respond to
William Silvert cien...@silvert.org
To
ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
cc
Subject
Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
Since I did my graduate work in physics, not ecology, I was hesitant to
step
in here. However on looking at the various responses I would like to point
out that in physics
...@silvert.org
Sent by: Ecological Society of America: grants, jobs, news
ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
03/14/2009 06:07 PM
Please respond to
William Silvert cien...@silvert.org
To
ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
cc
Subject
Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
Since I did my graduate work in physics
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 9:27 AM
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
If there is no difference between a Ph.D. and an Ed.D. why does almost
every major university in the nation, barring Harvard, offer both
degrees?
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:57 AM, Mitch Cruzan cru...@pdx.edu wrote:
Whether
] EdD vs PhD
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who want opportunities
and
placement. PhD is for the passionate.
WT
- Original Message -
From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 11:18 AM
Subject: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs
Society of America: grants, jobs, news
[mailto:ecolo...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of Wayne Tyson
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:07 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who want opportunities
and
placement. PhD
[mailto:ecolo...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of David M. Lawrence
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:39 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
It's nice to see the enlightened opinion here -- i.e., tripe -- but
until someone comes up with a substantive difference between the two
This question was absolutely legitimate, and I would like to personally
apologize to Jay for the disgraceful level of professionalism exhibited by
some of the respondents. To say that I was disappointed in some of the
comments is an understatement. EdD or PhD, this thread has certainly proven
] EdD vs PhD
By now this thread may be getting a little old and I hope I'm not beating a
dead horse. But I just would like to point out that a piece of paper does not
equal intelligence. I do agree with earlier folks that pointed out that drive
and determination are 90% of a PhD with 10% being
PhD in science: most of these teach, and conduct research in, science in a
science department at an institution of higher learning.
EdD in science (education): most of these teach, and conduct research in,
pedagogy of science in an education department at an institution of higher
learning.
: Sean McMahon sean...@duke.edu
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 11:05 PM
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
Wait a second here. This has nothing to do with the debate over two
terminal degrees (can't get more than a Ph.D. or Ed.D). A Masters is not
a terminal
] On Behalf Of David M. Lawrence
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 10:39 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
It's nice to see the enlightened opinion here -- i.e., tripe -- but
until someone comes up with a substantive difference between the two
types of degrees
-
From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 3:50 PM
Subject: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
I have indeed decided to pursue a PhD, but I thought that I would take this
opportunity to inform ECOLOG subscribers about some of the misconceptions
Mitch, your opening paragraph and premise just doesn't site right with
me. From my observations of the folks I've seen get PhDs, I have a hard
time accepting that a PhD is something that the majority of the
population is not capable of achieving due to any inherent
intellectual prowess- that
Wow. This thread is sort of reminding me of the whole science vs.
creationism topic that appeared on the Entomology listserv out of
UGuelph. While this thread is certainly entertaining I question the
intent of the original poster and will put forth the possibility of an
internet troll
... it is to teach them to think, if that is possible,
and always to think for themselves.' -Robert Hutchins
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:06:27 -0400
From: aroad...@vt.edu
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Fellow Ecologers:
I enjoy reading the debates that occur
I couldn't help but add a little fuel to this fireI completely agree with
Dave's assertion that many of the negative, arrogant and rude comments
regarding the merits of an Ed.D. are based more on ignorance and a superiority
complex than on any real knowledge of the degree itself. I
Whether it sits right with you or not, it is true. Not everybody has
the same intellectual ability, the same as we are not all able to be
Olympic athletes no matter how hard we work. Otherwise, universities
would not require high scores on entrance exams for undergraduate study,
and we would
I would argue that getting a Ph.D. is 90% working hard and meeting
deadlines and 10%
how smart you are relative to the other Ph.D. students. But, you
wouldn't be in the
program in the first place if you didn't prove a certain level of
intelligence...this goes for
all graduate programs.
On Fri,
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Fellow Ecologers:
I enjoy reading the debates that occur on this listserv and am content
to keep my opinion to myself, however, in response to this most recent
discussion (or should I say mudslinging) about the differences between
...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of Wayne Tyson
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:07 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who want opportunities
and placement. PhD is for the passionate.
WT
- Original Message - From: Jay
If there is no difference between a Ph.D. and an Ed.D. why does almost
every major university in the nation, barring Harvard, offer both
degrees?
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:57 AM, Mitch Cruzan cru...@pdx.edu wrote:
Whether it sits right with you or not, it is true. Not everybody has the
same
In an attempt to reduce the amount of useless information that I posted I
had only provided the information that I thought was necessary for my
question to be answered accurately. However, given how this has spiraled
into a huge debate with me being a fictitious troll I guess I will inform
the
If I can add to this clutter, qualities of phDs are vastly different among
universities. Through my carrier, I have encountered many phDs and advised phD
graduate students. Reviewing their manuscripts, research and dissertation
projects, I sometimes wonder how they were able to receive phD and
What??? The person who started this thread asked a legitimate question
-- the kind of question this listserv is for, i.e., to seek advice on
some professional matter from peers. The trolls came later.
Dave
=?iso-8859-1?Q?MTS?= wrote:
Wow. This thread is sort of reminding me of the whole
-
From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
In the future I will abstain from asking controversial questions (didn't
realize this was one).
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
If there is no difference between a Ph.D. and an Ed.D. why does almost
every major university in the nation, barring Harvard, offer both
degrees?
On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:57 AM, Mitch Cruzan cru...@pdx.edu wrote:
Whether it sits right with you
: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
From: malcolm.mccal...@herpconbio.org
To: fatcatinalittlec...@hotmail.com
CC: ECOLOG-L@listserv.umd.edu
Interesting. When I went to college I went there to learn, not to be
taught. In fact, I often ended up spending much to much time learning
tangents to what
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
Whether it sits right with you or not, it is true. Not everybody has
the same intellectual ability, the same as we are not all able to be
Olympic athletes no matter how hard we work. Otherwise, universities
would not require high scores on entrance exams
can, but be realistic about
your prospects.
Bill Silvert
- Original Message - From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 6:45 PM
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
In the future I will abstain from asking controversial questions
.
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 12:23:07 -0500
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
From: malcolm.mccal...@herpconbio.org
To: fatcatinalittlec...@hotmail.com
CC: ECOLOG-L@listserv.umd.edu
Interesting. When I went to college I went there to learn, not to be
taught. In fact, I often ended up spending much
should be earned without any
short
cuts.
Pete
-Original Message-
From: Ecological Society of America: grants, jobs, news
[mailto:ecolo...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of Mitch Cruzan
Sent: Friday, March 13, 2009 8:58 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
Whether
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
Whether it sits right with you or not, it is true. Not everybody has
the same intellectual ability, the same as we are not all able to be
Olympic athletes no matter how hard we work. Otherwise, universities
would not require
on to titles so dearly and remember to check our arrogance at
the door.
Mark Winterstein
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 18:54:52 -0500
From: malcolm.mccal...@herpconbio.org
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
that is completely a false assumption. I did a MS prior to my PHD
, 13 Mar 2009 18:54:52 -0500
From: malcolm.mccal...@herpconbio.org
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
that is completely a false assumption. I did a MS prior to my PHD,
but when students go directly into the PHD, they still have to go
through all the MS requirements
I have indeed decided to pursue a PhD, but I thought that I would take this
opportunity to inform ECOLOG subscribers about some of the misconceptions
with an EdD.
The university that I am currently enrolled in has two EdD options. The most
common option is a doctorate of education in science
It seems the prejudice against the EdD, like most prejudices, is based
on little evidence. Unfortunately, such prejudice is fairly common in
the supposedly rational confines of academia. In other words, it's a
turf thing.
The PhDs would do well to broaden their awareness of the empirical
...@bsu.edu wrote:
From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
Subject: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Date: Thursday, March 12, 2009, 3:50 PM
I have indeed decided to pursue a PhD, but I thought that I would take this
opportunity to inform ECOLOG subscribers about some
of America: grants, jobs, news
[mailto:ecolo...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of Wayne Tyson
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:07 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who want opportunities
and
placement. PhD
What Dave says is true, but since there is this prejudice, Jay would do
better getting a Ph.D. and avoiding the issue.
It seems the prejudice against the EdD, like most prejudices, is based
on little evidence. Unfortunately, such prejudice is fairly common in
the supposedly rational confines
, and are being,
evolved. --Charles Darwin
--- On Thu, 3/12/09, Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu wrote:
From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
Subject: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Date: Thursday, March 12, 2009, 3:50 PM
I have indeed decided to pursue a PhD, but I thought
There is a deeper issue here- A PhD is not just something you get, or
that anybody can just get. The ability to earn a PhD in any discipline
is something that the majority of the population is not capable of
achieving. It's not just about hard work- A PhD is earned through the
demonstration of
-Original Message-
From: Ecological Society of America: grants, jobs, news
[mailto:ecolo...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of Wayne Tyson
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:07 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who
: Ecological Society of America: grants, jobs, news
[mailto:ecolo...@listserv.umd.edu] On Behalf Of Wayne Tyson
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2009 6:07 AM
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who want opportunities
and
placement
I grew up mixed race in Jim Crow Louisiana, and when I hear someone say
give up and accommodate prejudice -- even in something like this -- it
turns my stomach. The prejudice is the problem, not the perceived
weakness of the Ed.d. versus the alleged strength of the Ph.D.
The requirements for
An Ed.D. does the same thing -- just in a different field. It may be
solely applied research as opposed to basic research, but a lot of
people get Ph.D. degrees in applied fields and no one seems to sneer at
their worth.
So, a Ph.D. dissertation that reveals how to improve yield of a pine
My name is Jayson Beugly. I am currently pursuing an EdD in science (aquatic
biology and fisheries)and an opportunity to switch to a PhD has come up. I
am searching for advice on the pros and cons of the PhD vs EdD. There seems
to be a bit of confusion regarding place and opportunities available
EdD is a BS degree in makeup, and is for those who want opportunities and
placement. PhD is for the passionate.
WT
- Original Message -
From: Jay Beugly jsbeu...@bsu.edu
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU
Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2009 11:18 AM
Subject: [ECOLOG-L] EdD vs PhD
My name
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