Re: VDQ finding dnf names

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 26 Mar 2024 15:31:30 -0400, Jon LaBadie wrote:

> On Tue, Mar 26, 2024 at 04:41:33PM -, I Beartooth wrote:

>>  It couldn't find brave, falcon, opera, nor vivaldi. VERY Dumb
>>Question : How do I look up what it calls them?
> 
> If you know the path to the browser, perhaps /usr/bin/opera, AND have
> the repo for it active, you could try the dnf command "provides".
> 
> $ dnf provides /usr/bin/opera

I tried "whatprovides" on her machine (and got nothing); is this a 
new version of it??
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Re: VDQ finding dnf names

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 26 Mar 2024 16:44:54 +, Barry wrote:

>> On 26 Mar 2024, at 16:42, Beartooth  wrote:
 
>>It couldn't find brave, falcon, opera, nor vivaldi. VERY Dumb
>> Question : How do I look up what it calls them?
> 
> I don’t think Fedora packages most of them.
> My guess is you downloaded them from the vendor site.
> And/or added repos to install and update them from.
> Have a look in /etc/yum.repos.d to see if there are obvious .repo files.

Sure enough, my own machine has (with apologies for formatting): 

btth@localhost:~$ cd /etc/yum.repos.d
btth@localhost:/etc/yum.repos.d$ ls
brave-browser-rpm-release.s3.brave.com_x86_64_.repo   google-chrome.repo
_copr:copr.fedorainfracloud.org:phracek:PyCharm.repo  opera.repo
_copr_phracek-PyCharm.repo.rpmsaverpmfusion-nonfree-
nvidia-driver.repo
fedora-cisco-openh264.reporpmfusion-nonfree-
nvidia-driver.repo.rpmnew
fedora.repo   rpmfusion-nonfree-
steam.repo
fedora-updates.repo   rpmfusion-nonfree-
steam.repo.rpmnew
fedora-updates-testing.repo   vivaldi.repo
btth@localhost:/etc/yum.repos.d$ 

So do I have to do it that way on her machine, too, one browser at 
a time? Or can I, say, sneakermail my file downstairs, add it into hers, 
and then do a single dnf install command?
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VDQ finding dnf names

[Beartooth]

I normally have two or three browsers open. Most have been 
installed for so long I no longer remember what dnf calls them. 

My wife, who also runs F39, has been having trouble with the ones 
she has, and I have yet to get around to trying to diagnose them. Today as 
a stopgap I tried to install some others for her, using dnf. 

It couldn't find brave, falcon, opera, nor vivaldi. VERY Dumb 
Question : How do I look up what it calls them?
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Re: Fora vs. mailing lists

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 10 Mar 2024 11:40:05 -0500, Thomas Cameron wrote:

> 
> 
> Quick definition: fora is the plural of forum, as in a web based forum
> to discuss a topic or technology, like
> https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/.
> 
> Having said that...
> 
> I love mailing lists. I have filters set up they silently go to the
> correct mail folder, I can read through them at my leisure, and I only
> have to deal with one client - my mail client. My mail client defaults
> to sane viewing rules, threaded, in the order I prefer. It's the same
> experience across every mailing list I'm a member of. I love that. It's
> very accessibility-friendly.
> 
> I hate using fora. [...]

There was some mention above of Gmane and its old troubles. This 
note is just to make sure everybody here does know Gmane has been alive 
and well again for years and years.-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Power User
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Re: HP12C Emulator?

[Beartooth]

On Sat, 6 Jan 2024 14:41:57 -0500, Mark C. Allman via users wrote:

> On 1/6/24 13:52, I Beartooth wrote:
>>  Is there an emulator of the HP12C for Fedora? (I'm running F39
>> Mate on a laptop and a PC.) I've found sites claiming there are
>> emulators for various OSs, but I can't seem to find an rpm download on
>> any that I've ever heard of.
[snipperoo]

> Don't know a 12c emulator, but Free42 (free42-3.1.2-1.fc39.x86_64) is a
> handy HP42s app. I also have Free42 on my AstroSlide Android phone.

Looks good, thanks! But the point of the 12C is that it's pre-
programmed (if not hard-wired) with a whole lot of tedious financial stuff 
that I want only to use, not study. 

If you commute by public transport, for instance, you can run 
simulations of real estate and mortgage transactions up the wazoo -- until 
you *know* how much house you can afford -- in otherwise dead time.

 (Actually, I've done that, a couple times, and mean to stay put; 
but at least two young couples among my friends are at the house-buying 
stage. I could lend out my 12C, of course, but it also has other uses ...)
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HP12C Emulator?

[Beartooth]

Is there an emulator of the HP12C for Fedora? (I'm running F39 
Mate on a laptop and a PC.) I've found sites claiming there are emulators 
for various OSs, but I can't seem to find an rpm download on any that I've 
ever heard of. 

Am I just more clueless in this case than usual? Or more paranoid 
than necessary? Like, did I skip some site that I'd've been safe on? (I 
did try a couple stabs with dnf install.)

I must've bought my real 12C sometime between 1987 and 1990, as 
near as I can recall, and it's still running just fine. The trouble is 
that I'm such a pack rat. It would help not to carry it too anytime I'm 
already carrying a perfectly serviceable Fedora machine.
-- 
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Re: rfkill??

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 31 Dec 2023 18:28:31 +, Barry wrote:

>> On 31 Dec 2023, at 18:00, Beartooth  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>Updating F39 just now on a laptop, I got a request for root to
>> authorize rfkill. I had just also updated F39 on a PC, with no such
>> request. (Both machines are connected to a KVM switch and a router by
>> cables, not wireless.)
> 
> What form did this request take?

It was in a small pop-up window.

> Did you save a screen shot or terminal output showing this request?

It disappeared the minute I got back to it from looking up rfkill.
 
> I think rfkill also handles bluetooth.

I don't do bluetooth. I think I have it, but I'm not even sure 
what it is.

-- 
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rfkill??

[Beartooth]

Updating F39 just now on a laptop, I got a request for root to 
authorize rfkill. I had just also updated F39 on a PC, with no such 
request. (Both machines are connected to a KVM switch and a router by 
cables, not wireless.)

I didn't authorize it, and shut the laptop down.

Is there something I should do next??
-- 
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Re: unwanted login

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 31 Aug 2023 11:35:35 -0300, George N. White III wrote:
[]
> Kernel.org has been working clean up power management, see
> .   Buggy
> ACPI implementations have been causing problems with wake from sleep,
> etc.   Some vendors have firmware updates that may help.
> Are all your machines the same?
 
They're all running F38 with Mate. One is a Thinkpad, one a 
desktop, and one (with the problem) a little thing like two or three decks 
of cards.  
[] 
>> Would it help to reboot? Could there be a problem with my KVM
>> switch??
>>
>>
> Easy to test by taking KVM switch out the loop -- there have been issues
> with the EDID getting corrupted on resume from sleep.
> See: 

Shudda thunka that. I'll try it tomorrow.
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Re: unwanted login

[Beartooth]

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 14:53:05 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

>>  I'm actually getting logged out; I have to give my username (id
>> est, confirm the default) and type my password every time.
> 
> Are you getting logged out or is it switching to the chooser?
> After you login, are applications still open or are you starting from
> what would be a normal initial login state?

Oho! I may easily be misapprised of the terms. It hasn't happened 
today (still on the machine with the problem, but only matescreensaver 
installed), but iirc they're still open.
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: unwanted login

[Beartooth]

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 13:18:40 +0930, Tim via users wrote:

> Beartooth 
>>> One of my F38 machines has taken to demanding that I login over and
>>> over. I want not to have to login at all. (I'm the sole user, and at 
>>> home.) Fwiw, I'm running xscreensaver under Mate. Where and how do I 
>>> reconfigure?
> 
> Richard:
>> On the screensaver configuration screen (under the
>> "system/preferences/look and feel/screensaver" pulldown) there's a
>> "lock screen when screensaver active" checkbox. I suspect that if you
>> uncheck that you'll get the action you desire.
> 
> I think *that* screensaver menu item would call up the preferences for
> the mate screensavers.  I think xscreensaver might use a separate
> configurator, unless the mate one ropes in other available ones, too.
> 
> I do recall that, in the past, having more than one set installed did
> cause problems for that kind of reason (separate control and
> configuration).

But I uninstall whichever one I'm not using, so that the one I do 
use has a clear field.
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Re: unwanted login

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 29 Aug 2023 09:44:16 -0700, Mike Wright wrote:

> On 8/29/23 07:44, Beartooth wrote:
>> On Mon, 28 Aug 2023 20:58:47 +, Richard wrote:
>> 
>>>> Date: Monday, August 28, 2023 19:09:43 + From: Beartooth
>>>> 
>>>>
>>>>One of my F38 machines has taken to demanding that I login over
>>>> and over. I want not to have to login at all. (I'm the sole user, and
>>>> at  home.) Fwiw, I'm running xscreensaver under Mate. Where and how
>>>> do I  reconfigure?
>>>
>>> On the screensaver configuration screen (under the
>>> "system/preferences/look and feel/screensaver" pulldown) there's a
>>> "lock screen when screensaver active" checkbox. I suspect that if you
>>> uncheck that you'll get the action you desire.
>> 
>>  I always do that; and yes, I've checked it twice in the last
>> couple minutes. What's more, I've tried it with and without a zero in
>> the "number of minutes" box.
>> 
>>  And, btw, it's been doing this through more than one change of
>> kernel with following reboot.
>> 
>>  Istr there's an applet somewhere actually called "login" or
>> something to that effect. I *think* it does other things; it might also
>> include a choice of when and whether to log the user out. But I haven't
>> managed to find it. :-(
> 
> You're looking for the "greeter".

My search function got something like a couple dozen hits.
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Re: unwanted login

[Beartooth]

On Wed, 30 Aug 2023 13:20:50 +0930, Tim via users wrote:

> On Mon, 2023-08-28 at 19:09 +0000, Beartooth wrote:
>> One of my F38 machines has taken to demanding that I login over and
>> over. I want not to have to login at all. (I'm the sole user, and at
>> home.) Fwiw, I'm running xscreensaver under Mate. Where and how do I
>> reconfigure?
> 
> I 'spose we should confirm, do you mean the screen saver is kicking in
> and you have to unlock it.  Or are you getting logged out?

I'm actually getting logged out; I have to give my username (id 
est, confirm the default) and type my password every time.

> Some xscreensavers were known to crash the display.

I've never seen that happen.

My practice after installing every new release has been to tell 
dnf first to remove mate-screensaver and then to install xscreensaver. The 
latter is still working fine on the other two machines in front of me.

I've just reversed that: told dnf to install mate-screensaver and 
remove xscreensaver. I found out immediately that the former doesn't let 
me manage my screen in any of the ways I want. 

Would it help to reboot? Could there be a problem with my KVM 
switch??
-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Power User
Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.


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Re: unwanted login

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 28 Aug 2023 20:58:47 +, Richard wrote:

>> Date: Monday, August 28, 2023 19:09:43 + From: Beartooth
>> 
>> 
>>  One of my F38 machines has taken to demanding that I login over
>> and over. I want not to have to login at all. (I'm the sole user, and
>> at  home.) Fwiw, I'm running xscreensaver under Mate. Where and how do
>> I  reconfigure?
> 
> On the screensaver configuration screen (under the
> "system/preferences/look and feel/screensaver" pulldown) there's a "lock
> screen when screensaver active" checkbox. I suspect that if you uncheck
> that you'll get the action you desire.

I always do that; and yes, I've checked it twice in the last 
couple minutes. What's more, I've tried it with and without a zero in the 
"number of minutes" box. 

And, btw, it's been doing this through more than one change of 
kernel with following reboot. 

Istr there's an applet somewhere actually called "login" or 
something to that effect. I *think* it does other things; it might also 
include a choice of when and whether to log the user out. But I haven't 
managed to find it. :-(
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is
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unwanted login

[Beartooth]

One of my F38 machines has taken to demanding that I login over 
and over. I want not to have to login at all. (I'm the sole user, and at 
home.) Fwiw, I'm running xscreensaver under Mate. Where and how do I 
reconfigure?
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: VDQ mate terminal (F37)

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 07 Apr 2023 02:26:32 +0930, Tim via users wrote:

> On Thu, 2023-04-06 at 15:53 +0000, Beartooth wrote:
>>  I must be getting more senile than I thought. I've lost the little
>> row of words on the top border of my mate-terminal (under F37, if it
>> matters) "File  Edit  View   Search  ... etc" and I can't find where to
>> turn it back on. 
>> 
>> 
> On my systems, if I right click within the Mate terminal window,
> there's a "show menubar" option in the menu that pops up.

Yes that works. MANY thanks!
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VDQ mate terminal (F37)

[Beartooth]

I must be getting more senile than I thought. I've lost the little 
row of words on the top border of my mate-terminal (under F37, if it 
matters) "File  Edit  View   Search  ... etc" and I can't find where to 
turn it back on. 

-- 
Beartooth Octogenarian

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Re: Xscreensaver forever in F37

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 02 Jan 2023 16:44:02 +, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:

> On Mon, 2023-01-02 at 16:21 +0000, Beartooth wrote:
>> 
>> When I first get to my study in the morning, my monitor
>> is
>> not dark, but still displaying some choice of xscreensaver. It always
>> used to stop and leave the monitor to rest. How do I get that behavior
>> back?
> 
> Look in the power settings, e.g. in KDE it's under:
> 
> Power Management->Energy Saving->Screen Energy Saving
> 
> Presumably Gnome has something similar.

Good idea. Actually, though, I run Mate. I just looked for it, but 
failed. Anybody know where it is, a/o what it's called? (I tried the 
things that looked likely to me.)
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Xscreensaver forever in F37

[Beartooth]

When I first get to my study in the morning, my monitor is not 
dark, but still displaying some choice of xscreensaver. It always used to 
stop and leave the monitor to rest. How do I get that behavior back?
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: strange error instead of update on F37

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 25 Nov 2022 10:42:13 -0700, Joe Zeff wrote:

> On 11/25/2022 10:28 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>> This is on a thinkpad several years old, with another machine right
>> next to it having no trouble.
> 
> This is an error at the other end.  Try again and it should work.

I did, and it did. Many thanks!
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strange error instead of update on F37

[Beartooth]

# dnf upgrade
 Fedora 37 - x86_64 0.0  B/s |   0  B 00:09
 Errors during downloading metadata for repository 'fedora':
   - Curl error (35): SSL connect error for
 https://mirrors.fedoraproject.org/metalink?
repo=fedora-37=x86_64 [OpenSSL
 SSL_connect: Connection reset by peer in connection to 
mirrors.fedoraproject.org:443 ]
 Error: Failed to download metadata for repo 'fedora': Cannot 
prepare internal
 mirrorlist: Curl error (35): SSL connect error for
 https://mirrors.fedoraproject.org/metalink?
repo=fedora-37=x86_64 [OpenSSL
 SSL_connect: Connection reset by peer in connection to 
mirrors.fedoraproject.org:443 ]
 []#

This is on a thinkpad several years old, with another machine 
right next to it having no trouble.
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Re: VDQ : Ffx updates

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 13 Oct 2022 08:55:39 +1030, Tim via users wrote:

> On Wed, 2022-10-12 at 14:06 +1030, Tim via users wrote:
[...]
>> You may find a section in its preferences which mentions updates, but
>> it's just descriptive text.  On my CentOS installation (the PC I'm
>> typing on now), it's on the general preferences section, very close to
>> the bottom, between the DRM content and performance section.
> 
> And I can confirm the same thing on my PC using Fedora 36 (which is
> usually kept up to date every other day or so).

So it isn't me. That's some slight consolation. But how do I know 
what repo it's getting all these mandatory instant updates from?
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Re: VDQ : Ffx updates

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 11 Oct 2022 18:18:03 +0200, Andras Simon wrote:

> 2022-10-11 18:09 UTC+02:00, Beartooth :
>> On Mon, 10 Oct 2022 17:14:56 +0200, Andras Simon wrote:
>>
>>> If he did install it outside of Fedora, wouldn't it be better to
>>> uninstall it and install the Fedora version? That way he would get
>>> regular updates along with the rest of his packages.
>>
>>  I've been running Ffx since it was iirc 'phoenix' and Fedora since
>> it was RH7; I can't begin to recall all the tweaks I've tried since the
>> Nineties.
>>
>>  So do I have this right? I should run 'dnf remove firefox', then
>> 'dny install firefox'. Reboot between?
> 
> No, you should uninstall the Firefox you installed outside of Fedora,
> not with dnf.
> If you did not do that, then I don't know why it wants to upgrade
> itself.
> 
> I don't know how to check whether you installed it outside of Fedora.
> But if
> 
> rpm -q firefox
> 
> says something positive, such as
> 
> firefox-105.0.1-1.fc35.x86_64
> 
> and not
> 
> package firefox is not installed
> 
> then you have a version that is installed with dnf. In that case , if
> 
> rpm -qV firefox
> 
> returns with no messages, there is no reason to reinstall it with dnf.

$ rpm -q firefox
firefox-105.0.2-1.fc36.x86_64
[btth@localhost ~]$ rpm -qV firefox

OK; so reinstalling is not the answer,alas! 

stan via users  a écrit :

You can fix this by going into
edit->settings->general  If you page down, near the bottom there will be a
setting to allow or disable automatic updates.

I tried that. Clicking on ">>" and scrolling got me to 
edit->settings->general (as did clicking on the equivalence sign, 
eventually), but I don't find the setting for automatic updates. Might it 
have been renamed?
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Re: VDQ : Ffx updates

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 10 Oct 2022 17:14:56 +0200, Andras Simon wrote:

> If he did install it outside of Fedora, wouldn't it be better to
> uninstall it and install the Fedora version? That way he would get
> regular updates along with the rest of his packages.

I've been running Ffx since it was iirc 'phoenix' and Fedora since 
it was RH7; I can't begin to recall all the tweaks I've tried since the 
Nineties.

So do I have this right? I should run 'dnf remove firefox', then 
'dny install firefox'. Reboot between?

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VDQ : Ffx updates

[Beartooth]

I run dnf clean all, followed by dnf upgrade, on all my machines, 
all on F36, daily. (I don't necessarily reboot, even if there's a kernel 
change. Should I?)

Nevertheless, Firefox demands its own updates, including its own 
reboot, whensoever it damn pleases, and won't lift an electronic finger 
till it gets its way.

Does this make some esoteric sense that I don't see? 

If not, how do I eliminate or take control of its irritating 
habit?
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Re: Cursor jumping

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 8 Apr 2022 10:22:56 -0600, Joe Zeff wrote:

> On 4/8/22 10:15, I Beartooth wrote:
>>  There seems to be some setting somewhere in recent releases (I'm
>> running F35) that causes the mouse cursor to jump around when it hits
>> certain positions. How do I turn this off?
> 
> What DE are you using?  I'm running XFCE and don't see it except maybe
> in one game.

Mate. I also generally run dnf clean all followed by dnf upgrade 
daily.
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Unlogging

[Beartooth]

Recent releases (I"m running F35) seem to log me out at certain 
times, regardless of what I'm doing. I want not ever to get logged out. 
How and where do I set that?
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Cursor jumping

[Beartooth]

There seems to be some setting somewhere in recent releases (I'm 
running F35) that causes the mouse cursor to jump around when it hits 
certain positions. How do I turn this off?
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Re: Pan updates

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 27 Dec 2021 06:35:24 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

> On 27/12/2021 01:45, Beartooth wrote:

>>  I'm OK, thanks! Just surprised.
>>
>>  I'd love to help, but my .sig means what it says (and I'm ancient
>> of days).
> 
> Well, according to the upstream website, the version you want was
> released on December 22. Do you think it reasonable that it someone
> would work on getting it into Fedora so quickly?

No; but I did think it odd that Fedora had not replaced .147 
with .148. I guess I didn't say that very well; sorry.

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Re: Pan updates

[Beartooth]

[...]
On Thu, 23 Dec 2021 16:00:08 -0500, Ted Roche wrote:
> 
> You can look up packages at https://packages.fedoraproject.org/
> 
> and https://packages.fedoraproject.org/pkgs/pan/pan/ shows you the
> current state of things.
> 
> Perhaps you can get in touch with the maintainers of the Fedora package
> (linked on that page) if you are very desperate for the new version and
> make your case, or perhaps volunteer to help out.

I'm OK, thanks! Just surprised.

I'd love to help, but my .sig means what it says (and I'm ancient 
of days).
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Pan updates

[Beartooth]

Pan 0.149 is just out; but I get $ rpm -q pan
pan-0.147-1.fc35.x86_64
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What the blazes?

[Beartooth]

[root@localhost ~]# dnf upgrade
Fedora 33 openh264 (From Cisco) - x86_64 
3.2 kB/s | 2.5 kB 00:00
Fedora Modular 33 - x86_64   
3.0 MB/s | 3.3 MB 00:01
Fedora Modular 33 - x86_64 - Updates 
3.2 MB/s | 3.0 MB 00:00
Fedora 33 - x86_64 - Updates 
3.4 MB/s |  23 MB 00:06
Fedora 33 - x86_64   
8.2 MB/s |  72 MB 00:08
Opera packages
14 kB/s |  13 kB 00:00
RPM Fusion for Fedora 33 - Free - Updates
431 kB/s | 383 kB 00:00
RPM Fusion for Fedora 33 - Free  
824 kB/s | 897 kB 00:01
RPM Fusion for Fedora 33 - Nonfree - Updates 
172 kB/s |  61 kB 00:00
RPM Fusion for Fedora 33 - Nonfree   
740 kB/s | 278 kB 00:00
Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[root@localhost ~]# 

What now??
-- 
Beartooth Implacable, Erstwhile Historian of Tongues
Who shall gather the smoke of the dead wood burning,
Or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning?
 -- JRR Tolkien
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Small-time factoring?

[Beartooth]

Having begun life as a mathematician (BA 1961), I still sometimes 
play with numbers, whether or not I'm near a computer. I mostly start by 
factoring them, so that I know  what I've got. But I get lost juggling 
more than about two or three three-digit numbers. 

It would be nice to have a factoring applet -- which wouldn't 
need to be vast nor intense enough to come anywhere near cryptographic 
use, but just as a mildly entertaining time waster.

My guess is that it exists, and is either already in Fedora, or 
can be handily installed. Anybody know?
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Or behold the flowing years from the Sea returning?
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Eliminating i686

[Beartooth]

I ran into a lot of trouble with one of my system upgrades from 
F32 to F33, mainly iiuc due to the presence of a superfluous i686 among 
all my .x86_64s. Just now while doing an ordinary F33 upgrade, I noticed 
pcre2-10.36-1.fc33.i686. I tried dnf remove, and it proposed to remove 
nearly ninety other items. I noticed that all of them also ended 
in .i686; so I told it to go ahead.

Was this a real dumb-cluck trick, or should I do the  like on my 
other machines?
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Re: Dragora bollixed?

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 01 Dec 2020 04:15:09 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

>>  My bad. There is no drop-down. The whole display is greyed out,
>> except for the colored line at the bottom showing its progress; and
>> when that finishes, the only thing not greyed out is "quit".
> 
> You will see that greyed out condition if dnfdragora is started with the
> --update-only parameter.

So how do I get it to launch without that? Can it be done with 
the GUI??
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Re: Dragora bollixed?

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 30 Nov 2020 06:50:32 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

> The more important question as this point is the one I asked in a later
> post.

> When it comes to dnfdragora, doesn't the drop-
> down with the selection of "To Update", "All",
> "installed", "Not Installed" provide the needed functionality?  That is,
> you can list what packages aren't installed and you can select from
> there which one to install.

My bad. There is no drop-down. The whole display is greyed out, 
except for the colored line at the bottom showing its progress; and when 
that finishes, the only thing not greyed out is "quit".
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Re: Dragora bollixed?

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 29 Nov 2020 07:37:13 +0800, Ed Greshko wrote:

> On 29/11/2020 05:10, I Beartooth wrote:
>>  I'm running F33 Mate, but I think I was also seeing the problem
>>  I'm
>> asking about under at least F32, and maybe also earlier.
>>
>>  Dragora has two icons that I can put on a panel. One of them is
>> supposed to be an updater. It works, afaict.

[...]
 
> The desktop files
> 
> /usr/share/applications/org.mageia.dnfdragora-updater.desktop
> /usr/share/applications/org.mageia.dnfdragora.desktop
> 
> both define the same Icon
> 
> Icon=dnfdragora
> 
> Sounds like you have 2 copies of
> /usr/share/applications/org.mageia.dnfdragora-updater.desktop
> 
> on your panel.
> 
> ---
> The key to getting good answers is to ask good questions.

Well, I try hard ...

I did cd /usr/share/applications, and got

# ls|grep dnf
org.mageia.dnfdragora.desktop
org.mageia.dnfdragora-localinstall.desktop
org.mageia.dnfdragora-updater.desktop

Is there some repo somewhere from which I can grep the standard 
icons for those three?

Meanwhile, I got a surprise. I tried to construct the command, 
not surprisingly getting several failures -- my CLI-foo is miniscule. But 
then came this:

[root@localhost btth]# /usr/share/applications/org.mageia.dnfdragora-
localinstall.desktop
-bash: /usr/share/applications/org.mageia.dnfdragora-localinstall.desktop: 
Permission denied
[root@localhost btth]# 

I suppose I should be glad it failed; but WHO has power to give 
or refuse permission to root??

I also went back (as user, not root) to the GUI of /usr/share/
applications, opened the file for the installer, and found a box saying 
its command is dnfdragora-localinstall.desktop; I copied that, added a &, 
and got a screenful of messages I don't understand. 

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Dragora bollixed?

[Beartooth]

I'm running F33 Mate, but I think I was also seeing the problem I'm 
asking about under at least F32, and maybe also earlier.

Dragora has two icons that I can put on a panel. One of them is 
supposed to be an updater. It works, afaict.

The other seems intended to do what it used to: permit me to 
slice and dice lists of apps, and to install or remove them. On any new 
install I used to use it heavily, eliminating apps I knew I'd never use, 
and adding ones not present by default that I do use.

Both icons do only the check for updates. Have I damaged 
something? Or is the exhaustive form deprecated?? If so, is there a 
replacement?

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Re: Have I bricked a PC? -- Hooray. -- Partitioning?

[Beartooth]

> On Sun, 08 Nov 2020 21:07:29 +, I Beartooth wrote:
 [...]
>   When I told it to reboot, it pulled in the drawer and immediately
> booted F 32 Live. I told it to install to hard drive -- and got another
> surprise. This machine has TWO drives,  sda with 112 GB, and sdb with
> 1.8 TB -- both supposedly almost full. I told it to create space
> ("delete all"), and it did indeed install F32, over the top of F32 that
> was already there.
> 
>   But when I then tried the same open-drawer trick with the F33,
> it did nothing for a long time, then booted F32. :-{ I broke the DVD
> with my bare hands; it shattered very satisfactorily. I'll go download
> and burn another. Stay tuned.

The new DVD did boot F33, and did let me start to install to hard 
drive. I'm in Anaconda, ready to choose partitioning. 

Anybody know a very complete tutorial for the terminally 
subtechnoid? I want it to give plenty of space to root (I'm going to 
tweak like mad.), and loads to the not quite only user (I always give a 
user ID to my wife, since our desks aren't both on the same floor; but 
she seldom even touches it.), DOES NOT let me pull any dumb tricks, but 
DOES touch all bases? 

There was a time, probably over twenty releases ago, when I could 
do tailored partitions, including iirc a separate /home; but then 
something changed, somehow, and nowadays I always end up having to go 
back to the automatic. 

    Thanks for all the help so far!
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Re: Have I bricked a PC? -- Surprise!

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 08 Nov 2020 21:07:29 +, I Beartooth wrote:

> I have a DVD with F 33 Live, in the drawer of an oldish machine.
> I can't get it to boot from the DVD.
[]
>   This is the machine, discussed here in a thread beginning October
> 30, about a transaction test error. The conclusion was that I had
> allocated space badly in F 32, and might as well install F 33 from
> scratch. That's what I'm trying to do.
> 
>   I've been running Fedora since it came out; IF I can get this
> thing to boot from the live DVD, I ought to be able to install it to the
> hard drive. But the boot options are innumerable -- most of them
> apparently not connected with the BIOS, if there still is one.

I found my DVD for F32 Live. I put that into the drawer, leaving 
the drawer open. I thought maybe that was magic.

When I told it to reboot, it pulled in the drawer and immediately 
booted F 32 Live. I told it to install to hard drive -- and got another 
surprise. This machine has TWO drives,  sda with 112 GB, and sdb with 1.8 
TB -- both supposedly almost full. I told it to create space ("delete 
all"), and it did indeed install F32, over the top of F32 that was 
already there.

But when I then tried the same open-drawer trick with the F 33, 
it did nothing for a long time, then booted F 32. :-{ I broke the DVD 
with my bare hands; it shattered very satisfactorily. I'll go download 
and burn another. Stay tuned.
-- 
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Re: Have I bricked a PC?

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 08 Nov 2020 16:24:25 -0800, ToddAndMargo via users wrote:

> On 2020-11-08 13:07, I Beartooth wrote:
>> 
>>  I have a DVD with F 33 Live, in the drawer of an oldish machine.
>> I can't get it to boot from the DVD.
[...]
>>  This is the machine, discussed here in a thread beginning October
>> 30, about a transaction test error. The conclusion was that I had
>> allocated space badly in F 32, and might as well install F 33 from
>> scratch. That's what I'm trying to do.
 
>>  Is there hope? What info do I need to post??
 
> KIB: did you set it to verify?

I used Brasero; iirc, I did tell it to verify.
 
> 3) did you go into BIOS and set the DVD drive to be
> first in the boot order?

If only I could get into the BIOS, I think I'd be home free, or 
almost, provided I could also get it to automount media

> 4) did you check the check sum of your iso?

Ouch! I think not.
 
> 5) can you read the DVD when in FC32?

Dunno: I can't get it mounted. (I have root access, but don't know 
what to call the DVD.)
 
> 6) what was the error message?

Error message? Error message?? Whence?

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Re: Have I bricked a PC?

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 09 Nov 2020 11:42:01 -0500, Richard Kimberly Heck wrote:

>> On 2020-11-08 13:07, I Beartooth wrote:
>>>
>>> I have a DVD with F 33 Live, in the drawer of an oldish
>>> machine. I can't get it to boot from the DVD.
>>>
>>> It was originally a System 76, which came with Ubuntu. I had
>>> to get help to switch it to Fedora, but it's been OK till now. 
>>> (I've been doing system upgrades with dnf; but that doesn't work 
>>> any more.)
> 
> I have been using Fedora on System 76 machines for some time now as
> well. Which one is this? Desktop or laptop? On a laptop, the model
> number is on a tag on the bottom of the machine. I've not had a desktop,
> but something similar should be true.

This is a desktop. We're thinking it's maybe five to seven years 
old. I don't see a model designation.

> I'd be shocked if it were a 32-bit machine, so I doubt that's the issue.
> 
> 
>>>     The first display on boot says American Megatrends, copyright
>>> 2015.

> It's the BIOS that controls that first screen, so it must still be
> functioning, to some extent. 

What of btrfs, whatever it is? New to me, but being discussed on 
this list now. 

> It's of course possible that the BIOS has
> gone bad, but that seems unlikely. Even if so, it ought to be possible
> to reinstall it. The System 76 folks could probably help with that, but
> we needn't go there yet.

> If you can take a photo of the boot options (e.g., with a phone), I
> might be able to help figure out which one you want. Send it privately
> if need be.

I'll try; my little old clamshell does have a camera, but I have 
yet to get any pix off it. Are you anywhere near Blacksburg and Virginia 
Tech, by any chance?

First, though, I'll send this off before I reboot.

> I think your worst-case scenario, really, would be to install a new hard
> drive.

Hmmm  Tempting. I have no hardware skills, and precious little 
knowledge; but there is a good shop here that I like. I also have a 
couple of external USB drives. Would they help??
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Re: Have I bricked a PC?

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 08 Nov 2020 17:57:41 -0800, ToddAndMargo via users wrote:

> On 2020-11-08 13:07, Beartooth wrote:
>> 
>>  I have a DVD with F 33 Live, in the drawer of an oldish machine.
>> I can't get it to boot from the DVD.

> How to test for a 64 bit CPU:
> 
> $ lscpu | grep -i bit CPU op-mode(s):  32-bit, 64-bit
> Address sizes:   39 bits physical, 48 bits virtual

Looks like I get what you get: 

 lscpu | grep -i bit
CPU op-mode(s):  32-bit, 64-bit
Address sizes:   39 bits physical, 48 bits virtual

-- but is that good or bad?

Fwiw, I tried over and over to get it to boot from a medium in the 
tray -- which I neither downloaded nor burned from this machine. But I 
think it's not the image: no matter what I find to do in setup (in either 
setup, actually -- there seem to be two), the machine shows no sign of 
even knowing the medium is there. It just goes right into booting F 32.

It's possible that I'm failing to recognize the commands, in 
either setup display, that will tell the machine to boot from a medium in 
its drawer.

I tried opening and re-closing the drawer. The machine hadn't 
mounted the medium, and still didn't. Neither Disk Mounter nor gnome-disk 
sees anything in the drawer. Usermount launched by my user denies there 
is anything I'm allowed to mount nor unmount, and admonishes me to 
contact my administrator. As root, it pops up a box offering to let me 
unmount /boot; /boot is full of F 32 files, but shows nothing with 33 in 
its name.

I have not yet tried burning the .iso to a thumb drive. If the 
lscpu result above doesn't mean doom, somebody please remind me how to do 
it, or where to re-read how! 
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Have I bricked a PC?

[Beartooth]

I have a DVD with F 33 Live, in the drawer of an oldish machine. 
I can't get it to boot from the DVD.

It was originally a System 76, which came with Ubuntu. I had to 
get help to switch it to Fedora, but it's been OK till now. (I've been 
doing system upgrades with dnf; but that doesn't work any more.

The first display on boot says American Megatrends, copyright 
2015.

This is the machine, discussed here in a thread beginning October 
30, about a transaction test error. The conclusion was that I had 
allocated space badly in F 32, and might as well install F 33 from 
scratch. That's what I'm trying to do.

I've been running Fedora since it came out; if I can get this 
thing to boot from the live DVD, I ought to be able to install it to the 
hard drive. But the boot options are innumerable -- most of them 
apparently not connected with the BIOS, if there still is one.

Is there hope? What info do I need to post??

-- 
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Re: F32 => F33 Error: Transaction test error: [unseen space]

[Beartooth]

On Sat, 31 Oct 2020 00:55:11 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 10/30/20 9:47 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>> 
>>  Running ]#  dnf system-upgrade download --refresh --releasever=33
>> --allowerasing
>> 
>> gets me a transaction test error saying
>> 
>> At least 674MB more space needed on the / filesystem.
>> 
>>  But gparted shows /dev/sda with 111.79 GB including 87.94 GB
>> unused, and /dev/sdb1 with 1.8 TB, and only  4 MB used.
> 
> gparted is not really the right tool.  

I used it only to show the partitions; shudda said so. Sorry.

> Do you really mean /dev/sda?
> That's the whole disk, not a partition and if you have unused space,
> that means you aren't using the whole drive.  

Probably. The whole subject of partitions seems clear to me till 
I try to apply it, and then suddenly all I think I know evaporates. I was 
trying to check how much space I had available on the whole machine. 

Would mate-disk-usage-analyzer have been better?

> The more important
> information is what does "df -h / /home /dev/sdb1" show?

   $ df -h / /home/dev/sdb2
 df: /home/dev/sdb2: No such file or directory
 Filesystem Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
 /dev/mapper/fedora-root00   15G   15G  885M  95% /

What does that first slash do? Should I be doing "df -h /" 
instead of just "df -h" routinely??

Fwiw, I *think* root has his own partition. Every time I try to 
use Anaconda for custom partitioning, I foul up, and end up having to 
accept the default.  But maybe that's convenient now.

Anyway, in case it helps, I also see 
 
 $ df -h
 df: /run/user/1000/doc: Operation not permitted
 Filesystem Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
 devtmpfs   7.8G 0  7.8G   0% /dev
 tmpfs  7.8G   45M  7.8G   1% /dev/shm
 tmpfs  7.8G  1.6M  7.8G   1% /run
 /dev/mapper/fedora-root00   15G   15G  877M  95% /
 tmpfs  7.8G  144K  7.8G   1% /tmp
 /dev/sda1     1014M  293M  722M  29% /boot
 tmpfs  1.6G   68K  1.6G   1% /run/user/1000

-- 
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F32 => F33 Error: Transaction test error: [unseen space]

[Beartooth]

Running ]#  dnf system-upgrade download --refresh --releasever=33 
--allowerasing

gets me a transaction test error saying 

At least 674MB more space needed on the / filesystem.

But gparted shows /dev/sda with 111.79 GB including 87.94 GB 
unused, and /dev/sdb1 with 1.8 TB, and only  4 MB used.

Partitioning seems simple till I have to use it, and then 
immediately bewilders me. What do I have to do??

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Re: Problem with CLI upgrade 32 -> 33 : SOLVED

[Beartooth]

On Wed, 28 Oct 2020 10:42:14 -0700, stan via users wrote:

> On Wed, 28 Oct 2020 15:25:28 - (UTC)
> Beartooth  wrote:
> 
>>  I go through the usual sequence (twice on one machine, once
>> on another), and end up with :
   []
>>  Is it me??
> 
> Not you.  The package qgis-3.12.1-4.fc32.x86_64 requires
> qt5-qtbase-5.14.2-5.fc32.x86_64, but there is no policy for dealing with
> that package because it doesn't exist in F33.  So, you can try adding
> --allowerasing to see if it will take care of that.  Do not
> automatically accept the result, check to be sure that it won't remove
> things you want.  If it does, try removing both qgis and qt5-qtbase
> before upgrading to see if that takes care of the problem.  If it works,
> re-install qgis and let it pull in the dependencies it wants.

OK, that worked. Many thanks!
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Problem with CLI upgrade 32 -> 33

[Beartooth]

I go through the usual sequence (twice on one machine, once  on 
another), and end up with :

No match for group package "powerpc-utils"
No match for group package "lsvpd"
No match for group package "PackageKit-Qt"
No match for group package "grub2"
No match for group package "coolkey"
No match for group package "gstreamer-plugins-good"
No match for group package "kexec-tools-anaconda-addon"
No match for group package "isdn4k-utils"
No match for group package "fedora-release-notes"
No match for group package "dnf-yum"
No match for group package "authconfig"
No match for group package "gnome-icon-theme-symbolic"
No match for group package "system-config-users"
No match for group package "mate-icon-theme-faenza"
No match for group package "tabish-eeyek-fonts"
No match for group package "grub2-efi"
No match for group package "PackageKit-Qt-devel"
No match for group package "shim"
No match for group package "exaile"
No match for group package "paratype-pt-sans-fonts"
Error: 
 Problem: package qgis-3.12.1-4.fc33.x86_64 requires libQt5Core.so.
5(Qt_5.14.2_PRIVATE_API)(64bit), but none of the providers can be 
installed
  - package qgis-3.12.1-4.fc33.x86_64 requires libQt5Sql.so.
5(Qt_5.14.2_PRIVATE_API)(64bit), but none of the providers can be 
installed
  - problem with installed package qgis-3.12.1-4.fc32.x86_64
  - qt5-qtbase-5.14.2-5.fc32.x86_64 does not belong to a distupgrade 
repository
  - qgis-3.12.1-4.fc32.x86_64 does not belong to a distupgrade repository
(try to add '--skip-broken' to skip uninstallable packages)

Of course I did try --skip-broken, but that failed, too. 

Is it me??
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Re: Add repo?

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 13:47:41 -0400, Tom Horsley wrote:

> On Sun, 25 Oct 2020 17:40:08 - (UTC)
> Beartooth wrote:
> 
>>  I've just discovered that dnf on one of my machines (a Thinkpad,
>> but I've forgotten where it keeps its model number) is lacking
>> rpmfusion;
>> and I can't seem to figure out how to add it. How do I do it?
> 
> Follow the instructions on rpmfusion web page?
> 
> https://rpmfusion.org/Configuration

Well, at least I knew it must be obvious (except to me). Many 
thanks!

I did the CLI, then noticed there was more, and did 

> RPM Fusion repositories also provide a lot of complement packages, it's 
> often difficult to remember which is the exact name of each complement 
> package. One can easily remember using the package group that the 
> repository extends.

> The following command will install the complements multimedia 
> packages needed by gstreamer enabled applications:

> sudo dnf groupupdate multimedia --setop="install_weak_deps=False" --
> exclude=PackageKit-gstreamer-plugin

I hope that was right. (I didn't add the next CLI offering, 
because I keep my browsers set not to do sound. Nor did I try any of the 
"tainted". Tom, or somebody, please let me know if those decisions were 
bad. TIA!)
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Add repo?

[Beartooth]

I've just discovered that dnf on one of my machines (a Thinkpad, 
but I've forgotten where it keeps its model number) is lacking rpmfusion; 
and I can't seem to figure out how to add it. How do I do it?
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Re: Seamonkey settings??

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 05 Oct 2020 13:33:30 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 10/5/20 1:20 PM, Beartooth wrote:
>> On Mon, 05 Oct 2020 12:50:51 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
>>  [...]
>>>>> Edit -> Preferences ?
>>>>
>>>>Sounds good -- except that I don't see Edit ...
>>>
>>> Do you see the menu bar at all?  Did you hide it?
>> 
>>  Certainly not on purpose. Where would it be, and how would I unhide
>> it? What does it look like?
>> 
>>  I see three lines: a line with the reload button and the location;
>> a line with "Home", "Bookmarks", etc.; and a line of tabs. Is any of
>> those it??
> 
> It's none of those.  If you look at the left of each of those, there is
> little vertical rectangle with dots and a tiny arrow.  Do you see
> another one that is horizontal?  If so, then click on it.  

I didn't see those, no.

> If not, then
> right-click one of the vertical ones and see if the menu bar option is
> unchecked.  If so, then check it.

That worked. Bless you, SIR!




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Re: Seamonkey settings??

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 05 Oct 2020 12:50:51 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
[...]
>>> Edit -> Preferences ?
>> 
>>  Sounds good -- except that I don't see Edit ...
> 
> Do you see the menu bar at all?  Did you hide it?

Certainly not on purpose. Where would it be, and how would I unhide 
it? What does it look like?

I see three lines: a line with the reload button and the location; 
a line with "Home", "Bookmarks", etc.; and a line of tabs. Is any of 
those it??

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Re: Seamonkey settings??

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 05 Oct 2020 12:18:08 -0700, stan via users wrote:

> On Mon, 5 Oct 2020 18:54:20 - (UTC)
> Beartooth  wrote:
> 
>>  Where are the settings for Seamonkey?
> 
> Edit -> Preferences ?

Sounds good -- except that I don't see Edit ...

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Seamonkey settings??

[Beartooth]

Where are the settings for Seamonkey? I'm running 
seamonkey-2.53.4-1.fc32.x86_64 under F32 fully updated. I've right- and 
left-clicked all over it, and I can't seem to get into any configuration 
worth doing. What am I missing? TIA!

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i686 in F32??

[Beartooth]

A few months back, I had lots of trouble with what should have 
been a routine, by-the-book dnf upgrade from one version of Fedora to 
another. What turned out, after much frustration, to have been the 
trouble was that I had several sort-of-duplicates: rpms the same except 
that one was .i686 in addition to another that was .86_64.

I have just done a dnf upgrade, which installed 
libFAudio-20.09-1.fc32.i686 and libFAudio-20.07-1.fc32.i686. Should I now 
do dnf remove *.i686?
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Re: Output text color (was dnf list color bad)

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 05 Jul 2020 11:43:01 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
[]
> But this is the wrong file anyway.  The configuration for dnf colors is
> in /etc/dnf/dnf.conf.  See "man dnf.conf" for details, see the section
> under "[MAIN] OPTIONS - COLORS".

Well, as /etc/dnf/dnf.conf I see only this:

[main]
gpgcheck=1
installonly_limit=3
clean_requirements_on_remove=True
best=False
skip_if_unavailable=True

I'll make a separate post for the rest, with effusive thanks for 
the clarifications.
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Re: Output text color (was dnf list color bad)

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 05 Jul 2020 12:59:10 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote:
[] 
> I'm pretty sure those are in /etc, not /etc/dnf.  If they're in the
> latter, can you confirm that and check what package provides them (rpm
> -qf /etc/dnf/DIR_COLORS*)?  I don't see anything providing them.

You're right. My bad. They're in /etc. And I get # rpm -qf /etc/
dnf/DIR_COLORS*
error: file /etc/dnf/DIR_COLORS*: No such file or directory


>>  In the first one, I found among much else
>> # If you use DOS-style suffixes, you may want to uncomment the
>> following:
>> #.cmd 01;32 # executables (bright green) I changed 32 to 31; removed
>> both hashmarks; no joy; rebooted; still no joy.
>> 
>>  Am I editing the wrong file? That comment about suffixes doesn't
>> quite sit right, but I didn't see anything else that looked likelier.
> 
> Assuming you really meant /etc/DIR_COLORS*, then to be clear, 1) that
> will affect ls rather than dnf; and 2) you _are_ most likely editing the
> wrong file if you edit /etc/DIR_COLORS.
> 
> The logic for which of the 3 files is used is in
> /etc/profile.d/colorls.sh (for bourne-style shells like bash).  Most
> modern terminal support 256 colors (at least), so they'll most likely
> use /etc/DIR_COLORS.256color.

Am I remembering wrong? Istr that I could tell a given machine 
*once* that I want to see dot files, and it would *always* display them.

> After you edit it, you must source /etc/profile.d/colorls.sh to pick up
> the changes.

"source" is a verb?? Sorry -- you lost me. What does it mean?

> You can also copy the proper DIR_COLORS* file to your home dir to avoid
> having a clean install overwrite your changes in /etc.  The paths which
> the colorls.sh script uses are:
> 
> $HOME/.dir_colors.$TERM $HOME/.dircolors.$TERM $HOME/.dir_colors
> $HOME/.dircolors
> 
> The first one found is used.

Sigh. The curse of the autodidact strikes again. I know that 
"HOME" in all upper case has a standard meaning, and I suppose "TERM" 
must, too. But I can never remember what it is, nor where to look it up. 

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Re: Output text color (was dnf list color bad)

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 12:02:40 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 7/3/20 11:59 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>>  IF (big if) I understand aright, the answer is that there are
>> various colors in command output, such as ls making folders differ from
>> files; all are fine except one.
>> 
>>  That one is the color dnf upgrade uses to list what it proposes to
>> change. (What it reports while making the changes is fine.) At present
>> it shows bright chartreuse on pale blue -- which just fuzzes out.
> 
> If the only problem is the one color from dnf, then either disable dnf
> colors or use the information from the last thread to adjust the color
> that's causing the problem.

I found /etc/dnf/DIR_COLORS,  /etc/dnf/DIR_COLORS.256color, and 
/etc/dnf/DIR_COLORS.lightbgcolor.

In the first one, I found among much else 
"# If you use DOS-style suffixes, you may want to uncomment the following:
#.cmd 01;32 # executables (bright green)" I changed 32 to 31; removed 
both hashmarks; no joy; rebooted; still no joy.

Am I editing the wrong file? That comment about suffixes doesn't 
quite sit right, but I didn't see anything else that looked likelier.
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Re: Output text color (was dnf list color bad)

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 02 Jul 2020 22:42:47 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote:

> Samuel Sieb wrote:
>> On 7/2/20 5:05 PM, Todd Zullinger wrote:
>>> Assuming I'm reading the request right, this part specifically is
>>> about adjusting the coloring in the terminal; making the commands
>>> which are input a different color than the output.
>> 
>> My understanding was that the problem is that they are now different
>> which they weren't before.  So he wants to either make them the same
>> again or find some way to adjust the output color.  I don't think your
>> method will make any difference to the color that the output is right
>> now.  It will only change the color of his typing which he's not
>> concerned about.
> 
> Gotcha. It's definitely not a method for everyone and far from the first
> thing I'd even want to use for this case. But you can change the output
> color too (subject to applications changing it themselves, of course).

I see I'm still unclear. Both the above are close.

In the first place, there is no such thing as A terminal color, 
only tab color SETS. I have five profiles, each with its own color set. 
(The same profiles have the same color sets on each of our machines.)

I normally keep eight tabs open. There are three for my user ID on 
any of my own machines, all with the same colors; and a fourth, with 
different colors, for that user on my domain. 

Two tabs on my machines have root's colors; a third tab is for 
root on my domain, with different colors. 

The fifth color set, on the eighth tab, is for my wife.

I don't much care whether outputs of commands use colors different 
from my inputs; it's nice, and convenient, *so* *long* *as* I can read 
them. The current problem is that sometimes I can't. 
 
> _If_ I was doing it here, I'd set the terminal text color to what I
> wanted for the output and then adjust the prompt/input color via PS1. 
> The opposite can be done too, with a slightly different tput command for
> the trap.  But that's an even less appealing way to go about fixing what
> seems to be a bug or misconfiguration somewhere.
> 
> It's unclear to me whether it's all command output or only some which
> differs from what's set as the terminal foreground color.  If _all_
> command output is using a color other than what is set as the terminal
> default, that seems like something which could be caused by having some
> color escape codes in the prompt, perhaps unintentionally?

IF (big if) I understand aright, the answer is that there are 
various colors in command output, such as ls making folders differ from 
files; all are fine except one. 

That one is the color dnf upgrade uses to list what it proposes to 
change. (What it reports while making the changes is fine.) At present it 
shows bright chartreuse on pale blue -- which just fuzzes out.

> Alternatively, I could be way off and this is something specific to the
> Mate Terminal. :)
> 
> Maybe a link to an image would help illustrate the problem better? 
> Bonus points if the terminal color settings dialog can be included in
> the image.

I can never remember the name of the canonical site for that, nor 
the command, although they make sense while I see them. However, I don't 
know if the site would preserve colors sent to it, or make them fit it, 
or leave that to each person viewing. Would it matter whether I posted a 
screenshot or something else?

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Output text color (was dnf list color bad)

[Beartooth]

Back on April 23, I started a thread on the color of dnf's output, 
which petered out without reaching any conclusion. I let it age. Having 
now gone back and re-examined the problem, I'd like to start over, and 
maybe do better.

Part of the problem, and one of the things I failed to make clear, 
is that I don't use pat colors. I began, long years ago, by setting 
several different soft colors as backgrounds on different terminal tabs, 
which were supposed to be easier on the eyes. Not seeing the colors I 
wanted in the canned array, I invoked the GUI slider.

EXAMPLE: Editing a profile named bbi, I click on the color tab, 
then on background. Up pops a box offering an array and also a button 
with a + on it. Clicking that gets me a new box, with a vertical bar and 
a square. The bar shows a spectrum; clicking anywhere on it colors the 
square, and moving a dot around in the square determines both the shade 
and the intensity of the background. Having done that, and accepted a 
background color, I click on text, and go through the same process to get 
a good contrast. 

Until F32, this process worked like a charm. I can log into any of 
my computers, go to any tab on the Mate terminal, and see at a glance who 
and where I am.(Since my domain is hosted on a remote machine, the where 
is not trivial.)

Until F32, when I entered a command on such a terminal tab, its 
output came in the same color as what I had typed. Now it differs, and 
that is fine. But the default is unreadable against my background.

Might we (pretty please!) get one more choice on the screen for 
choosing colors? It could be labelled "output" and work just like text, 
background, and (optionally) bold; or it could use the bold color by 
default.

Am I making sense this time??

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Download pix?

[Beartooth]

I took a couple pix with my Kyocera clamshell phone, which now I 
want to download to a  computer running Fedora 32, so that I can email 
them. The computer sees the phone when I connect them with a cable. What 
do I do next??
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Re: What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 11 Jun 2020 13:03:37 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> Check how it did the partitioning.  I have no idea what it will do when
> there are two drives.  Custom or blivet partitioning would have been
> much better for your case.


 df -h
 Filesystem Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
 devtmpfs   7.8G 0  7.8G   0% /dev
 tmpfs  7.8G 0  7.8G   0% /dev/shm
 tmpfs  7.8G  1.6M  7.8G   1% /run
 /dev/mapper/fedora-root00   15G  9.4G  5.7G  63% /
 tmpfs  7.8G  156K  7.8G   1% /tmp
 /dev/sda1 1014M  195M  820M  20% /boot
 tmpfs  1.6G  128K  1.6G   1% /run/user/1000

I did manage a couple of times to set Anaconda to use the 2TB 
drive as /home, with / and or /root on the smaller drive. But I didn't 
understand, and it wouldn't tell, what was wrong with those arrangements.
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Re: What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

Yesterday, I Beartooth wrote:

>>  The whole PC is now a backup; so I'd have no hesitation to DBAN it, 
>> install F32, and recopy data from my
>> present #1 machine. I did think it seemed to have surprisingly little
>> storage when I did that df -h; but if I understand better now, that
>> 1.7T is real -- and, I hope, available for other uses. Is that so?
>> Maybe I don't need to wipe it?

Lish me wuck. My old DBAN medium failed in five seconds flat on 
interactive, and failed again in five more on autonuke. So I burned a 
medium for F32 netinstall, and booted from that.

As usual, I missed some boneheaded thing, and couldn't get 
Anaconda to accept any manual partitioning I tried; so I eventually just 
let it go automatic. It finished all right, and I'm adding apps.

Beforehand, last night and this morning, I had copied my whole 
home directory to a thumb stick. Then this morning I merged it into the 
home directory of my #1 machine, which I'm using now. And I'm in process 
of merging it into #3. When that's done, I'll copy it back, knowing it 
works.

Many, many thanks to all hands, and especially to Samuel Sieb, for 
all the help!
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Re: What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 08 Jun 2020 11:18:21 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 6/8/20 9:35 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>> On Sun, 07 Jun 2020 14:07:29 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
>>> It's not a file.  It appears to be an lvm volume, kind of like a
>>> partition.  It's mounted at /.snapshot, so what does "ls -a
>>> /.snapshot"
>>> show you?
>> 
>>  Now it gets weird. I tried that command both as user and as root,
>> and got only
>> 
>>  ls: cannot access '/.snapshot': No such file or directory
> 
> Not weird, just my mistake.  I retyped from memory instead of looking at
> it or doing copy and paste.  "ls -a /.snapshots"  (It's plural...)

# ls -a /.snapshots
.  ..  alpha.0  lost+found


> Also, what about "lsof /.snapshots"?

# lsof /.snapshots
lsof: WARNING: can't stat() fuse.gvfsd-fuse file system /run/user/65536/
gvfs
  Output information may be incomplete.

It says "incomplete"; but the lines above are its whole output.
 
>>  For most of my time, there has been no question whether I would
>> snarl up a machine, but only when. So every time I bought a new one, I
>> kept the old one and the one before it, in order to be able to holler
>> for help.
> 
> Sounds like a good plan. :-)
> 
>> Disk /dev/sdb: 1.84 TiB, 2000398934016 bytes, 3907029168 sectors Disk
>> model: WDC WD20EZRZ-00Z Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes Sector
>> size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 4096 bytes I/O size
>> (minimum/optimal): 4096 bytes / 4096 bytes Disklabel type: gpt Disk
>> identifier: 772CAD71-6AAB-4868-9D69-C46B183C9581
>> 
>> Device  StartEndSectors  Size Type /dev/sdb12048   
>>  251903 249856  122M Microsoft reserved /dev/sdb2  251904
>> 3907026943 3906775040  1.8T Linux filesystem
> 
> Was this drive brought over from a windows system?  But anyway, there's
> your storage.

It's my wife's previous machine, a System76 PC from several years 
back. (She thinks five to eight years.) Being from them, it arrived with 
Ubuntu (only, afaik). But I had so much trouble installing Fedora 
(trouble I had not had with an early System76 netbook) that I had to call 
a friend here, who came and did the install for me. 

All I can think of, and it seems unlikely, is that System76 might 
for some reason have started with a Windows machine, not bare metal. 
Maybe that's why. 

> It appears like you took a large hard drive and set it up for some
> backup system, but I have no idea what one would work like that.

I don't know what the friend did. The whole PC is now a backup; so 
I'd have no hesitation to DBAN it, install F32, and recopy data from my 
present #1 machine. I did think it seemed to have surprisingly little 
storage when I did that df -h; but if I understand better now, that 1.7T 
is real -- and, I hope, available for other uses. Is that so? Maybe I 
don't need to wipe it?
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I have precious (very precious) little idea where up is.

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Re: Interfaces

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 09 Jun 2020 11:40:15 +0100, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:

> If you think the layout is problematic, I'd suggest discussing it on the
> Evo mailing list and eventually filing an RFE.
> 
> The icons are determined by the current style dictated by Gnome, not by
> Evolution itself. The same applies to fonts.

Years ago, I think about the time OSX first appeared, there were 
reports of an eminent industrial psychologist (whose name I've forgotten) 
who had said that all modern GUIs were downright wrong-headed. Does 
anybody remember? And was that insight ever followed up on? (I believe 
the guy died not long after writing that.)
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Re: What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 08 Jun 2020 09:39:28 +0200, Bob Marcan wrote:

> Seems almost nobody is using the command line.
> GUI for everything.
> I like to see how will they solve the repetitive task. :-)

I gave that a fresh thread, called Interfaces.
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Interfaces

[Beartooth]

In another thread, Bob Marcan wrote:

> Seems almost nobody is using the command line.
> GUI for everything.
> I like to see how will they solve the repetitive task. 

Well, what follows seems typical enough to be of possible interest.

I've been around long enough to know only too well that the CLI is 
preferable when feasible. The problem is remembering the commands, to the 
point where your fingers know them. I began with a prodigious memory, and 
ran it flat out for decades; so now in old age it's way full. 

But visual spatial memory, fortunately, seems to occupy a 
different register. It's slower and less sharp. To answer what I has 
clicked on, I was not able to rattle off a list, but had to go back and 
reconstruct it -- including recovering a couple times from errors. But I 
got there. The first false fork with the CLI'd've lost me.

-- 
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Re: What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 07 Jun 2020 14:07:29 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 6/7/20 10:42 AM, I Beartooth wrote:

>>  Going into the GUI, right clicking and choosing priorities, I see:
> 
> What gui?  Right-clicking on what?

Sorry. Mate. I clicked on the desktop icon for Computer, then 
Filesystem, dev, mapper; that displayed backup_vg-backup among others; I 
right-clicked on it.
 
>>   Link to block device (inode/blockdevice)
> 
> Yes, it's a block device.
[] 
> An inode is the chunk of metadata in the filesystem that describes a
> file.  You could think of it simply as a directory entry, but it's more
> complicated than that.  A block device is storage that accesses data in
> chunks.  For example, hard drives can only access data in chunks of 512
> bytes.  You can't directly access a specific byte.

OK, I think I follow that. Thanks!

>>  I'm wondering whether *any* file on an old machine could be so big
>> as a terabyte, let alone two. If not, what if anything is df -h telling
>> me about this machine as compared to my others? Anything about speed or
>> storage?
> 
> It's not a file.  It appears to be an lvm volume, kind of like a
> partition.  It's mounted at /.snapshot, so what does "ls -a /.snapshot"
> show you?

Now it gets weird. I tried that command both as user and as root, 
and got only 

ls: cannot access '/.snapshot': No such file or directory   

>>  I also have a still broader question. Instead of keeping each
>> machine, as heretofore, as nearly in sync with the others, actually as
>> close a copy of the others, might it be reasonably safe to keep one for
>> constant use and the others as supporting specialists of some sort.
> 
> That's completely up to you and what you want to use it for.

IOW, it's a reasonable thing to do, given that old evils like 
dependency hell are pretty well gone. Good. All hail the developers! 

For most of my time, there has been no question whether I would 
snarl up a machine, but only when. So every time I bought a new one, I 
kept the old one and the one before it, in order to be able to holler for 
help.
 
> To figure out what's going on with that storage, run the following four
> commands and copy their output:
> vgs 

# vgs
  VG#PV #LV #SN Attr   VSizeVFree
  backup_vg   1   1   0 wz--n-   <1.82t0 
  fedora  1   3   0 wz--n- <110.79g0 

lvs 
# lvs
 LV VGAttr   LSize  Pool Origin Data%  Meta%  Move Log 
Cpy%Sync Convert
  backup backup_vg -wi-ao 
<1.82t
  home   fedora-wi-ao 
52.92g
  root   fedora-wi-ao 
50.00g
  swap   fedora-wi-ao  7.86g  

fdisk -l 
# fdisk -l
Disk /dev/sda: 111.81 GiB, 120034123776 bytes, 234441648 sectors
Disk model: Samsung SSD 850 
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
Disklabel type: dos
Disk identifier: 0x57db626c

Device Boot   Start   End   Sectors   Size Id Type
/dev/sda1  *   2048   2099199   2097152 1G 83 Linux
/dev/sda2   2099200 234440703 232341504 110.8G 8e Linux LVM


Disk /dev/sdb: 1.84 TiB, 2000398934016 bytes, 3907029168 sectors
Disk model: WDC WD20EZRZ-00Z
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 4096 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 4096 bytes / 4096 bytes
Disklabel type: gpt
Disk identifier: 772CAD71-6AAB-4868-9D69-C46B183C9581

Device  StartEndSectors  Size Type
/dev/sdb12048 251903 249856  122M Microsoft reserved
/dev/sdb2  251904 3907026943 3906775040  1.8T Linux filesystem




Disk /dev/mapper/fedora-root: 50 GiB, 53687091200 bytes, 104857600 sectors
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes


Disk /dev/mapper/fedora-swap: 7.88 GiB, 8443133952 bytes, 16490496 sectors
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes


Disk /dev/mapper/fedora-home: 52.94 GiB, 56824430592 bytes, 110985216 
sectors
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes


Disk /dev/mapper/backup_vg-backup: 1.84 TiB, 2000267771904 bytes, 
3906772992 sectors
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 4096 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 4096 bytes / 4096 bytes

lsblk -t
NAME ALIGNMENT MIN-IO OPT-IO PHY-SEC LOG-SEC ROTA SCHED 
RQ-SIZE  RA WSAME
sda  0512  0 512

Re: What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 07 Jun 2020 10:58:57 -0700, Mike Wright wrote:

> The file is probably sparse, i.e. it is only as large as the usage
> which, at the moment, is 174M.  Enough snapshots and it could eventually
> grow to a max of 1.8T.
 
OK, even I should know, but if I do I don't remember: how, other 
than by df -h, do I get a machine to tell me its capacity? If the file 
*could* grow to 1.8T, is that some kind of software limit, or does it 
imply that the machine actually has at least 1.8T?
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What is backup_vg-backup? Can it be so big?

[Beartooth]

On a System76 PC several years old, running F32 fully updated (not 
Ubuntu), I see the following:

$ df -h
FilesystemSize  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
devtmpfs  7.8G 0  7.8G   0% /dev
tmpfs 7.8G 0  7.8G   0% /dev/shm
tmpfs 7.8G  1.6M  7.8G   1% /run
/dev/mapper/fedora-root49G   16G   31G  35% /
tmpfs 7.8G   60K  7.8G   1% /tmp
/dev/mapper/fedora-home52G   20G   30G  40% /home
/dev/sda1 976M  252M  658M  28% /boot
/dev/mapper/backup_vg-backup  1.8T  174M  1.7T   1% /.snapshots
tmpfs 1.6G   60K  1.6G   1% /run/user/65536
bash-5.0$ 

Going into the GUI, right clicking and choosing priorities, I see:

 Link to block device (inode/blockdevice)

So I searched inode, but got over my head in no time. Searching 
snapshot was a little more comprehensible, but using what I think it told 
me would demand knowledge I lack. I also tried blockdevice, and that 
*really* got me into a jungle of jargon.

I'm wondering whether *any* file on an old machine could be so big 
as a terabyte, let alone two. If not, what if anything is df -h telling 
me about this machine as compared to my others? Anything about speed or 
storage?

I also have a still broader question. Instead of keeping each 
machine, as heretofore, as nearly in sync with the others, actually as 
close a copy of the others, might it be reasonably safe to keep one for 
constant use and the others as supporting specialists of some sort.

Advice? Comments?

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Re: Prevent locking screen

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 01 Jun 2020 06:29:47 +, Andre Robatino wrote:

> In GNOME, Settings/Privacy/Screen Lock/Automatic Screen Lock -> Off.
> (You can still lock it manually if needed.)

I didn't find that in Mate, but I did find the power settings in 
the control panel, and changed that. Thanks, Tom!
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Prevent locking screen

[Beartooth]

How do I tell Fedora (currently 32 fully upgraded) never to lock 
the screen??
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Re: Lost Mate-panel : SOLVED

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 01 May 2020 20:16:29 +, I Beartooth wrote:

> Upgrading an E-series Thinkpad, a year or two old, running Fedora 31,
> via CLI, the upgrade kept failing with complaints about i.686 -- till I
> did "dnf remove  mate-*.i.686" -- then it completed, or seemed to. This
> machine was behind an HDMI KVM switch, and was giving a display spread
> across both its own monitor and my regular one, with four panels on
> each.
[]
>   Is there a third way?

I finally thought to try "dnf remove mate-panel," copy the list of 
deletions, and save to a file. THEN system-upgrade finally worked (doing 
something mysterious to me to a couple of apps); I told dnf to install 
the list I had saved, and all is well again. (I didn't think to try 
simply commanding "dnf install mate-panel." If the same problem should 
arise on my wife's similar machine, which I haven't yet upgraded, I will.)
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Arora browser failing under F32

[Beartooth]

I keep a drawer on a panel full of launchers for browsers. Twice 
I've tried for Arora from there, and once from the Main Menu. All three 
times it started, showing one tab, trying to go to fedoraproject.org, and 
closed again without getting anywhere. 

I did a dnf reinstall; that completed normally, but didn't help. 
The little box reporting trouble showed, but said nothing, and also 
closed without offering either to dump any data or to send anything to 
RedHat. 

The same happened on another F32 machine, but not on one running 
F31.
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More 686 woe

[Beartooth]

I've just tried to upgrade another (and much more important) 
machine -- and hit the mate-panel 686 snag again:

Error: Transaction test error:
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.ClockApplet.mate-
panel-applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.FishApplet.mate-panel-
applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/
org.mate.panel.NotificationAreaApplet.mate-panel-applet conflicts between 
attempted installs of mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64
  file /usr/share/mate-panel/applets/org.mate.panel.Wncklet.mate-panel-
applet conflicts between attempted installs of mate-
panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.i686 and mate-panel-1.24.0-4.fc32.x86_64

This is AFTER running with ' --skip-broken --allowerasing'
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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 07 May 2020 16:46:49 -0400, Jonathan Billings wrote:

> On May 7, 2020, at 16:42, Beartooth  wrote:
>>I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
>> onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
>> do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
>> without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> 
> It’d be part of the kernel if it’s a USB Mass Storage device. You
> shouldn’t need to install anything.
> 
> Does `gnome-disks` see the device?

I keep forgetting to mention that I run Mate. I get 

$ rpm -q gnome-disks
    package gnome-disks is not installed
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Browser list?

[Beartooth]

I like trying out browsers, but I remember dependency hell too 
strongly to risk it again. 

I have installed Opera (which I've run and liked since before 
Fedora) and Vivaldi which I liked the sound of; and both of them (once 
you find the rpm versions) have repos that Fedora/dnf can use. 

I also thought, only just now, to try searching 'browser' in 
dnfdragora, and did find a couple, which I installed and will play with. 

Anybody know any others? 
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Re: VDQ Thumb drive software

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 07 May 2020 13:44:11 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 5/7/20 1:41 PM, Beartooth wrote:
>>  I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something
>> onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to
>> do so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other
>> without finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
> 
> We'll need more info than that.  What do you want to put on the drive?
> I assume it's not the file manager that you're looking for. :-)

Two things, either of which can go onto an optical medium or a 
second thumb drive instead.

If I can find them, I'd like to save my tweaks: size and 
positions of panels, choice and positions of launchers, tabs of the 
terminal with their fonts and color schemes, tabs & bookmarks of all the 
browsers (all the ones in the regular repos, plus Opera and Vivaldi), the 
biggest mouse cursor there is, all that kind of stuff. (I always display 
'hidden' files, but there's some of that I never have found, running 
Fedora since its creation.)

And a netinstall .iso with Mate, for one more try at a re-
install. :-}


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VDQ Thumb drive software

[Beartooth]

I'm pretty sure the Fedora machine I want to use to put something 
onto a thumb drive doesn't have the thumb drive software installed to do 
so. But I've searched dnfdragora up one side and down the other without 
finding it. What is it called? Pretty please?
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 05 May 2020 13:01:12 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:


>>  All right, I now have it booted into F32 Live, with a Mate-
>> terminal open.
> 
> I've never use the Mate live boot.  Did it have an install option when
> it started up?  If not, check the menus for an install option.

It has the usual icon (on the desktop, not a panel) labeled 
"Install to hard drive." After going through all the menus I could find, 
and not seeing one for re-install, I tried that. It didn't show a re-
install either, not automatically and not under the help button. So I 
quit the install. Is there a CLI method? Maybe even one already online?

I should mention that never on any new install have I managed to 
make /home separate; every interpretation I've ever put on any directions 
has led only to an impasse from which I had to start over. I don't know 
what I've always gotten wrong, nor even whether it's always been one 
thing.
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 05 May 2020 11:46:18 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 5/5/20 11:43 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>> On Tue, 05 May 2020 10:37:24 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
>> 
>>> It sounds like you started the the upgrade process but it failed part
>>> way through.  I think doing a re-install would be the much easier
>>> option, but if you want to keep trying, then we can try a bit more.
>> 
>>  My bad. I took a guess at "re-install" and got it wrong -- trying
>> to re-do what I had.
>> 
>>  Can I actually do something like "dnf re-install xyz"?? What do I
>> put for xyz when it's a whole OS??
> 
> You get a live image or a net install image and boot from it.

Oh. 

All right, I now have it booted into F32 Live, with a Mate-
terminal open.
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 05 May 2020 10:37:24 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> It sounds like you started the the upgrade process but it failed part
> way through.  I think doing a re-install would be the much easier
> option, but if you want to keep trying, then we can try a bit more.

My bad. I took a guess at "re-install" and got it wrong -- trying 
to re-do what I had. 

Can I actually do something like "dnf re-install xyz"?? What do I 
put for xyz when it's a whole OS??

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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 04 May 2020 13:31:40 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> What does "cat /etc/fedora-release" tell you?

It said 32, much to my surprise. I was pretty sure (to my earlier 
surprise) that all the packages it had been showing me were 31.

> If it says you're on F31, then run:
> "dnf system-upgrade download --release=32 --allowerasing"

See below.

> If it says you're on F32, then run:
> "dnf distro-sync"
> and see what that offers to do.

It hit a great long (half a screenful) list of problems. 
I tried the upgrade; it reminded me to refresh, and I did; it 
installed inxi, whatever that is.
Then it hit the upgrade problems again, and this time suggested 
"--allowerasing"; so I added that to " --skip-broken."

    It stopped with the problem of sudo, systemd, and systemd-udev
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 04 May 2020 11:10:06 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> Then let's skip the whole live boot thing and do it the easy way. :-)

I shut it down, removed the live medium, and let it boot F 31.

> Can you explain what you meant by "blank flashing panels"? 

This didn't happen this time, praise whatever gods there be!

For the record, I saw two panels, devoid of icons, flashing fast 
and brightly, one on each side of the display.

> It's quite likely that we've been trying to solve the wrong problem.   
> Do you get a login screen?  

Yes. I opened a terminal which gave me this prompt:

[beartooth@localhost-live ~]$ 

> Can you login?  

Yes, with a lot of little boxes complaining about various applets 
and  offering to remove them. I told it not to. Then I did su - and it 
took my regular root password.

So I opened Firefox to the Fedoramagazine page for upgrading by 
CLI, and started copying & pasting as usual. It got as far as trying to 
download F 32.

 Then I got "Problem: The operation would result in removing the 
following protected packages: sudo, systemd, systemd-udev (try to add --
skip-broken' to skip uninstallable packages)

So I added it, and got the identical problem message again. And 
there it sits; but at least this time it's a different problem.
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

Doing this back and forth between two machines is very awkward, 
and doing it with the KVM switch was worse. If I could make the live 
medium run Pan, I could jump back and forth with the workspace switcher. 
Is there a way to do that?
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Sun, 03 May 2020 14:41:40 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 5/3/20 10:49 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>> On Sat, 02 May 2020 14:24:41 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
>> 
>>> I'm not familiar with Mate, but try opening the file browser.  At
>>> least on Gnome, the available partitions are listed in the list on the
>>> left and you can click to mount them.
>> 
>>  Bingo! I see two choices that are way too big to be on the DVD.
>> Caja can open both. Is there a canonical way to get to the panels,
>> better than trial and error? If I can locate and them, via GUI or via
>> CLI, maybe it'll be apparent to me or to someone here what is wrong and
>> how to fix them.
> 
> I'm not sure what you mean by "the panels". 

Remember that Mate resembles Gnome2; my old man's memory is way 
full of languages, and seldom recalls commands unless I use them very 
often, like "dnf upgrade." But my spatial memory remains usable.

So the first thing I do on any install is to put panels top, 
bottom, and both sides; and populate them with a fixed arrangement of 
icons in fixed places. 

When I tried to follow the usual CLI upgrade, I got failures 
because of the presence of i.686. I did "dnf remove  mate-*.i.686" -- 
then it completed, or seemed to; but after the upgrade reboot, when I 
KVM'd to the Thinkpad, I saw only blank flashing panels on each monitor. 
There was no terminal emulator anywhere.

So I created an F 32 Mate live medium on another machine, and 
managed to boot from that. As I see it, I can just install F 32 from live 
medium; or I can get into the hard drive, find a/o figure out (with a lot 
of help) what is wrong, fix it, and keep both my data and my arrangement 
of panels and icons, which is fairly tedious (but safe) to set up from 
scratch. 

> Figure out which entry is
> the root partition.  I'm going to assume it's called root and that
> you're running as a user called "liveuser".  If that's wrong, then
> you'll need to adjust the following commands accordingly.  Open a
> terminal and cd to "/run/media/liveuser/root".  Run "sudo chroot."

That gets "No such file or directory." I tried removing "/root" 
from it, and tried "chroot." I got "missing operand."

My machines have always been physically secure; so I've never 
learned sudo. I tried "su - " and became root. 

> Then try running "journalctl -b-1" and see if you can find an error or
> some reason that your graphical interface isn't loading.

Both with that, and with a space between "b" and "-1", I got (in 
bold) "Data from the specified boot (-1) is not available: No such boot 
ID in journal"

> I'm a little concerned about what you think you messed up when running
> in non-graphical mode earlier.  Does using "3" not boot you to a login
> prompt now?

Yes, it does. I must have said something badly.
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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Sat, 02 May 2020 14:24:41 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> I'm not familiar with Mate, but try opening the file browser.  At least
> on Gnome, the available partitions are listed in the list on the left
> and you can click to mount them.  

Bingo! I see two choices that are way too big to be on the DVD. 
Caja can open both. Is there a canonical way to get to the panels, better 
than trial and error? If I can locate and them, via GUI or via CLI, maybe 
it'll be apparent to me or to someone here what is wrong and how to fix 
them.

> The other option is to open a terminal
> and manually mount the partitions.

Hoo, boy! I can't remember the last time I touched a partition.
 
> Are you trying to fix the installed system, backup data, or re-install?

I'd prefer to fix, and keep what data are on it, particularly the 
panels; but if that's a big job, or beyond my ability, I'm willing to re-
install, restore, and tweak. There is nothing crucial on this machine, 
only stuff I'd like to take along if I ever do take it anywhere.

IF (big if) there is likely to be anything interesting in its own 
right to you or anyone on the team, I'm willing to be walked through 
whatever it takes; I owe Fedora and all its people big time.

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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 01 May 2020 20:16:29 +, I Beartooth wrote:
[]
> 
>   Do I go looking for a live distro that may let me mount the Thpd's
> hard drive and try to fix the panels somehow?
> 
>   Do I just call it a total loss and install F 32 from a freshly
> downloaded iso on a thumb drive?

I downloaded Fedora Mate Live 32 -- and could neither remember 
nor find the name of Fedora's thumb drive software. So I burned an old-
fashioned DVD. And I now have the Thinkpad back behind the KVM switch and 
booted from the DVD. So I can read this list and input to the Thpd.

The first thing I don't know is how to get the live OS to mount 
the hard drive. I'll try fiddling -- tomorrow, May 3. For now I'm 
offline. Thanks for your help!
-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Power User
Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.



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Re: Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

On Fri, 01 May 2020 14:03:10 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 5/1/20 1:16 PM, Beartooth wrote:
>>  Since the upgrade reboot, when I KVM to the Thinkpad, I see blank
>> flashing panels on each monitor. There is no terminal emulator
>> anywhere.
>> I've tried a couple times to reboot it to rescue mode, but it ignores
>> that.
> 
> What graphics device do you have?

Besides the Thpd's own monitor, I was connecting it through a 
TESmart 4-port HDMI KVM switch to my main monitor, an old 23" Dell flat 
panel whose model if any must be well-hidden.
 
>>  I can get to the line at the beginning of the boot process which
>> is supposed to make it boot into rescue mode, but that has no effect.
> 
> There is no "rescue mode" in the boot menu.  That entry is for an initrd
> that has all the kernel drivers, not just the ones for that specific
> machine.  For a real rescue mode, you need to use one of the net install
> iso images.
> 
> One option is to add "3" at the end of the kernel command line and if
> that doesn't work, then try "single".  The first one should get a full
> running system with not graphics and the second one should be a minimal
> boot.  Either way, you should be able to access the previous logs and
> find out what's happening.

Adding 3 worked, whereupon, dammitall, I forgot to look for logs, 
and of course messed up some more.
[]
>>  Do I just call it a total loss and install F 32 from a freshly
>> downloaded iso on a thumb drive?
> 
> Those are related.  You can put a Fedora live image on a thumb drive and
> boot it and if necessary do the re-install from it as well.

I'll go find a thumb drive -- with apologies for my clumsiness. 
Thank you!
-- 
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Old Red Hat bugzilla pwd

[Beartooth]

In course of trying to repair mate-panel on a Thinkpad, I hit a 
bug that might could deserve notice (I seem to have gotten the whole 
machine downgraded somehow.) -- and discovered that I still have an RH-
bgz account for my public address (the one I use here).

I haven't had occasion to use it in years (Yay Fedora!), and have 
no clue any more what my old password may be. Is there a way I can 
legitimate myself and have that password (or if need be, the whole old 
account) deleted, so that I can report a new oddity? Should I just report 
it here? 
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.

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What are pcscd and sys_nice??

[Beartooth]

Upon trying to open a 5-line URL at NYT, I just got an alert 
saying, "SELinux is preventing pcscd from using the sys_nice capability."

I tried searching, and got nothing specific to SELinux nor Fedora; 
what I did find is way over my head.

-- 
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I have precious (very precious) little idea where up is.

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Lost Mate-panel

[Beartooth]

Upgrading an E-series Thinkpad, a year or two old, running Fedora 
31, via CLI, the upgrade kept failing with complaints about i.686 -- till 
I did "dnf remove  mate-*.i.686" -- then it completed, or seemed to. This 
machine was behind an HDMI KVM switch, and was giving a display spread 
across both its own monitor and my regular one, with four panels on each.

Since the upgrade reboot, when I KVM to the Thinkpad, I see blank 
flashing panels on each monitor. There is no terminal emulator anywhere. 
I've tried a couple times to reboot it to rescue mode, but it ignores 
that.

I took it out from behind the KVM switch, but that didn't help.

I can get to the line at the beginning of the boot process which 
is supposed to make it boot into rescue mode, but that has no effect.

Do I go looking for a live distro that may let me mount the Thpd's 
hard drive and try to fix the panels somehow? 

Do I just call it a total loss and install F 32 from a freshly 
downloaded iso on a thumb drive? 

Is there a third way?

-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Linux Power User
I have precious (very precious) little idea where up is.

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Re: F32, Mate, i686 vs, 86_64

[Beartooth]

On Wed, 29 Apr 2020 13:56:04 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 4/29/20 1:41 PM, Beartooth wrote:
>>  Can I somehow remove all of one with a single command? (I expect
>> more such conflicts.)
> 
> Something must have brought the 32-bit libs in, do you have wine
> installed?  You could try "dnf remove *.i686", but make sure you check
> the remove list carefully.

I don't think I have wine on that one. I did try "dnf remove 
*.i686"; it got 164 hits, and I hardly knew squat about any of them. So I 
tried "dnf remove mate-*.i686" and got something a lot safer looking; I 
ran it.

Then I ran all the upgrade commands again, and this time they 
worked. Many, many thanks for all your trouble!
-- 
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Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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F32, Mate, i686 vs, 86_64

[Beartooth]

I'm getting failure because of conflicts in Mate-panel between i686 
and 86_64. 

Can I somehow remove all of one with a single command? (I expect 
more such conflicts.) 

How do I tell which a given machine should be pared down to?
-- 
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Re: dnf list color bad

[Beartooth]

On Tue, 28 Apr 2020 10:06:24 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

> On 4/28/20 9:14 AM, Beartooth wrote:
>> On Mon, 27 Apr 2020 14:12:49 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
>> 
>>>> On Thu, 23 Apr 2020 20:43:36 +0200, Łukasz Posadowski wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Try:
>>>>> dnf --color=never install python3-pygame
>>>>
>>>>I tried it, on all four machines. No joy. I rebooted them, and
>>>> did another upgrade. Still no joy. I even tried "eval dnf" on one
>>>> (Wow!),  but that didn't help, either. :-{
>>>
>>> I just tried it and it worked fine, no colors.  You can also set it in
>>> your dnf.conf file.  See "man dnf.conf" for details.  You can adjust
>>> the colors there as well if that's your concern.
>> 
>>  Well, I read "[MAIN] OPTIONS - COLORS" there (which I assume you
>> mean); but I don't see how to get back to what I use, which is
>> admittedly a little complicated. Please bear with me.
> 
> So are you trying to stop dnf from using colors or are you wanting to
> set your own?  [...]  If
> you want to change the colors it uses, then look in the man page for the
> options. e.g. "color_list_available_install"

Definitely the latter: change. I use those ten colors constantly. 
But I get :

# dnf install 'dnf command(color_list_available_install)'
Last metadata expiration check: 1:54:16 ago on Tue 28 Apr 2020 12:16:10 
PM EDT.
No match for argument: dnf-command(color_list_available_install)
Error: Unable to find a match: dnf-command(color_list_available_install)
# dnf install 'dnf-command (color_list_available_install)'
Last metadata expiration check: 1:55:14 ago on Tue 28 Apr 2020 12:16:10 
PM EDT.
No match for argument: dnf-command (color_list_available_install)
Error: Unable to find a match: dnf-command (color_list_available_install)
[root@localhost btth]# dnf color_list_available_install
No such command: color_list_available_install. Please use /usr/bin/dnf --
help
It could be a DNF plugin command, try: "dnf install 'dnf-
command(color_list_available_install)'"

I've chewed and chewed on the above and several variant 
interpretations of it -- and I'm lost.

Maybe I should say that my expressions like "soft blue" are my 
descriptions of what I actually do from Mate-terminal --> Edit --> 
Profiles then click on Default, then Edit, then Colors, then Custom, then 
one of the colors. Say I start with Text color. Then I click on a colored 
box, then on +. That gives me a window with a slider, which I can drag 
vertically to get, say in two dimensions till it looks purple. Then I get 
a purple window with two white lines; I drag the intersection in two 
dimensions till the little window in that box looks the way I want. Then 
I click Select, and the text on my open tab turns the color I had moved 
the cursor to.

I repeat the above for background, then, over and over, for each 
of the other six profiles.

Am I making sense yet?
-- 
Beartooth Staffwright, Not Quite Clueless Power User
Remember I know little (precious little!) of where up is.
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Re: dnf list color bad

[Beartooth]

On Mon, 27 Apr 2020 14:12:49 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:

>> On Thu, 23 Apr 2020 20:43:36 +0200, Łukasz Posadowski wrote:
>> 
>>> Try:
>>> dnf --color=never install python3-pygame
>> 
>>  I tried it, on all four machines. No joy. I rebooted them, and
>> did another upgrade. Still no joy. I even tried "eval dnf" on one
>> (Wow!),  but that didn't help, either. :-{
> 
> I just tried it and it worked fine, no colors.  You can also set it in
> your dnf.conf file.  See "man dnf.conf" for details.  You can adjust the
> colors there as well if that's your concern.

Well, I read "[MAIN] OPTIONS - COLORS" there (which I assume you 
mean); but I don't see how to get back to what I use, which is admittedly 
a little complicated. Please bear with me.

I normally keep eight tabs open on each machine. (I have four 
behind an HDMI KVM machine, plus one in another room, all with the same 
color scheme; my wife has one of her own, still with the color scheme.)

This is all F 31 Mate; it has evolved over twenty years.

Three tabs have soft pale green background for my normal user, 
with deep purple text (maximal contrast with green, but a little softer 
on ancient eyeballs than black); Alpine on my remote domain turns that 
yellow at top and bottom, soft gray in the middle, with dark blue text.

Two tabs are soft pale blue, available for root, with deep blood 
red text. One tab is a brighter blue with the same red, for root on the 
remote domain.

One tab is a dull soft tan, with maroon text, in case my wife 
wants to use one of my machines. 

If I've counted right, that's ten colors. 

This arrangement has two uses, major and minor. Major use is that 
I need not waste any of my often absent mind keeping track of who and 
where I am -- a distracting detail that usually matters. (Fwiw, I also 
use distinctive wallpapers and xscreensaver settings on each machine.) 
Minor use is that I also know without distraction which machine I'm on at 
the moment. (I allow NO window to obscure the background on any side.)

Setting all this up on each new release is a bore, and I wish I 
need not do it over and over; but it's worth it in use.

-- 
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Re: dnf list color bad

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 23 Apr 2020 20:43:36 +0200, Łukasz Posadowski wrote:

> Try:
> dnf --color=never install python3-pygame

I tried it, on all four machines. No joy. I rebooted them, and 
did another upgrade. Still no joy. I even tried "eval dnf" on one (Wow!), 
but that didn't help, either. :-{



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Re: dnf list color bad

[Beartooth]

On Thu, 23 Apr 2020 14:37:41 -0400, Tom Horsley wrote:

> On Thu, 23 Apr 2020 18:11:22 - (UTC)
> Beartooth wrote:
> 
>>  Today all of a sudden on all four machines on my desk, the list
>> that dnf gives me of what it proposes to do is an unreadable chartreuse
>> color. Could this be something I've done?? How do I fix it?
> 
> Apparently you have the same version of dnf I have. I utterly despise
> "helpful" colors, especially since all the people who pick them assume
> you have a white background in your terminal Then you can't read them at
> all with a dark background.

Actually, I use various pastel colors that're supposed to be easy 
on the eyes -- and color-code the tabs on my terminal so that I have an 
extra assurance against doing something in the wrong place. But *I* 
choose the colors for both background and text; so this misery would foul 
me up even if it were a decent color.

If the developers want the text input by me and the text input by 
dnf to be able to differ, great -- so long as they let the *user* choose 
both colors (or ignore them if so preferred). Springing it on us is a 
foul.
-- 
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Sometimes I do know what I'm talking about.
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dnf list color bad

[Beartooth]

I'm running F31 Mate.

Today all of a sudden on all four machines on my desk, the list 
that dnf gives me of what it proposes to do is an unreadable chartreuse 
color. Could this be something I've done?? How do I fix it?
-- 
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kf5

[Beartooth]

I run F31 Mate. When I run dnf upgrade, I often get dozens of kf5 
entries (23 today, by my count) -- presumably because I install and 
sometimes use K3B or Konqueror; I don't think I ever launch any other KDE 
app, at least not knowingly.

In particular, I used to use Konqueror mainly for reading man 
pages, because it was the only way I knew to get a display I could read; 
but now it doesn't do man pages at all, alas!

Also, formerly neither K3B nor Brasero always burned media I 
wanted; but one or the other always did.

I'm wondering a couple things. Does all that kf5 stuff, sitting 
there almost (?) unused, amount to a security hazard? Does it slow 
anything down perceptibly? (I inveterately use too many browsers with too 
many tabs.)

Might I ought to bite the bullet, removing K3B and Konqueror?
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