 
dusty, musty or clean and simi habitable,  lastly, can criders get on 
top of the inverters,


On Wed, Dec 29, 2021 at 6:57 AM  
wrote:


A 8048 Radian emitted a smell while charging batteries. It smelled 
like

Fritos corn chips. The smell seemed to come out of the exhaust vent on
top of the box.

Has anyone experienced this? Would you suspect electronic components
frying or just some dust?

Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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[RE-wrenches] Smell from Radian

2021-12-29 Thread drake . chamberlin

A 8048 Radian emitted a smell while charging batteries. It smelled like 
Fritos corn chips. The smell seemed to come out of the exhaust vent on 
top of the box.


Has anyone experienced this? Would you suspect electronic components 
frying or just some dust?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Fair price for an obsolete component

2021-12-11 Thread drake . chamberlin


Another legacy item I would like to find a value for is a 15 year old
VFX 3524 off grid inverter. The AC voltage fluctuates a bit, so maybe it
could use another control board.  The cover plate (valve cover) is
missing. Otherwise it works. 


I did an upgrade on a system and offered to buy the old components, but
have little idea what this old Outback is worth. 

Drake Chamberlin 

Athens Electric LLC 

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810 

CO Master Electrician's License 4526 


NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-12-10 20:55, Ray Walters wrote:


All else fails, I just would go back to the Trace retail, give it a 10% for 
being used, and call it good.   $165?no one will complain about that

On 12/10/2021 6:42 PM, Jerry Shafer wrote: 
Truely it depends, if someone is looking and needing that part, the sky is the limit, its its just going from one shelf to another will next to Nothing. I have SMA, Trace and bogart monitors all antiques now unless you find that guy that wants and needs it. 
So 25.00 to 200.00 
Jerry 

On Thu, Dec 9, 2021, 11:38 PM Sindelar Solar  wrote: 
What would be a fair and equitable price to ask for a good used Trace SW Remote display unit with the cable included, please?

Obviously there will likely be a range of opinions. I'd simply like to get a 
sense of the range among us Wrenches.
Thank you,
Allan
--

Allan Sindelar
al...@sindelarsolar.com
New Mexico EE98J Journeyman Electrician
Founder (Retired), Positive Energy, Inc.
505 780-2738 cell 


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[RE-wrenches] Max charge for lithium batteries

2021-10-31 Thread drake . chamberlin



I have a client that insists it is better not to charge lithium 
batteries to 100%. Is there any truth to this?


Thanks,

Drake


Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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Re: [RE-wrenches] "Re-powering" Aging Utilty Scale PV systems

2021-09-11 Thread drake . chamberlin

I've been following this string with interest. The maintenance of decade
old systems is important, as the modules are warrantied for 25 years.
This duration is often considered in payback expectations.

What actually fails in the utility scale inverters? Is the failure
catastrophic, or do relays or some boards fail? How much of the inverter
is compromised?

Is there any hope that at least some of these could be put back into
service by experienced electronic technicians?

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional ---

On 2021-09-08 17:45, William Miller wrote:

Friends:

I learned a new buzzword recently: "Re-powering." It means replacing inverters on an existing PV system of ten or more years old. Due to the high number of systems of this vintage it appears that re-powering has become somewhat of a sub-industry. The big problem is these systems are all 600 Volt limited PV panels, combiners and re-combiners and there are no 600 volt utility grade inverters being manufactured.

I am working on a utility scale system [1] built about 14 years ago that fits the description above. There are two 250KVA Xantrex GT250 inverters and one has failed. The question of the moment is: Repair or replace?

Repair: If we fix these inverters, can we count on support in the future?We can negotiate a service contract with Schneider at a cost yet to be revealed. This requires we buy a spare parts kit for about $100K. There are a few other companies that claim to offer repair services on these inverters but none has followed through.

Replace: The PV plant is built with panels and BOS all limited to 600 VDC max. There are no more 600 volt input utility scale inverters being built, or at least none that I have found. If we install a 1000 or 1500 volt inverter we may have to replace the entire PV array and BOS. It may be possible to convert the output of the existing panels to a higher voltage with DC-DC converters.

Here are the options I see:

Optimizers: One purveyor of optimizers is Solar Edge. Solar Edge offers a 100 KVA inverter. This inverter requires DC input of 850 volts. The inverter requires optimizers to obtain this voltage. The question: Do the optimizers isolate the PV from the higher string voltages in the case of a catastrophic failure of one or more of the optimizers?

Repower with outboard DC-DC voltage converters, such as provided by Alencon Systems. Solectria has successfully done this. Here [2] is a paper on the subject.

If anyone has dealt with this issue before I would sure appreciate any wisdom.

Here is a link [3] to a web-page I built for this project.

Thanks,

William Miller

Miller Solar

17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422

805-438-5600

www.millersolar.com [4]

CA Lic. 773985

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Exploding RSD Unit

2021-08-31 Thread drake . chamberlin


That is a great offer. For the sake of our industry I hope it succeeds.
What is the next step? Please keep us in the loop. 

Drake Chamberlin 

Athens Electric LLC 

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810 

CO Master Electrician's License 4526 

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional 

--- 


I would like to suggest that interested WRENCHES form their own "subcommittee" 
so that we can have an somewhat organized approach to this issue.  I do know Fronius has 
been working on this, and we should seek them out.  I will volunteer to help organize the 
subcommittee.  I have done similar work on other issues.  I think this will have to be 
done by email so I will set up a process if there is interest.  Chris

On 8/30/2021 2:40 PM, Brian Mehalic wrote: 
The process is very regimented. Here's a link with the details: https://www.nfpa.org/Codes-and-Standards/Standards-Development/How-the-process-works 

A few things to note: 

All submitted public inputs (PIs) are addressed by the relevant Code Making Panel (CMP); the NFPA has transitioned so that all this documentation is online (there used to be a PDF) - it can be viewed on the "Next Edition" tab of NFPA 70 here: https://www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/all-codes-and-standards/list-of-codes-and-standards/detail?code=70=nextedition 

The first draft of 2023, based on all the PIs submitted, came out on 6/28/21; comments on that document were due about 12 days ago, and the second draft meeting is scheduled for late October. The product of that meeting, which will post in March 2022, will be, for the most part, the 2023 NEC. 

Sooo, it is going to be tough to "repeal" or get rid of RS based on the current state of things. There is the NITMAM process (ugh, so many acronyms), which you can read about here https://www.nfpa.org/techsession and which I'm not very familiar with. 

Please keep in mind that CMP-4 (which I am a voting-alternate on, and which has jurisdiction over 690, 705, 710, and a few other Articles) is composed of a wide range of folks, from the enforcement (AHJ) community, the IBEW, various manufacturing trade organizations, utility organizations, the fire fighting/first responder community, and solar-specific organizations. Folks have widely varying degrees of interest in - and experience with - PV, but they all bring technical expertise from across the electrical industry. You may be surprised to hear it, but requirements in regards to RS could have been a lot more stringent, a lot more quickly, without key representation from the panel members that are most dedicated to the solar industry. Furthermore this is a consensus process, and is often the case rarely does anyone get exactly what they want. 

Many of these same folks have been very active participants in the PV Industry Forum, sponsored by SEIA, and comprised of something like 60-80 industry stakeholders that work together to craft and submit consensus Public Inputs for the first draft. In this latest cycle we submitted dozens of PIs, and the vast majority of them were accepted and became part of the first draft. This process is key to jump-starting the new Code cycle - without a Public Input to address, the code-making panel cannot "touch" a section of the code. And of course there are plenty of PIs from individuals and other organizations that are addressed by the panel. 

Cheers, 

Brian Mehalic 
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installation Professional(tm) R031508-59 
National Electrical Code(R) CMP-4 Member 
(520) 204-6639


Solar Energy International
http://www.solarenergy.org 

SEI Professional Services 
http://www.seisolarpros.com [1] 

On Sun, Aug 29, 2021 at 5:28 AM Christopher Warfel  wrote: 


Brian, I think you serve on a CMP.  (if not, anyone with knowledge on the 
process would be helpful.) What is the process for receiving and acknowledging 
input from non CMP members?  Every time I submitted comment, I received no 
response (as far as I can remember). Thank you, Chris

On 8/28/2021 11:09 AM, Brian Mehalic wrote: Movement? Maybe, but as far as I can tell it's just a forum to complain as I see no activity that could actually impact the NEC(R) via the clearly defined and delineated process. Also there are a few flat-out false claims on the site, along with a call to action to fix module level shutdown by...having module level shutdown in the junction box? Most of the complaints seem to come down to connector standardization (which obviously was not the issue with the APS meltdown that started this thread).  


Brian

On Aug 28, 2021, at 7:07 AM, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org wrote:

There is a movement to do away with module level shutdown. 

https://www.fixmlsd.com/?utm_campaign=solarbuilder_comment_medium=email_source=fixmlsd 

FixMLSD has convincing arguments that MLSD is less safe than safe than an arc fault protective device with a standard string configuration. Given the many problems with MLSD devices, it seems l

Re: [RE-wrenches] Exploding RSD Unit

2021-08-29 Thread drake . chamberlin

Fronius is also involved in the effort to remove the MLSD requirement.

https://solarbuildermag.com/featured/safety-concerns-for-solar-pv-module-level-shutdown-solutions/

In order to remove MLSD, it would require financial backing to get
someone on a committee, pay, house and feed them throughout the process.

Maybe Fronius or other large inverter manufacturers could afford to do
this.

-Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-08-28 12:20, Ray wrote:

All of these new code required safety features have a detrimental effect on reliability. That's not a huge deal with GT, but off grid, this can become a serious safety issue in itself, as the homeowner loses communications, water, heat, and frozen food.

There are opponents of solar energy that are laughing at us now, for being scared of our own shadow, when we as an industry have had an overall excellent safety record that goes back 40 years. We need to take a serious look at which safety issues are real, and which are not. Standardizing PV connections is very important. Module level RSD is not.

Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760

On 8/28/21 9:46 AM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar wrote:

The Schneider RSD is decent. At least it is useable as a 600vdc disco. The few offgrid homes that were required to use this had the Tigo units on the array panels and wireless comm to the RSD. As soon as the inspector was done, those went to Ebay. I never use a roof but have used a barn for panels.

AFCI, GFCI, and now RSD are just more things to fail when you need them the most, like during a wildfire or hurricane.

I know you folks have to do what you need to do to stay in business. For me, electronics are in a covered building.

Always!

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On Fri, 27 Aug 2021 07:48:34 -0800, James Jarvis wrote:
So who has a good reliable off grid RSD? It all looks like failure prone garbage to me.

Thank you,

-James Jefferson Jarvis
APRS World, LLC
+1-507-454-2727

(Sent from my phone. My apologies for spelling errors and brevity.)

On Fri, Aug 27, 2021, 05:02 Tump wrote:
I would once again say that; we as an industry can influence not only the writing of the code but with what we are _buying_ OR _not buying._
If the devices we are required to install to make things "more safe & reliable", at the cost of our livelihoods & reputations, we all need to make the folks that are building the RSD crap and those who require installation of questionably safe & reliable crap aware of these problems.
WE can thru either going to the code development meetings AND NOT buying or installing this stuff. Not too easy when a huge amount of solar is rooftop installs. As many of the installers in the NE know its not a single level ranch were installing this stuff on, short season & man lift required.
Tell your supplier why you are not buying that brand, let your supplier & folks on the list what manufacture has good reliable products AND tech support that we can understand, who we can get in a timely fashion, and get the satisfaction of a prompt replacement. IF we don't sell it they won't have a job or a market.

On Aug 26, 2021, at 2:09 PM, Jeremy Coxon wrote:

Carl,

Did you get any kind of joy out of APSmart on that failure?

I will say that their tech support guy did at least try to be helpful, but the language barrier was really really steep and their distribution channels are less than ideal. Their response to a request for compensation was that they would not be profitable if they had to pay for truck rolls for such a low cost item. I really don't think they GET IT. We've been in business for over 16yrs and this one failure could easily have ended that run.

I cannot imagine we're alone here. I was told by AP that their failure rate
was 0.2%. Now, I come from a reliability engineering background in petro
chemical/ big pharma where a 0.2% failure rate would be catastrophic. Can you
imagine that 2 out of every 1000 pills made could cause death? We engineered
secondary systems and multiple quality checks to contain catastrophic
consequences for components that had know failure rates higher than acceptable
values. A simple solution to this fire initiation issue would be a metal
enclosure instead of plastic casing. That still doesn't really solve the
problem of extra connections though.

Best Regards,
Jeremy Coxon NABCEP # 091308-21 ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Exploding RSD Unit

2021-08-28 Thread drake . chamberlin

There is a movement to do away with module level shutdown.

https://www.fixmlsd.com/?utm_campaign=solarbuilder_comment_medium=email_source=fixmlsd

FixMLSD has convincing arguments that MLSD is less safe than safe than
an arc fault protective device with a standard string configuration.
Given the many problems with MLSD devices, it seems likely that this is
true.

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-08-27 09:02, Tump wrote:

I would once again say that; we as an industry can influence not only the writing of the code but with what we are _buying_ OR _not buying._
If the devices we are required to install to make things "more safe & reliable", at the cost of our livelihoods & reputations, we all need to make the folks that are building the RSD crap and those who require installation of questionably safe & reliable crap aware of these problems.
WE can thru either going to the code development meetings AND NOT buying or installing this stuff. Not too easy when a huge amount of solar is rooftop installs. As many of the installers in the NE know its not a single level ranch were installing this stuff on, short season & man lift required.
Tell your supplier why you are not buying that brand, let your supplier & folks on the list what manufacture has good reliable products AND tech support that we can understand, who we can get in a timely fashion, and get the satisfaction of a prompt replacement. IF we don't sell it they won't have a job or a market.

On Aug 26, 2021, at 2:09 PM, Jeremy Coxon wrote:

Carl,

Did you get any kind of joy out of APSmart on that failure?

Best Regards,
Jeremy Coxon NABCEP # 091308-21 ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Original Envoy

2021-08-05 Thread drake . chamberlin


Thanks Jason. The Envoy-S tends to be pricey, but we will likely need to
bite the bullet!

---

On 2021-08-05 12:32, Jason Szumlanski wrote:

I have had no luck. Enphase sells the upgraded Envoy-S with plug and cord connection on their online store, at least last I checked.  

Jason Szumlanski 
Florida Solar Design Group 

On Thu, Aug 5, 2021, 11:13 AM  wrote: 


Hello Wrenches,

I'm looking for an original Envoy. I've looked on E Bay and searched the 
web, but so far no luck. Does anyone have one or know where one might be 
available?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810
CO Master Electrician's License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

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[RE-wrenches] Original Envoy

2021-08-05 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hello Wrenches,

I'm looking for an original Envoy. I've looked on E Bay and searched the 
web, but so far no luck. Does anyone have one or know where one might be 
available?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Autoformer and long AC run

2021-08-03 Thread drake . chamberlin

I mean twice the Watts / Amp.

---

On 2021-08-03 10:13, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org wrote:

Hi Brad,

The auto transformer should work just fine. You should get 4X the efficiency with 1/2 the current and twice the Watts / Volt. I don't know how much benefit is available from paralleling wires of different sizes; it is not recommended practice of course.

If you find a source for those old auto transformers, I'd sure like to know.

Best,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-08-02 15:16, Bradley Bassett wrote:

The system currently has a 600 foot run of 2-2-4 aluminum from the service to the house loads. The load is often only 120VAC which gives a large voltage drop using only the #2 and #4 conductors. My thought was to install an autotransformer at the load end so that the current runs through the #2 conductors at 240VAC for much less voltage drop. Are there any issues I should be looking at doing this? I'm thinking that to balance the legs a 4kVA autoformer would be adequate. The circuit is protected by 30A breakers both ends.

Second question is if I could reduce the voltage drop even more by taking the #4 and paralleling it to one of the #2 conductors. This would eliminate the neutral on the long run. I'm thinking that the autoformer could generate a new neutral for the load circuits. This is an older install so the neutral is already grounded to earth at both ends, there is no ground wire between the two such as would be required by code now. I know that code does not allow paralleling conductors smaller than 1/0 but I will disregard that in this case since it's my own system.

If anyone has one of the old AEE toroid autoformers you'd like to sell, or if you want one yourself we can do a bulk buy. Let me know off list.

Thanks,

Brad Bassett

AEE Solar

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Autoformer and long AC run

2021-08-03 Thread drake . chamberlin

Hi Brad,

The auto transformer should work just fine. You should get 4X the
efficiency with 1/2 the current and twice the Watts / Volt. I don't know
how much benefit is available from paralleling wires of different sizes;
it is not recommended practice of course.

If you find a source for those old auto transformers, I'd sure like to
know.

Best,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-08-02 15:16, Bradley Bassett wrote:

If anyone has one of the old AEE toroid autoformers you'd like to sell, or if you want one yourself we can do a bulk buy. Let me know off list.

Thanks,

Brad Bassett

AEE Solar

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Sol-Ark 12k w/ Generac Transfer Switch

2021-06-18 Thread drake . chamberlin


I've controlled Generac Guardians, using the transfer switch and adding
relays so the inverter decides when it should start. These were out of
warranty units. Checking with Generac about a proposed new generator, I
was told that it would void the warranty to do that. I was told that a
new Generac is supposed to come our around the end of the year that can
be controlled by an inverter. 

Drake 

Drake Chamberlin 

Athens Electric LLC 

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810 

CO Master Electrician's License 4526 

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional 

athens-electric.com [2] 


---

On 2021-06-17 09:41, r...@solshineenergy.com wrote:

Wrenches, 

I'm looking to tie in a Generac Powerpact 7.5kW generator with transfer switch to a Sol-Ark 12kW. The Sol-Ark has a two wire start (NO or NC) capability, however, the Generac transfer switch operates on loss of 240V. Is my only option to use a relay driven by the two wire start to drop 240V to the transfer switch?  

Thank you, 


rick brown
SolShine Energy Alternatives, LLC
Electrical & Solar Contracting Services
www.SolShineEnergy.com [1]
Check, Virginia 24072
Office: 540.235.3095
Mobile: 540.808.9502

VA Class A Contractor Lic# 2705147660
VA Master Electrician Lic# 2710062762
VA Alternative Energy Systems Installer  
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional 110112-21 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Magnum MM1524AE rebuild?

2021-06-11 Thread drake . chamberlin

Hello Jeff, 


That sounds really useful. How do you wire this? Where do you get the
momentary switch? 

Thanks, 


Drake

---

On 2021-06-09 12:13, Jeff Clearwater wrote:


Hey Dave and Wrenches,

This is why now I always install a pre-charge circuit for Magnum's and other 
inverters - especially on a Lithium pack with a BMS.  A momentary on-off switch 
and 50 watt 20 ohm resistor - $20 worth of parts = a lifetime of less stress on 
main breaker - inverter caps and battery BMS.  I recommend it for any inverter 
over 2 KW.  Many LiFePO4 BMS's will shut down when sensing that much inrush so 
it's a must on many systems.

Best,

Jeff Clearwater
Village Power Design

palumbo1...@gmail.com 
June 8, 2021 at 6:01 AM


Is a Magnum MM1524AE inverter/charger repairable and if so by whom? 

It failed after being reconnected to a battery bank, the typical small spark at the battery terminal when being reconnected was accompanied by a popping sound in the Magnum. Killed the Magnum. 

Dave Palumbo 

Hyde Park, VT 


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[RE-wrenches] VFX3648

2021-05-27 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hello Wrenches,

Does anyone know where an Outback VFX 3648 inverter might be purchased?

Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional



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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA SB 2500U

2021-05-22 Thread drake . chamberlin


Make sure the old modules are resistant to Potential Induced Degradation
(PID). The new transformerless inverters can induce PID on non PID
resistant modules. This issue surfaced with the installation of
inverters that did not solidly ground either conductor. 

Drake Chamberlin 

Athens Electric LLC 

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810 

CO Master Electrician's License 4526 


NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-05-18 21:22, Jerry Shafer wrote:

Wrenches 
I would also be surprised if the old 2500 would last very long. 
Better off with a SB5.0-41 and if you need RSD then add that in also. 

On Tue, May 18, 2021, 12:15 PM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar  wrote: 

Probably if it is old it does not have these recent Certifications and UL requirements. Just gave these to my local AHJ. 

IEEE 1547, UL 1741-SA, Rule 21, Rule 14H, PREPA, and CSA 107.1 


Product Certification History Project Date Description 80049402 2020-09-18 
Update to report 70194014 to meet grid support function according to CA Rule 21 
for 120Vac output configuration. 80036281 2020-03-15 Update report 70194014 to 
include UL1741 CRD SA17/18 UL 1741(California Rule 21 Phase 3 Function 2 and 
Function 3) for Model XW Pro 6848 NA. 80020062 2019-10-30 Update report 
70194014 to include firmware upgrade for Model XW Pro 6848 NA. 70220117 
2019-03-27 Update Report 70194014 to include minor firmware update for Model XW 
Pro 6848 NA. 70212688 2019-03-04 Update Report 70194014 to Include Volt-Watt 
and revised Freq-Watt grid tie requirements as per UL1741 Supplement SA for 
Model XW Pro 6848 NA (FGA 865-6848-21).

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On Tue, 18 May 2021 14:07:08 -0400, "Glenn Burt"  wrote: 

Hi Kirk, 

Can you elaborate on which UL standards the older SB units don't comply with? 

-Glenn 


From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of Kirk 
Herander, VSE
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2021 6:42 AM
To: re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA SB 2500U 


These older Sunnyboys do not comply with latest UL standards regardless. If its 
a new installation, a savvy utility  / AHJ will catch this.

Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar 

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC 

_Celebrating our 30th Anniversary 1991-2021!!_ 

www.vermont.solar [1] 

dba Vermont Solar Engineering 

802.863.1202 


On 5/17/2021 3:53:26 PM, William Miller  wrote:

Jay: 

Some years ago I mis-ordered 5 SB2500s for 208 three phase and it turned 
out the system was 240 VAC three phase (open delta). I had to return the 
inverters to the factory to be converted and I had to rewire all of the 
arrays. So no, I don't think this can be done in the field. 

William Miller 

Miller Solar 
17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422 
805-438-5600 
www.millersolar.com [2] 
CA Lic. 773985 

-Original Message- 
From: RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] On 
Behalf Of Jay 
Sent: Monday, May 17, 2021 11:44 AM 
To: RE-wrenches 
Subject: [RE-wrenches] SMA SB 2500U 

Does anyone know if you can convert a 
SMA SB2500U ( old red inverter) from 208 to 240vac? 

Without using a boost transformer. 

Thx 
Jay 

Peltz power. 

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generator Distributor

2021-05-14 Thread drake . chamberlin

My search for dealership options for Onan/Cummings and Kohler does not 
seem to be turning up any good options. Generac, on the other hand is 
eager to have me. Unfortunately, having an inverter control their 
generator will void the warranty at present. The rep told me they have a 
new option that will allow this, coming out at the end of the year.


They have a system with a battery and inverter that can be used for 
energy storage. Generac is pushing that hard. It is not useful for my 
present needs.


Does anyone know of a good place to buy an appropriate backup generator 
for a photovoltaic system?


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


---


On 2021-05-12 10:17, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org wrote:

Hello Wrench Colleagues,

Can anyone recommend a distributor for Onan or Kohler generator that
accepts new dealer applications?

These seem to be the top two units for backup systems, but I'm open to
other suggestions.

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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[RE-wrenches] Generator Distributor

2021-05-12 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hello Wrench Colleagues,

Can anyone recommend a distributor for Onan or Kohler generator that 
accepts new dealer applications?


These seem to be the top two units for backup systems, but I'm open to 
other suggestions.


Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Breakers weakening?

2021-05-09 Thread drake . chamberlin

I've replaced breakers with those symptoms and solved the problem. 


---

On 2021-05-09 08:52, Kirk Herander, VSE wrote:


That's what I expected to find, i.e. evidence of a heat event / loose 
connection at the breaker terminals (discolored and / or melted wire 
insulation, etc.), no visual evidence or smell.

Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar 

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC 

_Celebrating our 30th Anniversary 1991-2021!!_ 

www.vermont.solar [1] 

dba Vermont Solar Engineering 

802.863.1202 


On 5/8/2021 7:32:53 PM, Dave Tedeyan  wrote:

Kirk, 
Could there be a loose wire connection to the breaker? That could cause it to heat up an trip sooner than it otherwise would. 
Cheers, 
Dave 

On Sat, May 8, 2021, 2:13 PM Kirk Herander, VSE  wrote: 
I have a system where the SE1 inverter fried internally. The 60A AC output breaker tripped several times, as a result of the homeowner resetting over and over until he called me. 
I replaced the inverter under warranty and all is fine, except on sunny days the breaker will trip at about 40A, close to the max output of the inverter. Reset it outside of peak inverter output and its good. I assume the breaker has weakened from stress of some sort, so I replaced it and time will tell. 
Anyone ever seen a breaker have it's trip point reduced like this?


Kirk Herander / kirkh@vermont.solar 

Owner|Principal, VT Solar, LLC 

_Celebrating our 30th Anniversary 1991-2021!!_ 

www.vermont.solar [1] 

dba Vermont Solar Engineering 


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[RE-wrenches] Wrench Membership Dues

2021-05-06 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hello Wrench Associates,

While he's made it optional, I want to encourage you to respond to 
Michael's request for financial support for the Wrench List. Michael 
Welch founded the list in October of 1999, and has been the 
administrator of it ever since. He is now working strictly as a 
volunteer. He deserves our support.


He has suggested a minimum of a $50 donation. Some installers, like me, 
find the list much more valuable than that, and have upped the ante 
accordingly.


His email from a couple weeks ago lays out his request. It is pasted 
below. The following link can be used to pay your dues. It can also be 
found in the footer of every list email.


http://re-wrenches.org

The List is valuable in many ways.
•	It often provides a preview of what to expect when trying new 
equipment.
•	Many Wrenches give technical support that is superior to 
manufacturer’s tech support.
•	The list can get the attention of knowledgeable technical support 
people from manufacturers when the agents who answer the phone can't 
help.


Let’s keep this valuable resource going.

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional



Help Ensure Wrench List Continuance

As you are probably aware, the Wrench List has been under the personal 
direction of myself via a small, local nonprofit I work with, after Home 
Power magazine ended sponsorship of the list.


When we announced the sponsorship change back then, I promised that we 
would start asking for funds from members. At the time I was willing to 
keep going as a volunteer, which I'm still doing. I spend 8-20 hours a 
week on this list and I'm committed to continuing to do so. But we need 
to start bringing in funds to help cover list costs, including my time.


It's been over 2 years since the final Home Power financial crises 
killed its two magazines, ending all our jobs (mine included) and 
financial support for this listserve. There is no outside funding for 
this project. Lacking the likelihood of any big corporate sponsors, it's 
finally time to implement paid Wrench List membership!


Toward that end, we're beginning an annual dues/membership program. But 
don't worry—nobody will be excluded for lack of contributing. Paid 
membership is not mandatory, but would be greatly appreciated and will 
go a long way to ensure The Wrench List's life into the future.


We are suggesting that each individual member contribute an amount 
commensurate with the value of the list for that member, starting at $50 
per year. If you find the Wrench list particularly helpful, and/or your 
business is doing well, maybe $100 – $300 would be appropriate—it's up 
to you. Major manufacturers on the list might consider thousands, if 
they recognize the value the list has to the RE industry. So, if you 
find this listserve of value please consider membership at the level 
that works for you.


We've already had a few Wrenches send checks voluntarily—thank you! We 
look forward to a robust membership as more and more of you join. 
Membership dues are a legitimate business expense with full business tax 
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As always, if you have feedback, questions, or concerns about this, 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generator and AC coupling on a Sol-Ark

2021-05-04 Thread drake . chamberlin

You can even buy a kit.
https://www.solar-electric.com/outback-power-gs-ac-gen-kit-generator-back-up-kit.html
This provides an enclosure for the contactor.

---

On 2021-05-04 16:03, Jason Szumlanski wrote:

What happens when the contactor fails? I don't trust a NC contactor that is supposed to open on 240Vac coil voltage from the generator. It's not a failsafe solution.

Jason

On Tue, May 4, 2021, 3:15 PM Drake wrote:
P.S. The contactor method is even mentioned somewhere in the Outback literature. I've been using it for years. It is very simple and requires no complex equipment. It will not interfere with rapid shutdown. 40 A, 240 V contactors with 240 V coils are readily available and not terribly expensive. The 240 V output of the generator circuit provides the signal.

At 10:02 AM 5/4/2021, you wrote:
Get a contactor with a 240 VAC coil. Connect the coil wire wires to the 240 V output circuit of the generator, so when the generator comes on, the contactor opens. Run the current from the AC coupled Enphase inverters through the contacts from common to N/C.

---

On 2021-05-03 10:26, Dave Tedeyan wrote:
Hi All,

I am planning on using a Sol-Ark for the first time for adding battery backup
to an existing system. It is Enphase, so clearly it will be AC coupled, and
there is a whole house generator. When I talked to Sol-Ark about it, they
recommended putting the generator on a time of use schedule to not allow it to
come on during the day so that we don't run into the issue of the solar
backfeeding the generator.

I was wondering though if anyone has just used a contactor to cut out the solar
when the generator turns on? Something like Outback's GS-AC-Gen-Kit, although
in this case I will need something rated for just over 30A. This seems like a
better way to allow the generator to run at any time it is needed, especially
if it is a gloomy, snowy, winter day.

Cheers,
Dave

--
Dave Tedeyan, PE

1653 Slaterville Road, Ithaca, NY 14850
Cell: 607-288-2898
www.sungineersolar.com [1]

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generator and AC coupling on a Sol-Ark

2021-05-04 Thread Drake

P.S. The contactor method is even mentioned somewhere in the Outback 
literature. I've been using it for years. It is very simple and 
requires no complex equipment. It will not interfere with rapid 
shutdown. 40 A, 240 V contactors with 240 V coils are readily 
available and not terribly expensive. The 240 V output of the 
generator circuit provides the signal.


At 10:02 AM 5/4/2021, you wrote:
Get a contactor with a 240 VAC coil. Connect the coil wire wires to 
the 240 V output circuit of the generator, so when the generator 
comes on, the contactor opens. Run the current from the AC coupled 
Enphase inverters through the contacts from common to N/C.


---



On 2021-05-03 10:26, Dave Tedeyan wrote:

Hi All,

I am planning on using a Sol-Ark for the first time for adding 
battery backup to an existing system. It is Enphase, so clearly it 
will be AC coupled, and there is a whole house generator. When I 
talked to Sol-Ark about it, they recommended putting the generator 
on a time of use schedule to not allow it to come on during the day 
so that we don't run into the issue of the solar backfeeding the generator.


I was wondering though if anyone has just used a contactor to cut 
out the solar when the generator turns on? Something like Outback's 
GS-AC-Gen-Kit, although in this case I will need something rated 
for just over 30A. This seems like a better way to allow the 
generator to run at any time it is needed, especially if it is a 
gloomy, snowy, winter day.


Cheers,
Dave

--
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Sungineer Solar

1653 Slaterville Road, Ithaca, NY 14850
Cell: 607-288-2898
www.sungineersolar.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Generator and AC coupling on a Sol-Ark

2021-05-04 Thread drake . chamberlin


Get a contactor with a 240 VAC coil. Connect the coil wire wires to the
240 V output circuit of the generator, so when the generator comes on,
the contactor opens. Run the current from the AC coupled Enphase
inverters through the contacts from common to N/C. 


---

On 2021-05-03 10:26, Dave Tedeyan wrote:

Hi All,  

I am planning on using a Sol-Ark for the first time for adding battery backup to an existing system. It is Enphase, so clearly it will be AC coupled, and there is a whole house generator. When I talked to Sol-Ark about it, they recommended putting the generator on a time of use schedule to not allow it to come on during the day so that we don't run into the issue of the solar backfeeding the generator. 

I was wondering though if anyone has just used a contactor to cut out the solar when the generator turns on? Something like Outback's GS-AC-Gen-Kit, although in this case I will need something rated for just over 30A. This seems like a better way to allow the generator to run at any time it is needed, especially if it is a gloomy, snowy, winter day. 

Cheers,  
Dave

--

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1653 Slaterville Road, Ithaca, NY 14850 
Cell: 607-288-2898 
www.sungineersolar.com [1] 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] MC4s are listed for THWN, right?

2021-04-27 Thread drake . chamberlin

On a practical note, MC-4 functions fine with THHN inside a weather 
proof enclosure. It will not seal, due to the smaller overall diameter 
of the cable.


THHN is rated for 90C. It is not sunlight resistant, and should never be 
used exposed.


---


On 2021-04-26 23:16, frenergy wrote:

Blake,

            Its great to get definitive clarification on this MC4/THHN
issue, we've been using 4-14 Polaris connectors with good results. 
Being inside a Nema3 can and having silicone grease in the Polaris
makes for a solid, durable connection.  Inspecting some of these that
are now 17 years in the field shows very good condition for the wire
landing in the Polaris and the condition of THWN-2 wire insulation. 
We haven't had the best of luck with Buchanans.

Bill

Feather River Solar Electric
Bill Battagin, Owner
4291 Nelson St.
Taylorsville, CA 95983
530.284.7849
CA Lic 874049
www.frenergy.net

On 4/26/2021 5:41 PM, Blake Gleason wrote:

Corey,

Thank you!  Agreed, the message from Staubli's Eng dept is much less 
confusing (with the exception of the statement about THHN tending to 
be solid vs stranded).


All -
What are you folks using to transition from PV Wire to THHN/THWN-2 
inside a junction box?  We used to use split bolts, which make an 
awesome electrical connection, but are time-consuming and not easily 
serviceable.  Wire nuts (the right ones) are Listed, but never felt 
reliable for that purpose.  Same for WAGO levers.  I hear about people 
using Buchanan splice caps, but I wonder about trading one set of 
crimping problems for another.  And of course, the only problem with 
using THHN in an MC4 is that the compression gland may not be as 
watertight as it is with PVWire, and the Buchanans certainly are not 
watertight.  Terminal blocks generally aren't listed, definitely 
aren't watertight, and raise inspectors' eyebrows.  Why is this so 
hard for me??


Best,
Blake
Thanks



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Re: [RE-wrenches] Outback_Inverter firmware mismatch

2021-03-29 Thread drake . chamberlin

It seems that battery based inverters are not nearly as reliable as they
once were. I understand that the Samlex inverters are pretty
bulletproof. They are coming out with a 120/240V split phase to work
with a 48V battery bank. I don't know that these are grid interactive,
or if they can be stacked.

We need a manufacturer to produce something equivalent to the FX series
inverters, or the earlier Radians.

What is the best choice for a grid interactive, battery based inverter?
I tend to lean toward Schneider.

Drake

Drake Chamberlin

Athens Electric LLC

Ohio Electrical Contractor's License 44810

CO Master Electrician's License 4526

NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional

---

On 2021-03-28 12:04, Roland - RES wrote:

Aloha Wayne,

We too have been plagued by this issue, that has been extremely frustrating for us and our clients.

The newest 1.4.6 firmware is supposed to fix this issue. We have updated our systems with this and so far so good. However because of the sometimes long delays between the faults we can't be certain.

Prior to this most common fix was replacing the mate.

Also on FP2 we had a couple factory units have the hub jumpers set for the wrong stacking. I believe they were set for parallel operations versus series. Strange it would work fine with the jumpers either way for a long time. But it's worth a check.

Sent from a IPhone, with touch screen keys on the fly. Please excuse shortcuts
and typos.

Roland Shackelford

NABCEP CERTIFIED PV INSTALLER
President

Renewable Energy Services (RES), Inc.
Mobile: 808-938-9239 [3]
www.renewablenergy.com [4]

On Mar 27, 2021, at 3:11 PM, Wayne Irwin wrote:

Wrenches and Lones,

We have had chronic inverter firmware mismatch issues with FLEXpower TWO FXR series on many systems.
We've updated the firmware and replaced mates, yet the system failures continue.

The systems will work flawlessly for months and then randomly show error and the firmware mismatch. Occasionally the system will discover (on its own) that the firmware is the same and turn back on. But usually, the "solution" is to unplug the mate and plug it back in and like magic...everything works again anywhere from 3 months to a year.

This is disappointing and frustrating to the system owners as well as costly and time consuming for us.

Any guidance in resolving this issue would be greatly appreciated.

All these systems have been assembled by Outback.
None of them have OpticsRE.

Wayne Irwin
President
License #CVC56695
State Licensed Solar Contractor
Pure Energy Solar International Inc.
wa...@pureenergysolar.com
PureEnergySolar.com [1]
SolarChargingStation.com [2]
352 377-6527 Office
352 336-3299 Fax
352 316-1637 Cell

The Sun Is Always Shining!

The content of this message is Pure Energy Solar Confidential. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, any use or distribution is prohibited. Please notify me immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message from your computer system. Thank you.
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Concorde Lifeline Batteries

2021-03-18 Thread drake . chamberlin


They are the same price.

---


On 2021-03-18 09:35, Jay wrote:

The technical manuals are identical as well as the specs I looked at.

Drake is there a cost difference between them?

Jay

On Mar 17, 2021, at 9:02 PM, Maverick Brown 
 wrote:


It’s my understanding that they are exactly the same battery made in 
a line owned different family members. (More or less).


I have used many of them interchangeably (not in the same system).

Thank you,

Maverick


On Mar 17, 2021, at 6:11 PM, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org 
wrote:


Hello Wrenches,

Is there any reason to use Concorde Sun Xtender batteries instead of 
Concorde Lifeline batteries with PV systems?


The Lifeline is what is available from my supplier at this time?

Thanks,

Drake

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Concorde Lifeline Batteries

2021-03-18 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hi Jay,

We are looking at the GPL-4CT 6V to replace an existing bank of Sun 
Xtender 224 batteries.



---


On 2021-03-17 19:16, Jay wrote:

Hi Drake

Which models are you interested in?

Jay

On Mar 17, 2021, at 5:10 PM, drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org 
wrote:


Hello Wrenches,

Is there any reason to use Concorde Sun Xtender batteries instead of 
Concorde Lifeline batteries with PV systems?


The Lifeline is what is available from my supplier at this time?

Thanks,

Drake

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[RE-wrenches] Concorde Lifeline Batteries

2021-03-17 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hello Wrenches,

Is there any reason to use Concorde Sun Xtender batteries instead of 
Concorde Lifeline batteries with PV systems?


The Lifeline is what is available from my supplier at this time?

Thanks,

Drake

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[RE-wrenches] Residential tax credit

2021-03-15 Thread drake . chamberlin



Hello Wrenches,

A client would like to have an 11 kW residential system installed. He 
would like to utilize the federal tax credit, but is retired and doesn’t 
have sufficient income to benefit.


His son would finance most of the system if he could get the credit. His 
son is grown and lives out of state. Is there a good way to accomplish 
this? Should they set up a PPA?


Thanks,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
Ohio Electrical Contractor’s License 44810
CO Master Electrician’s License 4526
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
athens-electric.com

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[RE-wrenches] Code Question

2021-03-04 Thread Drake


Hello Wrenches,

I believe it is a code requirement to install conduits in their 
entirety before pulling wire through, and that this applies to all 
types of  rigid conduit.


Is this correct? Does anyone know where in the NEC this is stated?

Thank you,

Drake


Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
CO ME Licence 4526
NABCEP Certified Solar PV
740-448-7328
<http://athens-electric.com/>http://athens-electric.com/

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Energy Storage and Working Spaces for Other Equipment

2021-02-02 Thread drake . chamberlin


One time we built the wall out to bring the equipment in to compliance
with the front of the battery enclosure. 


Drake

---

On 2021-02-01 01:27, Ray wrote:

This isn't just a Li+ issue, this has been a problem going all the way back to the 90s.  Basically many AHJs don't catch it, but its still a violation.  We either keep the battery cabinet shallow, or we put the battery cabinet to the side.   Just use some common sense, if you are having to lean awkwardly over or around something to get to the breakers, its probably a violation.  


Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760

On 1/31/21 5:55 PM, Jason Szumlanski wrote: 
I'm reading that the working space must be down to the floor/grade with the exception of other equipment extending up to 6 inches deeper than the enclosure for which the working space applies.  

For example, technically you can't put a 32 inch deep base cabinet and countertop below a load center. I see it all the time, but inspectors around here in some jurisdictions will not allow it.  

I seriously doubt I would be flagged for a 24 inch deep battery enclosure below a 12 inch deep inverter with integrated disconnects, but by the book it seems like a violation.  

Jason 

On Sun, Jan 31, 2021, 5:38 PM Jerry Shafer  wrote: 
l dont know that this NEC code applies in the way you are reading or understanding it, I do see where foreign components are restricted with in the space. We have systems with two or three outback radians above blueplanet batteries and have not seen an issue. The BPE's are in an enclosed cabinet fire approved and protected from shock, putting batteries further away will create space issues. Since all of these components are required for the "system" to operate they are necessary. 
Jerry 

On Sun, Jan 31, 2021, 12:28 PM Jason Szumlanski  wrote: 

I'm seeing a lot of pictures of LiPO battery systems and people are mounting equipment above them like load centers, inverters with disconnects, and other serviceable enclosures. Some of these battery systems are 24 inches deep or more. This seems to violate NEC 110.26 requirements for the other serviceable equipment, but the pictures are proudly displayed as models of success. Even slender Tesla Powerwalls stick out significantly when stacked 2 or 3 deep and would be more than 6 inches deeper than a standard load center. Sure, the battery cabinets make great places to rest tools while working, but does anyone else see this as problematic?  

Jason Szumlanski 
Florida Solar Design Group  ___

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Re: [RE-wrenches] MLSD module level shutdown

2021-01-30 Thread drake . chamberlin

Is MLSD required in Europe or other parts of the world? What is their 
track record for safety?


---
On 2021-01-29 14:09, s...@ecologicalsystems.biz wrote:

So far the module level shutdown requirements have been a real blow to
our industry. The reliability and cost from a maintenance and
installation standpoint has been very hit or miss so far. It feels
like this requirement was rolled out far too quickly without enough
forethought to its impact on the industry. We are constantly going out
and fixing problems with mlsd installed by other contractors.
Thankfully the problems have nothing to do with the quality of the
installations. The problems are almost all due to premature failure of
the products or some inherent defect in them. This is a serious issue
costing the industry time and resources and making our installers less
safe. It just doesn’t really accomplish the intended goal of the
requirement.
I’m curious how other wrenches are dealing with this issue. I recently
became aware of fixMLSD.com which appears to be focused on bringing a
more sensible approach to this requirement.

Your thoughts are appreciated,
Sky Sims
Https://EcologicalSystems.biz
“Just An Old Wrench”
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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA Load Shedding Contactor 100A, 2P

2021-01-22 Thread drake . chamberlin

Use series resistors around the coil. 


---

On 2021-01-21 13:59, Jason Szumlanski wrote:

I just learned from the manufacturer that the mercury displacement relay's coil is rated for 43.2 to 52.80V. Obviously, the battery voltage can exceed 52.8 pretty significantly. Does the Sunny Island regulate the output voltage on this relay to 48V or is the actual battery voltage passed through on this terminal? 

The more I read about this load shedding strategy, the more it seems overly complicated. It's also another thing to fail. If the N.O. contactor coil fails, the loads to the house are going to lose power. That's not good for a remote installation. I guess you have to weigh battery protection with how critical the loads are. 

I'm wondering why the internal Battery Preservation Mode isn't sufficient enough. What's the purpose of load shedding if the BPM does effectively the same thing. I can see perhaps shedding some parts of the load and that is a nice feature, but to protect the batteries, why isn't BPM enough? 

Jason 

On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 8:48 PM Mac Lewis  wrote: 
Hi Jason, 

I have done this with mercury displacement relays: 
https://www.mdius.com/mercury-relays/two-pole-relays-contactors/two-pole-100-amp [1] 

They do have a 100A 2P 48V coil relay.  They seem to work perfectly. 

Good luck 

On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 2:51 PM Jason Szumlanski  wrote: 
Does anyone know where I can get a load shedding contactor described in SMA documentation for use with a multi-function relay in a Sunny Island? 

Thanks, 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] SMA Load Shedding Contactor 100A, 2P

2021-01-20 Thread drake . chamberlin


The mercury displacement relays are very robust. They do have a lead
warning.  


---

On 2021-01-19 20:48, Mac Lewis wrote:

Hi Jason, 

I have done this with mercury displacement relays: 
https://www.mdius.com/mercury-relays/two-pole-relays-contactors/two-pole-100-amp 

They do have a 100A 2P 48V coil relay.  They seem to work perfectly. 

Good luck 

On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 2:51 PM Jason Szumlanski  wrote: 

Does anyone know where I can get a load shedding contactor described in SMA documentation for use with a multi-function relay in a Sunny Island? 

Thanks, 


Jason Szumlanski  ___
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Charges 1 hour per calendar day

2021-01-09 Thread drake . chamberlin


Jay,

The generator is manual start.

Drake

---


On 2021-01-08 15:39, Jay wrote:

Is it ags start and is it starting on volts or %, or load?


On Jan 8, 2021, at 1:10 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar 
 wrote:


You said both, it will go into absorb for an hour only and it will 
net go

into absorb. Which one please?

Is there an AGS?


Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On Fri, 08 Jan 2021 13:33:56 -0500, 
drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org

wrote:
Hello Wrenches,

An off grid, Radian / Mate 3 system we set up some years back has 
worked



flawlessly. The client is now reporting that his system will only go
into absorption charge for 1 hour per calendar day. The setting was
previously to absorb for 2 hours.

He has tried shutting off the generator and then restarting. The
inverter will connect, but not go into absorb.

During this cloudy period, he is only able to get the batteries to 
about



80 percent before he needs to leave the site for a week or so.

I finally go through to Outback, and they think it is a Firmware
problem. As it is a long drive out, it seems worth while to run it by
the list. Does FW this seem like the issue?

Thank you,

Drake

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Radian Charges 1 hour per calendar day

2021-01-08 Thread drake . chamberlin

It will initially go into absorb, but only stay there for 1 hour. He has 
tried to get it back in absorb by shutting the generator off.


He turns the generator back on, and it doesn't trigger an absorb charge.

The system will only take a charge from the generator for 1 hour each 
calendar day.


---


On 2021-01-08 15:10, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar wrote:
You said both, it will go into absorb for an hour only and it will net 
go

into absorb. Which one please?

Is there an AGS?


Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On Fri, 08 Jan 2021 13:33:56 -0500, 
drake.chamber...@redwoodalliance.org

wrote:

Hello Wrenches,

An off grid, Radian / Mate 3 system we set up some years back has 
worked



flawlessly. The client is now reporting that his system will only go
into absorption charge for 1 hour per calendar day. The setting was
previously to absorb for 2 hours.

He has tried shutting off the generator and then restarting. The
inverter will connect, but not go into absorb.

During this cloudy period, he is only able to get the batteries to 
about



80 percent before he needs to leave the site for a week or so.

I finally go through to Outback, and they think it is a Firmware
problem. As it is a long drive out, it seems worth while to run it by
the list. Does FW this seem like the issue?

Thank you,

Drake

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[RE-wrenches] Radian Charges 1 hour per calendar day

2021-01-08 Thread drake . chamberlin


Hello Wrenches,

An off grid, Radian / Mate 3 system we set up some years back has worked 
flawlessly. The client is now reporting that his system will only go 
into absorption charge for 1 hour per calendar day. The setting was 
previously to absorb for 2 hours.


He has tried shutting off the generator and then restarting. The 
inverter will connect, but not go into absorb.


During this cloudy period, he is only able to get the batteries to about 
80 percent before he needs to leave the site for a week or so.


I finally go through to Outback, and they think it is a Firmware 
problem. As it is a long drive out, it seems worth while to run it by 
the list. Does FW this seem like the issue?


Thank you,

Drake

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[RE-wrenches] THD

2020-11-25 Thread drake . chamberlin




Hello Wrenches,

How much total harmonic distortion is acceptable for a generator feeding 
an inverter, house loads, etc. I'm looking at one that advertises less 
than 6%.


From what I've been able to find on the internet, inverter generators 
are 3 to 5%. Does this jive with your experience?


Does less than 6% seem like a good THD number?

Thank you,

Drake

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
athens-electric.com

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Re: [RE-wrenches] NEC 2020 - 705.12(B)(6)

2020-11-08 Thread drake . chamberlin

It depends on how many loads there are on the meter main besides the
feed-through. If the PV feed is coming from a point between the
distribution panel and the meter main, current will cancel out utility
power from the service drop.

If you had over 200 amps of branch circuit loads on the meter main, it
could be a problem with the feed coming from both directions.

---

On 2020-11-08 12:02, Jay wrote:

Hi Jason

My question is if it's 200a in from the main breaker and 100a from PV its 300 amps on the buss correct?

How is that ok with the 125% rule?

Or is this covered by some other rule as it's a feed through lug load center?

Jay

On Nov 8, 2020, at 9:46 AM, Jason Szumlanski
wrote:

Maybe this is a better example (attached). I don't see how this would be a problem under NEC 2014, 2017, or 2020. No portion of the main bus, feeder conductors, or subpanel could possibly be subjected to overcurrent without an OCPD stopping it.

My point is that here we are, 3 code cycles in since feeder taps were addressed, and there is still no clarification of intent. AHJs are still struggling with this.

I'm not sure where residential meter/mains with feed through lugs are popular. I know they are in Florida and I have heard Hawaii. I'm curious what your jurisdictions think of this if you have this scenario. Most of the time the subpanel is main lug only, but adding a main circuit breaker is usually an easy and cost-effective fix to make this interconnection type work.

Jason Szumlanski

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020 at 5:15 PM Jason Szumlanski wrote:

For further discussion, I don't see how my original scenario is any different from this attached scenario, which I think everyone would agree is allowed. All conductors and busbars are subject to the same potential loads and fault currents.
(Image attached).

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020 at 5:01 PM Jason Szumlanski wrote:

Of course the feeder conductors and bus bar could be subjected to a fault. But we're not talking about faults here. Fault protection is the job of the PV OCPD And primary supply OCPD to protect the downstream busbar and feeders. If that wasn't the case, you would need a new OCPD on BOTH the load and line side of a solar connection as a feeder tap, not just the load side.

If your interpretation is correct regarding the location of the OCPD, that sounds like a sub-feed breaker is the only way to comply, and I haven't seen such an animal for a typical residential load center. You can get these for NQ panelboards and similar panelboards from other manufacturers of course. It doesn't say as close as practicable or anything like that. It says that a busbar connection is allowed when there are feeder CONDUCTORS connected to feed through LUGS. What does "overcurrent device .. _at_ the supply end" mean? I emphasize "at." It's unclear how you would implement this other than a sub-feed breaker I suppose, but that's not what it says. It refers to feeder conductors on lugs on busbars, not feeder conductors on load-side terminals of an overcurrent device.

My point is that 705.12 should have been wrapped up neatly in a bow, but the lack of clarity, still, is astonishing. Why add a section about feed-through lugs if it's going to be so vague?

Jason

On Wed, Oct 28, 2020 at 3:37 PM Brian Mehalic wrote:
Hey Jason,
Here's the 2020 text:

6) Connections shall be permitted on busbars of panelboards that supply lugs connected to feed-through conductors. The feed-through conductors shall be sized in accordance with 705.12(B)(1). Where an overcurrent device is installed at the supply end of the feed-through conductors, the busbar in the supplying panelboard shall be permitted to be sized in accordance with 705.12(B)⁠(3)⁠(1) through 705.12(B)(3)(3).

The OCPD on the supply end of the feed-through conductors would be in the form of a sub-feed breaker at the point of supply to those conductors, re-establishing overcurrent protection of the conductors (likely at the same ampacity as the main breaker in the supplying panel. The feed-through conductors are basically an extension of the busbar in the supplying panel; they can either be protected by the main, or in the presence of multiple sources of power in the supplying panel (such as a backfed PV system breaker) they can be protected based on (B)(3)(1) - "the 125% rule" - or they can be protected by a new overcurrent device at their point of supply, in which case current on them is limited based on that OCPD size; in this latter scenario the busbar in the supplying panel is allowed to be sized based on one of (B)(3)(1) - (3) because it is protected downstream at its end.

The theory is pretty much the same as 705.12(B)(1) for feeders - when not connecting at the end of the feeder, use the "125% rule" or re-establish overcurrent protection for that portion of the feeder subject to multiple power sources.

In your drawing the 200 A feeder conductors, as well as the busbar below the PV system breaker, could

Re: [RE-wrenches] Supply side denial

2020-10-27 Thread drake . chamberlin


AEP Won't let us do a line side tap. We can tap into the line side and
install another service as permitted by the Rule of Six. I have used the
Eaton, 4 space breaker box with 2 spaces for the service disconnect and
2 for the PV connection. 


Supposedly you can use a main breaker retainer, according to Eaton tech
support, However, the box doesn't have holes for the screws, but you can
drill a hole in the box and get one screw in. It seems to hold the
breaker firmly.Some inspectors could have an issue with that. 

Other manufacturers may have better solutions. 


---

On 2020-10-27 18:27, Kristopher Schmid wrote:

Hi All, 

I have a utility that is hinting that they are going to deny my interconnection application with a supply side connection and require a load side.  Has anyone seen this before? 

(Proposed interconnection would be with Milbank step lugs in a 200 A socket and a 60 A fused disconnect within 10 feet.) 

If they refuse it, i am thinking that registering a complaint with the Wisconsin PSC may be appropriate. 

Kris 


Shine On!

Kris Schmid
Legacy Solar, LLC
137 West 1st Avenue
Luck, WI 54853
www.legacysolar.com [1]
715-653-4295
NABCEP Certified PV Installation Professional
Licensed Wisconsin Master Electrician
BSEE 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Enphase Raw Q Cable

2020-10-08 Thread Drake


Is there any reason we can't use sunlight resistant UF cable?

Drake Chamberlin
Athens Electric LLC
OH License 44810
NABCEP Certified Solar PV
740-448-7328
<http://athens-electric.com/>http://athens-electric.com/


At 12:08 PM 10/6/2020, Jason Szumlanski wrote:
Has anybody come up with a good wiring 
alternative to Raw Q Cable when making long runs 
along rails from a string to a junction box?Â


We are running into supply problems through 
distribution. I'm looking for something that might be more readily available.


Jason Szumlanski
Florida Solar Design Group
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