Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 Repeater
It's my understanding that the synthesizer is not programable outside of the 220-222 Mhz range, and that the harm. filter needs to be retuned first, as it will not pass signals above 222.000. DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I seen it once, I just lost the PDF and need to find it again. The first priority was going to be to run it in ACSSB in the 222 to 225 MHz region with 1.6MHz split instead of 220-222 1M. NB-FM would be the gravy. On 4/26/07, allan crites [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: DC, The model no. is ESP1000/ESP1000M and the master base station oscillator (MBSO) that operates at 10.275 MHz is contained in only one of the rack combination of up to 5 xmtrs. The manual is 1 1/2 thick and is very complex. I look forward to hearing how you expect to accomplish conversion onto NB-FM having not seen the manual. AC DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I always wanted to play with brute force hacking a SEA repeater onto NB-FM and into the ham band. Anyone remember what happend to the .PDF for the service manual and know anyone that has one to get rid of cheap? I would like the version that has the master reference oscillator but I cannot even remember the model number at the moment.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 Repeater
DCFluX, From what I saw the xmtr VCO (as is the rcvr VCO) is phase locked to the synth. which uses the 10.235 MHz reference. The xmtr VCO operates 10.235 MHz above the carrier freq. ( 220.005 + 10.235 = 230.240 MHz). The xmtr VCO output is mixed in a DBM with the 10.235 MHz ref. to get the output freq. If the VCO was mixed in the DBM with another freq. not the ref. freq. (ie. 230.240 - 224.005 = 6.235 MHz) then the xmtr would operate 224.005 to 225.000 MHz. You would then need to freq. ( or phase ) modulate the difference freq.( ie. the 6.235 osc.) at the desired deviation ( +- 5.000 KHz ) for an FM output (good luck), or do a +- 5 KHz modulated PLL at 6.235 MHz (again good luck with your FM gravy ). Perhaps you could do +- 1 KHz FM of an xtal osc. at 1/6th of 6.235 MHz ( 1.0391667 MHz ) and use the 6th harm. to get the deviation needed (yuk). Don't forget the xmit audio processing is not the same in a ACSB xmtr as in an FM xmtr. The ACSB rcvr operates above the xmtr from 221.005 to 221.995 MHz so the programing of the rcvr for use in a rptr from 222 - 225 MHz would need to be different than the xmtr, high in low out vs. low in high out on 222 - 225 MHz. The rcvr IF is 10.235 MHz if I remember correctly. Here an outboard quad.detector on 10.235 MHz of some sort would be needed for recovery of the modulation, if the +- 5.0 KHz modulation deviation ever made it thru the rcvr IF +- 2.5 KHz xtal BPF. Allan Crites WA9ZZU DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I seen it once, I just lost the PDF and need to find it again. The first priority was going to be to run it in ACSSB in the 222 to 225 MHz region with 1.6MHz split instead of 220-222 1M. NB-FM would be the gravy. On 4/26/07, allan crites [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: DC, The model no. is ESP1000/ESP1000M and the master base station oscillator (MBSO) that operates at 10.275 MHz is contained in only one of the rack combination of up to 5 xmtrs. The manual is 1 1/2 thick and is very complex. I look forward to hearing how you expect to accomplish conversion onto NB-FM having not seen the manual. AC DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I always wanted to play with brute force hacking a SEA repeater onto NB-FM and into the ham band. Anyone remember what happend to the .PDF for the service manual and know anyone that has one to get rid of cheap? I would like the version that has the master reference oscillator but I cannot even remember the model number at the moment.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater Antenna Question
I have a friend who used just this combinatin and a splitter like you mentioned. The VHF repeater was a Mastr II with a Sinclair 202G duplexer and the UHF repeater was a Yaesu 7000 with the Yaesu duplexer. The combination worked just fine on 2 meters but the 440 repeater receiver was desensed when the 2 meter repeater was keyed. The 440 repeater seemed to work OK when the 2 meter repeater was not keyed. The 2 meter repeater outputs about 20 watts from the duplexer and the 440 repeater was operated at the 10 watt level. The range of the 2 meter repeater was far superior to what he had with only the 440 repeater connected directly to the antenna. He has now done away with the 440 repeater and operates the 2 meter repeater with a direct connection from the duplexer to the GP9 antenna and is very happy with the performance. 73 - Jim W5ZIT -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 12:12 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater Antenna Question I am not sure if we ever visited this question before, If we have sorry... Here is the story, I have a Comet Dual Band Antenna GP9 VHF/UHF, works for me and I like the quality and price. I have a UHF Repeater and soon to have a VHF Repeater at the same location. I have no more space or money to run the cable for another antenna, to the top. How could I run both repeaters off the same antenna, I have a wacom duplexer 4 can base type (not the cheap mobile kind) for one and the other is a Telewave VHF 4 can (same type but VHF). Is it possible? Could I use one of those splitters (450/150 mini duplexers) attached to both duplexers? Or would I need something else? This is probably simple I just am not sure? Thanks in advance? JA Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and industry-leading spam and email virus protection.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/26/2007 4:39:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cross band coupler Thanks that sounds like the ticket. Seems like the way to go JA How about a diplexer from Comet or Diamond? I looked into this recently for a similar application and couldn't tell the difference between the expensive Telewave crossband couplers and the dime-a-dozen amateur diplexers. The specs given for the diplexers even indicate about twice the isolation compared to the crossband couplers. While the designs appear to be different (tuned cavity vs. tuned circuit), I can't find any information that would indicate any pros or cons between the two in practice. Anybody? Both Comet and Diamond call their diplexers duplexers. I have no idea why. They get it right when they call their triplexers triplexers. I was thinking about going with a Diamond product (they at least have a metal housing) and swapping out any UHF connectors for N types. http://www.rfparts.com/diamond/Product_Catalog/plexers.html http://www.cometantenna.com/products.php?CatID=1famID=6childID=0
Re: [Repeater-Builder] GE MVS VHF Repeater?
At 4/26/2007 16:24, you wrote: Mobiles converted to repeater (duplex) operation are explicitly banned in many commercial site leases, due to lack of shielding and other problems. Be forewarned, if you're planning on building something for a modern commercial 2-way site. Around here, many commercial 2-way repeaters were converted mobiles. Bob NO6B
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
At 4/27/2007 06:34, you wrote: How about a diplexer from Comet or Diamond? I looked into this They work fine provided you use the model WITHOUT the pigtail leads, IOW all connectors must be directly on the diplexer. Use only coax with silver-plated braid (RG-214, 223, 142 or 400) or hardline to connect to it. Also be careful with how much power to run to it. My systems that use crossband diplexers all run relatively low power (no more than 30 watts); others have reported problems with component overheating failure at higher power levels. If you plan on running 100 watts through it you should test on the bench by running continuous higher power through it for several hours. Bob NO6B
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Controller SSC 836AA
Yes, the controller is in the Tait station. You may be right, it could be a Tone Remote board or something similar. Any idea where I can find more infromation about it? cheers, Andreas - 5B8AP --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jim B. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: anpap wrote: Hello all, Does anyone have a manual or information on an SSC 836AA repeater controller? It also has the following on the PCB: T-A2-1761-4 if it makes any difference... Was this in the Tait station you mentioned? I ask because I think this is not a repeater controller, but a tone or DC remote panel. SSC did make various remotes, not sure if they're still around or not. And I remember 836AA was one of their model numbers for either a tone or DC remote. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL
Re: [Repeater-Builder] GE MVS VHF Repeater?
This child of a brainstorm would be at my own QTH (way out in the sticks), and even then I've been considering it more as a educational/learning tool than anything else. What's the fun in doing anything if you don't learn something from it? One of those just to see if it can be done effectively and see if *I* can do it, before moving on to bigger projects. And if all the smoke was to fall out, I might be out a total of $50, but I'd know where NOT to stick the screwdriver next time. I have a pretty firm grasp of the how's and why's just not entirely sure where to start. On 4/27/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 4/26/2007 16:24, you wrote: Mobiles converted to repeater (duplex) operation are explicitly banned in many commercial site leases, due to lack of shielding and other problems. Be forewarned, if you're planning on building something for a modern commercial 2-way site. Around here, many commercial 2-way repeaters were converted mobiles. Bob NO6B -- -- Every electronic device is manufactured with smoke stored deep inside... only a true genius can find a way to set it free.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] GE MVS VHF Repeater?
In cases where I utilize two mobiles as a repeater, I filter them up the ying ying. 1. Duplexer BP/BR with at least 90db of isolation 2. Two additional BP cavities on the RX + Angle Linear Pre-Amp to help compensate 3. One additional BP cavity on the TX 4. Isolator + LP filter I believe in keeping it clean. I try my best not to give Hams a bad reputation. I know of a few sites which no longer allow Amateur Radio Repeaters, this due past ham occupants and their poor McGuyvering skills / technics. Just my two bits. Paul Metzger K6EH - On Apr 27, 2007, at 07:00, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 4/26/2007 16:24, you wrote: Mobiles converted to repeater (duplex) operation are explicitly banned in many commercial site leases, due to lack of shielding and other problems. Be forewarned, if you're planning on building something for a modern commercial 2-way site. Around here, many commercial 2-way repeaters were converted mobiles. Bob NO6B Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star
I was hoping that AOR would introduce an outboard modem that would plug into any 9600-capable rig, Micor/Mitrek and enable D-Star (and P25, for that matter...) that way. I tried to e-mail them at the support address on their website, and it bounced. There's no reason why such an approach shouldn't work. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 - Original Message - From: hwingate [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 7:47 AM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star I have often wondered just how diffucult it would to be to build a D-Star system around a Micor or M2. D-Star is mostly open protocol (except for the software which is propriatry to Icom), the AMBE vocoder chips are available from the manufacturer, and GMSK modem chips are also available. Seems like some smart experimenter (much smarter than me anyway),could build such a system and we would not be stuck with one vendor for D-Star systems. It would also have the bulletproof RF performance of the Micor or M2 radios.
[Repeater-Builder] GE mastr II repeater UHF
I will probably get in trouble for this. If anyone is in need of a mastr II UHF repeater, I have two to get rid of. Contact me off list. Jordan
[Repeater-Builder] Re: GE MVS VHF Repeater?
I have been using a MVS repeater in a commercial setting for several years and to date have had no problems. I'm using it consistantly at about 40% duty cycle. It does require 2 radios which are easily connected to each other. --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, dakaratcaptivereefing [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Okay so I'm sitting on a pair of 40w GE MVS radios, currently in service as Packet APRS digi's on 2m, but going to replace them with other radios here shortly... Rumor has it they are more than capable of being converted into making a pretty decent repeater. I have access to a couple more of these rigs if I want/need them as well. Guess what I'm looking for is this possible? Good/bad idea? If so where's a good place to start? This would be my first real repeater, so any and all input would be greatly appreciated. Dave N0TRQ -- Every electronic device is manufactured with smoke stored deep inside... only a true genius can find a way to set it free.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 Repeater
It seems like an error crept into my latest post which was written early in the morning. That error is in the incorrect frequency I used for the reference frequency. The correct reference frequency is 10.275 MHz. All references to the incorrect frequency of 10.235 MHz should be changed to read 10.275 MHz. I regret the error. Allan Crites WA9ZZU allan crites [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: DCFluX, From what I saw the xmtr VCO (as is the rcvr VCO) is phase locked to the synth. which uses the 10.235 MHz reference. The xmtr VCO operates 10.235 MHz above the carrier freq. ( 220.005 + 10.235 = 230.240 MHz). The xmtr VCO output is mixed in a DBM with the 10.235 MHz ref. to get the output freq. If the VCO was mixed in the DBM with another freq. not the ref. freq. (ie. 230.240 - 224.005 = 6.235 MHz) then the xmtr would operate 224.005 to 225.000 MHz. You would then need to freq. ( or phase ) modulate the difference freq.( ie. the 6.235 osc.) at the desired deviation ( +- 5.000 KHz ) for an FM output (good luck), or do a +- 5 KHz modulated PLL at 6.235 MHz (again good luck with your FM gravy ). Perhaps you could do +- 1 KHz FM of an xtal osc. at 1/6th of 6.235 MHz ( 1.0391667 MHz ) and use the 6th harm. to get the deviation needed (yuk). Don't forget the xmit audio processing is not the same in a ACSB xmtr as in an FM xmtr. The ACSB rcvr operates above the xmtr from 221.005 to 221.995 MHz so the programing of the rcvr for use in a rptr from 222 - 225 MHz would need to be different than the xmtr, high in low out vs. low in high out on 222 - 225 MHz. The rcvr IF is 10.235 MHz if I remember correctly. Here an outboard quad.detector on 10.235 MHz of some sort would be needed for recovery of the modulation, if the +- 5.0 KHz modulation deviation ever made it thru the rcvr IF +- 2.5 KHz xtal BPF. Allan Crites WA9ZZU DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I seen it once, I just lost the PDF and need to find it again. The first priority was going to be to run it in ACSSB in the 222 to 225 MHz region with 1.6MHz split instead of 220-222 1M. NB-FM would be the gravy. On 4/26/07, allan crites [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: DC, The model no. is ESP1000/ESP1000M and the master base station oscillator (MBSO) that operates at 10.275 MHz is contained in only one of the rack combination of up to 5 xmtrs. The manual is 1 1/2 thick and is very complex. I look forward to hearing how you expect to accomplish conversion onto NB-FM having not seen the manual. AC DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I always wanted to play with brute force hacking a SEA repeater onto NB-FM and into the ham band. Anyone remember what happend to the .PDF for the ! service manual and know anyone that has one to get rid of cheap? I would like the version that has the master reference oscillator but I cannot even remember the model number at the moment.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
At 06:34 AM 4/27/2007, you wrote: How about a diplexer from Comet or Diamond? I looked into this recently for a similar application and couldn't tell the difference between the expensive Telewave crossband couplers and the dime-a-dozen amateur diplexers. ---I'm using a Diamond one on one of my systems but one without the pigtails (don't want leaky coax do we?!). Just make sure whichever one you get can handle the COMBINED power on both ports. I have used it quite successfully for the past 5 years on a 90 watt UHF repeater with a 60 watt 2 meter remote base. Ken -- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of the world famous RC210 Repeater Controller and accessories. http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/ Coming soon - the most advanced repeater controller EVER. Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and we offer complete repeater packages! AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Manuals FS
Jim, I am very interested in the following manuals. Please contact me directly ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) if they are still available. Your message posting clipped your email address, so I couldn't respond directly. Standard RPTS-LMR-1 90 watt ?UHF/FM Repeater System Owner's Operating and Maintenance Manual Standard DPX-1B/3B UHF Duplexers Instruction Manual Standard MTP-4B Multiple Tone Panel Inst. Manual Standard RPT-20 UHF/FM Repeater Owner's Operating and Maintenance Manual Thank-you. vern --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jim, K8COP [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have the following used manuals for sale: snip As far as I can tell they are complete. All manuals are $10.00 each. Shipping via USPS flat-rate shipping. e-mail me at: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks, Jim, K8COP
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star
You'd absolutely, ABSOLUTELY limit the energy you emit (the frequency converted input signal) to fit within the allowable channel you're repeater/transponder is coordinated. That's no different with the FM brand of repeater. You're responsible for your output. The IF is where you'd probably want to limit the frequency excursions of the input signal. We do that now. If the user's off frequency, part of their energy is clipped off by the filtering of the IF bandpass. As to the ID, MCW should suffice. I don't see any requirement that you must ID in the mode your delivering. Otherwise you'd be required to have a voice ID for a FM voice repeater and not CW. I hope no one minds this thread. I'm finding it fun and a good discussion of the merits/problems with doing something a little different. 73 Rod Nate Duehr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 4/26/07, Rod Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: go through unimpeded ( and undistorted.) One possible minor down side is that the user's radio needs to be somewhat on-frequency. If they come in 1 KHz low, they go out 1 KHz low. In theory, it's not the repeater owner's problem, but can be noticed on the output. Numerous issues there... If they're off-frequency, so is your repeater... and your repeater is only coordinated ON-frequency. This would be a bigger deal in areas (like mine) if you were on VHF with 15 KHz channel-spacing, for example... letting your linear transponder repeater doing digital traffic splatter all over your neighbor's analog output isn't going to win many friends. If they're over-deviating... same thing... unless you brick-wall limit them and cause the waveform to clip, making it useless... but at least they'd know their radio was Foo-BAR'ed up... Etc. Etc. Etc. There be dragons here. I don't think it's good engineering practice to put the end-users that much in charge of the signal you're putting out with your callsign on it. That would be another interesting thing... how to ID it properly... digital? CW? That one's easier than the others... but still a headache. (Come to think of it, now I want to go read the regs on satellite ID's... heh... hmmm... How does that work? The beacon? What if it's off, but the transponder's still on? Interesting campfire question for AMSAT friends... please answer off-list if you're tempted... ha... not here, unless we're going to start discussing linear ORBITING transponders as a form of repeater... GRIN...) Nate WY0X p.s. Want to drive people crazy? Hack up the code in your digital radio to understand received traffic that's been INVERTED by an inverting linear transponder... LOL... no encryption, just mega-geekiness...
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
At 06:34 AM 4/27/2007, you wrote: I was thinking about going with a Diamond product (they at least have a metal housing) and swapping out any UHF connectors for N types. As has been previously discussed here - the problems regarding PL259's have been greatly exaggerated and they will work just fine at UHF if properly installed. But if you sleep better at night using N's, knock yourself out! :-) Ken -- President and CTO - Arcom Communications Makers of the world famous RC210 Repeater Controller and accessories. http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/ Coming soon - the most advanced repeater controller EVER. Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and we offer complete repeater packages! AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000 http://www.irlp.net
Re: [Repeater-Builder] 220 Repeater
Ok, This is going to be a brute force hack. For the moment the game plan is to replace the microcontroller with one that is running special software. If I remember right that thing had 200 channels, spaced 5kHz. So we will need a look-up table to translate the channels to the frequencies. 222.10 -222.15 would have space for 10 channels with 5kHz spacing. According to the band plan I found they are ment for CW and SSB and it looks like 223.7 to 223.75 is clear as well. Some research will have to be done as well to determine if ACSSB uses upper or lower side band and how much bandwidth it will take to fine tune that plan, 10 channels may become 8 or 9. Then the rest would be dedicated into the normal 223.76 to 224.98 20kHz band plan. For conversion to NBFM I will know more once I see some prints, but at the moment I am thinking to run a Repeater-Builder (tm) AP-50 or some thing else with the audio AC coupled into the transmit VCO. That will leave some debate over what to do with the difference oscillator. Either shut it down and run the VCO in the 222-225 range, or leave it run but with no modulation. Probably the latter which would failitate flipping a switch to go between FM and ACSSB. Receiver is going to be a bit more complex and I will know more when I see a schematic, but if nothing else I will design an IF strip based on the SA-604 to go in there. So it will become a single conversion receiver. I will also need to determine the IF frequency the receiver is using. Hopefully we can tap RF somewhere to make use of off shelf crystal lattice filters.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star
There's one reason- they would have to purchase rights to the voice decoder designs from DVSI. D-Star is still young so other manufacturers may eventually jump on board once they convince themselves that the upfront engineering and intellectual costs will be worthwhile. By the way, as if there were not already enough digital voice protocols on the market Icom and Kenwood have teamed up and produced another protocol that they are offering through their respective land/mobile lines. This new unnamed digital voice protocol is said to meet the FCC's 6.25Khz emission mask requirements for narrowband ops. We'll see what happens. Gary George Henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was hoping that AOR would introduce an outboard modem that would plug into any 9600-capable rig, Micor/Mitrek and enable D-Star (and P25, for that matter...) that way. I tried to e-mail them at the support address on their website, and it bounced. There's no reason why such an approach shouldn't work. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
Re: [Repeater-Builder] GE MVS VHF Repeater?
Go for it just run it a about half rated power and put a fan on it. We have been using mobile radios in repeater service for years with few failures. Syntor X radios are my favorite to use as transmitters on VHF you can run them at 80 watts with fans. tom n8ies - Original Message - From: Dave Cochran To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: 4/27/2007 10:44:26 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] GE MVS VHF Repeater? This child of a brainstorm would be at my own QTH (way out in the sticks), and even then I've been considering it more as a educational/learning tool than anything else. What's the fun in doing anything if you don't learn something from it? One of those just to see if it can be done effectively and see if *I* can do it, before moving on to bigger projects. And if all the smoke was to fall out, I might be out a total of $50, but I'd know where NOT to stick the screwdriver next time. I have a pretty firm grasp of the how's and why's just not entirely sure where to start. On 4/27/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 4/26/2007 16:24, you wrote: Mobiles converted to repeater (duplex) operation are explicitly banned in many commercial site leases, due to lack of shielding and other problems. Be forewarned, if you're planning on building something for a modern commercial 2-way site. Around here, many commercial 2-way repeaters were converted mobiles. Bob NO6B -- -- Every electronic device is manufactured with smoke stored deep inside... only a true genius can find a way to set it free.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
I don't think any of them have cavities in them. I would suspect that the telewave is built very similar to the diamond etc. Mostly lumped circuit tuning (capacitor and coils) and maybe some 1/4 wave stub tuned coax rolled up inside. For a long time most commercial manufactures like telewave Sinclair etc. stayed away from cross band couplers between 150 and 450 bands but readily did it between 800 and 450 or 800 and 150. The problem with 150 and 450 is that they are harmonically related. A quarter wave length cavity on 150 is a three quarter wave length cavity on 450. A three quarter wave cavity resonates just as well at three quarter wave as it does at a quarter wave but of course has more selectivity as a three quarter wave. Most of the better transmitter combiners for 800 and 900 MHz used three quarter wave length cavities in them. Most of the cross band couplers use capacitors and inductors to form low and high pass filters to get around the 3rd resonance mode of cavities. Cross band couplers open the door for intermode problems as those 3rd harmonics are not attenuated all that much in the couplers. They do work but sometimes may cause problems. DUPLEXER / DIPLEXER A duplexer and diplexer are very similar. A diplexer is what it is usually called when two transmitters are combined together. If a transmitter and receiver are combined then it is called a duplexer. The cross band couplers I suppose could be called either as they do combine two transmitters but they also combine two receivers and allow duplex operation. You could have a 450 receiver working at the same time as a 150 transmitter so that would be a duplex situation. Maybe they should be called duo-duplexers. :) 73 Gary K4FMX -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of crackedofn0de Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 9:34 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/26/2007 4:39:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cross band coupler Thanks that sounds like the ticket. Seems like the way to go JA How about a diplexer from Comet or Diamond? I looked into this recently for a similar application and couldn't tell the difference between the expensive Telewave crossband couplers and the dime-a-dozen amateur diplexers. The specs given for the diplexers even indicate about twice the isolation compared to the crossband couplers. While the designs appear to be different (tuned cavity vs. tuned circuit), I can't find any information that would indicate any pros or cons between the two in practice. Anybody? Both Comet and Diamond call their diplexers duplexers. I have no idea why. They get it right when they call their triplexers triplexers. I was thinking about going with a Diamond product (they at least have a metal housing) and swapping out any UHF connectors for N types. http://www.rfparts.com/diamond/Product_Catalog/plexers.html http://www.cometantenna.com/products.php?CatID=1famID=6childID=0 Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]: At 4/27/2007 06:34, you wrote: How about a diplexer from Comet or Diamond? I looked into this They work fine provided you use the model WITHOUT the pigtail leads, IOW all connectors must be directly on the diplexer. Use only coax with silver-plated braid (RG-214, 223, 142 or 400) or hardline to connect to it. Also be careful with how much power to run to it. My systems that use crossband diplexers all run relatively low power (no more than 30 watts); others have reported problems with component overheating failure at higher power levels. If you plan on running 100 watts through it you should test on the bench by running continuous higher power through it for several hours. Bob NO6B About a year ago we diplexed a Daniels VHF repeater (30 watts) with a GE master UHF repeater (15 watts) into a Sinclair 210 C4. Install went well and worked good with reasonable antenna paterns. Recently we upgraded the UHF repeater to another Daniels (25 watts). The new repeater did not like the diplexer. The TX went into SWR shutdown and was not happy at all. Solution was to install a UHF 4 pole without the diplexer and life became good. We are not sure if we were being had or not, but we now are sucpicious of diplexers. I guess we did not re invent the wheel. Roger VA7RS
Re: [Repeater-Builder] GE MVS VHF Repeater?
On 4/27/07, Dave Cochran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This child of a brainstorm would be at my own QTH (way out in the sticks), and even then I've been considering it more as a educational/learning tool than anything else. What's the fun in doing anything if you don't learn something from it? Yup, sounds like a great project. One of those just to see if it can be done effectively and see if *I* can do it, before moving on to bigger projects. And if all the smoke was to fall out, I might be out a total of $50, but I'd know where NOT to stick the screwdriver next time. It'll cost a lot more than $50 when you're all done! (GRIN) I have a pretty firm grasp of the how's and why's just not entirely sure where to start. You've got the right idea... just eat the Elephant one bite at a time. Great folks here who will help! Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
Most of the radio circuits that i remotely test and we (Verizon) engineer are 0, -16 circuits, meaning that the from the telecom interface we are looking for a 0db signal on the transmit side, and when it gets to the other end at the interface card at the station the signal will be -16 db. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 26, 2007, at 10:40 PM, allan crites wrote: Tim, The ATT spec for line loss from the sending end to the central office is 9 +- 1 dB and from the central office to the receiving end is 9 +- 1 dB. So your total loss will be 18 +- 2 dB. I need to find my tone remote manual to get the answers to your other questions. WA9ZZU Steve Bosshard (NU5D) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe 16 db would be terribly excessive loss for a line - maybe 6 db tops. I usually set -10 dbm @ 1000 hz for +/- 3 khz deviation. ). 0 dBm for max deviation. and let the tone levels fall into place as you have indicated. If the line measures 6 db of loss @ 1000 hz, you may want to move the hold tone from -20 dBm to -17 or -14 dBm and the remainder accordingly. Also loss may vary with tone frequency, so loss at 1000 hz may be far different from loss at 2175 hz. Best luck, Steve NU5D On 4/26/07, tim_shephard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm working with a GE repeater, Master II. Its tone remoted. It is setup and working, but I'd like to know how to set the tone remote -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star
They're already using a DVSI AMBE vocoder in their HF digital voice modems. it's certainly not a large leap from there to D-Star. SOMEONE will do it soon enough... I just figured AOR might be the first, since they already have at least part of a foot in the door. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Apr 27, 2007 10:35 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star There's one reason- they would have to purchase rights to the voice decoder designs from DVSI. D-Star is still young so other manufacturers may eventually jump on board once they convince themselves that the upfront engineering and intellectual costs will be worthwhile. By the way, as if there were not already enough digital voice protocols on the market Icom and Kenwood have teamed up and produced another protocol that they are offering through their respective land/mobile lines. This new unnamed digital voice protocol is said to meet the FCC's 6.25Khz emission mask requirements for narrowband ops. We'll see what happens. Gary George Henry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was hoping that AOR would introduce an outboard modem that would plug into any 9600-capable rig, Micor/Mitrek and enable D-Star (and P25, for that matter...) that way. I tried to e-mail them at the support address on their website, and it bounced. There's no reason why such an approach shouldn't work. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
[Repeater-Builder] Stationmaster Disassembly
Folks, We took down the 220 MHz Phelps Dodge Model 200 Stationmaster off our tower to see if it can be rescued. There is no gel-coat left on it at all. I got the three screws around the perimiter of the mounting tube (aluminum) out, I found a stainless set screw in the copper tip. I also found three 7/16 hex head bolts around the perimiter of the RF connector. It appears that there is some sort of rubber bladder inside the mounting tube as well. Any clues, tips, ideas or suggestions so we can see what the internals look like before we go to the trouble of re-gelling it? Thanks Steve - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater Antenna Question
i have used two variations for diplexers, the Austin diplexers or even the triplexer has worked for me with great results. The next would be a DCI diplexer/ pass filters , their 2m/440 unit is very good / low insertion loss and the sharp filters help in keeping the intermod out.. Rich jhccradio wrote: I am not sure if we ever visited this question before, If we have sorry... Here is the story, I have a Comet Dual Band Antenna GP9 VHF/UHF, works for me and I like the quality and price. I have a UHF Repeater and soon to have a VHF Repeater at the same location. I have no more space or money to run the cable for another antenna, to the top. How could I run both repeaters off the same antenna, I have a wacom duplexer 4 can base type (not the cheap mobile kind) for one and the other is a Telewave VHF 4 can (same type but VHF). Is it possible? Could I use one of those splitters (450/150 mini duplexers) attached to both duplexers? Or would I need something else? This is probably simple I just am not sure? Thanks in advance? JA Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Wanted: SEA ESP1000 Service Manual
I was hoping someone had a link or could send me a copy of the service manual PDF for said repeater. SEA's official responce is: Sorry, no manuals available for the ESP1000 from SEA, on either pdf or printed copies. Best regards, Seems like very poor technical support.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star
You'll have to check with AOR on that one. For all we know whatever contract they may have with DVSI may be specific to the modem. I figured two years ago when they introduced the AR-ONE that they would include some decoders, or an expansion port for an option card, or maybe even trunking but no joy. It seems almost no communications receiver manufacturer wants to make the leap and start offering scanner features in their comm receivers. I know, the Wulfbergs do but even I won't spend that much at this time. If I see Taka (from AOR-USA) at Dayton I try to speak with him about this issue. Gary George Henry wrote: They're already using a DVSI AMBE vocoder in their HF digital voice modems. it's certainly not a large leap from there to D-Star. SOMEONE will do it soon enough... I just figured AOR might be the first, since they already have at least part of a foot in the door. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeating D-Star
I don't think you will be able to just plug binary data into a radio transmitter unless there is a made for the purpose FSK input for binary data that would support the DSTAR data rate. Steve On 4/27/07, Gary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You'll have to check with AOR on that one. For all we know whatever contract they may have with DVSI may be specific to the modem. I figured two years ago when they introduced the AR-ONE that they would include some decoders, or an expansion port for an option card, or maybe even trunking but no joy. It seems almost no communications receiver manufacturer wants to make the leap and start offering scanner features in their comm receivers. I know, the Wulfbergs do but even I won't spend that much at this time. If I see Taka (from AOR-USA) at Dayton I try to speak with him about this issue. Gary George Henry wrote: They're already using a DVSI AMBE vocoder in their HF digital voice modems. it's certainly not a large leap from there to D-Star. SOMEONE will do it soon enough... I just figured AOR might be the first, since they already have at least part of a foot in the door. George, KA3HSW / WQGJ413 Yahoo! Groups Links -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Tone remote setting question
Pretty much what we were trying to blow down Pac-Bell's lines in the heyday of tone and dry pairs. The problem was how excessive distances would not perform 100% in critical services even though the telco lines were in spec. Tone Remote lines are where I learned about/how the original analog (silver box) Motorola Tone Decoders (with lumped LC circuits) would easily out perform the Vega solid state (using op amps). A clearly demonstrated example of how active circuits were not an improvement over the original lumped analog design. One unforgiving telephone line into a lower spec or dynamic range tone decoder is enough to make a system problematic... ie the customer not happy or angry. cheers, skipp Dan Blasberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most of the radio circuits that i remotely test and we (Verizon) engineer are 0, -16 circuits, meaning that the from the telecom interface we are looking for a 0db signal on the transmit side, and when it gets to the other end at the interface card at the station the signal will be -16 db. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 26, 2007, at 10:40 PM, allan crites wrote: Tim, The ATT spec for line loss from the sending end to the central office is 9 +- 1 dB and from the central office to the receiving end is 9 +- 1 dB. So your total loss will be 18 +- 2 dB. I need to find my tone remote manual to get the answers to your other questions. WA9ZZU Steve Bosshard (NU5D) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe 16 db would be terribly excessive loss for a line - maybe 6 db tops. I usually set -10 dbm @ 1000 hz for +/- 3 khz deviation. ). 0 dBm for max deviation. and let the tone levels fall into place as you have indicated. If the line measures 6 db of loss @ 1000 hz, you may want to move the hold tone from -20 dBm to -17 or -14 dBm and the remainder accordingly. Also loss may vary with tone frequency, so loss at 1000 hz may be far different from loss at 2175 hz. Best luck, Steve NU5D On 4/26/07, tim_shephard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm working with a GE repeater, Master II. Its tone remoted. It is setup and working, but I'd like to know how to set the tone remote -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Wanted: SEA ESP1000 Service Manual
Scratch that, got the manual. Anyone have a repeater they want to get rid of fairly cheap?
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and wont have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Dan Blasberg Most of the radio circuits that i remotely test and we (Verizon) engineer are 0, -16 circuits, meaning that the from the telecom interface we are looking for a 0db signal on the transmit side, and when it gets to the other end at the interface card at the station the signal will be -16 db. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 26, 2007, at 10:40 PM, allan crites wrote: Tim, The ATT spec for line loss from the sending end to the central office is 9 +- 1 dB and from the central office to the receiving end is 9 +- 1 dB. So your total loss will be 18 +- 2 dB. I need to find my tone remote manual to get the answers to your other questions. WA9ZZU Steve Bosshard (NU5D) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe 16 db would be terribly excessive loss for a line - maybe 6 db tops. I usually set -10 dbm @ 1000 hz for +/- 3 khz deviation. ). 0 dBm for max deviation. and let the tone levels fall into place as you have indicated. If the line measures 6 db of loss @ 1000 hz, you may want to move the hold tone from -20 dBm to -17 or -14 dBm and the remainder accordingly. Also loss may vary with tone frequency, so loss at 1000 hz may be far different from loss at 2175 hz. Best luck, Steve NU5D On 4/26/07, tim_shephard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm working with a GE repeater, Master II. Its tone remoted. It is setup and working, but I'd like to know how to set the tone remote -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
Sorry - I believe it also needs to be able to measure the frequency of the audio tone on the line... Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of N9WYS My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and wont have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Dan Blasberg Most of the radio circuits that i remotely test and we (Verizon) engineer are 0, -16 circuits, meaning that the from the telecom interface we are looking for a 0db signal on the transmit side, and when it gets to the other end at the interface card at the station the signal will be -16 db. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 26, 2007, at 10:40 PM, allan crites wrote: Tim, The ATT spec for line loss from the sending end to the central office is 9 +- 1 dB and from the central office to the receiving end is 9 +- 1 dB. So your total loss will be 18 +- 2 dB. I need to find my tone remote manual to get the answers to your other questions. WA9ZZU Steve Bosshard (NU5D) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe 16 db would be terribly excessive loss for a line - maybe 6 db tops. I usually set -10 dbm @ 1000 hz for +/- 3 khz deviation. ). 0 dBm for max deviation. and let the tone levels fall into place as you have indicated. If the line measures 6 db of loss @ 1000 hz, you may want to move the hold tone from -20 dBm to -17 or -14 dBm and the remainder accordingly. Also loss may vary with tone frequency, so loss at 1000 hz may be far different from loss at 2175 hz. Best luck, Steve NU5D On 4/26/07, tim_shephard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm working with a GE repeater, Master II. Its tone remoted. It is setup and working, but I'd like to know how to set the tone remote -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars Yahoo! Groups Links -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.463 / Virus Database: 269.6.1/777 - Release Date: 4/26/2007 3:23 PM
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Wanted: SEA ESP1000 Service Manual
Matt, I have one ESP1000 repeater that is untested, no accessories. Contact me off-list. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 4:54 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Wanted: SEA ESP1000 Service Manual Scratch that, got the manual. Anyone have a repeater they want to get rid of fairly cheap?
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Wanted: SEA ESP1000 Service Manual
A year or so ago, I contacted SEA for the ESP1000 service manual, and was advised that it was available for purchase on CD-ROM for $50. I decided to forgo getting the manual because I didn't think it was economically possible to convert the ACSSB radios (there are two mobile radios inside the repeater enclosure) to FM. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of DCFluX Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 3:57 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Wanted: SEA ESP1000 Service Manual I was hoping someone had a link or could send me a copy of the service manual PDF for said repeater. SEA's official response is: Sorry, no manuals available for the ESP1000 from SEA, on either pdf or printed copies. Best regards, Seems like very poor technical support.
[Repeater-Builder] Help me in selecting a GMRS repeater antenna
Anyone have any suggestions on an antenna for GMRS repeater use. This repeater will be at my residence and the antenna will be mounted on a 5-foot tripod on the roof. I have a DB-420 and was successful in getting it mounted, but I felt it was just slightly too heavy. I was afraid it would come down in a strong wind. Can I use just the top section of the DB-420 without changing the phasing harness? If not, can someone please suggest a decent antenna? Antenna tripod mount is at about the 40-foot level and height really does not matter. I have a $500 antenna budget. Thanks Preston Moore __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Repeater Antenna Question
Hi: I use a JWX Dutch built diplexer, works great.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Help me in selecting a GMRS repeater antenna
Rather than doing that, I'd stay with the tri-pod, but reinforce it... Use 3/8 (or heavier) threaded rod to go through the roof deck itself, and extend down enough to go through a 2x4 which is placed across several roof rafters. The 2x4 will cause any strain on the tower to be distributed across several roof rafters rather than at a single point. Do this for all legs of the tower. I used a quad beam antenna and rotor mounted on a three-leg tower on the roof of my dad's garage 30+ years ago - back in my 11-meter days - and I never lost the antenna or tower due to high winds. I drilled through the single rafter that the one leg mounted above to allow for the cross-beam. The other two legs fell between rafters... Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Preston Moore Anyone have any suggestions on an antenna for GMRS repeater use. This repeater will be at my residence and the antenna will be mounted on a 5-foot tripod on the roof. I have a DB-420 and was successful in getting it mounted, but I felt it was just slightly too heavy. I was afraid it would come down in a strong wind. Can I use just the top section of the DB-420 without changing the phasing harness? If not, can someone please suggest a decent antenna? Antenna tripod mount is at about the 40-foot level and height really does not matter. I have a $500 antenna budget. Thanks Preston Moore
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
I use a TIMS Meter - transmission impairment measuring system - Halcyon, Convex, NT, even Helper Instruments made a nice $300 box for basic testing. Steve NU5D On 4/27/07, N9WYS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and won't have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
That's what I'm looking for!! Thanks, Steve! Mark - N9WYS _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Steve Bosshard (NU5D) I use a TIMS Meter - transmission impairment measuring system - Halcyon, Convex, NT, even Helper Instruments made a nice $300 box for basic testing. Steve NU5D On 4/27/07, N9WYS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and won't have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Stationmaster Disassembly
I had to take a large propane torch to the the of mine just last week in order to get it apart. Paul Metzger K6EH --- On Apr 27, 2007, at 12:54, Steve Hutzley wrote: Folks, We took down the 220 MHz Phelps Dodge Model 200 Stationmaster off our tower to see if it can be rescued. There is no gel-coat left on it at all. I got the three screws around the perimiter of the mounting tube (aluminum) out, I found a stainless set screw in the copper tip. I also found three 7/16 hex head bolts around the perimiter of the RF connector. It appears that there is some sort of rubber bladder inside the mounting tube as well. Any clues, tips, ideas or suggestions so we can see what the internals look like before we go to the trouble of re-gelling it? Thanks Steve Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Help me in selecting a GMRS repeater antenna
well I have been using DB 420 for years and they are about the best you can get. mount your mount for the wind load for your $500 and you will be better off. Also I don't think 1/2 the 420 would work like it is make. John - Original Message - From: Preston Moore To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 5:42 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Help me in selecting a GMRS repeater antenna Anyone have any suggestions on an antenna for GMRS repeater use. This repeater will be at my residence and the antenna will be mounted on a 5-foot tripod on the roof. I have a DB-420 and was successful in getting it mounted, but I felt it was just slightly too heavy. I was afraid it would come down in a strong wind. Can I use just the top section of the DB-420 without changing the phasing harness? If not, can someone please suggest a decent antenna? Antenna tripod mount is at about the 40-foot level and height really does not matter. I have a $500 antenna budget. Thanks Preston Moore __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Stationmaster Disassembly
I've restored radomes on several Stationmaster type antennas that have started to unravel by applying a generous coat of Wal Mart exterior latex semi-gloss white. Have held up for 5-6 years now in the Aridzona desert. 73 de Jack - N7OO - Original Message - From: Paul Metzger To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 6:58 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Stationmaster Disassembly I had to take a large propane torch to the the of mine just last week in order to get it apart. Paul Metzger K6EH --- On Apr 27, 2007, at 12:54, Steve Hutzley wrote: Folks, We took down the 220 MHz Phelps Dodge Model 200 Stationmaster off our tower to see if it can be rescued. There is no gel-coat left on it at all. I got the three screws around the perimiter of the mounting tube (aluminum) out, I found a stainless set screw in the copper tip. I also found three 7/16 hex head bolts around the perimiter of the RF connector. It appears that there is some sort of rubber bladder inside the mounting tube as well. Any clus, tips, ideas or suggestions so we can see what the internals look like before we go to the trouble of re-gelling it? Thanks Steve Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] msf 5000 900mhz id
The CW ID will only fire when the squelch is closed. You can't tell that unless you have a digital metering panel or RSS computer hooked up (for digital-capable stations), or go measure the squelch circuits. Tighten up BOTH the RCVR squelch and the RPTR squelch and see if that helps. The method varies according to the type of station control board. Also note that the CW ID is sent without PL/DPL, so if you are listening with a tone-coded squelch receiver, you may not hear it. The PA LEDs should come on, however. Bob M. == --- kc2kun [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a msf 5000 900mhz. Up on the air. THe machine been online for acouple of days. I cwid is set but it will not transmit. mike __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
The Fluke 187/189 series of digital multimeters will measure AC/DC volts, amps, dB, frequency, etc. A very nice accurate unit for around $300. It's not a comm test set, but it will definitely do all the measurements you'd need it to do for tone remote systems. Bob M. == --- N9WYS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's what I'm looking for!! Thanks, Steve! Mark - N9WYS _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Steve Bosshard (NU5D) I use a TIMS Meter - transmission impairment measuring system - Halcyon, Convex, NT, even Helper Instruments made a nice $300 box for basic testing. Steve NU5D On 4/27/07, N9WYS [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and won't have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
What you need to look for is a Transmission Impairment Measurement or TIM Set. HP made a nice one but i can't remember the number. There are several other manufactureres that make various units. Look for one that allows yuo to terminate as well as bridge the circuit. Short of that try to find a Helper Lineman. Good overall unit. Will measure levels/loss and generate preset tones. Milt N3LTQ - Original Message - From: N9WYS [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 8:08 PM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and won't have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Dan Blasberg Most of the radio circuits that i remotely test and we (Verizon) engineer are 0, -16 circuits, meaning that the from the telecom interface we are looking for a 0db signal on the transmit side, and when it gets to the other end at the interface card at the station the signal will be -16 db. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 26, 2007, at 10:40 PM, allan crites wrote: Tim, The ATT spec for line loss from the sending end to the central office is 9 +- 1 dB and from the central office to the receiving end is 9 +- 1 dB. So your total loss will be 18 +- 2 dB. I need to find my tone remote manual to get the answers to your other questions. WA9ZZU Steve Bosshard (NU5D) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe 16 db would be terribly excessive loss for a line - maybe 6 db tops. I usually set -10 dbm @ 1000 hz for +/- 3 khz deviation. ). 0 dBm for max deviation. and let the tone levels fall into place as you have indicated. If the line measures 6 db of loss @ 1000 hz, you may want to move the hold tone from -20 dBm to -17 or -14 dBm and the remainder accordingly. Also loss may vary with tone frequency, so loss at 1000 hz may be far different from loss at 2175 hz. Best luck, Steve NU5D On 4/26/07, tim_shephard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm working with a GE repeater, Master II. Its tone remoted. It is setup and working, but I'd like to know how to set the tone remote -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question
I have been building my own cross-band couplers for years. Two meters and 440 work fine as long as you stay away from harmonically related frequencies. My cross band coupler consists of a standard Tee section tuner for 440 with a series cap on the input, a shunt inductor, and a series cap on the output. The two caps are tuned for the best SWR on the input into the existing antenna system - even if there is some SWR. For two meters I use a series inductor, a shunt capacitor, and a series inductor. The two meter output inductor is connected in parallel with the 440 output cap, and again the two meter section is tuned for best SWR back to the two meter load. Tune the 440 section first, and you will find that the very small capacity on the output of the two meter section is no problem. Likewise, the inductor back to the two meter section poses no problem to the 440 output. Spreading or compressing the turns on the two meter coils will allow a good match when tuning the two meter capacitor. This system provides a two band to one band combiner, along with antenna matching for each band. The 440 section is hi pass while the two meter section is low pass, and each band is actually tuned to resonance Z matcher style. We operated a 440 repeater through one of these combiners to a GP-9 type antenna along with a two meter remote base. An MVP at 12 watts was the 440 repeater, and an Icom 22S was the remote base. It worked great with no interaction that we could tell. I added six meters to one of these couplers by simply putting a capacitor and inductor in series with no ground connection with the inductor connected to the output side of the combiner and had good operation on all three bands at the same time. The capacitor stator was connected to the six meter input. 73 - Jim W5ZIT -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 8:58 AM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question I don't think any of them have cavities in them. I would suspect that the telewave is built very similar to the diamond etc. Mostly lumped circuit tuning (capacitor and coils) and maybe some 1/4 wave stub tuned coax rolled up inside. For a long time most commercial manufactures like telewave Sinclair etc. stayed away from cross band couplers between 150 and 450 bands but readily did it between 800 and 450 or 800 and 150. The problem with 150 and 450 is that they are harmonically related. A quarter wave length cavity on 150 is a three quarter wave length cavity on 450. A three quarter wave cavity resonates just as well at three quarter wave as it does at a quarter wave but of course has more selectivity as a three quarter wave. Most of the better transmitter combiners for 800 and 900 MHz used three quarter wave length cavities in them. Most of the cross band couplers use capacitors and inductors to form low and high pass filters to get around the 3rd resonance mode of cavities. Cross band couplers open the door for intermode problems as those 3rd harmonics are not attenuated all that much in the couplers. They do work but sometimes may cause problems. DUPLEXER / DIPLEXER A duplexer and diplexer are very similar. A diplexer is what it is usually called when two transmitters are combined together. If a transmitter and receiver are combined then it is called a duplexer. The cross band couplers I suppose could be called either as they do combine two transmitters but they also combine two receivers and allow duplex operation. You could have a 450 receiver working at the same time as a 150 transmitter so that would be a duplex situation. Maybe they should be called duo-duplexers. :) 73 Gary K4FMX -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of crackedofn0de Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 9:34 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Repeater Antenna Question --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 4/26/2007 4:39:57 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: cross band coupler Thanks that sounds like the ticket. Seems like the way to go JA How about a diplexer from Comet or Diamond? I looked into this recently for a similar application and couldn't tell the difference between the expensive Telewave crossband couplers and the dime-a-dozen amateur diplexers. The specs given for the diplexers even indicate about twice the isolation compared to the crossband couplers. While the designs appear to be different (tuned cavity vs. tuned circuit), I can't find any information that would indicate any pros or cons between the two in practice. Anybody? Both Comet and Diamond call their diplexers duplexers. I have no idea why. They get it right when they call their triplexers triplexers. I was thinking about going with a Diamond product (they
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Tone remote setting question
Mark, You want to look for TIMS test set, with it you will be able to send and receive different tones at different levels and measure the levels as well. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 27, 2007, at 8:11 PM, N9WYS wrote: Sorry - I believe it also needs to be able to measure the frequency of the audio tone on the line... Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of N9WYS My helper told me that I need to start looking for test equipment - he's taking a different job and won’t have access to the equipment he does now. Inasmuch, what is the test meter called that you use to measure the signal level across/on phone lines? I'm told that I need one that measures in dB, I believe. Thanks! Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Dan Blasberg Most of the radio circuits that i remotely test and we (Verizon) engineer are 0, -16 circuits, meaning that the from the telecom interface we are looking for a 0db signal on the transmit side, and when it gets to the other end at the interface card at the station the signal will be -16 db. Dan KA8YPY On Apr 26, 2007, at 10:40 PM, allan crites wrote: Tim, The ATT spec for line loss from the sending end to the central office is 9 +- 1 dB and from the central office to the receiving end is 9 +- 1 dB. So your total loss will be 18 +- 2 dB. I need to find my tone remote manual to get the answers to your other questions. WA9ZZU Steve Bosshard (NU5D) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe 16 db would be terribly excessive loss for a line - maybe 6 db tops. I usually set -10 dbm @ 1000 hz for +/- 3 khz deviation. ). 0 dBm for max deviation. and let the tone levels fall into place as you have indicated. If the line measures 6 db of loss @ 1000 hz, you may want to move the hold tone from -20 dBm to -17 or -14 dBm and the remainder accordingly. Also loss may vary with tone frequency, so loss at 1000 hz may be far different from loss at 2175 hz. Best luck, Steve NU5D On 4/26/07, tim_shephard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm working with a GE repeater, Master II. Its tone remoted. It is setup and working, but I'd like to know how to set the tone remote -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars Yahoo! Groups Links -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.463 / Virus Database: 269.6.1/777 - Release Date: 4/26/2007 3:23 PM Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Tone remote setting question
Anyone know the answer to the original question. How do you make sure you have enough high level, function, and low level guard tones at the repeater input? The way I see it you have the keyer output into the phone line to make your initial adjustment. Then the repeater has a line input as well. Keyer Odbm - telco loss -16db - repeater in -16db - -Tim
